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Shabd Mystic

[Merged] Proof of Heaven

133 posts in this topic

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And this totally negates that idea that NDEs are feel good chemicals at work. If that were the case all NDEs should be positive. Quite obviously a sizable chunk are not.

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I agree about reincarnation as I am 100% convinced of that, but it is hard to believe, next to impossible if you examine it very closely, that our "selves" and therefore our consciousness, lives on past our earthly death without some sort of "higher" source of our existence.

I absolutely do not believe in God as portrayed by Christians and Muslims, as some sort of bearded old "man" but I absolutely believe in a higher power who is indescribable and beyond human comprehension.

I have come to some conclusions about the video:

Now, the woman with the brain aneurism...basically you had a corpse on the table...but...she was not dead...her Blood was alive. I tended to agree with the thought that our brains are 'receivers' of consciousness rather than producers of consciousness. But I have changed my opinion. Blood is the Receiver of Consciousness. The blood was alive, experiencing Awareness of what was going on around it...when it was transfused back into the womans body, the brain received that Awareness and produced Thought Process and Imagery of the operating room.

It makes sense that there is only One Consiousness....you can call it God, or whatever...and there is Life...Life receives consciousness like a container receives water. There is only One Consciousness, but many containers. The Blood literally is The Life. That is so heavy, even to me.

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I have come to some conclusions about the video:

Now, the woman with the brain aneurism...basically you had a corpse on the table...but...she was not dead...her Blood was alive. I tended to agree with the thought that our brains are 'receivers' of consciousness rather than producers of consciousness. But I have changed my opinion. Blood is the Receiver of Consciousness. The blood was alive, experiencing Awareness of what was going on around it...when it was transfused back into the womans body, the brain received that Awareness and produced Thought Process and Imagery of the operating room.

It makes sense that there is only One Consiousness....you can call it God, or whatever...and there is Life...Life receives consciousness like a container receives water. There is only One Consciousness, but many containers. The Blood literally is The Life. That is so heavy, even to me.

Interesting but bizarre as well. That is so full of holes it would take me a long time to type it all out, but I'll just throw one out there: If the blood was pumped into a completely different person, when he awoke would he then be her? Would her "consciousness" take over his body since her blood would be the only blood he now had?

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Interesting but bizarre as well. That is so full of holes it would take me a long time to type it all out, but I'll just throw one out there: If the blood was pumped into a completely different person, when he awoke would he then be her? Would her "consciousness" take over his body since her blood would be the only blood he now had?

No...because the brain produces thought process. The question is: If the blood was pumped into a completely different person would that different person recall the same experience?

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No...because the brain produces thought process. The question is: If the blood was pumped into a completely different person would that different person recall the same experience?

I hate to quote Wikipedia on anything but it was the quickest in this case so here goes:

"Consciousness is the quality or state of being aware of an external object or something within oneself."

"Blood" does not produce consciousness. The ONLY question is whether it is the brain that produces that consciousness, or the brain merely houses that consciousness while we are "in the body" (alive), with the brain directing that consciousness through it's various functions.

This entire thread is arguing that consciousness is separate from the brain and that once the "housing" (the functioning brain) is removed from the equation, then that consciousness leaves the brain and moves on to other, higher realms.

Blood plays no part in consciousness, other than in keeping the brain working.

As for the brain, it is either:

1) "Housing" that consciousness as long as it is working (and that consciousness moves on after it stops working),

or

2) Creating that consciousness and keeping it active only as long as the brain is working.

The only question here is whether that consciousness is always confined to the human brain or is, in fact, only temporarily confined to it as long as the brain is functioning.

Blood isn't related to consciousness in any other way than, if you believe option number 2, it helps keep that brain functioning. Blood is no more important regarding consciouness than the liver or pancreas, etc.

In those cases, as well as with the blood, if you removed them then the brain stops functioning. The only question then is whether or not consciousness then ceases or continues in a different form.

.

Edited by Shabd Mystic
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Hi LibstaK,

You had better have a word to your government then, a lot of mystical societies tend to think of Sirius and Alnilam as heaven, and indeed Australia's Federation Day of 1st January 1901 in Sydney was aligned to Sirius and Alnilam!

http://www.abc.net.a...s/fev_inaug.htm

Love the Australian Coin below ha ha:-

http://www.australia...er/200131oz.htm

Oh so Australia really is "God's country" :P , well most Aussies would agee B)

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Perhaps an analogy will help. I might have missed something when I came up with this but I think it works:

Imagine an airtight empty building the size of the Houston Astrodome made of fiberglass. Imagine inside being zero gravity. Now imagine it filled with iron particles that float around it.

