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Big Bad Voodoo

Jesus 'died on Friday, April 3, 33AD'

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Posted (edited)

H

he was a Prefect, which means that he came under the Governor of Syria, which is not quite the same. And calling him a governor has only lead to historians assuming he never existed, as there was no governor of Judea but Judea a subdivision of the Syrian province.

In this case, there was no governor of Syria during Pilate's first six years in office, since the post was vacant.

And if it is true that John the Baptist began his preaching in 15th year of the emperor Tiberius (28 AD), then the execution of Jesus had to have ocurred after that time.

http://www.earlychri...actspilate.html

As to whether Pilate was dismissed, retired or was just replaced with the change of emperors, I'm not sure which is true.

Edited by TheMcGuffin

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In this case, there was no governor of Syria during Pilate's first six years in office, since the post was vacant.

Correct, which does not mean that Pilatus got "promoted". There were another dozen or so prefects in the Syrian province, it just meant that instead of reporting to Antioch he had to report to the next higher authority. In about 300 AD the prefects were abolished and there was only the Syrian governor responsible for the Syria-Palestine area.

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Correct, which does not mean that Pilatus got "promoted". There were another dozen or so prefects in the Syrian province, it just meant that instead of reporting to Antioch he had to report to the next higher authority. In about 300 AD the prefects were abolished and there was only the Syrian governor responsible for the Syria-Palestine area.

Officially he had the military title of prefect, in command of auxiliary troops instead of legions, because he was of euestrian rather than senatorial or consular rank, although quite of few sources do still call him a provincial governor, even if only of a small, third-rank province. He was even allowed to issue his own coins.

http://ecole.evansville.edu/articles/pilate.html

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Officially he had the military title of prefect, in command of auxiliary troops instead of legions, because he was of euestrian rather than senatorial or consular rank, although quite of few sources do still call him a provincial governor, even if only of a small, third-rank province. He was even allowed to issue his own coins.

http://ecole.evansvi...les/pilate.html

Any Roman military commander could issue coins, provided he adhered to the established standards of size and weights to pay his people.That was not a very special privilege.

The "sources" you quote a generally not contemporary with the happenings in Palestine. 60 years later somebody insisted in calling Pilatus a "governor"or ducem instead of prefectus, and mostly people related to the church. That stuck, to the point that, once we understood Roman history through their own records instead of through the gospel, historians were convinced he never existed. And nobody would have bothered were it not because he sponsored some modifications to the arena in Cesarea Maritima where a plaque was unearthed that reads: sponsored by Pontius Pilatus. After a long search it was discovered that he was a subaltern of the Syrian governor.

Having said all that, the other aspect is that he probably had nothing to do personally with the dead of JC and that it was some cohort leader stationed in J'lem who decided to nail him to the cross. Pilatus' place of work was in Ceasarea Maritima, about 50 miles away and there was no sound reason for him to be in J'lem during passover when the tempers were boiling high.

In any case, Mr. Pilatus was a very little and not quite bright light who hardly finds a mention in the Roman annals of the time

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OK, point taken.But "That" type of eclipse would have no bearing on the darkness falling upon Jerusalem when Jesus was crucified. Unless you are making a point that I have failed to see?

Bear in mind that I'm still agnostic as to whether Jesus even historically existed.

However. I have seen arguments made that the Sixth Hour (which has been translated as Noon in today's text's) would equally make sense as being Midnight.

Luke 23:44-45 could be translated as:

It was now about the sixth hour, and there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour, for the sun had stopped shining. And the curtain of the temple was torn in two.

Matthew 27:45:

But from the sixth hour there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.

Mark 15:43

At the sixth hour darkness came over the whole land until the ninth hour.

No darkness in John, of course.

The argument, essentially, is that the beginning of Luke 45 "for the sun had stopped shining" was a marginal gloss.

In which case - the light of the moon being eclipsed would result in a darkness over the entire land.

I don't particularly have any opinion either way. I'm just reporting the position for further discussion.

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I hate that this may seem like a silly question, but did the death of Jesus make the earthquake or did the earthquake kill Jesus?

