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cor2000

Time travel

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Time travel to the past is physically impossible. Time travel to the future might be an option.

well i don't really agree seeing as past and future are illusions

there is no then. it's all 'now' so 'travelling' is actually the wrong term anyway

this is one of the reasons i think they haven't figured it out yet.

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All you'd need to do is change reality back to what it was. Destroy then reconstruct (whatever construct is the actual base of this universe not a scientist so i don't have a clue) back to how you want it. You do it perfectly to reflect the past, you are in the past(Hopefully you leave the important things like your memory otherwise you'd never remember it, oh and don't clone yourself either ;) might want to leave a way to change it back as well). sort of, since Joc is pretty much right with the whole time change thing. That's more of a creating reality then time travel(hitting the reset button basically) though.(isn't that close to how teleporting would work though reconstructing yourself except just yourself in to a different spot instead of a different time same thing bigger scale)

Going to the "future" that way though would be a pain because you could never accurately predict every bit. Going back to the present would be pretty easy if you recorded all the info before you left, going to the past would be cake, when you started to record all of the info that is.(before that you would have to guess*) Problem is that would be visiting the past since you have that "future" problem to worry about. You would have to take in to account every change that would happen to change what you consider to be the present.

There are a lot of problems though before that is even feasible though. On a smaller scale it would be more useful though. Like dispensers to instantly make something out of nothing, reverse aging, crap like that.

*You may end up like the fly or something worse if you guess wrong.

Yeah I wouldn't want to be the guy working on that project.

Edited by Jinxdom

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Well the brainiacs are really in full flow here...

I totally agree with the idea you need a machine rather than a process to go back in time.

If you use a process like a wormhole how are you going to find the technology to return.

Considering you used said technology and find no natural way to replicate it.

I think rubbing two sticks together and making fire is about the limit you can do in the Stone Age.

If you go forward using a process there's every chance you won't be stranded.

However with a machine you have more flexibility whichever way you travel.

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Wow Joc........that's too weird even for me to entertain.

Perhaps I just stated it 'weirdly'. Change occurs constantly. It all occurs within a set of 'constants' we call the Law of Physics. I wasn't meaning to implie that the Law of Physics is inaccurate, merely that Man discovered the 'laws'. The discovery was an attempt to explain why and when and how things happen. It's all about measurements. And time...is a measurement. How fast. How slow. But the thought that Time is a thing that can be traversed back and forth...to me THAT is total weirdness and completely unfounded by the Laws of Physics.

Edited by joc

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This whole conversation is slightly scuppered by the fact that we don't really know what time actually is, so any talk of "time travel" is unreasonably premature.

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This whole conversation is slightly scuppered by the fact that we don't really know what time actually is, so any talk of "time travel" is unreasonably premature.

The only person I have ever known who has used the word 'scuppered' in a sentence. :tu:

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This whole conversation is slightly scuppered by the fact that we don't really know what time actually is, so any talk of "time travel" is unreasonably premature.

But this is how great discoveries happen. We need to have these 'slightly scuppered conversation", I think through those type of conversations is how our sciences where developed. Through meaningless and going no where conversations. Even though we don't truly know what time is, we still need to converse and share our ideas on what time may be, in order for us to come up with an idea on what it is. Time is more than 24hrs, 60mins, 60 secs. And just from a few posts here, we can already see how everyone here has a different perspective on what time is and how it works. A lot of intelligent remarks I might add. So if we were to only keep talking about things that we "think we know", our knowledge and understanding would not grow to what it is now.

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But this is how great discoveries happen. We need to have these 'slightly scuppered conversation", I think through those type of conversations is how our sciences where developed. Through meaningless and going no where conversations. Even though we don't truly know what time is, we still need to converse and share our ideas on what time may be, in order for us to come up with an idea on what it is. Time is more than 24hrs, 60mins, 60 secs. And just from a few posts here, we can already see how everyone here has a different perspective on what time is and how it works. A lot of intelligent remarks I might add. So if we were to only keep talking about things that we "think we know", our knowledge and understanding would not grow to what it is now.

Leaving aside the fact that great discoveries are not made on message boards, I'm not arguing against science for science's sake (which I'm massively in favor of), just pointing out that having a conversation about what form time travel might take is utterly academic until we understand the nature of time better.

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If we film a ball rolling on a table, and reverse the film, we cannot tell the reversed film from the forwarded film. If we film an egg drop from a table and splater on the floor, and reverse that film, we will know that the film has been reversed.

From the whole egg to the splattered egg is change, but the splattered egg to the whole egg is change also. What determines the allowed change from the disallowed change in this example? I think what regulates change in this way is the nature of our consciousness as it observes change from past to future.