That iron represents consciousness.

In the center of the Astrodome is a massive electronic magnet that is powered by electricity. That magnet itself is the brain, and the electricity is the blood (or the "life" energy however you wish to think of it). When the electromagnet is switched on all the iron immediately comes and fastens itself to the magnet.

The consciousness (the iron) is now located in the "brain" (the magnet) and will be retained by the brain (magnet) as long as the brain (magnet) is "alive." The moment the switch is flipped and the "blood" (electricity) stops feeding the "brain" (magnet), the "brain" (magnet) is "dead" (shut off) and "consciousness" (iron particles) drifts off to other places.

The idea of the iron "filling the void" of the Astrodome is because that is what higher paths of mysticism teach, and many near-death experiences hint at (many say they felt "one with the universe" or that "all living things are one").

My guess is that this didn't make it any clearer, and likely made it worse, lol, but I figured I'd give it a shot. :)

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I hate to quote Wikipedia on anything but it was the quickest in this case so here goes:

"Blood" does not produce consciousness. The ONLY question is whether it is the brain that produces that consciousness, or the brain merely houses that consciousness while we are "in the body" (alive), with the brain directing that consciousness through it's various functions.

This entire thread is arguing that consciousness is separate from the brain and that once the "housing" (the functioning brain) is removed from the equation, then that consciousness leaves the brain and moves on to other, higher realms.

Blood plays no part in consciousness, other than in keeping the brain working and either:

1) "Housing" that consciousness as long as it is working (and that consciousness moves on after it stops working),

or

2) Creating that consciousness and keeping it active only as long as the brain is working.

The only question here is whether that consciousness is always confined to the human brain or is, in fact, only temporarily confined to it as long as the brain is functioning.

Blood isn't related to consciousness in any other way than, if you believe option number 2, it helps keep that brain functioning. Blood is no more important than the liver or pancreas, etc. In those cases, as well as with the blood, if you removed them the brain stops functioning. The only question then is whether or not consciousness then ceases or continues in a different form.

.

Wikipedia? Really? Okay. I just have a different mind set I guess. I tend to think outside of the 'general information box'.

Consciousness isn't something produced by the brain...it is something that just Is. When we are in a conscious state...it means we are aware of our surroundings and processing information in real time...but Consciousness exists without the body, without the brain. That being said...

The only question here is whether that consciousness is always confined to the human brain or is, in fact, only temporarily confined to it as long as the brain is functioning.

I have other questions. Again, we have a corpse and we have living oxygenated blood. Now, we all know that blood can be frozen, and re transfused into a living patient. But how do we know that if it is living and oxygenated that it is not experiencing consciousness? Without the blood...the brain doesn't function. Yet, without the brain, the blood can function. So, I am not convinced that blood is not aware.

As far as that goes, I am not convinced that the 'corpse' on the table is not aware either.

This is all trying to be explained through 'scientific' studies. And while they are exhaustive...they are not by any means the final word.

Pehaps the blood IS the living entity. Perhaps the blood is not just the carrier of nutrients and oxygen to the brain. Perhaps the soul purpose of the body and brain is to house the Blood. There are many other questions...but I will just say now that the studies are inconclusive.

I remember a study done back in the 70s. A line of people walk by plants connected to an EKG type device. One person burned the plant with a cigarette lighter....the EKG needle responded accordingly. Then, the same line of people walked by the same plant. No one had a cigarette lighter, but, when the person who had burned the plant walked by, the EKG needle reacted the same as when the plant had been burned. This would make one consider the possibility that plants experience conscious awareness.

I just had a wild thought. What if...the 'other side' is the actual 'real world' and we are numb to it by our addiction to oxygen? And what part does Gravity play in Conscious Awareness?

There are other questions.

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a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

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a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

yep...btw...any one who quotes Bruce Lee is a friend of mine! :yes:

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Wikipedia? Really? Okay. I just have a different mind set I guess. I tend to think outside of the 'general information box'.

As i said, i used it because it happened to be the very first link and Google showed the first few lines and they happened to be what I knew virtually every other source of the definition would be, and i didn't want to search for "Stanford University's" definition just to make it somehow seem more relevant. It would have been the same thing.

