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Abramelin

Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 2]

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Tin mines existed on Balkan 2700 BC. It is wierd that they mentioned Tin mines.

In the context of the OLB the tin mines in Cornwall are mentioned.

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In the context of the OLB the tin mines in Cornwall are mentioned.

Thats something what I stumble upon. Because Tin we used to made alloys and is knwown that Tin is rare. In Europe just south England and Serbia. Next closest Tin mine to Frisia is Afghanistan. Anyway thanks on your other answers.

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Thats something what I stumble upon. Because Tin we used to made alloys and is knwown that Tin is rare. In Europe just south England and Serbia. Next closest Tin mine to Frisia is Afghanistan. Anyway thanks on your other answers.

OLB tells, that criminals could escape with help of the borough mothers to Cornwall and Danmark in order to work in the tin and metal mines. In Cornwall they were tattood with red and blue signs. As the work in the mines was hard and unhealthy, many fled to Scotland. This may be regarded as the first so called colonisation of Scotland by the Frisians, preceding the victory over the Gauls at Kerenak.

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OLB tells, that criminals could escape with help of the borough mothers to Cornwall and Danmark in order to work in the tin and metal mines. In Cornwall they were tattood with red and blue signs. As the work in the mines was hard and unhealthy, many fled to Scotland. This may be regarded as the first so called colonisation of Scotland by the Frisians, preceding the victory over the Gauls at Kerenak.

Just going by what we read in the OLB , it could point possibly to the Picts originally being called the painted people , because they were tattood people escaping from the mines , if the Fri's are true to their laws then it is not them who have made them into slaves, so someone else must have captured them and put them to work .

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Just going by what we read in the OLB , it could point possibly to the Picts originally being called the painted people , because they were tattood people escaping from the mines , if the Fri's are true to their laws then it is not them who have made them into slaves, so someone else must have captured them and put them to work .

They were no slaves, but forced laborours (prisoners). According to the OLB the mines were Frisian possessions/colonies.

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Gerhard Frederich Muller. a german (anglicised as Gerard Miller) (1705 - 1783) this man wrote the history of the Russian people after the ravages of the golden horde , when the russians had most of their history destroyed ( either that or the Russians had no history in that part of the land ,and wanted to construct a history to validate themselves occupying the land........this Muller is supposed to have done , by using a large collection of manuscripts of both Scandinavian , and German history .

.....He is said to have invented the Normanist theory..which is now largely discredited)

In 1761 - he was elected as an honourary foreign member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences,and died at the age of 77 in Moscow . he went on a couple of expeditions to Siberia , which was both to map the lands , and .to make a record of the siberian culture .... .it was on his return when he continued to write the history of Russia , that he not only fell out with schumaker ..the head librarian of the Romanov Imperial libraries, who had been a good friend of his, but also a top Russian Historian called Lomonov.

He was not directly accused of being a liar , and making up the history , but after a dissertation he presented on " the lineage of names of the Russian People "further developing his theory of the Normanist theory ........ Lomonov made the comment " he not only proposes that the ancient slavic tribes had invited the 3 brothers of the Northern Scandinavian "Rus" tribes to reign over us , because of our inability to govern ourselves without robbing our own kings of their treasures with theivery , flame and the sword, ( at this point in history Russia had a very tense relationship with Sweeden, so Mullers timing was bad )....."but he then leaves us with the noble surprise ,that the Scandinavians with their victorious arms successfully conquered the whole of the land which has now been called Russia."

The intensity of outrage against Muller grew , until he had to leave Russia for a number of years, some of the controversy involved Russians accusing the realm of only using foreign historians to write history to suit their ultimate goals , as no native researcher would so bend the truth .....This was the period when Muller went to Sweden and became a member of the Swedish Academy of Science.......however the powers that be seemed happy with his history , and when the furore died down some years later , Muller returned to Moscow and later died there.

............................were muller , and his other foreign historians taken on just to concoct a history for the elite rulers, and does the invitation to the Rus have anything to do with Friso and his brothers , or the Askar portion of the OLB........i am thinking ,was Twiskland the area around European Germany , Scandinavia , and European Russia called this because it kept changing sides/ ownership through war and disputes , between these two and the slavs were the poor people in the middle in constant war...........an old english saying " be-twixt and between"... meaning neither deffinately one or the other ??.

Edited by NO-ID-EA

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Gerhard Frederich Muller. a german (anglicised as Gerard Miller) (1705 - 1783) this man wrote the history of the Russian people after the ravages of the golden horde , when the russians had most of their history destroyed ( either that or the Russians had no history in that part of the land ,and wanted to construct a history to validate themselves occupying the land........this Muller is supposed to have done , by using a large collection of manuscripts of both Scandinavian , and German history .

