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libstaK

Pope Benedict begins trip to Lebanon

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I love this comment. It shows how much faith you truly have in your religion. LOL

10%20pope%20meme.jpg

tumblr_luvt60cDq41qkeavmo1_500.jpg

These tickle me and show my point.

The christian faith is based on the belief in a man that was crucified on a cross - God didn't intervene and prevent that, so why would a "Pope" expect him to do so on his behalf?

Faith is not about circumventing cause and effect but comprehending the nature and of it - bullet proof glass is a pretty good comprehension imo.

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Only to fanatics that always have excuses ready to hand. Constantly using made up CT's to answer every situation that looks bad for your people is lame, KoS.

i see .. say like example of usa attacking iraq for excuse coz of nuclear weapons which were never found ? yeah real fanatics i see what you mean

Edited by Knight Of Shadows

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i see .. say like example of usa attacking iraq for excuse coz on nuclear weapons which were never found ? yeah real fanatics i see what you mean

That somebody else acts like an ar$ehole is not a valid excuse to do it yourself, at least not there where they pretend to be civilized.

Edited by questionmark

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The christian faith is based on the belief in a man that was crucified on a cross - God didn't intervene and prevent that, so why would a "Pope" expect him to do so on his behalf?

Faith is not about circumventing cause and effect but comprehending the nature and of it - bullet proof glass is a pretty good comprehension imo.

Wasn't that because God let it happen on purpose? Wasn't it part of the plan? That's the impression I get form the bible. Pretty much says that it's gods will if you are to die. So if the Pope had that much Faith in God who would beleive that he would only be killed if he was meant to be.

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Wasn't that because God let it happen on purpose? Wasn't it part of the plan? That's the impression I get form the bible. Pretty much says that it's gods will if you are to die. So if the Pope had that much Faith in God who would beleive that he would only be killed if he was meant to be.

That's easy - you don't test God on these matters. He has also placed the Pope in a time, place and the wherewithall to obtain a bulletproof "pope mobile", to say no to that is to put God to the test gratuitously.

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That's easy - you don't test God on these matters. He has also placed the Pope in a time, place and the wherewithall to obtain a bulletproof "pope mobile", to say no to that is to put God to the test gratuitously.

That's twisting it a bit really. Was he not saying no to God by getting the "pope mobile" in the first place?

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That's twisting it a bit really. Was he not saying no to God by getting the "pope mobile" in the first place?

I don't think so, he was using what is already available. I guess what he is saying is "This is a job, God might have my back but no more than he does anyone else on this Earth - I don't imagine I'll get special treatment and I won't act like I do either".

Here's some parallel context:

8 Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' " 9 The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10 For it is written: " 'He will command his angels concerning you to guard you carefully; 11 they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.' " 12 Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.' " 13 When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.

It could easily be misplaced pride (temptation) rather than faith when a person doesn't do all they can to protect themselves because "God will protect me".

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I don't think so, he was using what is already available. I guess what he is saying is "This is a job, God might have my back but no more than he does anyone else on this Earth - I don't imagine I'll get special treatment and I won't act like I do either".

Here's some parallel context:

8 Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' " 9 The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10 For it is written: " 'He will command his angels concerning you to guard you carefully; 11 they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.' " 12 Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.' " 13 When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.

It could easily be misplaced pride (temptation) rather than faith when a person doesn't do all they can to protect themselves because "God will protect me".

That means in the context of stabbing yourself, jumping of a cliff or jumping of a motorway crossover.

Not really the same thing as getting a bulletproof case to travel in. lol

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That means in the context of stabbing yourself, jumping of a cliff or jumping of a motorway crossover.

Not really the same thing as getting a bulletproof case to travel in. lol

Sure it is, jumping off a cliff and expecting to land safely is akin to expecting to be bullet proof if someone fires a gun in your direction.

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Sure it is, jumping off a cliff and expecting to land safely is akin to expecting to be bullet proof if someone fires a gun in your direction.

Lets say the pope is shot and killed no matter what it would be gods will right.

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Lets say the pope is shot and killed no matter what it would be gods will right.

Exactly.

Sure it is, jumping off a cliff and expecting to land safely is akin to expecting to be bullet proof if someone fires a gun in your direction.

