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Abramelin

Luke 19:27

62 posts in this topic

I expect Him to be large and in charge and when the dust clears the survivors are going to wonder WHY we couldn't have had this peace all along.... A better day is coming - mostly because it can't get much worse and life continue.

Because of people like you who don't want peace.

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The moral problem there is that you support your god even though he claims he will kill three quarters of the population and you're more than ok with that. Not only that, your more concerned with your own self preservation than those lives.

Correction. 5 people that he defines as righteous, which always seems to be on a sliding scale. Because of the belief that 'everyone is a sinner' he could clearly say there's no righteous peple there because he deems everyone a sinner from birth.

You seem to flip flop there. On one hand, god does all the killing. On the other it's man. Which is it?

You seem to have no problem about it though, for someone who doesn't 'want' it to happen.

Wow, wait a minute, i'm now lost. Where is written that God will kill three quarters of population? Where did i say i'm ok with that? I just said i really don't know what else to do but to ensure my self preservation, and i asked you to clarify, but you didn't bother to help me understand your actions in that psychiatrist scenario.

You seem to confuse me with some catholic :) I don't believe that people are born with sin, that is not logical. And i think righteousness is something clear to anyone, there was no change in definition as far as i know.

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Wow, wait a minute, i'm now lost. Where is written that God will kill three quarters of population? Where did i say i'm ok with that? I just said i really don't know what else to do but to ensure my self preservation, and i asked you to clarify, but you didn't bother to help me understand your actions in that psychiatrist scenario.

Well , talking about death that will surely happen, and promoting death are two different things. For instance, I believe three quarters of population will perish very soon. But I wouldn't like that to happen, not to people i know, not to people i don't know. So just the facts that Jesus talked about that, the fact that He explained the Judgment and the Law, doesn't mean the He wants people to die by the Law.

As to the scenario you laid out you'd have to be more than 'quite confident' before you did anything. You'd have to be certain.

You seem to confuse me with some catholic :) I don't believe that people are born with sin, that is not logical. And i think righteousness is something clear to anyone, there was no change in definition as far as i know.

Righteousness is far from clear. From far too many believers I hear the belief in god superceeds righteousness. For example, I could live a good life and come up with a cure to a disease, which saves millions of lives. Yet, because I don't believe in god, I'm not righteous.

So what truly matters to your god: if a person does god deeds or if a person believes in god?

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At this stage in the tread, the following may be of some relevance.

Heb 5:12 In fact, though by now you should be teachers, you still need someone to teach you the basic truths of God's word. You have become people who need milk instead of solid food.

Heb 5:13 For everyone who lives on milk is still a baby and is inexperienced in the message of righteousness.

Heb 5:14 But solid food is for mature people, whose minds are trained by practice to distinguish good from evil.

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As to the scenario you laid out you'd have to be more than 'quite confident' before you did anything. You'd have to be certain.

I was asking what would you do, and it seems your answer is basically the same as mine : Don't know, not sure. So it is not logical to accuse me to pursue my own self preservation if you couldn't do better.

Righteousness is far from clear. From far too many believers I hear the belief in god superceeds righteousness. For example, I could live a good life and come up with a cure to a disease, which saves millions of lives. Yet, because I don't believe in god, I'm not righteous.

So what truly matters to your god: if a person does god deeds or if a person believes in god?

As far as i know, being righteous has NOTHING to do with faith in God. I am believer, yet i confirm i am NOT righteous. And yet i have atheist friend i know from work, who is better christian than hundreds of other people i know, who declare themselves as christians. I firmly believe that God does not judge people on what they declare themselves, but according to what principle they live, since Gods principles are written in our hearts. If you don't believe in God, and yet hold your moral conscience in high regard, if you follow the rule that you do to others what you like to be done to yourself, if you are humble, merciful and just, and not judging others, then God counts you among his people, although you do not believe in Him.

I think Epistle of Romans sums up what i mean, especially 2:13-15

"For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another"

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But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them — bring them here and kill them in front of me.

http://bible.cc/luke/19-27.htm

Can someone explain to me what Jesus meant with this?

" 'I can guarantee that everyone who has something will be given more. But everything will be taken away from those who don't have much."