.....He is said to have invented the Normanist theory..which is now largely discredited)

In 1761 - he was elected as an honourary foreign member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences,and died at the age of 77 in Moscow . he went on a couple of expeditions to Siberia , which was both to map the lands , and .to make a record of the siberian culture .... .it was on his return when he continued to write the history of Russia , that he not only fell out with schumaker ..the head librarian of the Romanov Imperial libraries, who had been a good friend of his, but also a top Russian Historian called Lomonov.

He was not directly accused of being a liar , and making up the history , but after a dissertation he presented on " the lineage of names of the Russian People "further developing his theory of the Normanist theory ........ Lomonov made the comment " he not only proposes that the ancient slavic tribes had invited the 3 brothers of the Northern Scandinavian "Rus" tribes to reign over us , because of our inability to govern ourselves without robbing our own kings of their treasures with theivery , flame and the sword, ( at this point in history Russia had a very tense relationship with Sweeden, so Mullers timing was bad )....."but he then leaves us with the noble surprise ,that the Scandinavians with their victorious arms successfully conquered the whole of the land which has now been called Russia."

The intensity of outrage against Muller grew , until he had to leave Russia for a number of years, some of the controversy involved Russians accusing the realm of only using foreign historians to write history to suit their ultimate goals , as no native researcher would so bend the truth .....This was the period when Muller went to Sweden and became a member of the Swedish Academy of Science.......however the powers that be seemed happy with his history , and when the furore died down some years later , Muller returned to Moscow and later died there.

............................were muller , and his other foreign historians taken on just to concoct a history for the elite rulers, and does the invitation to the Rus have anything to do with Friso and his brothers , or the Askar portion of the OLB........i am thinking ,was Twiskland the area around European Germany , Scandinavia , and European Russia called this because it kept changing sides/ ownership through war and disputes , between these two and the slavs were the poor people in the middle in constant war...........an old english saying " be-twixt and between"... meaning neither deffinately one or the other ??.

It is an interesting story, but the explanation of the name Twiskland is not Between-land, but Tuisco-land or Tuito-land. Tuisco or Teuto was a protogermanic deity. Tuisco > Deutsch, Tuito > Teuto(burger Wald). The northern part of present day Germany was Saxony, the southern part Alemannia (Fr. Allemagne) and the central part something like Teutonia. Besides the name of the Germans came only in Roman times and cannot be the same as the Geertmen. The Geertmen were originally a Frisian people, which settled at Athens, built a borough and a harbour (Pyraeus). They left for Carmania, where they were neighbours of the Frisians. They joined the Frisians to assist Alexander the Great and Nearchus and travelled home after the death of Alexander. Friso did not allow them to settle near Stavoren, so they moved on to the Eems river mouth, where they founded Grenega (Groningen). So they were the proto-Groningians. Ottema initially called them Frisians too in his Aanteekeningen, but changed wrongly to Germans. This misunderstanding of Ottema caused a lot of trouble, leading to the false theory of Wirth, which has been abused for nazi puposes.

Edited by Knul

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It is an interesting story, but the explanation of the name Twiskland is not Between-land, but Tuisco-land or Tuito-land. Tuisco or Teuto was a protogermanic deity. Tuisco > Deutsch, Tuito > Teuto(burger Wald). The northern part of present day Germany was Saxony, the southern part Alemannia (Fr. Allemagne) and the central part something like Teutonia.

And I want to add that that is still the way Germany is called in Norway, Sweden, Denmark.and North Friesland:

http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyskland

http://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyskland

http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyskland

http://frr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tj%C3%BCschl%C3%B6nj

.

Edited by Abramelin

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The Oera Linda Book: A Neo-Pagan Fantasy Novel

Wyatt Kaldenberg

The Oera Linda Book has a long and controversial history. Most people believe it is a hoax. Very few people believe it is a genuine manuscript handed down from Heathen times generation to generation until today. In his introduction, Mr. Wyatt Kaldenberg gives his theory that The Oera Linda Book is a fantasy novel, mistaken for an authentic Heathen text. Mr. Kaldenberg tells us, “When Bram Stoker’s Dracula, Orson Wells’ The War of the Worlds, and the Blair Witch Project all first came out many people believed they were true because they were epistolary fiction. Were they hoaxes just because some people mistook them for being true? I think not. I believe The Oera Linda Book is fiction people misconstrued as non-fiction.” Kaldenberg goes on, “In 1978, I was first sent a copy of The Oera Linda Book by N.J. Teraplin who was, at the time, the former leader of the recently disbanded Runic Society out of Milwaukee. Teraplin believed the book to be genuine. I had a number of problems with it. However, N.J. Teraplin was a true believer in the book, and he saw it as a sort of Heathen Bible. The leader of the Odinist Fellowship, Else Christensen, published The Oera Linda Book in about 1979 and sold it through The Odinist newsletter. It was the topic of some debate among American Heathens during the 1970s and early ‘80s, then it faded out of fashion in the mid-1980s. No one really talks about it any more.”

