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Mr.United_Nations

Could Syria civil war start a new cold war?

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Well turkey wants to set up a safe zone inside Syria, however I think Iran and Russia would think the West would act illegal

there's already small safe zone since turkey got their forced on borders since the shootdown of their airplan

all syrian troops fell back and the area was captured by rebels

russia is going to back up this regim forever .. read my reply to and then about the potential gas passing from qatar to europe by syrian lands

that will make russian gas market goes down and crash

russia got alot to lose .. and their mistake was to side with dictators against the people of that country

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Through out the past year Syrian people have been protesting against Assad which they wanted to him to change and step down, however forward that today thousands have died and fled on both sides. Now comes a new horror that Syria will use Chemical weapons against foreign interventions or feels threatened. Now Israel has said it will consider a plan if Israel is attacked, and again another uneasy report that is Iran will use force if foreign countries or organisations intervening in the crisis including Arab nations.

Go back to 1991 Iraq launched scud attacks in Israel and Saudi Arabia, however none contained any chemicals much to the relief of everyone. Now Sryia has scuds and could launch at anyone. With apparent backing of Iran, China and Russia and the rebels backing with the West, could it turn ugly or is this a war if words.

What is your opinion?

The UN mandate on Libya gave the West the permission to protect civilians. It did not authorise the ground invasion and air campaign to destroy the Libyan armed forces. It did not authorise the assasination attempts on Gaddafis life or his 'man love' execution which is out there on the internet. This is why Russia and China now refuse to back us on action in Syria.

From their perspective they know they cant trust us.

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Posted (edited)

Kos, I don't think you understand the vast amount of destruction the west (be it Nato, or w/e) would need to wreak upon Assad to even create a no fly zone. All air defenses need to be destroyed, as well as arms depots, or CC stations. Very rapidly it becomes just another western expedition into yet another mideast country that will welcome us for about 3 weeks before the suicide attacks happen. And we don;t need that ****. Our economy is in the tank, we have tons of issues, and your country really has little use besides a pawn piece in our little chessgame with Iran. I know I'm coming across harsh, and I apologize for the tone, but there is no way that the west can help without it causing us more issues and Syria isn't worth it.

Edited by wittyusernamefailed
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Kos, I don't think you understand the vast amount of destruction the west (be it Nato, or w/e) would need to wreak upon Assad to even create a no fly zone. All air defenses need to be destroyed, as well as arms depots, or CC stations. Very rapidly it becomes just another western expedition into yet another mideast country that will welcome us for about 3 weeks before the suicide attacks happen. And we don;t need that ****. Our economy is in the tank, we have tons of issues, and your country really has little use besides a pawn piece in our little chessgame with Iran. I know I'm coming across harsh, and I apologize for the tone, but there is no way that the west can help without it causing us more issues and Syria isn't worth it.

Syrians are a diverse group, they are not muslim muslim.

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I understand that. Which is one of the main reasons we need to stay out. The lack of clearly defined sides that we can chart policy with is asking for a diplomatic disasterpiece.

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Libyan rebels are in Aleppo helping the rebels, so what's Iran guna do? stick to its word?

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I think it reeks of BS.

The moment I heard on an American news site "Syria has Chemical and biological WMD's".... I was like "Ah here we go again".... "Where are the ones from Iraq?"

I have a question.... Why does the US give Israel a load of money each year and why do we constantly have to help them? What do we get in return? Kinda confused by this and nobody seems to ask it?

In Israel they kill and torture civilians every single day.... Yet we throw money at them and are strong allies with them. But most other countries who kills and tortures civillians we go flying in there like "superheroes" or "freedom fighters"... lol

Straight up inaccurate. And as NRN said, Syria has admitted to having chemical weapons. All a country needs is precursor chemicals and a lab like one used for fertilizer/pesticide production. Iran and NK as well as Saddam's Iraq were most likely the source of the precursors. And not to stir up such a tired beaten up old subject but there were many convoys of heavy trucks traveling between Syria and Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. Some of Assad's actual weapons could conceivably be from Iraqi stocks.

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ohh really .. i bet you don't reliaze that if syria let qatar gas exported to europe

the russian gas will go downhill and no one will buy it no more

since qatar oil is less expensive to extract and more easy therefore cheaper

than russian gas therfore russian gas .. bye bye

am sure your goverments keeps telling you quada and stuff as excuse not to do their duty

toward a country that IS part of UN

the free army is orgarnized .. it's formed by the original army defects got experince

and few volunteers chosen carefully

and it's all about israel isn't ? the west all it cares about israel

well they better hope israel doesn't stick it's nose in our country to save this corrupted system

but like i said really .. and then we never really expected the west to help

they're punch of double standards countries who care about nothing but oil and greed .. or gas

