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H.H. Holmes

Unsolved Serial Killings Map

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Maybe I'm 'thick' or something... but it's not working for me... I've tried several times over the past few days and all I accomplished was to add a lake (by accident) which I was able to delete....

You are doing better than I am.. I can't get it to edit at all. I figured it was because the collaboration options weren't turned on.

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You are doing better than I am.. I can't get it to edit at all. I figured it was because the collaboration options weren't turned on.

That's because I have decades of experience in programming and computers to help me get further before I get stuck! :tsu:

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Sorry for the delayed update to this thread.

I added a few more unknown serial killings to the map, including two "Jack the Ripper"s one from Atlanta and the other from New York who were active in the 1910's, both were much different in their choice of victims.

The "Atlanta Ripper" case is very interesting and shares many similarities to both the original Jack the Ripper crimes (mutilation of sexual organs and no apparent sexual assault) and to a string of over 40 axe murders of mulatto women that occurred during the same time period (the 20 victims of the Atlanta killer were all mulatto, also both cases went unsolved). It is safe to assume that this was not the work of the original ripper who, for some reason, moved to Atlanta, since the time frame would be extreme and the only witness report described a well dressed black man. However, the string of axe murders is interesting to consider with the similarities in victim type and the close (perhaps overlapping) time frame between the two murders. I will add an entry on the Axe Murders once I get to it's place in the book and I will try to search the internet for other information. There was also the New Orleans Axeman who was also active earlier in the century, although most of his victims were white couples.

I am trying to be more descriptive without taking too much from the book. I hope my new entries shed a little more light on each case more thoroughly.

To the question about editing the map: As far as I am aware the map in set to "public" access, so there shouldn't be any trouble adding your own entries. I'll double check to make sure it is open to the public, but I am almost positive it has been set to allow anyone to edit it.

Edited by H.H. Holmes

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Here are three from Arizona;Angela Brosso-november 8th 1992 and Melanie Bernas-September 21st 1993 in Phoenix both were linked through forensic evidence.In a seperate case Diana Vicari fron October 23 1992 in Tuscon.All 3 were never solved,but I am working on changing that,email me if you want more info on these cases.Good luck with your list.

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The police never believed that Joann and Roberts murders were connected to the Orchard Apartment Murders. Alys Rankin as well as Roberts head have never been found to date, and wether it was the same killer or a copycat, as they thought at the time...they got away scott free.

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The Child Murders at Robin Hood Hills is quite known though, but as it is right now, unsolved.

The trial of the West Memphis Three was a kangaroo-court that costed them many years.

Watch Paradise Lost.

Another case that came to mind, that was sort of solved though, but had another story following it, was Herb Baumeisters killings in Fox Hollow Farm and the couple who bought that house later.

Here's a sneak peak of it>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W70bW3j4HQU

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Maybe I'm 'thick' or something... but it's not working for me... I've tried several times over the past few days and all I accomplished was to add a lake (by accident) which I was able to delete....

Taun could you add a lake by my house please? HH excellent topic, research and execution (no pun intended) :clap: I've always felt odd being so taken by the subject of serial killers, glad to see there are more out there.

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Many of the unsolved occured before the introduction of DNA.

Many happened before the introduction of cctv cameras.

Many unsolved crimes are unsolved, not because they do not have a suspect, but they do not have enough evidence.

when you say "unsolved serial murders", are you refering strictly to murders which are similar that it is the work of 1 person (or the same persons) within that particular area?

Edited by freetoroam

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Like with other horrible human behavior, I would not be surprised if one or more serial killers are on internet forums, disquised of course.

Perhaps there is one here. <_<

:passifier: :passifier: :passifier:

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They r disquised as humans. they r really alien monsters pretending to be human.

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Diana Vicari and her sister Debbie were close friends of mine, back in 82-83 and a few years after Dianas arms were found in the dumpster in the downtown area by the train tracks. Off of Perry AVe area, near 6th street in Tucson. If you have found anything out new let me know, thank you.

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The Child Murders at Robin Hood Hills is quite known though, but as it is right now, unsolved.

The trial of the West Memphis Three was a kangaroo-court that costed them many years.

Watch Paradise Lost.

There were six victims in that case. Three were murdered by the marsupial prosecutors.

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Morbidly interesting

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Posted (edited)

What happened to that case?

Last I checked- which was about a year ago- authorities weren't agreeing on whether there's only one, or if there's more than one serial killer.

The first extremely difficult aspect of the case is that the victims were considered high risk, and the second is that there's bodies (the older cases) that have yet to be identified.

Edited by regi
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Sorry for the delayed update to this thread.