Kaldenberg continues, “The Oera Linda Book has a remarkable history. It was very popular for a few years after it was first published, then it was discredited and fell from the limelight. The Oera Linda Book has greatly influenced the liberal New Age movement and is the source of many of Wicca’s basic ideas. The Wiccan myth that secret pagan knowledge was passed down from generation to generation to today comes largely from the Oera Linda Book. The idea that Europe was dominated by Goddess worship, until a male sky God cult invaded our homeland and suppressed the original feminist society comes from the Oera Linda Book. Much of the New Age recreation of the old lost continent of Atlantis myth into a modern day myth came from the Oera Linda Book and other sources. The Oera Linda Book ties all these New Age occult ideas together with liberalism and egalitarianism.”

http://www.amazon.com/The-Oera-Linda-Book-Neo-Pagan/dp/1463618522

http://www.amazon.com/The-Oera-Linda-Book-Neo-Pagan/dp/1463618522#reader_1463618522

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From the book:

"Many people call the book a hoax. I don't believe it's a hoax because the people who pronoted it honestly believed it to be real. The man who wrote the book, Cornelis over de Linden's grandfather, never claimed it was real. He died before he could publish his novel. They promoted the Oera Linda Book as an authentic ancient manuscript."

"The Theosophical Society's H.P.Blavatsky was very influenced by the Oera Linda Book. When H.P.Blavatsky moved to Belgium in 1886, the Oera Linda Book was the talk of all occult circles she associated with. She knew the book well. While in Belgium, she wrote much of his famous book The Secret Doctrine, which was largely based on the Oera Linda Book . H.P.Blavatsky's theory of root races, Atlantis, and so on came largely from the Oera Linda Book.

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Wilhelm Muller (1794 - 1827 ) son of a Tailor , Political Lyricist , Translator , and History writer...............although mainly known today as a lyricist ( some of his poems were set to music by Franz Peter Schubert) he struggled in his early years to get his work published, until taken under the wing of Duke Anhalt Dessau , who assisted him in entering the University of BBerlin , where he studied History, Philosophy and Music , ..........In 1917 he was taken to Egypt by Baron Von Sack to help him collect inscriptions for translation . (not bad connections for the son of a tailor )

Later he wrote Leider der Greichen (Songs of the Greeks) which was a cry for the support of the Greeks , in their long fight against their conquest of the Ottoman Turks, and made strong political denunciations of the Prussian Govmt .... another of his works was Am Brunnen Vor dem Tore (1820 ) perhaps better known as Der Lindenbaum.......apparently his untimely death in 1827 , was surrounded in rumours of suicide , or muder , which persisted for some years after, but which has never been resolved .

Friedrick Max Muller (1823 - 1900) son of Wilhelm..........A well documented education , which i do not need to go into......F.Max Mulller was eventually taken on by the British Government after the conquest of India to investigate the Hindu Religion, and the Antiquated Sanskrit Writings, .......acc to monsignor Munro , a Roman Catholic Bishop of Glasgow , muller made staunch lectures against divine revelation, and against Jesus Christ , reducing them all to mere natural occurences .

Charles Godfrey Lellard and Helena Blavatsky were seeking him out in the hope that he would join them in singing the praises of Pagan Religions , against Christianity.

During Millers work for the British Government in India , he became interested in the "Aryan " Indo European Culture , but he set them in opposition to Semitic Religions,...During this time he formulated a theory of Turanism , which was a political movement for the union of all Turanian (Pan Turkish ) peoples , Ottoman Turks, of both Istanbul and Anatolya , Turkomans of central Asia , and Persia , the Tartars of Southern Russia , and those in Trans Caucasia , The Magyars of Hungary , Finns of Finland and Sami tribes), and the Baltic, and all the aboriginal tribes of Siberia, including Monguls , Manchus, Koreans and Japanese...........This Ural/Altaic linguistic/Nomadic hypothesis is now largely discredited .

In 1844 he went to Berlin University to study with Friedrick Schelling , and in 1845 to Paris to study Sanskrit under Eugene Burnhouf , where they published the complete Rig Veda.....in 1846 he came to England and was in charge of Sanskrit studies under the pay of the East India Company . and became Oxford University's leading scholar of Indian Studies , which Britain controlled as part of the Empire.

