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prometheuslocke

Mind Control. It's been here the whole time.

431 posts in this topic

As an aside, can I get a show of hands on this question please: scowl, Emma, Harte, kmt_sesh

Would you associate the phenomenon described in Quantum Leap (Dr. Samuel Beckett), with mind control?

Y/N

Only the commercials between the scenes of that sometimes campy TV show. :w00t:

Really? Are you going to reference a sci-fi television program for support?

and to you, what do the words 'on knees with bent arms" mean?

In the pic, the figures "on knees with bent arms" are two Kas of Horus.

They are holding up, or "uplifting" Horus' aura (my term - translated as "the perfection of Horus.")

The djed in the pic is performing the same function, only it upholds Horus' body itself (the snake in the lotus.)

I'm not an ancient Egyptian priest, expert in the religion, but it seems to me that it is unlikely that Horus' invisible doubles would pray to themselves (Horus.)

Harte

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Can I edit the title of the thread?

"Posession: It's been here the whole time."

That, I can agree with. Not the fact of being possessed by another or a demon (necessarily,) but in the belief that such a thing has or is occuring.

So now we're back to schizophrenia.

Harte

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You did not directly ask me, but my opinion is No.

Quantum Leap was Possession, because the other persons mind went elsewhere. There was no direct or indirect mind control. Only exchanging of minds.

I think I'd amend this to say possession via time travel since Scott Bakula's character was constantly swapping places with people from different points in time. As opposed to normal possession which is usually presented as being in the persons own timeframe. But yeah, it's still not mind control.

cormac

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Only the commercials between the scenes of that sometimes campy TV show. :w00t:

Really? Are you going to reference a sci-fi television program for support?

I'm just trying to understand why you don't see mind control where I clearly do. It's becoming more apparent to me. The Egyptian myths of god's "minds" incarnating in human form (kings or not), is obviously mind control to me. If you want to call it possession, that's fine... but they are functionally the same thing. Possession by an outside force, whether complete or partial (of which both were described in Egyptian (and many other) religions) is mind control. Just because there is no LSD administration, and it's not the CIA doing it, doesn't mean they aren't functionally the same phenomenon.

In the pic, the figures "on knees with bent arms" are two Kas of Horus.

They are holding up, or "uplifting" Horus' aura (my term - translated as "the perfection of Horus.")

The djed in the pic is performing the same function, only it upholds Horus' body itself (the snake in the lotus.)

That's a non answer, "Kas of horus" does not explain their positioning and actions in the picture. And once again, the inscriptions do not attribute them to Horus or Harsomptus.

They are holding nothing up, but I do agree that the djed and Heh are. I believe this shows that they were seen as assisting the unseen force, which they called the ba of Horus. (Again to correct kmt_sesh earlier, it is clearly noted that it is his ba and not ka.)

I'm not an ancient Egyptian priest, expert in the religion, but it seems to me that it is unlikely that Horus' invisible doubles would pray to themselves (Horus.)

they're... not.... Horus.

That, I can agree with. Not the fact of being possessed by another or a demon (necessarily,) but in the belief that such a thing has or is occuring.

So now we're back to schizophrenia.

You cannot imagine any other possible explanation other than a neurological disorder to explain this belief? This is the problem.

I'd love to talk about schizophrenia more with you, lets start another thread.

<3

Edited by prometheuslocke

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I'm just trying to understand why you don't see mind control where I clearly do. It's becoming more apparent to me. The Egyptian myths of god's "minds" incarnating in human form (kings or not), is obviously mind control to me. If you want to call it possession, that's fine... but they are functionally the same thing. Possession by an outside force, whether complete or partial (of which both were described in Egyptian (and many other) religions) is mind control. Just because there is no LSD administration, and it's not the CIA doing it, doesn't mean they aren't functionally the same phenomenon.

I would maintain that the phenomenon being described is schizophrenia, not possession.

