Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 11
Abramelin

Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 2]

6,100 posts in this topic

All very interesting stuff.

I was looking in the Frisian Dictionary for something else but found wralda basically...

I never went for a meaning of 'old man' as I don't subscribe to the point that wr ever meant man in this word context nor the fact the words would be back to front 'man old' - so I've always been watching for the true meaning...

ur- (1), afries., Präf.: nhd. aus...; ne. out...; Vw.: s. -al-d-a-fe-d-er, -bek, -bek-bind-a, -bek-dē-d*, -bek-dê-l-a, -bek-du-ā, -bek-find-a, -bek-gu-ng-a, -bek-ku-m-a, -bek-stê-t-a, -bek-ti-ā, -bek-wī-s-a, -ber-e, -ber-lik, -ber-ns-e, -breid-a, -bri-ng-a, -bri-ng-e-lik, -bri-ng-er, -fal-l-a, -fel-l-inge, -fra-m-eth-ia, -ful-l-a, -hal, -hal-ia, -hlī-a, -lê-s-a, -wēn-a; Hw.: s. or; vgl. got. us; E.: germ. *uz, Präf., aus-, heraus-

uraldafeder* 1 und häufiger, uraldfader*, ur-al-d-a-fe-d-er*, ur-al-d-fa-d-er*, afries., M. (kons.): nhd. Urgroßvater; Vw.: s. ur- (1); E.: s. ur- (1), al-d-a-fe-d-er; L.: Hh 121a, Hh 179

uraldfader*, ur-al-d-fa-d-er*, afries., M. (kons.): Vw.: s. ur-al-d-a-fe-d-er*

The W in WRALDA must equate to the UR form above - UR-ALDA

It says #1 ur- so that means 'out' or maybe even OUR - I note the "vgl. got. us; E.: germ. *uz,"

our (pron.) dictionary.gif Old English ure "of us," genitive plural of the first person pronoun, from Proto-Germanic *ons (cf. Old Saxon usa, Old Frisian use, Old High German unsar, German unser, Gothic unsar "our"), http://www.etymonlin....php?search=our

WRALDA seems to mean 'our elder'

Edited by The Puzzler
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All very interesting stuff.

I was looking in the Frisian Dictionary for something else but found wralda basically...

I never went for a meaning of 'old man' as I don't subscribe to the point that wr ever meant man in this word context nor the fact the words would be back to front 'man old' - so I've always been watching for the true meaning...

ur- (1), afries., Präf.: nhd. aus...; ne. out...; Vw.: s. -al-d-a-fe-d-er, -bek, -bek-bind-a, -bek-dē-d*, -bek-dê-l-a, -bek-du-ā, -bek-find-a, -bek-gu-ng-a, -bek-ku-m-a, -bek-stê-t-a, -bek-ti-ā, -bek-wī-s-a, -ber-e, -ber-lik, -ber-ns-e, -breid-a, -bri-ng-a, -bri-ng-e-lik, -bri-ng-er, -fal-l-a, -fel-l-inge, -fra-m-eth-ia, -ful-l-a, -hal, -hal-ia, -hlī-a, -lê-s-a, -wēn-a; Hw.: s. or; vgl. got. us; E.: germ. *uz, Präf., aus-, heraus-

uraldafeder* 1 und häufiger, uraldfader*, ur-al-d-a-fe-d-er*, ur-al-d-fa-d-er*, afries., M. (kons.): nhd. Urgroßvater; Vw.: s. ur- (1); E.: s. ur- (1), al-d-a-fe-d-er; L.: Hh 121a, Hh 179

uraldfader*, ur-al-d-fa-d-er*, afries., M. (kons.): Vw.: s. ur-al-d-a-fe-d-er*

The W in WRALDA must equate to the UR form above - UR-ALDA

It says #1 ur- so that means 'out' or maybe even OUR - I note the "vgl. got. us; E.: germ. *uz,"

our (pron.) dictionary.gif Old English ure "of us," genitive plural of the first person pronoun, from Proto-Germanic *ons (cf. Old Saxon usa, Old Frisian use, Old High German unsar, German unser, Gothic unsar "our"), http://www.etymonlin....php?search=our

WRALDA seems to mean 'our elder'

Puzz,

Maybe you can check also the dutch word "oer".