In one of his Sanskrit Rig Veda critiques , he said that the Hindu scriptures were all mythology , and a disease of language.and stated to his mother in a letter home that he needed to reform Hinduism , much the way Christianity was changed in the reformation.......he told her that Hinduism was doomed , and that he was very sad that his work was going to be used as racialist propaganda.........and he also said in one letter home that ... India has been conquered once , but it now needs to be conquered again , by education , the Christianity of the 19th century would hardly be the Christianity of India,and if Christianity did not step in - who's fault would it be .??? .......Miller wrote many letters home to his mother which are interesting reading ... maybe giving the impresion that he was not comfortable with the task he was given, and also telling her that the huge amount of money he was being paid for each page of translation of the Sanskrit , would make him rich .

Wilhelm Max Muller. (1862 - 1919 ) son of Friedrich Max Muller........Also became an Orientalist following in his fathers footsteps .. he became more interested in Egyptology , writing his book Asien und Europa Altaegyptischen Denkmalern .......he lectured at a Philadelphian institute , before deciding to migrate to American and becoming the llecturer of Egyptology at the Pensylvania University.......... how is the state of Chronology in Egyptology i wonder ??

Do we notice any similarities here in men of the same surname , possibly writing history for conquering governments in the way they want it written , i am not saying they did , i am saying there are similarities in their careers ...............Now the big question........Who was the Frederik Muller that is said to have been just a dutch antiquarian book-seller, who 's word and expertise was taken as good enough to bring doubt on the authenticity of the Oera Linda Book , and was there any ulterior motive in this refutation .??????

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Wilhelm Muller (1794 - 1827 ) son of a Tailor , Political Lyricist , Translator , and History writer...............although mainly known today as a lyricist ( some of his poems were set to music by Franz Peter Schubert) he struggled in his early years to get his work published, until taken under the wing of Duke Anhalt Dessau , who assisted him in entering the University of BBerlin , where he studied History, Philosophy and Music , ..........In 1917 he was taken to Egypt by Baron Von Sack to help him collect inscriptions for translation . (not bad connections for the son of a tailor )

Later he wrote Leider der Greichen (Songs of the Greeks) which was a cry for the support of the Greeks , in their long fight against their conquest of the Ottoman Turks, and made strong political denunciations of the Prussian Govmt .... another of his works was Am Brunnen Vor dem Tore (1820 ) perhaps better known as Der Lindenbaum.......apparently his untimely death in 1827 , was surrounded in rumours of suicide , or muder , which persisted for some years after, but which has never been resolved .

Friedrick Max Muller (1823 - 1900) son of Wilhelm..........A well documented education , which i do not need to go into......F.Max Mulller was eventually taken on by the British Government after the conquest of India to investigate the Hindu Religion, and the Antiquated Sanskrit Writings, .......acc to monsignor Munro , a Roman Catholic Bishop of Glasgow , muller made staunch lectures against divine revelation, and against Jesus Christ , reducing them all to mere natural occurences .

Charles Godfrey Lellard and Helena Blavatsky were seeking him out in the hope that he would join them in singing the praises of Pagan Religions , against Christianity.

During Millers work for the British Government in India , he became interested in the "Aryan " Indo European Culture , but he set them in opposition to Semitic Religions,...During this time he formulated a theory of Turanism , which was a political movement for the union of all Turanian (Pan Turkish ) peoples , Ottoman Turks, of both Istanbul and Anatolya , Turkomans of central Asia , and Persia , the Tartars of Southern Russia , and those in Trans Caucasia , The Magyars of Hungary , Finns of Finland and Sami tribes), and the Baltic, and all the aboriginal tribes of Siberia, including Monguls , Manchus, Koreans and Japanese...........This Ural/Altaic linguistic/Nomadic hypothesis is now largely discredited .

In 1844 he went to Berlin University to study with Friedrick Schelling , and in 1845 to Paris to study Sanskrit under Eugene Burnhouf , where they published the complete Rig Veda.....in 1846 he came to England and was in charge of Sanskrit studies under the pay of the East India Company . and became Oxford University's leading scholar of Indian Studies , which Britain controlled as part of the Empire.

In one of his Sanskrit Rig Veda critiques , he said that the Hindu scriptures were all mythology , and a disease of language.and stated to his mother in a letter home that he needed to reform Hinduism , much the way Christianity was changed in the reformation.......he told her that Hinduism was doomed , and that he was very sad that his work was going to be used as racialist propaganda.........and he also said in one letter home that ... India has been conquered once , but it now needs to be conquered again , by education , the Christianity of the 19th century would hardly be the Christianity of India,and if Christianity did not step in - who's fault would it be .??? .......Miller wrote many letters home to his mother which are interesting reading ... maybe giving the impresion that he was not comfortable with the task he was given, and also telling her that the huge amount of money he was being paid for each page of translation of the Sanskrit , would make him rich .