I added a few more unknown serial killings to the map, including two "Jack the Ripper"s one from Atlanta and the other from New York who were active in the 1910's, both were much different in their choice of victims.

The "Atlanta Ripper" case is very interesting and shares many similarities to both the original Jack the Ripper crimes (mutilation of sexual organs and no apparent sexual assault) and to a string of over 40 axe murders of mulatto women that occurred during the same time period (the 20 victims of the Atlanta killer were all mulatto, also both cases went unsolved). It is safe to assume that this was not the work of the original ripper who, for some reason, moved to Atlanta, since the time frame would be extreme and the only witness report described a well dressed black man. However, the string of axe murders is interesting to consider with the similarities in victim type and the close (perhaps overlapping) time frame between the two murders. I will add an entry on the Axe Murders once I get to it's place in the book and I will try to search the internet for other information. There was also the New Orleans Axeman who was also active earlier in the century, although most of his victims were white couples.

I am trying to be more descriptive without taking too much from the book. I hope my new entries shed a little more light on each case more thoroughly.

To the question about editing the map: As far as I am aware the map in set to "public" access, so there shouldn't be any trouble adding your own entries. I'll double check to make sure it is open to the public, but I am almost positive it has been set to allow anyone to edit it.

You might want to check out the Ripper style murders that happened in Austin, Texas in the early 1900s...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servant_Girl_Annihilator

  • Mollie Smith, 25, was murdered the night of 30 December 1884. Walter Spencer was seriously injured.[1]
  • Clara Strand and Christine Martenson, two Swedish servant girls, were seriously wounded the night of 19 March 1885.[1]
  • Eliza Shelly was murdered the night of 6 May 1885.[1]
  • Irene Cross bled to death after being attacked by a man with a knife on the night of 22 May 1885.[1]
  • Clara Dick was seriously injured in August, 1885.[1]
  • Mary Ramey, 11, was murdered the night of 30 August 1885. Her mother, Rebecca Ramey was seriously injured.[1]
  • Gracie Vance, was murdered on the night of 28 September 1885. Orange Washington was also killed during the attack upon Vance. Lucinda Boddy and Patsey Gibson were seriously injured.[1]
  • Susan Hancock was murdered the night of 24 December 1885[1]
  • Eula Phillips was murdered the night of 24 December 1885. Her husband, James Phillips, was seriously injured.[

Maybe I can add this to the Google map....

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Last I checked- which was about a year ago- authorities weren't agreeing on whether there's only one, or if there's more than one serial killer.

The first extremely difficult aspect of the case is that the victims were considered high risk, and the second is that there's bodies (the older cases) that have yet to be identified.

Some experts claimed that the close proximity of some of the corpses was just a mere coincidence. They made it seem like both mass killers and mob hit-men used the same small stretch for dumping and hiding the bodies of their victims. In my opinion, that's possible but not probable. It sounds like something from a movie where two killers bury corpses at the same time in the same place, although they don't even know each other.

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Posted (edited)

Some experts claimed that the close proximity of some of the corpses was just a mere coincidence. They made it seem like both mass killers and mob hit-men used the same small stretch for dumping and hiding the bodies of their victims. In my opinion, that's possible but not probable.

It's a complex case, that's for sure!

One thing's apparent... all of the discovery sites are in a large, very remote area, and for the perp/perps, it's clear that it's been an ideal dumping ground for well over a decade from the discovery of the last known victim.

There can be no doubt that the most recent four victims (all discovered along Gilgo Beach, all wrapped in the same burlap sacks) were of the same perp. One victim was missing in '07, one in '09, and two in 2010.

From there, it gets complicated in determining whether or not it's one perp for ALL the victims discovered because some of the older remains were matched to remains discovered in Manorville, Long Island (about 40 miles away) in 2003. That victim was identified. Also, remains discovered on Fire Island in '96 matched remains more recently discovered in Gilgo Beach.

As I recall, those last four known victims were discovered by happenstance, in that what led to those discoveries began with the search of another missing person (whose body wasn't found until some time later in another location in Long Island).

Experts disagree about whether or not that victim was of the same perp as the most recent four. I don't believe she was (to start with, I don't think she was murdered, but there's a lot of circumstances surrounding just that one case.)

The L.I. Serialkiller case enlightened me as to the technique of geographic profiling and how it can be helpful to an investigation. The case offers a lot of info. to go on in that regard because there's multiple victims, there's an established dump site, and since several of the victims were identified, it could be determined when and where they were last known to be, and those things helped to establish a pattern of behavior from the perp.

I want to clarify that- if I'm recalling correctly- there were a total of 9 victims (and/or remains of 9 victims) eventually discovered on Gilgo Beach, and only five of those victims have been identified.

