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Dale Larner

Was Vincent van Gogh Jack the Ripper ?

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... did you hire an independent court-qualified forensic handwriting examiner to authenticate the handwriting? If not, it can't be admitted as evidence according to Rule 901 of the Federal Rules of Evidence.

I had to keep the secret while researching and writing the book. I couldn’t involve others. I’ll keep it in mind, but I don’t think it’s necessary at this point. Perhaps others will do that later to verify what I’ve found.

That is an admission that your handwriting analysis cannot be considered evidence.

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That he "could have" traveled from Arles to London and back is absolutely, inarguably, not "strong evidence." It isn't weak evidence...it isn't evidence at all.

It's called speculation. Lots of people were probably on those trains at those times. It is entirely possible that one or more individuals took those particular trains each and every time a Ripper murder occurred. That doesn't make any of them Jack the Ripper. But then, if you had chosen some unremarkable businessman as the victim of what I can only see as a self-serving smear campaign, you wouldn't have found anyone willing to even listen to your theory (because that's all it is), let alone publish it.

Furthermore, I reject your claim that your comparison of some of Vincent's letters to supposed Ripper letters can be deemed valid evidence. As Jonathan has already stated, only two or three of the letters are even acknowledged to be authentic. Did you use even one of the accepted letters for your comparison? By the way, did you employ an established handwriting expert to do the comparison? If so, what is his name and what are his credentials?

And please, don't suggest that I read your book. Your attempts at self-promotion fall on deaf ears in this quarter. I am a book editor by profession, and I weep at the current state of the publishing industry that enables spurious works of "research" to reach print.

You must understand that providing that Van Gogh could travel from Arles to London relates to showing the amount of time it took to travel back then. It seems like such a great distance, but understanding that it was possible to make it in 24 hrs. shows it wasn’t so far.

Well, if Jonathan stated that only two or three of the Ripper letters are authentic, then I must be wrong. I suppose he knows who Jack was then.

Please don’t read my book. Is that better? The last thing I want is to make an editor weep. I prefer an editor that’s looking for something to smile about, and I think my book does that.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

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Google now recognizes two UM entries of this thread and has moved up the rankings about 5 places. The continue exposure of Larner as a fraud is growing. But on to more juicy stuff.

I also forwarded Larners book webpage (along with a dozen or so other slandereous media pages) to the Van Gogh Museum which I have come to find does work with the estate of Van Gogh. I was advised that his information will be forwarded. I've also been made aware that his title work will most likely open himself up for significant legal action as it reads

"The True Story of How Vincent van Gogh Became Jack the Ripper"

When in fact there is no truth to the story at all.

It's one thing to write fiction and satire for entertainment ala Lincoln Vampire hunter and so forth but quite different to pass off fabrications and misinformation as historical accounts. Particularly in a defamitory and slanderous way. Which is exactly what Larner is doing publicly on many many many different media outlets and platforms.

I predict a cease and disist letter in the very near future for Dale Larner.

Thanks for all the hard work you’re doing. Hope you follow your dreams and can make them come true. Don’t let anyone tell you that you can’t follow your dreams.

All the best,

Dale Larner

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Now that you have written your book.. why not pay for a couple forensic hand writing experts to check to see the the writing is the same.. Talk to your local university they will be able to help you..

to be honest.. I can tell you its not.. all you have done is snipped the middle out and matched the edges..

you need to look at the whole letter not part of it.. how much pressure (thickening of the ink etc) was used in writing.

The angle of the whole letters in a word against just one letter..

The loops and curls at the end of the letters, were the cursive .. block so on and so forth..

and I am willing to say if you have a couple of actual experts (and by experts I mean actually trained ones, not ones that have learned it from reading books or doing a online course) I will buy 50 copies of your book and hand then out freely around the schools and universities here in west australia..

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Thanks for all the hard work you’re doing. Hope you follow your dreams and can make them come true. Don’t let anyone tell you that you can’t follow your dreams.

All the best,

Dale Larner

I agree that BishopRyan did the right thing in bringing this to the notice of the Van Gogh Museum. For myself, no, I haven't yet had a dream which made me forget logic and besmirch a famous person's reputation with claims that could at best be described as 'derived from a fanciful imagination' and have absolutely no foundation in reality. And if I did, I would recognise it as one of those things where acting responsibly means you *shouldn't* follow your dream (or in your case, nightmare..).

I have a challenge for you, Dale. Take a summary of your book (or even this thread..) to a free legal service, or your nearest university's legal department, or similar. Put your evidence to them, and ask if they think you are on solid legal ground... Ask (nicely) for their opinion in writing, and post the result here (feel free to black out any names or phone numbers).