Wilhelm Max Muller. (1862 - 1919 ) son of Friedrich Max Muller........Also became an Orientalist following in his fathers footsteps .. he became more interested in Egyptology , writing his book Asien und Europa Altaegyptischen Denkmalern .......he lectured at a Philadelphian institute , before deciding to migrate to American and becoming the llecturer of Egyptology at the Pensylvania University.......... how is the state of Chronology in Egyptology i wonder ??

Do we notice any similarities here in men of the same surname , possibly writing history for conquering governments in the way they want it written , i am not saying they did , i am saying there are similarities in their careers ...............Now the big question........Who was the Frederik Muller that is said to have been just a dutch antiquarian book-seller, who 's word and expertise was taken as good enough to bring doubt on the authenticity of the Oera Linda Book , and was there any ulterior motive in this refutation .??????

In Amsterdam still exists the Frederik Muller Academy (FMA), where librarians are trained. In fact the OLB belongs to the domain of librarians. Verwijs himself was librarian of the Provincial Frisian Library, Winkler was librarian of the Frisian Society, Wumkes.was librarian of the Provincial Frisian Library, Eekhoff librarian of Leeuwarden, CP Burger librarian of the Amsterdam University and so on. Just guess my profession ! By the way Frederik''s father Samuel Muller was a teacher at the Baptist Academy in Amsterdam, where J.H. Halbertsma studied. Wasn't it the main task of the owners of the OLB to preserve it for future generations ?

Edited by Knul

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From the book:

"Many people call the book a hoax. I don't believe it's a hoax because the people who pronoted it honestly believed it to be real. The man who wrote the book, Cornelis over de Linden's grandfather, never claimed it was real. He died before he could publish his novel. They promoted the Oera Linda Book as an authentic ancient manuscript."

"The Theosophical Society's H.P.Blavatsky was very influenced by the Oera Linda Book. When H.P.Blavatsky moved to Belgium in 1886, the Oera Linda Book was the talk of all occult circles she associated with. She knew the book well. While in Belgium, she wrote much of his famous book The Secret Doctrine, which was largely based on the Oera Linda Book . H.P.Blavatsky's theory of root races, Atlantis, and so on came largely from the Oera Linda Book.

Sure, the OLB has been used and abused. The more important is to establish it's real history.

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In Amsterdam still exists the Frederik Muller Academy (FMA), where librarians are trained. In fact the OLB belongs to the domain of librarians. Verwijs himself was librarian of the Provincial Frisian Library, Winkler was librarian of the Frisian Society, Wumkes.was librarian of the Provincial Frisian Library, Eekhoff librarian of Leeuwarden, CP Burger librarian of the Amsterdam University and so on. Just guess my profession ! By the way Frederik''s father Samuel Muller was a teacher at the Baptist Academy in Amsterdam, where J.H. Halbertsma studied. Wasn't it the main task of the owners of the OLB to preserve it for future generations ?

Can you get any records on him knul , mother , father , grandparents etc , his training , education etc,,,,,,,,,,if you are in the proffession, and a new book came to light like OBL , do you think you would have enough clout with your peers , and educational bodies to have a book disregarded as a fake ?..........i know he was not the only one against it , but from what i read he was the main protagonist.....just think he must have had more credentials than antiquarian book-seller .

Edited by NO-ID-EA

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Can you get any records on him knul , mother , father , grandparents etc , his training , education etc,,,,,,,,,,if you are in the proffession, and a new book came to light like OBL , do you think you would have enough clout with your peers , and educational bodies to have a book disregarded as a fake ?..........i know he was not the only one against it , but from what i read he was the main protagonist.....just think he must have had more credentials than antiquarian book-seller .

Unfortunately I found only references in Dutch. As far as I know, Frederik Muller did not play the role as you suppose. He has been asked to give his opinion on the age of the paper used for the OLB and agreed with van Gelder that the paper could not be older than the mid 19th c.

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Knul, what do you think why did they mentioned tin mines? It could be any other mines but they precisely said tin mines more then once. And we know that Tin mines closest to Frisia are in South England, Serbia and Afghanistan. :blink:

What's interesting here to me is, that tin mines are also in Brittany - which sounds alot like Britannia or similar word used in OLB, for what we think is saying Britain - I checked it out in all the context and think that they do mean Britain, but how interesting that tin mines are also in Brittany, which is close to Frisia too...

Europe has very few sources of tin. It was therefore of extreme importance throughout ancient times to import it long distances from known tin mining districts of antiquity, namely Erzgebirge along the border between Germany and Czech Republic, the Iberian Peninsula, Brittany in France, and Devon and Cornwall in southwestern England

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_sources_and_trade_in_ancient_times

Edited by The Puzzler

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It is an interesting story, but the explanation of the name Twiskland is not Between-land, but Tuisco-land or Tuito-land. Tuisco or Teuto was a protogermanic deity. Tuisco > Deutsch, Tuito > Teuto(burger Wald).