we never really care if they help or not

in case you haven't noticed we are fighting russia , china , iran , hezboallah , syrian army , iraqis shiites mercenries

and the west as it keeps covering up for the regim despite the loud statements .. no action

however in any case we don't care about the west

even if the whole world decided to fight us and stand on the system side

we're gonna take our freedom with a boot on all of their noses

No, I didn't know about the natural gas issue from Qatar. But that really doesn't help the US - maybe Europe but somehow I doubt they would "rock the boat" with Russia unless the gas was very much less expensive. You have to face facts.... the west attacking in Syria is a lose lose for the west. Unless Turkey and maybe the Arab League were willing to actually put in troops an air campaign wouldn't help so much. And Assad looks to be going down even as it is now. It just will probably take quite a bit longer and many more dead, unfortunately.

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Straight up inaccurate. And as NRN said, Syria has admitted to having chemical weapons. All a country needs is precursor chemicals and a lab like one used for fertilizer/pesticide production. Iran and NK as well as Saddam's Iraq were most likely the source of the precursors. And not to stir up such a tired beaten up old subject but there were many convoys of heavy trucks traveling between Syria and Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. Some of Assad's actual weapons could conceivably be from Iraqi stocks.

How is it inaccurate? I've seen it happening, I've seen people going over there to help them. I've seen the videos of these streets where civilians are being terrorised by the Isreali Military.

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How is it inaccurate? I've seen it happening, I've seen people going over there to help them. I've seen the videos of these streets where civilians are being terrorised by the Isreali Military.

I just mean that you exaggerated. No civilians are being tortured and killed "daily" Kept down with a boot on their necks, yes. But that's partly justified by the killings during the last intifada. Don't want to start an argument - just pointing out that there are TWO SIDES to this problem and the Israelis are NOT Satan incarnate like the world portrays them. They have the land and aren't going anywhere but the Palestinians keep dreaming of pushing them into the sea. It could be settled - but it won't be. Not until one side or the other is destroyed.
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Reports saying that there is large concentration of naval ships from China, Russia, USA and Turkey in the East Med.

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Reports saying that there is large concentration of naval ships from China, Russia, USA and Turkey in the East Med.

I hope they all play nice and act professionally. Mistakes and accidents are dangerous in such a situation.

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Posted (edited)

I just mean that you exaggerated. No civilians are being tortured and killed "daily" Kept down with a boot on their necks, yes. But that's partly justified by the killings during the last intifada. Don't want to start an argument - just pointing out that there are TWO SIDES to this problem and the Israelis are NOT Satan incarnate like the world portrays them. They have the land and aren't going anywhere but the Palestinians keep dreaming of pushing them into the sea. It could be settled - but it won't be. Not until one side or the other is destroyed.

Didn't say that at all.

I said that I don't understand why the US pays so much to Isreal when Isreal treats is people like other countries do that we have invaded supposedly for that reason.

I've seen the videos of the civilians having military come into their houses and beat them. They harrass civilians and torture them.

Reports saying that there is large concentration of naval ships from China, Russia, USA and Turkey in the East Med.

What are the reasons for them being there exactly? That's what I don't understand. You can jsut send a Naval fleet into an area with no explanation? Is it being called a "naval exercise" by all sides? lol

Edited by Coffey

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I just mean that you exaggerated. No civilians are being tortured and killed "daily" Kept down with a boot on their necks, yes. But that's partly justified by the killings during the last intifada. Don't want to start an argument - just pointing out that there are TWO SIDES to this problem and the Israelis are NOT Satan incarnate like the world portrays them. They have the land and aren't going anywhere but the Palestinians keep dreaming of pushing them into the sea. It could be settled - but it won't be. Not until one side or the other is destroyed.

The Palestinians were alarmed and disturbed by Jewish immigrants into their land.

"They treat Arabs with hostility and cruelty, unscrupulously deprive them of their rights, insult them without cause, and even boast of such deeds; and none opposes this despicable and dangerous inclination." Ahad Aham, 1891

"This Western purblindness is itself a hallmark of the Palestinian problem. The Palestinians are not the first and probably not be the last to be dispossessed and banished; but so far they are, perhaps, in the unique position where not only is their Catastrophe ruled out of the Western Court as being irrelevent to their reactions against its perpetrators, but where these very reactions are held to incriminate them". - Walid al-Khalidi, Palestinian historian.

"We are a people. There was no such thing as a Palestinian people. It is not as though there was a Palestinian people and we came and threw them out and took their country away from them. They did not exist." Golda Meir, former Prime Minister of Israel

"I define the Jewish national home to mean the creation of an administration which would arise out of the natural condition of the country - always safeguarding the interests of the non-Jews of the country - with the hope that by Jewish immigration, Palestine would ultimately become as Jewish as England is English."

