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jugoso

New Era of 'Peace and Unity'

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Bolivian President Evo Morales is marking today's winter solstice and the much-discussed calendar date by celebrating a hopeful vision for a "new era of peace and love" in the world,one in which the spirit of community and respect for Mother Earth will win out over the greed induced by global capitalism.

In an open invitation to celebrate the day, Morales explained that "the Mayan calendar's 21 of December is the end of the non-time and the beginning of time. It is the end of the Macha and the beginning of the Pacha, the end of selfishness and the beginning of brotherhood, it is the end of individualism and the beginning of collectivism."

And continued, "The scientists know very well that this marks the end of an anthropocentric life and the beginning of a bio-centric life. It is the end of hatred and the beginning of love, the end of lies and beginning of truth. It is the end of sadness and the beginning of happiness, it is the end of division and the beginning of unity, and this is a theme to be developed. That is why we invite all of you, those of you who bet on mankind, we invite those who want to share their experiences for the benefit of mankind."

http://www.commondre...line/2012/12/21

It´s our decision to make!! :tu:

Edited by jugoso
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"it is the end of individualism and the beginning of collectivism"

Haha, no. What I earn is mine.

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Yeah, good luck with that one, Evo ol' mate!

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"it is the end of individualism and the beginning of collectivism"

Haha, no. What I earn is mine.

No one taught you that sharing can be very rewarding?

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No one taught you that sharing can be very rewarding?

I was taught to share when I had things to share but I was also taught that I shouldn't expect things. I work for what is mine, they can work for theirs.

I understand I come from a privledged background, but my parents didn't. They worked hard to provide for their children (me and my sisters) so we could have more then they did and enjoy and work for more.

I'll help others work towards obtaining what they should do to provide for themselves. As an accountant, I do. I crunch numbers for my coworkers so they can get their pay checks on time while they provide the actual business that brings in the money and makes me a worthwhile investment.

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Yeah, good luck with that one, Evo ol' mate!

Yeah but it certainly is a nice sentiment though IMO.

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Bolivian President Evo Morales is marking today's winter solstice and the much-discussed calendar date by celebrating a hopeful vision for a "new era of peace and love" in the world,one in which the spirit of community and respect for Mother Earth will win out over the greed induced by global capitalism.

In an open invitation to celebrate the day, Morales explained that "the Mayan calendar's 21 of December is the end of the non-time and the beginning of time. It is the end of the Macha and the beginning of the Pacha, the end of selfishness and the beginning of brotherhood, it is the end of individualism and the beginning of collectivism."

And continued, "The scientists know very well that this marks the end of an anthropocentric life and the beginning of a bio-centric life. It is the end of hatred and the beginning of love, the end of lies and beginning of truth. It is the end of sadness and the beginning of happiness, it is the end of division and the beginning of unity, and this is a theme to be developed. That is why we invite all of you, those of you who bet on mankind, we invite those who want to share their experiences for the benefit of mankind."

http://www.commondre...line/2012/12/21

It´s our decision to make!! :tu:

Very appreciative of President Morales' words.

The part of moving away from an anthropocentric view of life to a biocentric one is very next level.

The shift away from the individual to the collective has been occuring for some time and it will be nice to see it come into full swing.

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A great vision for the world and many will like the sentiment because they know we need change in the systems of this world. For instance, a child dies every 5 SECONDS from simple problems like lack of clean water, they die from diarrhoea! think about that as you down your turkey on the 25th.

“I believe that to meet the challenge of our lives, human beings will have to develop a greater sense of universal responsibility. We must all learn to work not just for our own self, family, or nation but for the benefit of all mankind. Universal responsibility is the key to human survival. It is the best foundation for world peace, the equitable use of natural resources and through concern for future generations, the proper care of the environment”. The Dalai Lama

But there are those that are blind to the rest of humanity and only selfishness is their guiding rule. Mention a ‘Hopeful Vision’ and they will ask if you mean a new 3D TV!

“The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you’re inside, you look around. What do you see? Businessmen, teachers, carpenters. The very people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged and many of them are so inert, so hopelessly dependant on the system that they will fight to protect it”. Morpheus, the Matrix.

Best wishes to all for the New year.

“If the Climate was a bank we would already have fixed it” H.Chavez

Edited by sutemi
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We all have our delusions.

No one taught you that sharing can be very rewarding?

Which capitalism doesn't prevent. Edited by Rlyeh

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“If the Climate was a bank we would already have fixed it” H.Chavez[/size]

Honest quote as is the following.