So, let's see...the Frisian/Fryan people called it Twiskland and in Frisian twisk is between, which is exactly what the land was, between, them and the Findas, where wild beasts lived, the thing that kept them apart.

It makes no sense whatsoever for the word twiskland NOT to mean between land.

The explanation of the name Twiskland IS between-land - a later folk etymology has jumped in and become a name based on a later Germanic deity, Tuisco of whom the Fryans didn't have - so that name, would be a later name and Twiskland as used in the OLB would indeed translate to between land. IMO anyway.

In German twisk (between) is twisko - twisko probably became Tuisco - leader/king/deity/progenator of the people of the betweenland - then proto'ed up as meaning 'people' - but it seems to me more logical that they were the people who lived in the between land and that the original meaning for all these offshoot later Germanic words is indeed Frisian twisk - between.

twi-s-k

34, twi-s-k-a, afries., Präp.: nhd. zwischen; ne. between; Vw.: s. a-, bi-*,

en-, on-; Hw.: vgl. ahd. zwiskÐn*; Q.: R, B, E, H, W, S; E.: germ. *twisko,

-------------------------

As a comparison you could think about whether Greece is Hellas because of a folk hero called Hellen or is it really named for the hellinga, people who lived on the side of the hills?

This is the core of the whole OLB - these names, that occur and make perfect sense in Frisian or a mythical folk name, that has us believe the name we know is from it....

Edited by The Puzzler

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What is strangely lacking from the OLB is what happened around 1200 BC:

1250 to 1050 BC -- Purifying Fires and an Exodus of Enormous Proportions

[...]

Apolloduros, a Greek author of the 2nd Century BC, recounts the event which, as with Crete, struck Mycenae: "Poseidon in his rage let monstrous masses of water overwhelm the land; the Thrisassio plain was drowned and Attica sank beneath the sea.". All things considered, Homer, Apolloduros, and the archeological and geological evidence all paint the same picture.

A physicist that studies earthquakes has another interpretation of what else took place. He sees a swarm of earthquakes taking place over 50 years, around 1200 BC, and sweeping areas from southern Italy to central Turkey. It was not just the earthquakes that were responsible, but that "the earthquakes provided the vulnerability of these economic and military centers to attack."

Elsewhere in Europe

Similar events seem to stretch throughout Europe and into the region of the North Sea. Over 400 pile (lake) dwellings in Europe were overwhelmed so quickly that bronze weapons, jewelry, cooking pots, and other objects of daily use were found in the lake bed. The scene seems to suggest that sudden and simultaneous flood waves occurred in the lakes, and were of the kind that only occur after the most violent earthquakes.

One geologist found many places from North Jutland to Dithmarschen, in the area of the North Sea, with traces of a great flood that overwhelmed islands and coastal lands: "If we compare the results of these observations, we have to conclude that a flood coming from the west once broke over these coasts, far surpassing in height and extent any other known to history." As a result, a village now rests five meters (16.5 feet) below the surface of Lake Bolsena. Italian Department of Antiquities authorities say that it was smashed by a severe earthquake that caused a violent "tidal" wave to wash over the village, leaving only the walls of the huts. Its full extent is suggested by the Umbrians' history, who are not native to Italy, but legend says that they were driven from their homeland by a terrible flood. These are but a few examples of civilizations dissolved away as a result of floods and gargantuan earthquakes, which seem to dominate the scene of this time period.

The north of Europe was densely populated before this period of upheaval began. However, it lost most of its population in the 13th Century BC. The archeological evidence indicates an almost total lack of finds on the Danish islands and the Scandinavian mainland. Furthermore, this situation lasts for 350 years, and was the result of widespread forces unleashed against civilization. Archeologists and historians see the events culminating in a mass migration away from the region.

Geologists' observations in a number of areas indicate that a huge wave overcame Europe. The West Coast of Germany was flooded by such an enormous wave that banks of silt were created that today stretch 25 kilometers (15.5 miles) and up to 10 meters high (35 feet), even after more than 3,000 years of weathering. On the south coast of the North Sea another excavation disclosed what remained of a "catastrophe of annihilating force": "With all its violent power, the North Sea [struck so hard] that trees were laid flat by the first rush of the water. The tops of these uprooted trees always point to the east, which supports the assumption that the catastrophe was caused by a storm from the west."

