Are UFO experts that "know too much" killed?

[Sakari]

and.... taking it one step further,,, supose as a disinformation tecnique to confuse the matter, government operatives spun the Monroe/UFO theory so as to make *all* theories about her death look foolish.

it would not surprise me at all, not with some of the things I have seen government oeratives do to "hide" a commonly believed or even solo theory

been there, done that before. three times, in fact.

I would love to hear and see evidence on that.

[TheMacGuffin]

Hi Mac, Why would M.M, know too much about U.F.O's ? .I dont reckon that she committed suicide either,maybe she was "taken out" because she knew too much about JFK,and.... just maybe was going to "spill the beans".which would have caused chaos to a whole lot of people,including the Gov't.

The story goes that when she was having an affair with JFK, she learned that he had seen crashed UFOs and alien bodies at a military base, and mentioned this to her journalist friend Dorothy Kilgallen. The latter had learned about the same type of thing in 1955 from Lord Mountbatten, and that is actually true as we now know.

Anyway, when Monroe's relationship with JFK ended, she was going to spill the beans at a press conference with Kilgallen. At any rate, she was known to have kept a diary as well, which went missing after her death.

We know now that the affair with JFK was real and that she was very angry when it ended, calling the White House repeatedly and threatening to tell everything--not only about UFOs of course. If she was murdered, the story also goes that James Anlgeton of the CIA arranged it. Well, it's not as if he had no experience in that department, being head of counter-intelligence.

[TheMacGuffin]

I would love to hear and see evidence on that.

This is the famous document that started it all. Some people will tell you it's a fake and others a genuine leaked document of the type that is never supposed to see the light of day--just kept around for insurance and blackmail purposes, so everybody has something on everybody else.

I once knew a guy who went far because he had a drawer full of nasty stuff like this, and everyone was afraid of him. He would just say with a smile "Well, according to this record, on such-and-such day you did such-and-such". The higher up they go the worse they are in that way.

Hoover and Angleton had power like that in Washington.

Edited October 13, 2012 by TheMacGuffin

[TheMacGuffin]

The FBI also had her under surveillance too, and considered her a security risk with leftist views, but then Hoover thought that about virtually everybody. Who knows? Her autopsy was not exactly by the book, but then neither was JFK's, was it?

http://tangibleinfo....lyn-monroe.html

And if you want wheels within wheels and plots within plots, there are those who will say that enemies of the Kennedy's on the political Right, including Hoover and Angleton, killed Monroe in hopes of somehow pinning it on Jack and Robert Kennedy.

Edited October 13, 2012 by TheMacGuffin

[Sakari]

This is the famous document that started it all. Some people will tell you it's a fake and others a genuine leaked document of the type that is never supposed to see the light of day--just kept around for insurance and blackmail purposes, so everybody has something on everybody else.

I once knew a guy who went far because he had a drawer full of nasty stuff like this, and everyone was afraid of him. Hoover and Angleton had power like that in Washington.

Thank You....

I was talking more about earl of trumps " personal " been there, done that.......

( remember when I said I had you mixed up with someone else, I did, and I now remember who )

[TheMacGuffin]

Thank You....

I was talking more about earl of trumps " personal " been there, done that.......

( remember when I said I had you mixed up with someone else, I did, and I now remember who )

I think of myself as a sort of "librarian" with plenty of things to share, at least when the mood strikes me--only I keep my "library" in my head. So did my father, although after he died I made sure to clean up anything written down that might have been left behind.

A friend of mine helped me dump some of it off a pier in California, but that's another story.

Edited October 13, 2012 by TheMacGuffin

[spud the mackem]

The story goes that when she was having an affair with JFK, she learned that he had seen crashed UFOs and alien bodies at a military base, and mentioned this to her journalist friend Dorothy Kilgallen. The latter had learned about the same type of thing in 1955 from Lord Mountbatten, and that is actually true as we now know.

Anyway, when Monroe's relationship with JFK ended, she was going to spill the beans at a press conference with Kilgallen. At any rate, she was known to have kept a diary as well, which went missing after her death.

We know now that the affair with JFK was real and that she was very angry when it ended, calling the White House repeatedly and threatening to tell everything--not only about UFOs of course. If she was murdered, the story also goes that James Anlgeton of the CIA arranged it. Well, it's not as if he had no experience in that department, being head of counter-intelligence.

What you have said makes sense,I worked for the U.K Gov't and almost everything was on a "need to know" basis.And we are sworn in to an Official Secrets Act,....... For Life..!!....Like keep quiet and nothing bad will happen.

[TheMacGuffin]

Kilgallen really did get a crashed UFO story from Lord Mountbatten in 1955, which did get into the newspapers. She later "committed suicide" as well in 1965, under circumstances that were very similar to Marilyn Monroe's death.