That's not the same at all.

The equivalent of jumping off a cliff would be the equivalent of shooting yourself. Not someone else shooting you. As both are suicide, which is what the Bible was aiming at.

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That somebody else acts like an ar$ehole is not a valid excuse to do it yourself, at least not there where they pretend to be civilized.

true but i had giving a potentioal scenario had been a western nation wanted to go on rampage on some country

they'll steerup something then use it as excuse let me ask you honestly .. is that very far fetched ? honestly ? :D

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true but i had giving a potentioal scenario had been a western nation wanted to go on rampage on some country

they'll steerup something then use it as excuse let me ask you honestly .. is that very far fetched ? honestly ? :D

The problem with this view imo is that implies that some groups/communities have a 'push button' once pressed a predictable response is guaranteed; and that they would react en masse, thoughtlessly following some kind of a herd instinct! I find this offensive. I'd rather think that people misjudged, erred, misunderstood other cultures; that there are fanatics and moderates, cynics and the gullible...than they are but a mindless mass on the move.

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that is true .. but with kind mentality the westerns see us and the way their media , movies portray us

they got used to the " terrorist " muslim face they wouldn't see otherwise

so should they decide to streerup a strike say against the pope and pin it on exteremists .. no problem there

all the west will go " ohh bad muslims "

not even paying little attention that their goverment has made so many disgusting acts and that could be one of them

can you deny that ?

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that is true .. but with kind mentality the westerns see us and the way their media , movies portray us

they got used to the " terrorist " muslim face they wouldn't see otherwise

so should they decide to streerup a strike say against the pope and pin it on exteremists .. no problem there

all the west will go " ohh bad muslims "

not even paying little attention that their goverment has made so many disgusting acts and that could be one of them

can you deny that ?

Can you prove it? :D

KoS, I think we disagree here, blaming the West for all our problems, seeing it as the prime mover of all that's going on in the ME will simply blind us, prevent us from correctly diagnosing our problems and consequently from finding realistic solutions. We have to admit that we are responsible for the larger part of our problems then decide to deal with them appropriately. Seeing conspiracies everywhere will only end up giving us a paranoid world view in which we are helpless, hapless followers, easily goaded to the left or to the right.

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Can you prove it? :D

KoS, I think we disagree here, blaming the West for all our problems, seeing it as the prime mover of all that's going on in the ME will simply blind us, prevent us from correctly diagnosing our problems and consequently from finding realistic solutions. We have to admit that we are responsible for the larger part of our problems then decide to deal with them appropriately. Seeing conspiracies everywhere will only end up giving us a paranoid world view in which we are helpless, hapless followers, easily goaded to the left or to the right.

There is no conspiracy,and i disagree with you,the West carries a huge portion of blame for it's tinkering in the ME.

When the wells run dry,no one will give a damn...

Edited by shaddow134

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This video makes me so happy our founding fathers had the foresight to write the Establishment Clause and introduce it so gently into US law.

Religion must be able to break the chains of government that hopelessly attempt to represent it. I know the opposite can also be said, that it's government that must break the chains of religion. And I would agree looking at it that way is equally true. Religion and government are two things that should stay separate, as much as humanly possible.

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There is no conspiracy,and i disagree with you,the West carries a huge portion of blame for it's tinkering in the ME.

When the wells run dry,no one will give a damn...

The West can only exploit the problems we create and then meet with apathy. If the West aided dictators, we allowed them to ascend to power and remain there. If the West bribed corrupt officials, they are afterall 'natives' whom we allowed into office and turned a blind eye to nepotism, bribery, and dysfunctional law enforcement. We allowed extremists in office, tolerated their hate speech; stood by when almost 50% are malnourished, living at or below the poverty line while Fauchon is opening branches in our cities. The problems of overpopulation and extreme environmental pollution are of our making, and so are illiteracy and the collapsing educational system. We participate in the inequality of women and minorities, sexual harassement in our streets.....the list goes on and on. The sum total of all these problems maybe exploited by others but that's a consequence not a cause. Hanging our negligence on the shoulders of the West then crying over it makes us nothing but weaklings, always at the receiving end. When my son was a young child he used to blame the floor for hurting his knees when he fell!

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Exactly.

That's not the same at all.