The laws of physics allow change to happen, but in those laws there is no preferred direction that changes can occur. If we film elementary particles colliding and bouncing off each other, if we reverse the film, all the laws that determine the results of the event remain the same. I think we can infer from this that change in reverse is just as real as change in the forward direction. Our consciousness preferrs the forward direction, and that's what we observe.

If the reverse change is just as real as the forward change, then there must exist a past for this reverse change to occur in. If change exists in the forward direction, there must be a future for this forward change to occur in.

How do we know this everlasting, changing moment we are aware of is the true reality? We consider it true because of the nature of our consciousness. Our consciousness determines for itself the direction of change, but change itself has no preferred direction.

If it were otherwise we would be eternally confused as to what is happening. :) I just think our comprehension and what appears to us to be true and real is determined by the nature of our llimited consciousness. What lies external to our consciousness? The nature of actual existence I think is very different than what we percieve it to be.

I think I got the idea you trying to convey.. Basically what your trying to say is that since there is matter and energy available for reality to go forward, there is also a form of matter and energy that would be available for reality to go in reverse??? :yes: ??......

I think even if we were ever capable of reversing reality...we would still experience the reversal...in a forward state of consciousness. Just like the egg breaking and watching it in rewind. Even though you are watching the breaking egg rewind on the t.v, you would still be experiencing it... linear(forward) form of consciousness....

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Leaving aside the fact that great discoveries are not made on message boards, I'm not arguing against science for science's sake (which I'm massively in favor of), just pointing out that having a conversation about what form time travel might take is utterly academic until we understand the nature of time better.

I get what your saying. But who knows, if us having a conversation about what form time travel might take, may help us understand the nature of time much better. And Who's to say that great discoveries haven't been made on message boards, it would be much easier for scientist from all around the world to have a conversation and discussions on a message board rather meetings to figure out and share their ideas.

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Of course time travel is possible. This topic was started next year.

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Lots of good ideas here about time. Who is to say which is correct? joc says we measure change and call it time, I say time is a series of present moments we experience that are intervals or slices of space-time that must always exist in their own moments.

Others have other concepts of time and how to manipulate time. The original OP asks, "What kind of technology can we use to time travel?". Trying to discover what time itself is is may be a prerequisite to answering this question.

The laws of physics seem to allow time travel by manipulating gravity, as gravity twists space-time. Gravity warps time as well as space. I think if time did not exist as a dimension, gravity would have no effect on time or rate of change, but it does, as does accelerating different frames of reference.

It can be argued that different rates of change due to gravity or acceleration are due to the laws of physics (constants) without considering time as an actual dimension. I can see the logic in this. Change just happens, allowed within the laws of physics.

It seems to me that if all there is is the present moment of space, and this present configuration of space is constantly changing itself, what is this present moment of space and when does it exist?

Ten years ago at a certain moment, that was someone's present moment of space. When did that occur? I think it occurred in a moment of space-time, and as that moment was physical reality for that person, that reality cannot just vanish. Change occurs, but the interval of change itself varies according to one's personal frame of reference.

According to the theory of relativity, your 'now' and my 'now' do not correlate. Everyone is experiencing a different frame of reference as to their consideration of 'now'. 'Now' or the present moment is not a constant, it varies everywhere in the universe. The concept that the present moment is all there is becomes inadequate, as there is no universal present moment. When do these personal present moments occur?

I think the 'when' is the slice of space-time in which they occur. The slice of time is the 'when' and the corresponding slice of space is the 'where'. These 'when's' and 'where's' co-exist in their configurations of space-time, and their existences cannot suddenly vanish out of reality. I think these moments of space and time always must exist.

So, defining a specific, personal configuration of space as 'now', and stating that this 'now' is reality, and that change defines space without including a dimension of time I think is an inadequate definition of reality.

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Time travel to the past is physically impossible. Time travel to the future might be an option.

I think we need prove that there is a past or future first before we start talking about time travel.

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The laws of physics seem to allow time travel by manipulating gravity, as gravity twists space-time. Gravity warps time as well as space. I think if time did not exist as a dimension, gravity would have no effect on time or rate of change, but it does, as does accelerating different frames of reference.

How in tarnation does gravity warp space and time?

Edited by joc

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How in tarnation does gravity warp space and time?

According to the general theory of relativity, gravity is a curvature of space and time caused by matter. Matter warps space around it in three dimensions, and time is also warped.

The rate of time is slower near a massive object than from some distance from that object. This is gravitational time dilation. If someone on earth and someone in a space ship some distance from earth compare their rates of time by their clocks, they both would agree that the clock on earth is ticking slower than the clock on the spaceship.