Used as in "oer-oud" (age old or original).

http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/oer2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Puzz,

Maybe you can check also the dutch word "oer".

Used as in "oer-oud" (age old or original).

http://www.etymologi.../trefwoord/oer2

Id think oer was like over, as in oera linda = over old = very old.

The dictionary gives URALDA so that's what I'm sticking with.

Its simply 'our elder' imo. ur-alda, which seems very logical and simple in English.

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been investigating my K1b maternal heritage some more and seems it was part of the larger Corded Ware cultural horizon which was situated around Saxony and probably the people who made the Nebra Sky Disk but not the megalithic builders.

This all seems very logical again to me, I am a typical Anglo-Saxon type, but what is strange or not, is that the K maternal haplotype is also a Jewish line - so this indicates to me, somewhere, sometime, the people, at least the maternal lines, were part of an original Creator God people who had similar beliefs. The areas of Germany that the Saxons lived, as part of the wider Fryan cultural family, should therefore be similar to Fryan beliefs, which as we look at the OLB more and more, one would think it was telling us that Fryans and Jews were one and the same, at least in it's belief system.

Then the word Saxon is just like Saka, the Persian name for Scythians, so then the ball rolls to the theory that Scythians and Saxons were originally the same people, which is what I was looking for, all those blue eyes, but not nec. blonde hair, more a light brown to auburn, throw into the mix Israelites and you get these kinds of comparisons, making this what I see as a fairly sound theory, even though it is regularly thrown in the 'doesn't work' box and general information is on bible sites...

Israelites, Scythians and Saxons Without A King (interesting, since I also peg the Gutians as an early Gothic, Saxon type - According to the Sumerian king list, "In the army of Gutium, at first no king was famous; they were their own kings and ruled thus for 3 years - "passage of Bede: 'The ancient SAXON'S HAVE NO KING, but many chiefs set over their people")

Israelites, Scythians and Saxons Had Divining Rods

Israelites, Scythians and Saxons Had Similar Religions

Israelites and Scythians Had Groves But No Images

Israelites-Scythians-Saxons Were Civilized, Wise and Unconquerable

Israelites and Scythians Boiled Meat By Burning Bones

Israelites and Scythians Didn't Eat Pigs

Israel and Scythia Didn't Intermarry with Other Nations (neither did Hittites in general)

http://hope-of-israe.../scythians.html

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Its simply 'our elder' imo. ur-alda, which seems very logical and simple in English.

Please cut the crap.

Check german "UR-"

- - - - - - - edit to add:

"Our" in Fryan is "US(A)" or "VS(A)".

Edited by gestur

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please cut the crap.

Check german "UR-"

Excuse me?

Check the Frisian dictionary ur-

It clearly says the ur in uralda is the one that ends up as English our. #1 ur-

Since when is the OLB in German?

You might note that your german ur has the same etymology root as the ur mentioned above - both relate to out - that is, if you are thinking the ur equates to 'original, earliest'.

Whose side are you on exactly?

The phrase is retained in the Lords Prayer - OUR father - Our elder feeder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As for Scythians, read Chronicles of Eri (I am at p.300 of 1000 and convinced it's not a forgery, although I don't take the content as all true gospel).

Their language was completely different (and artificial) as compared to that of the Fryans (and as described by them).

It looks like they were the "prestera fon Sidon" and Fonikians (?) of the OLB.

(No time now to check the exact refenrences.)

But somewhere more back in time they will indeed have been related somehow.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gestur,

I see your edit and I've checked the OLB for our and see it's VSA

Us-a

Ours

Ancient is not WR either, it's over, like VG said. Eg. Oviralda - over old, used for ancient.