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At this point in time, shouldn't this thread at least be moved from the true crime section and into the writers and artists hangout?

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sounds legit.

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Lol I have never heard anything about anyone thinking van Gogh was Jack the Ripper until now...thats funny. The female nurse who was angry at her husband for being with prostitutes is more believable theory than van Gogh. You know who's an interesting guy that im suprised no one ever talks about when on the killing topic lol Prince Vlad from the 14th century...

Well, now you have heard of it. The truth has been hidden for a very long time, and sometimes when the truth comes to light about someone who is well known, the public refuses to believe it because the image of the person in question has been so completely established to be a certain way. So the knee-jerk response is, “No way, that’s ridiculous.”

Ah, but there are facts and hidden images and handwriting matches and evidence and many other things that match up so well. And suddenly the false veneer is scrubbed away, and the true nature of a person is seen, and it’s ugly and it’s real.

If you only saw this thread and had a little chuckle and moved on, then I would suggest having a look at the website to see a little more. Here’s a link to the matches, which includes a handwriting comparison that some others on here can’t seem to accept as believable. You can see for yourself just how similar Van Gogh's handwriting is to Jack the Ripper's.

http://vincentaliasjack.com/wordpress/vangogh_ripper_matches/

Thanks,

Dale Larner

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Well, now you have heard of it. The truth has been hidden for a very long time, and sometimes when the truth comes to light about someone who is well known, the public refuses to believe it because the image of the person in question has been so completely established to be a certain way. So the knee-jerk response is, “No way, that’s ridiculous.”

Ah, but there are facts and hidden images and handwriting matches and evidence and many other things that match up so well. And suddenly the false veneer is scrubbed away, and the true nature of a person is seen, and it’s ugly and it’s real.

If you only saw this thread and had a little chuckle and moved on, then I would suggest having a look at the website to see a little more. Here’s a link to the matches, which includes a handwriting comparison that some others on here can’t seem to accept as believable. You can see for yourself just how similar Van Gogh's handwriting is to Jack the Ripper's.

http://vincentaliasjack.com/wordpress/vangogh_ripper_matches/

Thanks,

Dale Larner

Dale.

It matters not whether the person is famous. If there is no concrete evidence to support a person being the offender, then that's it. End of story. And in this case there is no evidence other than your seeing images in his paintings and as you say, (quote) ''similar'' handwriting. . Many people have similar handwriting. It takes a real handwriting expert to say whether or not a persons handwriting is probably that of the offenders. You are not a handwriting expert and to date you have not had the decency to employ such an expert. Yet you still make these outlandsih claims.

You also mention train timetables stating is is possible to get to London from where VG was living at the time, commit the murders and get back again. Maybe so, but this does not make him guilty of the offences. Again there is no evidence that he used the train at the times in question. If he had the chance to do this, then so did thousands of others. Having the chance, or opportunity to do so does not mean he did.

So far, you have not provided one single shred of evidence that would stand up in a court of law.

You can continue spouting a lot of rubbish to allegedly support your claim or you could make some proper enquiries using real detective work (not fictional images in paintings) and realise what a plonker you are making of yourself. :cry:

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Dale, can I offer a suggestion?

Hire a digital camera, one of those professional rigs, get someone au fait with their use and make a documentary about it. Do things like catch the train as you suggest Vincent did, see if you can demonstrate on camera the timeline and put your evidence on film. I'm sure there are enough amateur Ripperologists out there who'll help you, give on camera info etc.

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Dale, can I offer a suggestion?

Hire a digital camera, one of those professional rigs, get someone au fait with their use and make a documentary about it. Do things like catch the train as you suggest Vincent did, see if you can demonstrate on camera the timeline and put your evidence on film. I'm sure there are enough amateur Ripperologists out there who'll help you, give on camera info etc.

Now here’s someone who is looking at this the right way—positive and constructive. So refreshing. Thanks for the idea, Wearer of Hats. I think you’re on the right track. There’s no telling what other ideas it might lead to.

Good thinking.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

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Something like I said?.....Make proper enquiries using real detective work?.....Hmmmm

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Posted (edited)

Dale, can I offer a suggestion?

Hire a digital camera, one of those professional rigs, get someone au fait with their use and make a documentary about it. Do things like catch the train as you suggest Vincent did, see if you can demonstrate on camera the timeline and put your evidence on film. I'm sure there are enough amateur Ripperologists out there who'll help you, give on camera info etc.