"Bring my enemies, who didn't want me to be their king. Kill them in front of me.'"

here Jesus means worldly people (the exteriorists) who don't accept his spiritual kingdom( the holy inwardness), cannot have eternal life, hence he says "killing them" but this usage does not mean you kill selfish and materialistic people, this expression means (for people like them) due to their godlessness, their death is more good than their life, because worldy people that don't have any spiritual belief are perishable. You might think it is like a reproach to materialistic lifes.

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" 'I can guarantee that everyone who has something will be given more. But everything will be taken away from those who don't have much."

"Bring my enemies, who didn't want me to be their king. Kill them in front of me.'"

here Jesus means worldly people (the exteriorists) who don't accept his spiritual kingdom( the holy inwardness), cannot have eternal life, hence he says "killing them" but this usage does not mean you kill selfish and materialistic people, this expression means (for people like them) due to their godlessness, their death is more good than their life, because worldy people that don't have any spiritual belief are perishable. You might think it is like a reproach to materialistic lifes.

So those that don't worship Jesus are expendable?

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So those that don't worship Jesus are expendable?

I hope I said above clear enough but my reply to your question:

Nature or god or elohim or galactic federation whatever you say for the Creator, it's unimportant, it's important that what or who you want to mean, this order that we experience, disciplines them anyway, even if they don't want to find out truths!

In fact every entity has a value in God's plan but unbelievers don't have a spiritual value because of their godlessness, as the phrase goes that they are like an animal. It's important to notice that bodies change, die but souls live forever. Souls need any spiritual belief to live in a spiritual form. Jesus/Christianity and Abraham's other religions give people the belief of this spiritual form. The rest is people's problem. If you want a certain answer for your question, it's here: "Unfortunately, yes!"

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Good grief people Jesus was telling one of his riddles, those words were of a king in Jesus story.:)

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So those that don't worship Jesus are expendable?

I hope I said above clear enough but my reply to your question:

Nature or god or elohim or galactic federation whatever you say for the Creator, it's unimportant, it's important that what or who you want to mean, this order that we experience, disciplines them anyway, even if they don't want to find out truths!

In fact every entity has a value in God's plan but unbelievers don't have a spiritual value because of their godlessness, as the phrase goes that they are like an animal. It's important to notice that bodies change, die but souls live forever. Souls need any spiritual belief to live in a spiritual form. Jesus/Christianity and Abraham's other religions give people the belief of this spiritual form. The rest is people's problem. If you want a certain answer for your question, it's here: "Unfortunately, yes!"

Sorry I misunderstood it some. Now I realized that I am wrong! :( so sorry folks!

dear HavocWing,

If you mean there being unchristian, in point of spirituality unchristian people that have any creator belief, can improve their souls, too. As far as I know there are some esoteric, occult foundations for irreligionists that have any spiritual belief, but Prophet Abraham's religions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam) make most simple helping people for this development. Moses, Jesus, Muhammad are holy characters of holy books ( differences and conflicts that are between those, root in exterior views, cultural and historical problems, in fact all are crops of Elohim) if you accept them, you easily find out the existence of god in your inwardness, moreover hence Jesus had said: "Whoever has seen me has seen the Father."

Regards.

muzzybluezzy

Edited by Muzzybluezzy

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But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them — bring them here and kill them in front of me.

http://bible.cc/luke/19-27.htm

Can someone explain to me what Jesus meant with this?

Jesus was talking about the destruction of Jerusalem.

As they heard these things, he proceeded to tell a parable, because he was near to Jerusalem, and because they supposed that the kingdom of God was to appear immediately. (Luke 19:11 ESV)

The one who had one minas (or talent) was Jerusalem. It was taken and given to the Gentiles, who trampled the city underfoot, starting in 70 CE. Jerusalem did not want Jesus as their king. By 66 CE, the Gospel had beared great fruit in all places of the world EXCEPT for Jerusalem. They had chased out the disciples and killed those sent to preach repentance. If you read Revelation 4-6 in a historical context, and pair it with Matthew 24:14, it can be concluded that the end came in the first century and has been progressing according to God's plan (the sealed scroll of Revelation 5 and 6) since then.

I hope that helped any.

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In addition, Luke 21:24 and several other parts of the New Testament spoke of a Times of the Gentiles as beginning after Jerusalem's desolation. The saints would be persecuted as well as rule, just as the Jews had. And like Jerusalem, the Gentile capital Rome is to be destroyed to avenge the blood of the saints and the prophets. (Revelation 19:1-2)

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