But English our comes from this word.

This means IMO that it was also there in Fryan. There is no WR - you know that, find WR in the OLB out of the word WRalda, it doesn't exist.

Maybe it was actually UUR - WR

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually it does exist, in the word for written, which I immediately looked for after saying that, it's not found at the beginning of the word though, it's preceded by a h.

HWRYTEN

Considering the wer in this is apparently a PIE root for twist, bend - this word is made up of 2 parts.

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry I was impatient about UR, Puzzler. I should have taken more time to reply, but we've been through that so many times already. Am in the middle of moving, so a bit scattered.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you are looking for a meaning for the word ur (wr), but in connection to the history given in chronicles of eri , can ur be Ur(WR) as in Mesopotamian UR , chrons of Eri says the scyths scattered when Nimrod the Assyrian (Asher-ian ) conquered their country, some escaped in boats (Scuths) to Armenia ,

and later Laban brother of Og (Gog, Magog connection ?) son of Noah ( the one Giant left after the flood was called Og , said to have been allowed to sit on the roof of the ark ) migrated to Italy , and others to greece , look at anag of Laban (Alban-y , or Alban-i ) the god they brought to Britain eventually was Bal

(Bal-an ? another anag of Laban) god of mesops was An , Anu or ani , anni .....note the many gods/kings of the Norse and Greek literature starting with EA or AE , mesop god EA ? ( ENKI ), many kings of Munster(Ireland ) in particular, were called Ailil (Mesop god En-lil )

another interesting anag could be scythia , and icthys the fish , early christian symbol for jesus , but also ea the mesop god was the fish god/ fish man , the bishops mitre is said to be a relic of this god , as it looks like a fishes head , with open mouth

seems to me a fair few coincidences , but could be just coincidence ?

Edited by NO-ID-EA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
... in chronicles of eri , can ur be Ur(WR) as in Mesopotamian UR ...

Wasn't that fire? Dutch: VUUR (VVVR).

But fire in Fryan is FJUR which also means four (tetrahedron is symbol for element fire).

One resemblance between Fryans and Scythians was fire worship.

The Scythian word for fire may have been derived from the Fryan "Ur-alda").

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry I was impatient about UR, Puzzler. I should have taken more time to reply, but we've been through that so many times already. Am in the middle of moving, so a bit scattered.

Thanks, I'm sorry I'm so uppity, maybe the English too much in me.

Edited by The Puzzler
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wasn't that fire? Dutch: VUUR (VVVR).

But fire in Fryan is FJUR which also means four (tetrahedron is symbol for element fire).

One resemblance between Fryans and Scythians was fire worship.

The Scythian word for fire may have been derived from the Fryan "Ur-alda").

Fire elder, hmmmm

I spent all night on ur, aus, out, uz, our, us and all I got was a massive headache.

Things are not what they seem IMO.

A good one for Sumerian Ur is basque water.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Things are not what they seem IMO.

I can imagine, sometime here the same feeling.

From one side it seemed (maybe still) pretty sure to me, looked on from Dutch language standpoint, that VVR-ALDA is meant to be linked with the O(V)ER-OUDE (oer shortened version of over, like in bed-over-grootvader). O(ve)r-igine is than the oldest facet of existence that over-is-gaan to all coming existence afterwards. This is maybe slightly personal interpretation ;-)

On the other side it is also striking that the word "wereld" (world) can be seen in it.

As VVR-ALDA is also called the big sea, ocean, in Dutch the ocean is sometimes referred to as "wereldzee".

I always thought that "wereld" should be linked somehow with whirling ("weer" as in always coming back, turning in circles, physical and timewise).

But what is it that the word "wereld" (world) comes from?

Maybe over-ald (the big whole of what ever existed before and will exist in future, alltime and everywhere)?

Hence the expression "never in the world", when saying not in past and future to come?

So is it "weer" or "over" the Dutch word "wereld" is formed from, i wonder.