If you believe there is a different definition then you are free to search for it. I already knew what the definition was and was only getting it because you didn't seem to understand what consciousness meant..

Consciousness isn't something produced by the brain...it is something that just Is. When we are in a conscious state...it means we are aware of our surroundings and processing information in real time...but Consciousness exists without the body, without the brain.

If consciousness exists without the body, then it obviously exists without the blood too.

I have other questions. Again, we have a corpse and we have living oxygenated blood. Now, we all know that blood can be frozen, and re transfused into a living patient. But how do we know that if it is living and oxygenated that it is not experiencing consciousness? Without the blood...the brain doesn't function. Yet, without the brain, the blood can function.

Blood "functions" only by the fact that it is not "dead." A liver can also "function" without the brain as can a heart or kidney or anything else that can be put in another living human being. Heck, the recent 'transplant" of a face show that a face can still function without a brain. Skin grafts are almost the same thing as blood transfusions.

Pehaps the blood IS the living entity. Perhaps the blood is not just the carrier of nutrients and oxygen to the brain. Perhaps the soul purpose of the body and brain is to house the Blood. There are many other questions...but I will just say now that the studies are inconclusive.

Well, belief that if you wish. As i said before that is crazy and would take too long to counter and would be a colossal waste of time to try. If you are enamored with that idea then that's great. I'm not looking to win any arguments. I am only looking to add to this discussion wherever I might prove to have something to add. Talking about blood having consciousness is definitely not worth my spending any more time on.

I just had a wild thought. What if...the 'other side' is the actual 'real world' and we are numb to it by our addiction to oxygen? And what part does Gravity play in Conscious Awareness?

There are other questions.

Short answers that echo my personal convictions and those of countless accomplished mystics throughout history (so take them or leave them as you wish):

The "other side" IS the "real word" (which is why almost all near-death experiencers describe a "hyper-reality" that makes our existence here seem like a dream rather than reality). And "addiction to oxygen" plays no part other than until we stop breathing we will never understand that (unless "death" is experienced prior to that via NDE or mystical pursuits).

"Gravity" has nothing to do with consciousness.

.

a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

Exactly.

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Shabd Mystic' timestamp='1350913811' post='4512130']

As i said, i used it because it happened to be the very first link and Google showed the first few lines and they happened to be what I knew virtually every other source of the definition would be, and i didn't want to search for "Stanford University's" definition just to make it somehow seem more relevant. It would have been the same thing.

I usually do the same thing when I don't know what a word means....

If consciousness exists without the body, then it obviously exists without the blood too.

Yes, most defintitely. I wasn't meaning to put forth the notion that blood is Consciousness...merely the thought that blood is the 'living entity' and the body is just a host for the blood. I'm not saying that is what I believe...I am just speculating on the possibility.

Blood "functions" only by the fact that it is not "dead." A liver can also "function" without the brain as can a heart or kidney or anything else that can be put in another living human being. Heck, the recent 'transplant" of a face show that a face can still function without a brain. Skin grafts are almost the same thing as blood transfusions.

You mention the liver, and skin grafts, etc. These cannot live without the blood. The blood obviously can live without the body. When the blood dies...everything else dies along with it. But specifically in the case where the woman's blood is being kept alive while her body undergoes death is what I am talking about. I seriously doubt that if they had transfused her corpse with frozen blood, oxygenated and run through tubes at the correct temperature that she would have survived. I am just speculating on all of this. Questioning out of the box...which is the exercise of the video itself.

Well, belief that if you wish. As i said before that is crazy and would take too long to counter and would be a colossal waste of time to try. If you are enamored with that idea then that's great. I'm not looking to win any arguments. I am only looking to add to this discussion wherever I might prove to have something to add. Talking about blood having consciousness is definitely not worth my spending any more time on.

It may sound crazy. But if blood doesn't have consciousness, then plants don't have consciousness, earth worms don't have consciousness, because none of these have a brain.

Short answers that echo my personal convictions and those of countless accomplished mystics throughout history (so take them or leave them as you wish):

The "other side" IS the "real word" (which is why almost all near-death experiencers describe a "hyper-reality" that makes our existence here seem like a dream rather than reality). And "addiction to oxygen" plays no part other than until we stop breathing we will never understand that (unless "death" is experienced prior to that via NDE or mystical pursuits).

Again, I am just speculating on thoughts that come into my mind. I am not saying this is what I believe.

"Gravity" has nothing to do with consciousness.