In fact, I have a feeling that if Lehman Brothers was Lehman Brothers and Sisters, they might still be around.

In other words if banks were for all instead of so only a few could profit then they would have a different mission sans greed and the banking crisis would have never occured to begin with, perhaps.

Edited by I believe you
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Bolivian President Evo Morales is marking today's winter solstice and the much-discussed calendar date by celebrating a hopeful vision for a "new era of peace and love" in the world,one in which the spirit of community and respect for Mother Earth will win out over the greed induced by global capitalism.[/color]]

good read. from Oregon.

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There isn't going to be some new era of spiritual enlightenment because human nature is inherently evil because it is based upon self preservation and survival of the fittest. So all this talk of 'peace and unity' is delusional and deceiful and there will be no change for the better in the world until human nature changes or is forcibly changed.

Edited by fadedface

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"it is the end of individualism and the beginning of collectivism"

Haha, no. What I earn is mine.

People from a privileged middle and upper class background should give more or be forced to give more to people who have been denied the oppurtunities that they have had. Part of the problem in society is these self serving privileged people who have all the oppurtunity given to them and patronize the rest of us that they've earnt it when in reality they've had the breaks in life even though they don't admit it.

Edited by fadedface

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There isn't going to be some new era of spiritual enlightenment because human nature is inherently evil because it is based upon self preservation and survival of the fittest. So all this talk of 'peace and unity' is delusional and deceiful and there will be no change for the better in the world until human nature changes or is forcibly changed.

That is not true.

During our earliest stages when we lived in the jungle, if you went off on your own, you would die. People had no privacy then! We worked as a group.

Loneliness itself evolved so if you got mad and left you would feel lonely and want to go back and make up. If you didn't you'd die on your own, even if you left with one or two other people, no way, all dead.

This mechanism insured our success, cooperation and not competition allowed us to be successful as a species and not die out.

Humans are group animals. If aliens were to one day put us in a zoo they would insure we were put in as groups so we could thrive, if they put us alone, in solitary, we would not thrive.

We can also do things better as a group. Doctors working for a while as a group begin to function as one unit, their individualness dissapates, they work faster without talking, it is automatic, and it is not just them being faster because of numbers, each individual themselves works faster than they would alone as if being part of a machine improves their efficiency.

All our advances in the end are passed down because of knowledge being passed down, and it is passed down in groups, people cooperating, and when it is passed down it is added upon making the information superior for the next generation. Cooperation is why we succeed.

This is what I have learned by reading lots of science and history.

On the other hand those who are into conservative politics, the same who usually despise science, will claim it is competition that leads to our continue success as a species. Capitalist ideology...ugh.

Believe what you want, I know what side I am going with.

Edited by I believe you

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That is not true.

During our earliest stages when we lived in the jungle, if you went off on your own, you would die. People had no privacy then! We worked as a group.

Loneliness itself evolved so if you got mad and left you would feel lonely and want to go back and make up. If you didn't you'd die on your own, even if you left with one or two other people, no way, all dead.

This mechanism insured our success, cooperation and not competition allowed us to be successful as a species and not die out.

Humans are group animals. If aliens were to one day put us in a zoo they would insure we were put in as groups so we could thrive, if they put us alone, in solitary, we would not thrive.

We can also do things better as a group. Doctors working for a while as a group begin to function as one unit, their individualness dissapates, they work faster without talking, it is automatic, and it is not just them being faster because of numbers, each individual themselves works faster than they would alone as if being part of a machine improves their efficiency.

All our advances in the end are passed down because of knowledge being passed down, and it is passed down in groups, people cooperating, and when it is passed down it is added upon making the information superior for the next generation. Cooperation is why we succeed.

This is what I have learned by reading lots of science and history.

On the other hand those who are into conservative politics, the same who usually despise science, will claim it is competition that leads to our continue success as a species. Capitalist ideology...ugh.

Believe what you want, I know what side I am going with.

When you say humans are group animals I think you mean clique animals.

Humans form self serving cliques to ensure their own mutual protection and survival. The interaction in these cliques is based on self serving hypocrisy and double standards and anyone who doesn't fit into the clique because their 'face doesn't fit' are rejected, marginalised and persecuted by the clique or society. The cooperation you mention between humans is built on prejudice, intolerance and social darwinism. The individuals who invariably have a more profound understanding of the universe have been outsiders or eccentrics who did not fit into the unfair hypocritical group cooperation of human society.

Group cooperation like all human action is based on natural selection and therefore competition.