Most strange is that there is an expression in Dutch "over en weer" gaan, meaning going hence and forth.

Like the pendulum clock: over en weer is the time ticking.

06007.jpg

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, so I'll go with over, since the Frisian ur in uralda means out, meaning outer.

The OLB also has Wr.alda is thet alderaldesta jeftha overaldesta,

over- word-forming element meaning "above; highest; across; too much; above normal; outer," from Old English ofer (see over). Over and its Germanic relations were widely used as prefixes, and sometimes could be used with negative force.

over (prep.) Old English ofer "beyond, above, upon, in, across, past; on high," from Proto-Germanic *uberi (cognates: Old Saxon obar, Old Frisian over, Old Norse yfir, Old High German ubar, German über, Gothic ufar "over, above"), from PIE *uper (see super-).

For whatever reason the over became wr...

It actually seems to me that over is related to very and the root form is 'wer/e'

over old and very old seem very much alike, just using a variable word, very has the wr...

very (adj.) late 13c., verray "true, real, genuine," later "actual, sheer" (late 14c.), from Anglo-French verrai, Old French verai "true, truthful, sincere; right, just, legal," from Vulgar Latin *veracus, from Latin verax (genitive veracis) "truthful," from verus "true" (source also of Italian vero), from PIE root *were-o- "true, trustworthy" (cf. Old English wær "a compact," Old Dutch, Old High German war, Dutch waar, German wahr "true;" Welsh gwyr, Old Irish fir "true;" Old Church Slavonic vera "faith," Russian viera "faith, belief").

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

world (n.) Old English woruld, worold "human existence, the affairs of life," also "the human race, mankind," a word peculiar to Germanic languages (cf. Old Saxon werold, Old Frisian warld, Dutch wereld, Old Norse verold, Old High German weralt, German Welt), with a literal sense of "age of man," from Proto-Germanic *wer "man" (Old English wer, still in werewolf; see virile) + *ald "age" (see old).

That seems like nonsense to me then, with Proto Germanic wer as man, the OLB has overalda - with ver possibly being over, maybe derived from very, another wer word.

I doubt this Fryan word comes from this below... the OLB distinctly has man words for man.

Tha maenniska mügon felo thinga vntslûta, men to fâra Wr.alda is ella êpned. Tha maenniska send maennalik aend berlik, men Wr.alda skept bêde. Tha maenniska minnath aend haetath,

virile late 15c., "characteristic of a man; marked by manly force," from Middle French viril (14c.) and directly from Latin virilis "of a man, manly, worthy of a man," from vir "a man, a hero," from PIE *wi-ro- "man,

It might actually stem from this Gothic word, not connected to the wer as man one.

Gothic has a word translating kosmos, not derived from the same stem: faírhvus, used by Ulfilas in alternation with manasêþs. The corresponding West Germanic term is werold "world", literally wer "man" + ald "age". Gothic faírhvus is cognate to Old High German fërah, Old English feorh, terms expressing "lifetime" (aevum).[

Which is what the name wralda as world seems to mean to me from the OLB context - he's not time or earth, he made the beginning - this most ancient of ancients - time commenced - the world consists of the whole universal area surrounding Earth, the Cosmos - this imo is wralda's meaning transferred to World, up there, living in the higher realms of Heaven.

How do they know the corresponding term werold comes from wer as man? 'very old' could mean a 'lifetime' just as easy as man-age. I also think that probably far also joins in the family. All meaning very or over as in extra (long, far etc)

Edited by The Puzzler
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also think that probably far also joins in the family. All meaning very or over as in extra (long, far etc)

Brilliant thought.

How many seemingly different words can share a common ground in meaning when pondering on it.

Is it only a play of the mind or is language really that logical in it's base if we acknowledge it's flexibility ...

Over (-> ver is far) and very is also said to be connected with waar-lijk (veritas). Is far ~ ver ~ waar?

Ver-stand and ver-nemen is in the act of grasping the truth of something (waar-heid).