Dale would probably catch a train, go through the chunnel and arrive in london three hours later, forgetting that in VG's day it was steam locos and a ferry lol.

edit....damn,,,,just given it away now have I not?....Oh well....have to help a little I suppose lol

Edited by Englishgent
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Now that he has written his book.. I would still like to see him take the hand writting to get check..

yet time and again.. he doesnt..

no one else could take the credit.. since its on the net and time stamped..

like I said dale.. go take it in and get it check by a couple of experts .. and if they say My God.. this is unbelievable.. the writing matches.. but make sure you get a professional.. not someone who is basically a book learnt hack..

I will buy 50 copies of your books and give it to the librarys and uni's over here in west oz..

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Dale.

It matters not whether the person is famous. If there is no concrete evidence to support a person being the offender, then that's it. End of story. And in this case there is no evidence other than your seeing images in his paintings and as you say, (quote) ''similar'' handwriting. . Many people have similar handwriting. It takes a real handwriting expert to say whether or not a persons handwriting is probably that of the offenders. You are not a handwriting expert and to date you have not had the decency to employ such an expert. Yet you still make these outlandsih claims.

You also mention train timetables stating is is possible to get to London from where VG was living at the time, commit the murders and get back again. Maybe so, but this does not make him guilty of the offences. Again there is no evidence that he used the train at the times in question. If he had the chance to do this, then so did thousands of others. Having the chance, or opportunity to do so does not mean he did.

So far, you have not provided one single shred of evidence that would stand up in a court of law.

You can continue spouting a lot of rubbish to allegedly support your claim or you could make some proper enquiries using real detective work (not fictional images in paintings) and realise what a plonker you are making of yourself. :cry:

Providing the info that Van Gogh could travel from Arles to London in 24 hrs., based on actual train and steamer schedules from 1888, is all about providing information that corroborates the claim. Without it, the cries from the critics who think it was impossible for Van Gogh to travel such a distance and on various occasions back then would continue unabated.

The reality disputes the perception, and therefore I’ve provided the information to quell those cries. But then new cries rise up—“But anyone could have traveled those routes,” they say. Yes, I see.

All of the cries will eventually be quieted.

If making a plonker of myself means enduring the fiery darts of indignation on my march toward victory, then I’m a real plonker for sure.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

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Again notice that dale is not planning on getting the hand writing checked by professionals..

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Dale.

You are only a plonker because so far no real detective work has been done. It is all supposition and pareidolia. As I have already said, there is nothing thus far that would stand up in a court of law.

If you are going to make these accusations, then you must at the very least, have realistic and concrete evidence to back up your claims.

What I will say though, is that so far you have endured the fiery darts very well :)

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Now that he has written his book.. I would still like to see him take the hand writting to get check..

yet time and again.. he doesnt..

no one else could take the credit.. since its on the net and time stamped..

like I said dale.. go take it in and get it check by a couple of experts .. and if they say My God.. this is unbelievable.. the writing matches.. but make sure you get a professional.. not someone who is basically a book learnt hack..

I will buy 50 copies of your books and give it to the librarys and uni's over here in west oz..

I understand your desire to have an expert confirm the handwriting comparison I’ve put forward, but it will simply have to wait until a later date. It’s not something I find necessary at this time. I made an exhaustive analysis of the Jack the Ripper letters and the Van Gogh letters, and finding specific visual matches and many matches in content, I then pieced together the information and presented it as evidence. The reader can determine if that evidence is strong or weak. I believe it is strong and persuasive and obvious. But please also understand that the handwriting comparison is only one of the many carved stones used to build my castle—the book.

Having experts in each of the areas take apart the book and validate what it presents will be something grand, and for some, that’s what they will need in order to believe what has been presented. Regardless, most like to read and see things for themselves and can judge whether they’re being sold crow’s meat when they thought they were getting pheasant.

I’ve chosen to only serve up the best meat and to do so with all the trimmings. I’ve cooked up a full course meal for the reader. As any good chef would do, I’ve taken great care to add just the right amount of seasoning and to get the taste just right. I want my patrons to walk away full and satisfied.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

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mate I'll be honest.. I wont bother buying the book until its been verified.. because your exhaustive analysist of the writings really has been done the wrong way around.. you've snipped the middle out of the letters and tried to match the other ends..

anyone could do that with anyones hand writing.. I am currently looking at a request list from one of my rigs for parts.. and I could do the same thing with what he has written and how I write.. our style of writing is close to being the same.. and if I did what you did with the letters.. people will say its the same person writing both..