Also about 2.5 meters (8.2 feet) below the waves near the island of Memmert, ancient dryland was discovered. There, underwater, and in addition to other things, "the hoof marks of cattle and horses were also visible and wagon tracks [were] clearly marked in the soil." Certainly, these had been covered quickly or they would not have lasted, which suggests more than merely "a storm." This event was one of the factors that sent masses of people (including the Sea People) migrating, or more accurately, fleeing for their lives.

The story throughout the remainder of Europe is all too familiar when compared with the evidence from elsewhere. In Hungary the existing population either completely died out or moved to some unknown location(s), leaving the area behind for the fundamental, even ethnic changes that occurred with the newcomers, the Urnfield culture. Etna, a volcano in Northeastern Sicily, erupted three times during this period. Thapsos, a promontory, once an island near Syracuse in Sicily, has virtually nothing left of the village that was brought to ruin there. In Central Europe the Tumulus culture, too, filled the pages of its final chapter. The last remains of Stonehenge, enfeebled by the previous cycle, was no match for what this cycle brought upon them, as they passed from history. Spain, France, Portugal and a number of islands were not immune, as elsewhere, to the necessity of wildlife's reestablishment.

http://www.livingcos...1250-1050BC.htm

http://www.unexplain...25#entry3342971

In Defense of Nature: The History Nobody Told You About

By Richard Michael Pasichnyk

http://books.google....AwC&redir_esc=y

.

It does mention the time frame (c. 1200BC) in this part: (mentioning Ulysses, Troy and Cecrops)

IN THE YEAR ONE THOUSAND AND FIVE AFTER ATLAND WAS SUBMERGED, THIS WAS INSCRIBED ON THE EASTERN WALL OF FRYASBURGT.

After twelve years had elapsed without our seeing any Italians in Almanland, there came three ships, finer than any that we possessed or had ever seen.

On the largest of them was a king of the Jonischen Islands whose name was Ulysses, the fame of whose wisdom was great. To him a priestess had prophesied that he should become the king of all Italy provided he could obtain a lamp that had been lighted at the lamp in Tex-land. For this purpose he had brought great treasures with him, above all, jewels for women more beautiful than had ever been seen before. They were from Troy, a town that the Greek had taken.

------------------------------

So, if you really mean it's odd how no catastrophe is mentioned in the OLB in that time frame when in history it shows that some major events were occurring geologically - it does say this at the end of the same above chapter...

When they arrived at the strait, both the sea and the earth trembled. The land was upheaved so that all the water ran out of the strait, and the muddy shores were raised up like a rampart. This happened on account of the virtues of the Geertmen, as every one can plainly understand.

But yeah, it's quite extraordinary the description you posted gave: huge wave over Western Europe, mass migrations inc Sea People etc. but no mention of any event in Europe from them. There is quite a large gap though, next entry is 1600 years after Atland submerged, that's 600 years later - so it's possible parts from the 1200BC -600BC time frame are not included or were not written because of the disasters and events, upheavals and so forth and never included as entries.

Edited by The Puzzler

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So, let's see...the Frisian/Fryan people called it Twiskland and in Frisian twisk is between, which is exactly what the land was, between, them and the Findas, where wild beasts lived, the thing that kept them apart.

It makes no sense whatsoever for the word twiskland NOT to mean between land.

The explanation of the name Twiskland IS between-land - a later folk etymology has jumped in and become a name based on a later Germanic deity, Tuisco of whom the Fryans didn't have - so that name, would be a later name and Twiskland as used in the OLB would indeed translate to between land. IMO anyway.

In German twisk (between) is twisko - twisko probably became Tuisco - leader/king/deity/progenator of the people of the betweenland - then proto'ed up as meaning 'people' - but it seems to me more logical that they were the people who lived in the between land and that the original meaning for all these offshoot later Germanic words is indeed Frisian twisk - between.

twi-s-k

34, twi-s-k-a, afries., Präp.: nhd. zwischen; ne. between; Vw.: s. a-, bi-*,

en-, on-; Hw.: vgl. ahd. zwiskÐn*; Q.: R, B, E, H, W, S; E.: germ. *twisko,

-------------------------

As a comparison you could think about whether Greece is Hellas because of a folk hero called Hellen or is it really named for the hellinga, people who lived on the side of the hills?

This is the core of the whole OLB - these names, that occur and make perfect sense in Frisian or a mythical folk name, that has us believe the name we know is from it....

In the OLB it is common practice to derive the name of a people from the supposed founder not from the actual position of the country of that name. In OLB times peoples were moving from the one spot to the other like the Francs named after its supposed leader Franc.

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In the OLB it is common practice to derive the name of a people from the supposed founder not from the actual position of the country of that name. In OLB times peoples were moving from the one spot to the other like the Francs named after its supposed leader Franc.

But there is no Tuisco mentioned, the area is Twiskland.