True -> through (thorough) -> door (zien) -> door hebben -> per-cipere -> waarnemen and then you can see a link with door~through~per~pfer~ver~waar in the context of truth, transparancy, far reaching.

Edited by Van Gorp
2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Brilliant thought.

How many seemingly different words can share a common ground in meaning when pondering on it.

Is it only a play of the mind or is language really that logical in it's base if we acknowledge it's flexibility ...

Over and over, this is what I see.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Over and over, this is what I see.

Wow, over and over again: "weer-al" in dutch.

I can best speak about Dutch: there it seems

Repetition in time = WEER-AL

Repetition in place = OVER-AL

In English OVER is used in repetition of time also. Connection OVER-WEER?

-> Age-old, Everlasting, Omnipresent = VVR-AL(DA)

Edit: remembers me that in older usage 'over' is also used in repetition of time: "opnieuw" (again) is sometimes said as "over-nieuw".

Also in usage "over-doen" (remake, make again, weer-al).

Edited by Van Gorp
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry if this seems too much on the same theme, but likely I had to convince myself a bit more and now I'm pretty sure:

OVER=WEER

OVER-houden = Be-WAREN = WEER-houden (Guarding, taking care it is not lost after time)

WEER (weather) -> WEDER -> Telkens weer, weder-kerend, again and again -> Een storm trekt ook over, just like the weather is passing over and coming back after time

Edited by Van Gorp

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

weer-al sounds like wheel and what else does wheel do, but go over and over..?

I like this one for WRALDA: wēr* 12, afries., Adj.: nhd. wahr, wahrheitsgetreu, wirklich, gültig; ne. true, truthful;

even though the dictionary has URALDA and related the ur to outer/over.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

fir bolg might mean 'true dwellers' = autochthons, indigenous, sounds a logical name to me.

fir as true and maybe a word like bōgia 2, bō-g-ia, afries., sw. V. (2): nhd. wohnen; ne. dwell (V.); Vw.: s. on-; Hw.: s. būw-a; vgl. ae. bōgian; E.: s. germ. *bōwwōn, sw. V., bauen, wohnen; vgl. idg. *bʰeu-, *bʰeu̯ə-, *bʰu̯ā-, *bʰu̯ē-, *bʰō̆u-, *bʰū-, *bʰeu̯h₂-, V., schwellen, wachsen (V.) (1), gedeihen, sein

what is schwellen? This seems to sound like swell or swollen, which is a word they connect to bolg, bulge

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what is schwellen? This seems to sound like swell or swollen, which is a word they connect to bolg, bulge

Yes schwellen is to swell.

In Dutch you have the verb "belgen" which also means to swell or figuratively: to become furious (zich dik maken).

http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/belgen

Verbolgen: http://gtb.inl.nl/iWDB/search?actie=article_content&wdb=WNT&id=M074845

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

fir bolg might mean 'true dwellers' = autochthons, indigenous, sounds a logical name to me.

fir as true and maybe a word like bōgia 2, bō-g-ia, afries., sw. V. (2): nhd. wohnen; ne. dwell (V.); Vw.: s. on-; Hw.: s. būw-a; vgl. ae. bōgian; E.: s. germ. *bōwwōn, sw. V., bauen, wohnen; vgl. idg. *bʰeu-, *bʰeu̯ə-, *bʰu̯ā-, *bʰu̯ē-, *bʰō̆u-, *bʰū-, *bʰeu̯h₂-, V., schwellen, wachsen (V.) (1), gedeihen, sein

what is schwellen? This seems to sound like swell or swollen, which is a word they connect to bolg, bulge

In English you have "to bulge" which has the same meaning.

The "Fir Bolg" were the "people of the sacks".... But I think it simply meant "Belgae", because they had migrated from presentday Belgium to southern England, and then on to Ireland. Like the Chauci and Menapi, as I mentioned a year or so ago.

Btw, "fir" (Irish Gaelic) means "men".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 11

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.