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Posted (edited)

I hate that this may seem like a silly question, but did the death of Jesus make the earthquake or did the earthquake kill Jesus?

According to the Gospel of Matthew, the earthquake happened after Jesus "gave up his spirit"

The other Gospels don't mention any earthquake coinciding with the death of Jesus.

Edited by Archimedes

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Bear in mind that I'm still agnostic as to whether Jesus even historically existed.

However. I have seen arguments made that the Sixth Hour (which has been translated as Noon in today's text's) would equally make sense as being Midnight.

Luke 23:44-45 could be translated as:

It was now about the sixth hour, and there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour, for the sun had stopped shining. And the curtain of the temple was torn in two.

Matthew 27:45:

But from the sixth hour there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.

Mark 15:43

At the sixth hour darkness came over the whole land until the ninth hour.

No darkness in John, of course.

The argument, essentially, is that the beginning of Luke 45 "for the sun had stopped shining" was a marginal gloss.

In which case - the light of the moon being eclipsed would result in a darkness over the entire land.

I don't particularly have any opinion either way. I'm just reporting the position for further discussion.

I'm not a Hebrew scholar, but I believe they considered nightfall before the Sabboth to be the end of any type of work, even carrying food or firewood or water was forbidden. So, I very much doubt that they would be out after dark, in the very middle of the night, taking down Crucified criminals. The whole idea of leg breaking them was to get them dead before dusk.

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I'm not a Hebrew scholar, but I believe they considered nightfall before the Sabboth to be the end of any type of work, even carrying food or firewood or water was forbidden. So, I very much doubt that they would be out after dark, in the very middle of the night, taking down Crucified criminals. The whole idea of leg breaking them was to get them dead before dusk.

The Jewish day starts at sunset - hence what we'd consider to be the night before is the start of their Sabbath.

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The Earthquake was horizontal that was when He went down into hell to preach to the fallen angels and liberate all the Patriarches,Prophets and all who died which had Faith in Him as the Saviour. Paradise was a place in Hell where the Saints were kept until the Crucifixtion, they were comforted; Satan could not hurt them. You can read about Paradise in Luke 16 about the Lazarus went to Abrahams Bosom (Paradise) and the Rich man (the Rich man went to hell) Many people say this is a parable but it is an actual story they are real people. Jesus Christ came to die to pay humanitys sin debt which was owed to the Father and it demanded death.

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Posted (edited)

When Jesus Christ died on the Cross; the Earth quaked horizontally instead of vertical; that is why the earth quaked .. He went dowm in to Abrahams Bosom which was a part of hell to take "Captivity Captive" from Satan He also preached to the fallen angels imprisoned there, which has 5 compartments. You may read about Abrahams Bosom or Paradise which is now empty in Luke 16.

When it got dark that was when the Father turned away from Him for becoming a curse on the Cross for mans sin; He was a Sacrifice...."The Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world" who is now seated at the right hand of the Father. He did a Finished Work on the Cross He said "It is Finished"!

Done our sin debt paid in full!!!! Praise God!!!! and now we can rest in Him those of us who are Believers and are saved and cleansed by His Precious Blood. Before He was Crucified the Temple Priest never sat down they were constantly sacrificing little Lambs which represented Christ. In AD 70 He had Titus destroy the temple because they would not quit sacrficing.

Edited by Devilanse

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how can you pinpoint the exact date of death of someone who does not exist?

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The Earthquake was horizontal that was when He went down into hell to preach to the fallen angels and liberate all the Patriarches,Prophets and all who died which had Faith in Him as the Saviour. Paradise was a place in Hell where the Saints were kept until the Crucifixtion, they were comforted; Satan could not hurt them. You can read about Paradise in Luke 16 about the Lazarus went to Abrahams Bosom (Paradise) and the Rich man (the Rich man went to hell) Many people say this is a parable but it is an actual story they are real people. Jesus Christ came to die to pay humanitys sin debt which was owed to the Father and it demanded death.