Have you ever really considered that question before? Neither had I until it came across my conscious awareness as a thought. The entire Universe has one thing in common...gravity. As a 'mystic' you at times seem rather closed minded on topics that don't fit your belief system. Not criticizing...just saying.

snapback.pngSeeker79, on 22 October 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

snapback.pngSeeker79, on 22 October 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

a receiver of conciousness. Much like a radio tuned in.

Exactly.

Pretty much what I believe. Consciousness is. There is only one thing that really exists. Energy. Infinite Energy. Infinite Energy IS Consciousness...and it manifests itself, in an infinite number of forms, on an infinite number of levels, for an infinite number of reasons. When we exist as humans, we exist as Infinite Energy manifested in the form of a human being. The drops of rain, the ocean, the air, the stars, the space between the stars...all Energy...all Consciousness. How can you know that the rock beside the road, even the road itself has Awareness? Because it is. It is because it has been manifested out of the pool of infinite potential by Infinite Energy.

Edited by joc

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Hi libstaK,

Indeed Australia is a beautiful country, and generally uneffected by the religious wars of Europe, if you want to delve into its esoteric history with astronomy about Federation Day in Sydney, please scroll down link below to thread section #38:-

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=232340&st=30

The most esoteric part to live in Australia is probably around the area of Childers, Queensland, being the Shire of Isis, link below:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shire_of_Isis

Love the logo, link below ha ha:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Isis_shire_logo.png

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Hey Joc,

Sorry if my last post seemed a bit "brisk." I haven't been feeling well today and I was hurrying to finish. I didn't mean to be rude.

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Analysis of Atheists' NDE's

When the famous English novelist, Somerset Maugham, was expiring in France, aged 91, he summoned the world-class atheist, A.J. Ayer, like a priest to his deathbed, to reassure him that there was no afterlife. Professor Ayer duly delivered the words of consolation Maugham longed to hear.

But when Ayer himself was dying two decades later, he wasn't so sure. Having choked on a piece of smoked salmon that stopped his heart for at least four minutes, the famed philosopher saw, and heard things he had spent a lifetime denying.

On his return from he knew not where, Ayer wrote a chagrined but enigmatic account of what has become known in Britain and beyond as Near Death Experience.

...

For much more follow the above link ...

.

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Hey Joc,

Sorry if my last post seemed a bit "brisk." I haven't been feeling well today and I was hurrying to finish. I didn't mean to be rude.

Hope you are feeling better. :)

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Hope you are feeling better. :)

From the article: he found 100 per cent of people calling themselves atheists had experienced "tremendous ecstasy".

Tremendous ecstasy! They all have one thing in common. They all were 'dead' so to speak...meaning their brain went through extreme trauma...and they returned, all experiencing, Tremendous Ecstasy. The brain flooded with endorphins and dopamine I would gather.

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From the article: he found 100 per cent of people calling themselves atheists had experienced "tremendous ecstasy".

Tremendous ecstasy! They all have one thing in common. They all were 'dead' so to speak...meaning their brain went through extreme trauma...and they returned, all experiencing, Tremendous Ecstasy. The brain flooded with endorphins and dopamine I would gather.

That was an idea that many "non-believing" scientists had pushed forward but many NDE experiencers have been doctors and scientists themselves and have completely discredited that idea on MANY grounds, but none more than the fact that they say no amount of endorphins or even morphine or any drug or hormone known to man can even come close to comparing to what is experienced in "the beyond."

Countless mystics have told the same story, and very much like the extraordinary level of "reality" they experience that leaves them feeling as though everyday life is no more than a dream, the bliss experienced, and not even at the higher spiritual levels but much before that, is so incredible that there is no way to make the human mind even grasp it.

The very same thing is told about the incredible love that is experienced. It is said that God is NOTHING but "love and bliss" (as the New Testament also says but the Old Testament completely defies) and when you experience it you are changed forever. It is nothing even remotely like love experienced on earth, even the most incredible and intense love we can ever feel. It is very unconditional and very intense.

I am not allowed to discuss my own experiences but there are countless sources of mystics who have done so, from Christian mystics (who only ever attain the "lower" spiritual realms) to incredibly accomplished mystics such as Rumi, Nanak, Kabir and many others (who achieved the highest possible levels). And they try as best as possible to describe the love and bliss that "defies explanation." Just Google those names along with terms like love and I'm sure there will be much to read.

.