Gravitational time dilation is the effect of time passing at different rates in regions of different gravitational potential; the lower the gravitational potential (the closer the clock is to the source of gravitation), the more slowly time passes. Albert Einstein originally predicted this effect in his theory of relativity[1] and it has since been confirmed by tests of general relativity

http://en.wikipedia....l_time_dilation

Edited by StarMountainKid

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According to the general theory of relativity, gravity is a curvature of space and time caused by matter. Matter warps space around it in three dimensions, and time is also warped.

The rate of time is slower near a massive object than from some distance from that object. This is gravitational time dilation. If someone on earth and someone in a space ship some distance from earth compare their rates of time by their clocks, they both would agree that the clock on earth is ticking slower than the clock on the spaceship.

http://en.wikipedia....l_time_dilation

That is complete and utter nonsense. Einstien was brilliant..but he wasn't exactly right about everything...that is HIS theory and it is incredibly stupid. I am not saying Einstien was incredibly stupid ...just his theory of relatives never knowing when to leave after Thanksgiving dinner.

Gravity doesn't warp anything. Well...wait a minute...water has a strong gravitational pull...and here in North Texas we have problems with our Foundations because the ground moves so much, so maybe it is the gravitational pull of water warping the ground that causes the foundations to crack...hmmmm.

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Time travel is possible.... Only thing it's only possible through studying the history of a time period so closely that you can actually picture what is was like in your mind and therefore in a sense go there... but it's clearly not what the op has in mind. So as for true time travel? I doubt it's possible but who knows what the future will bring

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Time travel is possible.... Only thing it's only possible through studying the history of a time period so closely that you can actually picture what is was like in your mind and therefore in a sense go there... but it's clearly not what the op has in mind. So as for true time travel? I doubt it's possible but who knows what the future will bring

Like the movie: Somewhere in Time...

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That is complete and utter nonsense.

Are you being serious? Gravitational time dilation has been proven to be real in many, many experiments as has gravity as defined by Einstein's general theory of relativity.

How can you dismiss objective experimental results, and how do you explain these results?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tests_of_general_relativity#Gravitational_redshift

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Are you being serious? Gravitational time dilation has been proven to be real in many, many experiments as has gravity as defined by Einstein's general theory of relativity.

How can you dismiss objective experimental results, and how do you explain these results?

http://en.wikipedia....tional_redshift

Light bends? Duh? It bends when it goes through water, it bends when it goes through glass, I am sure it bends when it goes through strong gravitational forces, Black Holes have such a gravitational pull that they pull in the actual light. How does that prove that Gravity Warps Space or Time? It doesn't. Space? You can't really see Space now can you? We know it is there. It is Space..it is Dark Energy..but the Light moves through the Space and the bending of the light doesn't affect in anyway the speed of the light. The Speed of Light is a Constant...there is no friction in space and even the friction of coming into contact with matter doesn't slow Light down. But let me clarify that there are different frequencies of 'light'...none the less...nothing you said or Einstein said or any tests I have read prove that Space Warps or Time Warps....that is like proving the existence of God.

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Light bends? Duh? It bends when it goes through water, it bends when it goes through glass, I am sure it bends when it goes through strong gravitational forces, Black Holes have such a gravitational pull that they pull in the actual light. How does that prove that Gravity Warps Space or Time?

(Bold type mine) Light bends when it goes through a strong gravitational force because it follows the geodesic of that bent space caused by the gravitational force. Gravity is not a force that 'pulls' light toward it. The space around a gravitational force is not flat it is curved, so light follows that curved space, that geodesic.

.nothing you said or Einstein said or any tests I have read prove that Space Warps or Time Warps....that is like proving the existence of God.

Maybe you didn't study my link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tests_of_general_relativity#Gravitational_redshift

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You are correct. I did not study your link...but I did read it.

Light bends when it goes through a strong gravitational force because it follows the geodesic of that bent space caused by the gravitational force. Gravity is not a force that 'pulls' light toward it. The space around a gravitational force is not flat it is curved, so light follows that curved space, that geodesic.

That is all theory speculation and there is not a smidgen of proof for it. . Space is not flat nor curved...it is ...space...it has no form...it is dark energy. And any theory to the contrary is just that...theory.

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That is all theory speculation and there is not a smidgen of proof for it. . Space is not flat nor curved...it is ...space...it has no form...it is dark energy. And any theory to the contrary is just that...theory.

I have no further comments is this discussion for obvious reasons.

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I have no further comments is this discussion for obvious reasons.

I would assume the obvious reason being that there is no imperical proof that Space and Time are 'warped' by the gravitational forces of the Universe.

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I would assume the obvious reason being that there is no imperical proof that Space and Time are 'warped' by the gravitational forces of the Universe.

Um, sorry but you're wrong on this one. Gravity warping space-time is one of the features of general relativity and has been pretty thoroughly backed up with evidence, black holes being a good example.

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