"I trust in God that a Jewish state will come about; but it will come about not through political declaration, but by the sweat and blood of the Jewish people." - Chaim Weizmann

"In Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country... the four Great Powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the seven hundred thousand Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land... So far as Palestine is concerned, the Powers have made no statement of fact which is not admittedly wrong, and no declaration of policy which at least in the letter, they have not always intended to violate." Lord Balfour, 1919

There are orthodox Jews that believe Zionism is a blasphemy, a violation of the Word of God, who would - in His own time - lead the Jews back to the 'promised land'.

"The cause of unrest in Palestine, and the only cause, arises from the Zionist movement and our promises and pledges to it." - Winston Churchill

"There can only be one National Home in Palestine, and that a Jewish one, and no equality in the partnership between Jews and Arabs, but a Jewish predominance as soon as the numbers of that race are sufficiently increased." Dr. Elder, the acting chairman of the Zionist Commission, speaking before a British Commission of Enquiry in 1921

"To defend the fact that I couldn not accept Arabs in my trade union, the Histradruth; to defend preaching to housewives that they not buy at Arab stores; to defend the fact that we stood guard at orchards to prevent Arab workers from getting jobs there... to pour kerosene on Arab tomatoes; to attack Jewish housewives in the markets and smash the Arab eggs they had bought..." - David Ben Gurion, leader of the Histradruth

"Between ourselves it must be clear that there is no room for both people together in this country... we shall not achieve our goal of being an independent people with the Arabs in this small country. And there is no other way than to transfer the Arabs from here to the neighouring countries, to transfer them all; not one village, not one tribe should be left." - from the diary of Joseph Weitz, administrator in charge of Zionist colonization

"The Fund strove to avoid the isolation of villages, as this was liable to impair the secure and smooth progress... endeavors were made to create blocks of settlements, a sort of skeleton of Jewish districts... which bore a military value, either because they overlooked centres of Jewish activity already operated or likely to be so in the future or the occupation of which provided control over communications..."

"In the decade preceding the establishment of the state, the decisive stage in the struggle for the future state, a number of land operations were carried out which were of supreme consequence in the Jewish war of independence... When the great day arrived, and the United Nations decided to establish a Jewish state, those who were responsible for defining its boundaries were compelled to include the lands bought by the Jews, together with the settlements thereon. The frontiers of the new state which march in so curiously a winding fashion were largely determined by the success of the Jews in creating faits accomplis." - Abraham Granott, former chairman of the board of directors of the Jewish National Fund

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Can we keep Palestine/Israel debate in another topic? we all know those debates can be heated at times when members talk about that.

@Coffey maybe they are massive sea rave or just a huge stand off lol.

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Can we keep Palestine/Israel debate in another topic? we all know those debates can be heated at times when members talk about that.

@Coffey maybe they are massive sea rave or just a huge stand off lol.

Hahahaha I love the picture that paints in my head. Loads of UV lights all over the ships with laser shows and huge speakers being carried by Navy helicopters. lol (only if that was how it really was)

They should settle war with dance off's and stuff. lol

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NRN I think the Russians are there to show the flag and retrieve their people if the war gets worse. Putin seems interested in flexing his muscle but I don't think he would intentionally start a conflict that could quickly escalate out of control by anyone. It's the accidents and mistakes when so many vessels are so close that is troubling.

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Kos, I don't think you understand the vast amount of destruction the west (be it Nato, or w/e) would need to wreak upon Assad to even create a no fly zone. All air defenses need to be destroyed, as well as arms depots, or CC stations. Very rapidly it becomes just another western expedition into yet another mideast country that will welcome us for about 3 weeks before the suicide attacks happen. And we don;t need that ****. Our economy is in the tank, we have tons of issues, and your country really has little use besides a pawn piece in our little chessgame with Iran. I know I'm coming across harsh, and I apologize for the tone, but there is no way that the west can help without it causing us more issues and Syria isn't worth it.

no need for apology i'd rather hear some one admit a harsh truth than to make a sweet nice lie

this is what i been trying to say .. for the west syria is not worth it

not that we need western help anyway

however i'd be angry .. more than angry actually p***ed off just as all of my people will

if the west interfer after the fall of system

they won't interfer to save people but after we won they will interfer and invade

hope they don't coz if they do it's going to be a long war for us

coz we won't accept their interfernce after ward an interference soaked in our blood

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no need for apology i'd rather hear some one admit a harsh truth than to make a sweet nice lie

this is what i been trying to say .. for the west syria is not worth it

not that we need western help anyway

however i'd be angry .. more than angry actually p***ed off just as all of my people will

if the west interfer after the fall of system

they won't interfer to save people but after we won they will interfer and invade

hope they don't coz if they do it's going to be a long war for us

coz we won't accept their interfernce after ward an interference soaked in our blood

I don't think you'll have to worry about that - except in the case of securing the chem/bio stocks. It would be a shame, I agree, for the rebels to rid the country of Assad and his thugs only to be attacked for not securing the WMD's. The world simply cannot have that stuff floating around unsecured. Air strikes would just leave multiple toxic waste sites in Syria and troops on the ground to actually secure and account for the inventories will lead to combat between the rebels and the West. Or the rebels could do the smart thing and deal so that the security of the WMD's is assured.