Do people really still believe Hell is underground? Is then Heaven in the sky?
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Do people really still believe Hell is underground? Is then Heaven in the sky?

clearly, hasnt deep sea research shown this to be correct or space research shown astronaughts the way to heaven ;)

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Why Do They Take The Mention Of An Earthquake So Literally?? Maybe The Earthquake Was Said To Have Happened Only To Emphasize The Fact That A Tragedy Was Occuring .. FGS, Christ Was Dying!! This May Also Be The Reason Why The Sky Darkened ..

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http://www.dailymail...spels-date.html

Jesus died on Friday, April 3, 33AD, according to an investigation which matches his death to an earthquake.

The investigation, from the International Geology Review, looked at earthquake activity around the Dead Sea, which is around 13 miles from Jerusalem.

The Gospel of Matthew, Chapter 27, says that as Jesus lay dying on the cross, an earthquake shook the area, scattering graves and making the sky go dark.

However, putting the jigsaw together, Williams said the clues were:

  • All four gospels and Tacitus in Annals (XV,44) agree that the crucifixion occurred when Pontius Pilate was procurator of Judea from 26-36 AD
  • All four gospels say the crucifixion occurred on a Friday
  • All four gospels agree that Jesus died a few hours before the beginning of the Jewish Sabbath (nightfall on a Friday)
  • The synoptic gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke) indicate that Jesus died before nightfall on the 14th day of Nisan; right before the start of the Passover meal
  • John’s gospel differs from the 'Synoptic Gospels'; apparently indicating that Jesus died before nightfall on the 15th day of Nisan

ok sorry but you're going to have to have more than the gospels as your proof. the bible is hardly a factual historical document.

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How could Jesus have dies in the year 33AD when AD stands for after death. So they are now tring to say Jesus died 33 years after he died? And the whole notion of using AD (after death) is redundant unto itself because all believers say that he 'died' on the cross but was resurected and thus Jesus is not dead.

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How could Jesus have dies in the year 33AD when AD stands for after death. So they are now tring to say Jesus died 33 years after he died? And the whole notion of using AD (after death) is redundant unto itself because all believers say that he 'died' on the cross but was resurected and thus Jesus is not dead.

AD stands for Anno Domini, or year of the lord, generally considered his birthyear.

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I have no idea where this AD="After Death" assumption started, but it's endlessly obnoxious.

Undoubtedly religious types will use this piece of "scientific data" to flaunt their beliefs, thus continuing the "us against them" mentality running rampant in modern theology.

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The Bible is hardly science fact. It's like getting someone to pick a story book and trying to prove that the fiction is fact. It is impossible!! Forget the Bible it is a bunch of puzzle stories written by men, not the word from God... Which it should be but.. oh yeah he don't exist

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bible is a collection of stories written by men to explain things when science had not come around and common sense was to the level of a 6 year old.

science = evidence. example: humans evolved from apes cuz we have dna testing and we look and act lik them.

religion = faith. doomsday will happen at 2012 cuz howard camping heard the word of GOD! whoops just a april fools prank x) no offense

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I have no idea where this AD="After Death" assumption started, but it's endlessly obnoxious.

It comes from Primary School Religious Education lessons misremembered by people who should have been either paying more attention or less, either way the confusion wouldn't have happened.

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How could Jesus have dies in the year 33AD when AD stands for after death. So they are now tring to say Jesus died 33 years after he died? And the whole notion of using AD (after death) is redundant unto itself because all believers say that he 'died' on the cross but was resurected and thus Jesus is not dead.

The first time I read that in this thread I thought it was a joke.

But after the second time I start to worry...

Please don't PM (= Post Mortem) me, lol. I don't want private messages from the 'beyond'.

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Posted (edited)

what about considering the possibility that Jesus never even existed? that would be the more scientific way to do things. They cant use the sedimentary record to pinpoint an exact day, that is BS anyway, they are just assuming it was on a Friday of the week in question as told in the "scriptures" *Snip* ...

Edited by Karlis
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Phenomena that can't be reproduced in a lab are not necessarily BS. We have all kinds of unquantifiable happenings right here on our little blue planet. In fact, I would wager most of you posting on this thread are aware that there is more going on in the world than we can really measure or observe. That being said, the Bible is a book, written by mortal men to control the population en masse, not a book written by some ruthless deity and his son's friends. I think you all are correct that this "breakthrough" is a real reach.

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