I think your book will be like a Mrs Mac's Pie (the aussies here will understand this) it looks good ... but when you take a bite.. instead of meat.. you find a lot of gravy and gristle and no substance..

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Posted (edited)

I can't believe the thread isn't locked yet.

I have never heard of someone trying to promote a book as much as this guy. Everytime someone asked for strong evidence, he says its in the book, this is a crock of s**t!

As numerous people have said it was well documented that he was in Arles at the time of the murders, now if van gogh was a serial killer as you have suggested then why would he travel all the way to london and rush back when we know all serial killers cherish that kill and don't want to rush it. when he could of just killed someone in arles!

overall this is the biggest load of rubbish and the mods should close it as this is just basically free advertising for his slanderous book!

Edited by mrmorgan

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OOOOOOO OOOOOOO I just saw bigfoot and Elvis taking about what his hound dog wouldn't do...............Now thats believable.

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Now here’s someone who is looking at this the right way—positive and constructive. So refreshing. Thanks for the idea, Wearer of Hats. I think you’re on the right track. There’s no telling what other ideas it might lead to.

Good thinking.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

No. Someone who is looking it the right way is someone who's asking for REAL EVIDENCE.

We gave you many chances Larner, yet you are unable to provide one single piece of evidence showing that your theory is true. You've been doing this for months, on numerous forums.

You are obviously not a serious researcher. You are just another liar trying to find a way to pay his mortgage by creating a false theory about the Ripper murders. We have seen this a thousand times, and I don't understand why the Mods are keeping this thread open.

You won't find a publisher. Why ?? Because you are accusing a legendary figure of being a killer without having a single piece of real evidence to back up your claim. No serious publisher in his right mind will publish your book, because if he do that he'll be sued by relatives of Van Gogh, simple as that.

You are committing a crime Larner. Accusing somebody of being a serial killer when you have no evidence to prove it is a serious crime.

I hope you won't make any money out of your lies. I really hope so. I, as a student in Criminology, can't stand liars like yourself. You said in your introduction in the community lounge that you are a dreamer. Well....Keep on dreaming, dreamer.

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Good question. Vincent could come and go as he pleased in Arles. He had no job and was accountable to no one. His younger brother, Theo, who lived in Paris, paid all of his bills.

Thanks,

Dale Larner

Do you actually know how far away Arles is from London?! Especially in 1888...... It's not like hopping on a plane. lol

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No. Someone who is looking it the right way is someone who's asking for REAL EVIDENCE.

We gave you many chances Larner, yet you are unable to provide one single piece of evidence showing that your theory is true. You've been doing this for months, on numerous forums.

You are obviously not a serious researcher. You are just another liar trying to find a way to pay his mortgage by creating a false theory about the Ripper murders. We have seen this a thousand times, and I don't understand why the Mods are keeping this thread open.

You won't find a publisher. Why ?? Because you are accusing a legendary figure of being a killer without having a single piece of real evidence to back up your claim. No serious publisher in his right mind will publish your book, because if he do that he'll be sued by relatives of Van Gogh, simple as that.

You are committing a crime Larner. Accusing somebody of being a serial killer when you have no evidence to prove it is a serious crime.

I hope you won't make any money out of your lies. I really hope so. I, as a student in Criminology, can't stand liars like yourself. You said in your introduction in the community lounge that you are a dreamer. Well....Keep on dreaming, dreamer.

well said man.

this fella is a complete scam artist and nobody should buy his book

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I can't believe the thread isn't locked yet.

I have never heard of someone trying to promote a book as much as this guy. Everytime someone asked for strong evidence, he says its in the book, this is a crock of s**t!

As numerous people have said it was well documented that he was in Arles at the time of the murders, now if van gogh was a serial killer as you have suggested then why would he travel all the way to london and rush back when we know all serial killers cherish that kill and don't want to rush it. when he could of just killed someone in arles!

overall this is the biggest load of rubbish and the mods should close it as this is just basically free advertising for his slanderous book!

Van Gogh had previously lived in London, and I believe he committed his first murder while living there. He then returned to London fifteen years later to kill more prostitutes as a mature serial killer using the name Jack the Ripper. He was highly motivated to make the trips from Arles to London.

He didn’t murder in Arles because it was too small a town and would attract attention to him. Arles was his safe place.

Not rubbish and not slanderous.

Did you see the handwriting comparison? It looks like evidence to me.

http://vincentaliasjack.com/wordpress/vangogh_ripper_matches/

Dale Larner

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