The equivalent of jumping off a cliff would be the equivalent of shooting yourself. Not someone else shooting you. As both are suicide, which is what the Bible was aiming at.

So it's not suicidal in the modern age of guns, when one Pope has already been shot to ignore the protection offered by a bullet proof vehicle - I'll bet his security detail would disagree with you.

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So it's not suicidal in the modern age of guns, when one Pope has already been shot to ignore the protection offered by a bullet proof vehicle - I'll bet his security detail would disagree with you.

It's not suicidal in the way that shooting yourself or jumping off a cliff is, which is the way the bible means. The way you are saying would be up to God if he survived or not. (if he actually believed in him)

Anyway can you blame people for wanting the head of such a disgusting organization. (I do not mean Catholics as people, I mean the catholic church itself)

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It's not suicidal in the way that shooting yourself or jumping off a cliff is, which is the way the bible means. The way you are saying would be up to God if he survived or not. (if he actually believed in him)

Anyway can you blame people for wanting the head of such a disgusting organization. (I do not mean Catholics as people, I mean the catholic church itself)

The bible asks you to not put God to the test, it doesn't just mean by suicidal behaviours but by basically saying "no worries, God will protect me, I am special" in any way, shape or form - the cliff is just the scenario put to Jesus in which he quoted that proviso as his reason for not falling for it when the devil dared him.

Yes I can blame them a little, and I don't like Benedict at all. I was raised a catholic, shunned it for many a year and then made my peace with my heritage but never fell wholly back within it's particular "grasp" - went to more gnostic leanings.

There are disgusting folk in almost every walk of life and yes, they have corrupted the Catholic Church in many arenas - but the WHOLE organisation is not in and of itself disgusting, even with Nicea and it's outcomes which I abhor, I have come to see that many genuine, sincere and altruistic souls also find a way to do good within it's realms.

The catholic church is just as evil and just as good as the sum of mankind itself.

Edited by libstaK
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The bible asks you to not put God to the test, it doesn't just mean by suicidal behaviours but by basically saying "no worries, God will protect me, I am special" in any way, shape or form - the cliff is just the scenario put to Jesus in which he quoted that proviso as his reason for not falling for it when the devil dared him.

Yes I can blame them a little, and I don't like Benedict at all. I was raised a catholic, shunned it for many a year and then made my peace with my heritage but never fell wholly back within it's particular "grasp" - went to more gnostic leanings.

There are disgusting folk in almost every walk of life and yes, they have corrupted the Catholic Church in many arenas - but the WHOLE organisation is not in and of itself disgusting, even with Nicea and it's outcomes which I abhor, I have come to see that many genuine, sincere and altruistic souls also find a way to do good within it's realms.

The catholic church is just as evil and just as good as the sum of mankind itself.

I disagree, if they used all that money they have to actually do some good and apologize for what they have done, then I would agree. They have caused massive amounts of death and suffering. The death and suffering they could have prevented if they actually wanted to do good.

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I disagree, if they used all that money they have to actually do some good and apologize for what they have done, then I would agree. They have caused massive amounts of death and suffering. The death and suffering they could have prevented if they actually wanted to do good.

The issue with the money aka: Vatican hoarded riches I totally agree, they have no need for it and others could benefit - no excuse on their part for that behaviour especially given that if they were generous their congregations would throw more money at them anyway, as folk do when they really respect a cause with integrity.

I doubt there will be an apology, an admission that mistakes were made would be the next best thing, probably won't get that either.

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So it's not suicidal in the modern age of guns, when one Pope has already been shot to ignore the protection offered by a bullet proof vehicle - I'll bet his security detail would disagree with you.

Was it not gods will to have Pope John Paul the second shot. Or was it gods will to have a Pope mobile. Ahh yes god works in mysterious ways. Guns have been around for hundreds of years and many a Pope has made a murdeous exit from the pulpit.

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Was it not gods will to have Pope John Paul the second shot. Or was it gods will to have a Pope mobile. Ahh yes god works in mysterious ways. Guns have been around for hundreds of years and many a Pope has made a murdeous exit from the pulpit.

To be fair Popes of the past were usually removed by earthly forces of sinister means and in all probability God (if he were to exist) had nothing to do with it..

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