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Posted (edited)

I don't think you'll have to worry about that - except in the case of securing the chem/bio stocks. It would be a shame, I agree, for the rebels to rid the country of Assad and his thugs only to be attacked for not securing the WMD's. The world simply cannot have that stuff floating around unsecured. Air strikes would just leave multiple toxic waste sites in Syria and troops on the ground to actually secure and account for the inventories will lead to combat between the rebels and the West. Or the rebels could do the smart thing and deal so that the security of the WMD's is assured.

ohh please this WMD will be the excuse for attacking us for sure ..

and based on your opinion western people will completely accept it

and let's face is the west or usa are not the most honest nations ever they been know for dirty schems

however am very pleased that the events in my country have shown the world's power nations real face

which is .. ugly , hideious . and disgusting faces on display for all to see

as they are willing to let many die but when it comes to aftermath they are willing to fight like rapid dogs

still i think should they attack they will get a good come back from the rebels

we won't let our self defense weapons be stolen by greedy nations

who only stood by watching us die and done nothing but talk

we fought a tyrannt for two years from bare hand to small arms to big arms

and few on numbers and we will manage to win

i can't see why we won't manage to win over the westerns forces afterwards " should the decide to attack " too

how on earth they ask us not to dislike the west .. i have no idea :D

Edited by Knight Of Shadows

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ohh please this WMD will be the excuse for attacking us for sure ..

and based on your opinion western people will completely accept it

and let's face is the west or usa are not the most honest nations ever they been know for dirty schems

however am very pleased that the events in my country have shown the world's power nations real face

which is .. ugly , hideious . and disgusting faces on display for all to see

as they are willing to let many die but when it comes to aftermath they are willing to fight like rapid dogs

still i think should they attack they will get a good come back from the rebels

we won't let our self defense weapons be stolen by greedy nations

who only stood by watching us die and done nothing but talk

we fought a tyrannt for two years from bare hand to small arms to big arms

and few on numbers and we will manage to win

i can't see why we won't manage to win over the westerns forces afterwards " should the decide to attack " too

how on earth they ask us not to dislike the west .. i have no idea :D

Us? Where you from? Syria or Iran?

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He is a Sryian and anti Assad

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Posted (edited)

He is a Sryian and anti Assad

Thanks for answering.

I only wondered as it's helpful to get information form someone who is actually there. I don't trust the media.

Edited by Coffey

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Thanks for answering.

I only wondered as it's helpful to get information form someone who is actually there. I don't trust the media.

Well he can tell that the Assad government are just big lies

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ohh please this WMD will be the excuse for attacking us for sure ..

and based on your opinion western people will completely accept it

and let's face is the west or usa are not the most honest nations ever they been know for dirty schems

however am very pleased that the events in my country have shown the world's power nations real face

which is .. ugly , hideious . and disgusting faces on display for all to see

as they are willing to let many die but when it comes to aftermath they are willing to fight like rapid dogs

still i think should they attack they will get a good come back from the rebels

we won't let our self defense weapons be stolen by greedy nations

who only stood by watching us die and done nothing but talk

we fought a tyrannt for two years from bare hand to small arms to big arms

and few on numbers and we will manage to win

i can't see why we won't manage to win over the westerns forces afterwards " should the decide to attack " too

how on earth they ask us not to dislike the west .. i have no idea :D

So you believe that the people in western countries should sit back and just trust that no al qeada types will get their hands on ANY chemical weapons? Do you also think that IF one or two of those weapons were stolen and used to kill a few hundred westerners in Europe or the US we should just accept that because we didn't stop Syrians from killing EACH OTHER? Your own people started this conflict by demonstrating and refusing to be ruled by a dictator. He chose to kill you because he wants to continue as a dictator. The West is NOT involved in that except to the extent that Arabs tend to blame the West or other "outsiders" for any problems they have. You'll have to fight against the West also if the rebels do not prove they have secured the WMD. And if a WMD is ever used against a western target, Syria would be held liable to be punished for it. These things are not bullets or artillery. They kill THOUSANDS at a blow. In a major city with the right wind/ weather conditions maybe tens of thousands. Even the Russians are distancing themselves from him since he mentioned using them against "foreign" elements. They know that it will mean a catastrophic war with Israel if he uses them. And when he is killed or runs away, those weapons will have to be secured by someone the West feels they can trust to keep them safe. It may well be that some Syrian group meets that description but I can't imagine who it would be just now.

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