Edited by fadedface
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I was taught to share when I had things to share but I was also taught that I shouldn't expect things. I work for what is mine, they can work for theirs.

I understand I come from a privledged background, but my parents didn't. They worked hard to provide for their children (me and my sisters) so we could have more then they did and enjoy and work for more.

I'll help others work towards obtaining what they should do to provide for themselves. As an accountant, I do. I crunch numbers for my coworkers so they can get their pay checks on time while they provide the actual business that brings in the money and makes me a worthwhile investment.

People from a privileged middle and upper class background should give everything they have or be forced to give everything to disadvantaged people who have been denied the oppurtunities that they have had. Part of the problem in society is all you self serving smug privileged people who have had all the oppurtunity in life given to you and you patronize the rest of us that you've earnt it when in reality you've had all the breaks in life that have been denied to others even though you and you're kind don't admit it.

Edited by fadedface

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We all have our delusions.

Which capitalism doesn't prevent.

Well it certainly doesn´t encourage it. Inherent greed and capitalism seem to go hand in hand.

Critics of capitalism associate it with social inequality and unfair distribution of wealth and power; a tendency toward market monopoly oroligopoly (and government by oligarchy); imperialism, counter-revolutionary wars and various forms of economic and cultural exploitation;materialism; repression of workers and trade unionists; social alienation; economic inequality; unemployment; and economic instability.

Edited by jugoso

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People from a privileged middle and upper class background should give everything they have or be forced to give everything to disadvantaged people who have been denied the oppurtunities that they have had. Part of the problem in society is all you self serving smug privileged people who have had all the oppurtunity in life given to you and you patronize the rest of us that you've earnt it when in reality you've had all the breaks in life that have been denied to others even though you and you're kind don't admit it.

They haven't been denied it, no more then people who were born into middle or upper class backgrounds 'handed' their things. These things happen by chance, it's what you decide to do with what you're given.

First, let me tackle the bits that I've bolded. I find it startlingly insulting that you'd lump me into the 'self-serving smug privileged people, who patronize the rest of 'you', when I've had all the breaks, and I won't admit it.'

I understand I come from a privileged background, but my parents didn't. They worked hard to provide for their children (me and my sisters) so we could have more then they did and enjoy and work for more.

Notice, I mention I come from a privileged background, I admit that fact, I've grown up in a lower-middle class to a upper-middle class family, I know the value of hard work. Second, I've never patronized people who have a lower living standard then myself or make less then me or anything like that.

Third, the only thing my father provides me is a roof over my head nowadays. I pay him rent from my job, I pay for my own food, my own clothing, etc and so forth. If I had to live on my own, even with my current job, I would be living from pay check to pay check. I am lucky and I admit that.

And give everything they have? Then they'd have less then you. They'd have nothing. I suppose it's okay to be spiteful when you've spent you're life seeing others live lavishly but that doesn't mean you should burn the yard because of a few moles.

I give when I can, money, time, the sweat of my brow, but I cannot be an automaton for the less fortunate, I am privileged, I am sorry.

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The rich and the poor will have to dialogue.

The belief by the rich that the poor are just lazy falls apart when you look at the numbers overall and wealth distribution is becoming more and more imbalanced. There is not suddenly all these new people who decided to become lazy.

Also if you are rich but hire people at tremendously lower wages so their standard of living is lower than yours then that is viewing them just as a product and one you should get at the lowest price, not seeing others as humans.

The belief by the poor that the rich are all greedy and want others to suffer is just not true. If they are greedy it is less or as equal as everyone else is, the expressions take different forms but if the poor hater switched shoes they would become what they hated, it was jealousy all along.

The problem is that upward mobility is currently being limited. Many can see that a few are greatly profiting while others are suffering. Sure at times it is purely become certain industries do well while others flounder. The problem then becomes that certain industries that profit do so on the misery of others although there is no study showing that all these companies are the same. So on both sides there are issues of perception.

The dialogue happens over and over throughout history, in every society that develops social stratification.

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People from a privileged middle and upper class background should give everything they have or be forced to give everything to disadvantaged people who have been denied the oppurtunities that they have had. Part of the problem in society is all you self serving smug privileged people who have had all the oppurtunity in life given to you and you patronize the rest of us that you've earnt it when in reality you've had all the breaks in life that have been denied to others even though you and you're kind don't admit it.

alot of these "Disadvantaged" people chose to be that way as they don't want to find a job/won't accept working their way up and expect things to be handed over to them freely (Expect to walk off the street into a CEO's position). Over here in Australia we have a term "dole bludger" people who live on welfare and refuse to get a job all the while whinging that the dole is not higher (occasionally they work cash in hand while claiming welfare but that is rare), they even live in state owned housing (no this doesn't include disabled, elderly etc as they are in separate categories these are healthy people that are mooches on society). Do you really support people like this getting money for free from middle income & rich people?