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It does mention the time frame (c. 1200BC) in this part: (mentioning Ulysses, Troy and Cecrops)

IN THE YEAR ONE THOUSAND AND FIVE AFTER ATLAND WAS SUBMERGED, THIS WAS INSCRIBED ON THE EASTERN WALL OF FRYASBURGT.

After twelve years had elapsed without our seeing any Italians in Almanland, there came three ships, finer than any that we possessed or had ever seen.

On the largest of them was a king of the Jonischen Islands whose name was Ulysses, the fame of whose wisdom was great. To him a priestess had prophesied that he should become the king of all Italy provided he could obtain a lamp that had been lighted at the lamp in Tex-land. For this purpose he had brought great treasures with him, above all, jewels for women more beautiful than had ever been seen before. They were from Troy, a town that the Greek had taken.

------------------------------

So, if you really mean it's odd how no catastrophe is mentioned in the OLB in that time frame when in history it shows that some major events were occurring geologically - it does say this at the end of the same above chapter...

When they arrived at the strait, both the sea and the earth trembled. The land was upheaved so that all the water ran out of the strait, and the muddy shores were raised up like a rampart. This happened on account of the virtues of the Geertmen, as every one can plainly understand.

But yeah, it's quite extraordinary the description you posted gave: huge wave over Western Europe, mass migrations inc Sea People etc. but no mention of any event in Europe from them. There is quite a large gap though, next entry is 1600 years after Atland submerged, that's 600 years later - so it's possible parts from the 1200BC -600BC time frame are not included or were not written because of the disasters and events, upheavals and so forth and never included as entries.

There is no gap, Ulysses is mentioned, and his story is placed at the time of these upheavals.

But these upheavals which got people all over Europe on the move are not even as much as hinted at in the OLB.

.

Edited by Abramelin

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Very true , but does that make it more or less likely that OLB is true or false ??

If it is a forgery you could say that the forgers would by the time of writing it,had a knowledge of the other things that were going on in the world, and so could mention a few .

but if as OLB seems to suggest Frisia got cut off from the rest of the world because land sank and rose,and so navigation possibly became difficult.......dont forget this is around the time the greek dark ages occured ... from around circ 1200 BC to 750 BC , end of Mycenaean peak , Dorian invasion , Famine , Plague, de-population,

most greek pots stopped having decoration on them , the use of linear B script ceased ., as some say it almost seems as though Greece lost all contact with foreign powers, and there was no cultural growth at all until around 900 BC.

If things were the same in Frisia , then they too may not have known what was going on in other countries.

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Very true , but does that make it more or less likely that OLB is true or false ??

If it is a forgery you could say that the forgers would by the time of writing it,had a knowledge of the other things that were going on in the world, and so could mention a few .

but if as OLB seems to suggest Frisia got cut off from the rest of the world because land sank and rose,and so navigation possibly became difficult.......dont forget this is around the time the greek dark ages occured ... from around circ 1200 BC to 750 BC , end of Mycenaean peak , Dorian invasion , Famine , Plague, de-population,

most greek pots stopped having decoration on them , the use of linear B script ceased ., as some say it almost seems as though Greece lost all contact with foreign powers, and there was no cultural growth at all until around 900 BC.

If things were the same in Frisia , then they too may not have known what was going on in other countries.

They may not have known what was going on in other countries? They were all over Europe!

By 1200 BC they didn't own all of Europe any longer, but they were still there.

The Greeks may have had their 'dark ages', but the Egyptians hadn't: they recorded what was happening (the Sea Peoples).

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They may not have known what was going on in other countries? They were all over Europe!

By 1200 BC they didn't own all of Europe any longer, but they were still there.

The Greeks may have had their 'dark ages', but the Egyptians hadn't: they recorded what was happening (the Sea Peoples).

There is nothing about classical history in the OLB what not has been commonly teached in the gymnasia of the 19th century. The new element in it is, that Frisian prehistory has been connected with classical history, starting with Nyhellenia, Minno, the Middelzee and the Jonian islands to show that all Europe initially stood under the guidance of the Fryans, because the world was divided between Frya (Europe, white people), Finda (Eastern people, yellow people) and Lyda (Africa, black people).

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There is nothing about classical history in the OLB what not has been commonly teached in the gymnasia of the 19th century. The new element in it is, that Frisian prehistory has been connected with classical history, starting with Nyhellenia, Minno, the Middelzee and the Jonian islands to show that all Europe initially stood under the guidance of the Fryans, because the world was divided between Frya (Europe, white people), Finda (Eastern people, yellow people) and Lyda (Africa, black people).

My point was that if all of Europe was in turmoil around 1200 BCE, why does he OLB not mention that period, not one single word.

I'll tell you why: those who created the OLB in the 19th century didn't know anything about it.

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