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That was an idea that many "non-believing" scientists had pushed forward but many NDE experiencers have been doctors and scientists themselves and have completely discredited that idea on MANY grounds, but none more than the fact that they say no amount of endorphins or even morphine or any drug or hormone known to man can even come close to comparing to what is experienced in "the beyond."

Countless mystics have told the same story, and very much like the extraordinary level of "reality" they experience that leaves them feeling as though everyday life is no more than a dream, the bliss experienced, and not even at the higher spiritual levels but much before that, is so incredible that there is no way to make the human mind even grasp it.

The very same thing is told about the incredible love that is experienced. It is said that God is NOTHING but "love and bliss" (as the New Testament also says but the Old Testament completely defies) and when you experience it you are changed forever. It is nothing even remotely like love experienced on earth, even the most incredible and intense love we can ever feel. It is very unconditional and very intense.

I am not allowed to discuss my own experiences but there are countless sources of mystics who have done so, from Christian mystics (who only ever attain the "lower" spiritual realms) to incredibly accomplished mystics such as Rumi, Nanak, Kabir and many others (who achieved the highest possible levels). And they try as best as possible to describe the love and bliss that "defies explanation." Just Google those names along with terms like love and I'm sure there will be much to read.

.

Why are you not allowed to discuss your own experiences?

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Some examples of quotes from mystics about the bliss they experienced:

Buddha:

There is pleasure and there is bliss.

Forgo the first to possess the second.

Ramana Maharishi:

Bliss is not added to your nature, it is merely revealed as your true natural state, eternal and imperishable.

Kabir:

My mind has returned

To its own primal state;

I realized the Lord

When I died while living.

Says Kabir: I am merged

In the bliss of Sahaj;

I no longer know fear,

Nor inspire it in others.

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe:

Ha! A rush of bliss

flows suddenly through all my senses!

I feel a glow, a holy joy of life

which sets my veins and flesh afire.

Was it a god that drew these signs

which soothe my inward raging

and fill my wretched heart with joy,

and with mysterious strength

reveal about me Nature's pulse?

Am I a god? The light pervades me so!

In these pure ciphers I can see

living Nature spread out before my soul.

At last I understand the sage's words:

“The world of spirits is not closed:

your mind is shut, your heart is dead!

Pupil, stand up and unafraid

bathe your earthly breast in morning light!

"Here in this body are the sacred rivers: here are the sun and moon as well as all the pilgrimage places... I have not encountered another temple as blissful as my own body." ~ Saraha

Kabir:

I have attained

The dazzling state of bliss —

Free from fear, free from pain,

I am the weaver, O Lord, of Thy Name;

I weave and reap the profit

Of inner rapport with Thee.

I am the weaver of the Lord’s Name.

Swami Sivananda:

Life is a pilgrimage. The wise man does not rest by the roadside inns. He marches direct to the illimitable domain of eternal bliss, his ultimate destination.

I have tasted the bliss of the Original Abode which alone is true. The world, on the other hand, is only a fleeting show, and only if one ponders over this, one will be able to realize the essence and then alone will one's boat of life be able to cross the ocean of worldly existence. ~ Tulsi Sahib

.

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From the article: he found 100 per cent of people calling themselves atheists had experienced "tremendous ecstasy".

Tremendous ecstasy! They all have one thing in common. They all were 'dead' so to speak...meaning their brain went through extreme trauma...and they returned, all experiencing, Tremendous Ecstasy. The brain flooded with endorphins and dopamine I would gather.

100% ? there are plenty of negative NDEs to show that "good feelings" are not the only result.

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Why are you not allowed to discuss your own experiences?

It is the mystical "path" I follow. It is taught that spiritual "attainments" are only granted by God to one who doesn't speak of them (to do so would be a form of "bragging" no matter how much one tried to word it to sound otherwise). It is taught, and has been taught by history's greatest mystics, that everything is granted only by the grace of God and that such grace is only given to those who begin to let go of their "ego" (having things be about "me") so that their concerns are not about themselves but about God.

I understand that probably sounds ludicrous but i have had enough "proof" that it is so that i will never challenge it, lol. I'm not even saying that I have anything worth talking about. I am saying that even if i had nothing at all, I can't talk about it if i wish to have anything one day. What i have or haven't experienced doesn't matter. If i sat here and told everyone of wild and wonderful journeys I've had to multiple heavens and how i spoke to Jesus and Buddha and countless others, who in their right mind would believe me anyway?