At that time, she was writing a book about the JFK assassination, getting interviews with Jack Ruby and people like that. Her manuscript was never found.

[spud the mackem]

Its pretty grim that people are killed or mysteriously disappear,because the Gov't of the day is frightened of being honest and revealing the truth.I've seen the F.B.I. in action in your Country, man they are Scary.

[TheMacGuffin]

Its pretty grim that people are killed or mysteriously disappear,because the Gov't of the day is frightened of being honest and revealing the truth.I've seen the F.B.I. in action in your Country, man they are Scary.

It's been this way since World War II, and then thoroughly institutionalized during the Cold War. FDR was the one who gave Hoover the authority to spy on anyone without warrant, open their mail, install listening devices, tap their phones, and it really made Hoover what he was. He also created the CIA, or at least its predecessor the OSS.

At the time, even people in Congress were worried this would all turn into some kind of "Gestapo", and they had very good reason to be concerned. Most people will never know the half of it, not even a tenth of it.

[Rafterman]

Still waiting to see the full list of 25 named in the article and any evidence that these death rates are any different than any other segment of the population?

Shouldn't we be somewhat skeptical of articles that make such earth shattering accusations, but yet are shorter than a standard movie review?

I personally know at least 3 dozen individuals who are doing the exact work mentioned in the article - some working under government contract - and none seem to be too concerned about turning up dead under mysterious circumstances.

[TheMacGuffin]

I personally know at least 3 dozen individuals who are doing the exact work mentioned in the article - some working under government contract - and none seem to be too concerned about turning up dead under mysterious circumstances.

Otto Binder made a list of deaths that he considered "suspect" as of 1971, including Morris J. Jessup (suicide?), Edward Ruppelt (died at a very young age of a heart attack?), Damon Runyon, Jr. who like Dorothy Kilgallen was investigating UFOs and the Kennedy assassination (suicide?).

Indeed, he had a list of UFO researchers who seemed to die very young of heart attacks or fast-acting cancers, as well as a suspiciously large number of suicides. Quite a few of them were also repeated warned, threatened and harassed.

Here's another article about Binder and the "liquidation" of the UFO researchers in the 1950s and 1960s. You be the judge.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&ved=0CDwQFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fufoupdateslist.com%2F2003%2Fjul%2Fm10-009.shtml&ei=f3t5UNXsKI_89gSIuoCABw&usg=AFQjCNGAN7_kUk5uCgulS3wm1CLKJ1zdLA&sig2=6aUY0O-4ANxbiS-42nvB2Q

[TheMacGuffin]

Binder says, for example, that the UFO broadcaster Frank Edwards was threatened at least three times before his death from an apparent heart attack, and he wasn't the only one.

Edward Ruppelt was "advised" to edit his book on UFOs to make it more skeptical of ETs, and so on. All I can say is that age 37 is very young to die of a heart attack. I'm sure it happens, but how common is that?

[archernyc]

Still waiting to see the full list of 25 named in the article and any evidence that these death rates are any different than any other segment of the population?

Me too.My father had his first heart attack at 37, so that one could be just coincidence. Did Ruppelt's family have a history of heart disease?

It seems fishy at first reading, but how many thousands of people work in the aerospace industry? and there's only 25-40 deaths that seem a bit fishy? Statistically speaking, that seems kinda normal.

Edited October 13, 2012 by archernyc

[TheMacGuffin]

UFO research is not a healthy field to be involved in, even for scientists. Just ask James McDonald and John Mack. Well actually you can't ask them because they died relatively young as well, one from suicide and the other in an accident(?), of course after suffering years of ridicule and attack designed to discourage others from taking up this work.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CGAQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fufocon.blogspot.com%2F2007%2F06%2Fufo-curse.html&ei=JYt5UKvkA4rm8QTiv4H4Bw&usg=AFQjCNGgtvrg8i0o8tFDoxIuuLtNJFTHLQ&sig2=6RX_z3aFvCvv98gEGy2W_g

[TheMacGuffin]

Me too.My father had his first heart attack at 37, so that one could be just coincidence. Did Ruppelt's family have a history of heart disease?

It seems fishy at first reading, but how many thousands of people work in the aerospace industry? and there's only 25-40 deaths that seem a bit fishy? Statistically speaking, that seems kinda normal.

I do know that it was Ruppelt's second heart attack, which seems unusual for a young man from a military background otherwise in good health.

[TSS]

UFO research is not a healthy field to be involved in, even for scientists.

Hasn't done Good's career any harm - he dug deeper then most and posted plenty of docs in his book (which many then followed and copied)...his life and career have been fine. Vallee career hasn't suffered, he's respected inside and outside this field.....i'm sure if you was to dig as deep into the other side you'd find plenty who have had no bother....then you're left with little more then standard odds of people dying in any field, as they do in all walks of life.