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alot of these "Disadvantaged" people chose to be that way as they don't want to find a job/won't accept working their way up and expect things to be handed over to them freely (Expect to walk off the street into a CEO's position). Over here in Australia we have a term "dole bludger" people who live on welfare and refuse to get a job all the while whinging that the dole is not higher (occasionally they work cash in hand while claiming welfare but that is rare), they even live in state owned housing (no this doesn't include disabled, elderly etc as they are in separate categories these are healthy people that are mooches on society). Do you really support people like this getting money for free from middle income & rich people?

Is it not true that in your society the "dole bludger" label falls most on aboriginals and foreigners? There are ethnic divisions and tension that run concurrent to the type of language you are using.

Well if you invade a foreign country and do not give the original inhabitants the same type of communities, access to education, and good jobs, then why blame them for that?

If immigrants come and have access to mechanisms that allow upward mobility then they will integrate. If not they won't. We as a society design the environemnt and in return engineer society by doing so, it happens by commission or ommision.

If immigrants come and are just given dead end jobs then they society is choosing to use these people as a cheap source of labor with no path to equal status in society.

For you to try and say some people are like this or that without realizing how their environment has been manipulated and neglected then it is rather a narrow view you present that ignores certain variables.

Edited by I believe you

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Is it not true that in your society the "dole bludger" label falls most on aboriginals and foreigners? There are ethnic divisions and tension that run concurrent to the type of language you are using.

Well if you invade a foreign country and do not give the original inhabitants the same type of communities, access to education, and good jobs, then why blame them for that?

If immigrants come and have access to mechanisms that allow upward mobility then they will integrate. If not they won't. We as a society design the environemnt and in return engineer society by doing so, it happens by commission or ommision.

If immigrants come and are just given dead end jobs then they society is choosing to use these people as a cheap source of labor with no path to equal status in society.

For you to try and say some people are like this or that without realizing how their environment has been manipulated and neglected then it is rather a narrow view you present that ignores certain variables.

no actually the typical dole bludger is portrayed as Caucasian (and usually drug dependent) living in "bogan" areas. One of my own aunt falls into this category she is a druggie, never worked in her life and mooch's off my grandma (and yes, has claimed the dole for a significant period of time, to the point she actually had 2 kids to extend her dole payments which she doesn't take care of and leaves it to my grandma to look after, one of which is seriously sick due to my aunt taking drugs during pregnancy)

Edited by evil_kenshin

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They haven't been denied it, no more then people who were born into middle or upper class backgrounds 'handed' their things. These things happen by chance, it's what you decide to do with what you're given.

The socio economic background someone comes from still laregly determines how successful a person is and also their quality of life even though you probably wouldn't admit this because you've always had unfair social advantages that are denied from others. And the unfair social advantages you have extend beyond class distinctions and privilege

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no actually the typical dole bludger is portrayed as Caucasian (and usually drug dependent) living in "bogan" areas. One of my own aunt falls into this category she is a druggie, never worked in her life and mooch's off my grandma (and yes, has claimed the dole for a significant period of time, to the point she actually had 2 kids to extend her dole payments which she doesn't take care of and leaves it to my grandma to look after, one of which is seriously sick due to my aunt taking drugs during pregnancy)

I don't believe you.

Seems you are deflecting the way that label is used.

You might call your aunt one but part of your society believes there are more to be found among certain groups.

Also calling people names, regardless of who they are, and then believing they are a certain way without understanding the role environment plays, is purely conservative politics and a type of the "us vs them" script.

Also sadly, so many feel just like their parents, how lame, have fun repeating the same mistakes in thinking as your parents but the rest of the world is moving on.

Edited by I believe you

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I don't believe you.

Seems you are deflecting the way that label is used.

You might call your aunt one but part of your society believes there are more to be found among certain groups.

Also calling people names, regardless of who they are, and then believing they are a certain way without understanding the role environment plays, is purely conservative politics and a type of the "us vs them" script.

Also sadly, so many feel just like their parents, how lame, have fun repeating the same mistakes in thinking as your parents but the rest of the world is moving on.

you don't have to believe me, but a dole bludger is portrayed as caucasion in the media etc, there's even a comedy television series called "housos" sponsored by centrelink (the welfare agency in our country) about dole bludgers who are white.

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