So there is no reason to discuss anything "I" have experienced, even if there were loads to talk about. (And if there were it would probably be safe to assume I wouldn't care if readers of some Internet message board did or didn't even know about it because i would be so filled with bliss and love that I doubt I would even care about the Internet, let alone spend time posting on a message board.) That would only be an exercise in "look at me." There have been countless famous mystics who reached the highest possible spiritual levels "inside" and who became "one with God" and who were thereby authorized to share their experiences with others. I just quoted several of them. I just love to talk about such things because it is the focus of my life and what i care most about.

I, personally know many people who have been following this mystical path for many years, some as long as 60 years, and i have seen firsthand the INCREDIBLE changes that have happened to them all. Changes that are very similar to those reported by countless NDE experiencers, only with the mystics the changes have been MUCH more profound. In comparison to mystical experiences of a higher order, all the NDE stories are mere child's play. Using a baseball analogy, NDE stories are like t-ball while the highest mystical experiences are like the Hall of Fame.

But NDEs are very believable to the average person whereby mystical experiences reported by great mystics seem too incredible to believe. So i saw this story in Newsweek and figured it might hit home for "some" people at least, while most Atheists and non-believers would continue to refuse to believe what i am convinced is not only 100% true, but at every single person's fingertips if they only cared enough to find it. "Seek and ye shall find." ;)

.

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100% ? there are plenty of negative NDEs to show that "good feelings" are not the only result.

This is incredibly true!!

The "bliss" some NDEers experience, they never realize, is not what they will have when they die. It is but a taste of what is possible, and what every soul can attain if he follows the right path to attain it.

All the reports of NDEs help convince people that God truly exists (in the form of light but not the way many people imagine Him) and that something like heaven actually exists, but only some NDEers come back realizing that if they want to attain anything like they experienced after they die, the only way to do that is via meditation while alive.

The doctor featured in the Newsweek article came back remembering that "lesson from heaven" and he is now heavily involved in meditation and a mystical search to be able to return to that heaven any time he wants (when he meditates). Many NDEers do become mystics when they 'come back" but a lot of NDEers can't recall much of the "incredible truths" they know they were told during their NDE. They just say they were filled with all the knowledge there was, but they couldn't retain much of it.

The hellish NDEs happen to many people too (not as many) and those people always come back experiencing profound changes in their lives and attitudes. They all leave the NDE remembering they need to make great changes but not all remember that the mystical path was the greatest change they needed to make if they wished to return "permanently." But some do remember that and they begin to pursue a mystical path. The Harvard neurologist was but one of them.

.

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This is amazing and I hope the guy who was in here earlier arguing that these people weren't really "dead" will take a look and explain again how they aren't dead.

Rev. George Rodonaia underwent one of the most extended cases of a near-death experience ever recorded. Pronounced dead immediately after he was hit by a car in 1976, he was left for three days in the morgue. He did not "return to life" until a doctor began to make an incision in his abdomen as part of an autopsy procedure. Prior to his NDE he worked as a neuropathologist. He was also an avowed atheist. Yet after the experience, he devoted himself exclusively to the study of spirituality, taking a second doctorate in the psychology of religion. He then became an ordained priest in the Eastern Orthodox Church. He served as a pastor at St. Paul United Methodist Church in Baytown, Texas.

Rev. George Rodonaia held an M.D. and a Ph.D. in neuropathology, and a Ph.D. in the psychology of religion. He delivered a keynote address to the United Nations on the "Emerging Global Spirituality." Before emigrating to the United States from the Soviet Union in 1989, he worked as a research psychiatrist at the University of Moscow. The following is a Dr. Rodonaia's experience in his own words from Phillip Berman's excellent book, The Journey Home.

The rest at -

http://near-death.com/experiences/evidence10.html

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This is amazing and I hope the guy who was in here earlier arguing that these people weren't really "dead" will take a look and explain again how they aren't dead.

Would that be me?

Rev. George Rodonaia underwent one of the most extended cases of a near-death experience ever recorded. Pronounced dead immediately after he was hit by a car in 1976, he was left for three days in the morgue.

I don't buy that story for a minute. Because someone wrote it in a supposed obituary it is now fact? In fact, many people have been mistakenly declared dead only to wake up in the morgue or in the casket on the way to their funeral. This sounds more like a 'Jesus complex' to me. The good Rev dead 3 days and resurrected just like Jesus. If he was really dead for 3 days then it isn't a near death experience. It is a Death experience.

Edited by joc

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