[TheMacGuffin]

Hasn't done Good's career any harm - he dug deeper then most and posted plenty of docs in his book (which many then followed and copied)...his life and career have been fine. Vallee career hasn't suffered, he's respected inside and outside this field.....i'm sure if you was to dig as deep into the other side you'd find plenty who have had no bother....then you're left with little more then standard odds of people dying in any field, as they do in all walks of life.

Well, that's the whole question here, not that everybody dies but whether some people had "help" dying at relatively young ages, especially those in UFO research.

Otto Binder thought this was happening as early as 1971.

[synchronomy]

Related to the "Disclosure Project", 4 people closely involved in organizing it got cancer within a short period of time.

I've read most of Greer's publications. He is widely regarded as a "pushy SOB" by anyone he wants information from.

From Colin Andrews: http://www.colinandrews.net/Greer-Pawelec-Testimony.html

"Brave souls already perished in this search like Steven

Greer's close colleague Shari Adiamak and U.S. Congressman Steven Schiff. Steven Greer and

myself also, each discovered serious cancer's around the same period when we were establishing the

Disclosure project and also making in-roads in the Pentagon and elsewhere. Shari and Steven Schiff

died and Steven Greer and I survived. I have no doubts that the cancers were deliberately inflicted by

those who became gravely concerned for where Disclosure was going - today this is one part of where

it is going."

Greer has written and talked about this extensively over the years. He makes no secret of his belief that it was a deliberate attempt to stifle the Disclosure Project.

[TheMacGuffin]

Related to the "Disclosure Project", 4 people closely involved in organizing it got cancer within a short period of time.

I've read most of Greer's publications. He is widely regarded as a "pushy SOB" by anyone he wants information from.

Greer has written and talked about this extensively over the years. He makes no secret of his belief that it was a deliberate attempt to stifle the Disclosure Project.

The CIA was trying to figure out how to inject people with fast-acting cancers going back to the 1950s, as well as viruses that caused cancer. They were even very interested in that SV-40 virus that contaminated one of the early polio vaccines since it was thought to be cancer-causing. After all, it is one way of assassinating someone without any risk of it being traced back to the Agency.

They were trying to give Fidel Castro and Patrice Lumumba some kind of diseases like that, which all came under the domain of Dr. Sidney Gottlieb and his MK Ultra program--not to mention the stable of nasty Nazis they had working for them at the time.

[synchronomy]

The CIA was trying to figure out how to inject people with fast-acting cancers going back to the 1950s, as well as viruses that caused cancer. They were even very interested in that SV-40 virus that contaminated one of the early polio vaccines since it was thought to be cancer-causing. After all, it is one way of assassinating someone without any risk of it being traced back to the Agency.

They were trying to give Fidel Castro and Patrice Lumumba some kind of diseases like that, which all came under the domain of Dr. Sidney Gottlieb and his MK Ultra program--not to mention the stable of nasty Nazis they had working for them at the time.

Figuring out what causes a disease is the first step to curing it. Causing cancer is old news now as any lab mice will tell you!

Seems though a popular technique to cure verbosity is a little polonium brewed into a cup of tea.

Persuasion can be far more subtle yet remain very effective. Former military and private sector employees talking too much have found their pension checks start to go missing, and upon inquiring they get a red-tape runaround for a while.

[archernyc]

I found this on the Disclosure Project website:

When we were organizing The Disclosure Project a few years ago, I asked one of Neil Armstrong’s friends if Armstrong would come to Washington to brief members of Congress at the 1997 Congressional briefing we organized in April of that year. I was told that Armstrong wished he could –but that if he spoke about what really happened during the moon landing, that Neil Armstrong, his wife, and children would all be killed. It was put to me this bluntly.

I found this to be unbelievable at the time, but since then have found that such threats and bullying by the over-reaching national security state is routine. A very senior scientist at the Naval Research Labs in Washington DC recently told me and the Disclosure Project team that if he spoke about some of the information he knew, that he, his wife, his children and grandchildren would all be killed.

[Sakari]

I find it odd that people do not look at the fact not on " citizen " has ever gotten a good clear picture or video of a " ship "....Nor, any type of evidence that is even somewhat convincing.

Yet, we still have C.T.'s like this one.....

[TheMacGuffin]

I find it odd that people do not look at the fact not on " citizen " has ever gotten a good clear picture or video of a " ship "....Nor, any type of evidence that is even somewhat convincing.

Yet, we still have C.T.'s like this one.....

There are a million pictures of UFOs, and they are routinely dismissed as fake, but I never thought they all were. We've had threads about this before.

[Sakari]

There are a million pictures of UFOs, and they are routinely dismissed as fake, but I never thought they all were. We've had threads about this before.

Really?......

Any of these million pictures " clear, or convincing " like I stated in my reply?