Edited by regi
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Makes you wonder if the Servant Girl Annihilator is also H.H. Holmes, I wonder if anyone has studied his whereabouts at the times of the murders. He's also thought to be a possible suspect in the Jack the Ripper killings.

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It's a complex case, that's for sure!

One thing's apparent... all of the discovery sites are in a large, very remote area, and for the perp/perps, it's clear that it's been an ideal dumping ground for well over a decade from the discovery of the last known victim.

There can be no doubt that the most recent four victims (all discovered along Gilgo Beach, all wrapped in the same burlap sacks) were of the same perp. One victim was missing in '07, one in '09, and two in 2010.

From there, it gets complicated in determining whether or not it's one perp for ALL the victims discovered because some of the older remains were matched to remains discovered in Manorville, Long Island (about 40 miles away) in 2003. That victim was identified. Also, remains discovered on Fire Island in '96 matched remains more recently discovered in Gilgo Beach.

As I recall, those last four known victims were discovered by happenstance, in that what led to those discoveries began with the search of another missing person (whose body wasn't found until some time later in another location in Long Island).

Experts disagree about whether or not that victim was of the same perp as the most recent four. I don't believe she was (to start with, I don't think she was murdered, but there's a lot of circumstances surrounding just that one case.)

The L.I. Serialkiller case enlightened me as to the technique of geographic profiling and how it can be helpful to an investigation. The case offers a lot of info. to go on in that regard because there's multiple victims, there's an established dump site, and since several of the victims were identified, it could be determined when and where they were last known to be, and those things helped to establish a pattern of behavior from the perp.

I want to clarify that- if I'm recalling correctly- there were a total of 9 victims (and/or remains of 9 victims) eventually discovered on Gilgo Beach, and only five of those victims have been identified.

Let's pretend that there's just one perpetrator. It could be that the person changed their older dumping grounds to a newer dumping ground, which seemed like a safer place for hiding victims. The investigators probably looked at a radius that included all of these locations. Perhaps the perp' moved closer to the newer dumping ground. Maybe the move can be matched to the change in dumping grounds. It's a shot in the dark in a cave. It might be worth checking and charting such movements, though. It might narrow the field of suspects.

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Geographic profiling is now widely used to try and track a serial killer.

In the USA it can be quite difficult if the killer moves to another state, but since the Ted Bundy case which changed the way states communicate with each other, this has become easier.

There are many books on geographical profiling and they are truly an interesting read.

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Posted (edited)

As I recall, those last four known victims were discovered by happenstance, in that what led to those discoveries began with the search of another missing person (whose body wasn't found until some time later in another location in Long Island).

Experts disagree about whether or not that victim was of the same perp as the most recent four. I don't believe she was (to start with, I don't think she was murdered, but there's a lot of circumstances surrounding just that one case.)

I want to clarify that- if I'm recalling correctly- there were a total of 9 victims (and/or remains of 9 victims) eventually discovered on Gilgo Beach, and only five of those victims have been identified.

I wasn't recalling correctly! Apparently, there are a total of 10 victims. Apart from the 5 identified, there's 2 females, a female toddler, and an Asian man, all unidentified.

Also, investigators don't believe that Shannen Gilbert's death (the missing person case which led to the other discoveries) is connected to the murders, but her family believes she was murdered.

It's the unidentified victims- including Jessica Taylor (Manorville, '03) that experts disagree about whether or not they're of the same perp.

Interestingly, remains found in Manorville in '00 also matched remains on Ocean Parkway...

It could be that the person changed their older dumping grounds to a newer dumping ground, which seemed like a safer place for hiding victims. The investigators probably looked at a radius that included all of these locations. Perhaps the perp' moved closer to the newer dumping ground. Maybe the move can be matched to the change in dumping grounds.

Oh, yes! Experts have said that the perp's MO could have changed for some reason or another, and those are possible reasons.

It's evident is that if it hadn't been for the search for Gilbert, it's highly doubtful that any of the victims along Ocean Parkway would have been discovered to this day.

The vegetation is very dense in those locations, and they're nowhere that anyone would have occasion to be.

Intriguing, it was determined that the last two victims left their cell phones behind. One left from a motel room, and the other left from her home.

The '09 victim's family was contacted multiple times- it's believed by the perp, using the victim's cell phone. The calls originated in Manhattan, which is where at least 2 of the victims (including Taylor) were missing from.

There was a documentary-style presentation of the case on A&E which I remember was very thorough. 48 Hours (which I'm not crazy about) also profiled the case.

Edited by regi
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