That's a non answer, "Kas of horus" does not explain their positioning and actions in the picture. And once again, the inscriptions do not attribute them to Horus or Harsomptus.

No?

Words to speak of Harsomtus, the great god, who dwells in Dendera, who arises from the lotus blossom as the living Ba, whose perfection is carried by the km3tjw-pictures of his Ka, ..., whose body is carried by the dd-pillar, beneath it's ssmw-picture the primeval (Hathor) sits and whose majesty is carried by the companions of his Ka

Translation from Wolfgang Waitkus, University of Hamburg

Harte

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...

They are holding nothing up, but I do agree that the djed and Heh are. I believe this shows that they were seen as assisting the unseen force, which they called the ba of Horus. (Again to correct kmt_sesh earlier, it is clearly noted that it is his ba and not ka.)

Please try to read my responses more carefully. I don't like to be misrepresented, even if by accident. At no point did I argue that the serpent in the lotus bulb was not the ba of Horus—I certainly would not say such a thing, given that the inscriptions clearly identify it as the ba.

The matter to which you're referring comes from an earlier post of yours where you claimed the bas of gods possessed people like avatars. I did respond to that post and requested that you provide a proper supporting reference for your claim. You still have not done so. Specifically, I pointed out that only kings believed they contained the life force or direct spirit essence of a god, and this was Horus. And it was the ka of Horus, not his ba. But again, I'm offering you the chance to provide a proper supporting reference if you believe I'm mistaken.

they're... not.... Horus.

The figures are identified as Harsoumtus and his elements (ka, ba). I'm not sure why you're having such a hard time grasping this, but Harsomtus is Horus (the name means "Horus, Uniter of the Two Lands").

Providing I have adequate time this evening, I'll try to return to this discussion to respond to your recent posts in reply to mine.

I'd love to talk about schizophrenia more with you, lets start another thread.

That would be fine, but the Alternative History forum would not be the correct place for this topic. Please be sure to use the correct forum.

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you will watch your world perish in flames for your ignorance.

OK, when will that happen? I have plans this weekend.

Edit: The CIA lost two mind control lawsuits, and Canada lost at least one.

The "mind control" in these lawsuits wasn't the quantum physics baloney you've been slicing. The were unethical but conventional psychological experiments done on people who were not properly informed of the nature of what they had signed up for. Look them up.

You are talking out of the wrong orifice, my friend.

You consider comments like this to be productive discussion? How old are you?

Congrats on not answering yet another question posed directly to you!

I answered it. You didn't like the answer.

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you will watch your world perish in flames for your ignorance.

No offense, but if given the option of the world ending in flames or people like you being right, I'd light the world-ending flames myself. If for no other reason than to avoid the tedious gloating. (Fortunately, I don't see your theories being proven in the real world.)

--Jaylemurph

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Posted (edited)

Please try to read my responses more carefully. I don't like to be misrepresented, even if by accident. At no point did I argue that the serpent in the lotus bulb was not the ba of Horus—I certainly would not say such a thing, given that the inscriptions clearly identify it as the ba.

The matter to which you're referring comes from an earlier post of yours where you claimed the bas of gods possessed people like avatars. I did respond to that post and requested that you provide a proper supporting reference for your claim. You still have not done so. Specifically, I pointed out that only kings believed they contained the life force or direct spirit essence of a god, and this was Horus. And it was the ka of Horus, not his ba. But again, I'm offering you the chance to provide a proper supporting reference if you believe I'm mistaken.

The figures are identified as Harsoumtus and his elements (ka, ba). I'm not sure why you're having such a hard time grasping this, but Harsomtus is Horus (the name means "Horus, Uniter of the Two Lands").

Providing I have adequate time this evening, I'll try to return to this discussion to respond to your recent posts in reply to mine.

That would be fine, but the Alternative History forum would not be the correct place for this topic. Please be sure to use the correct forum.

So the confusion is all clear to me now. Harsomptus is the biological son of Horus, "possessed" by his ba. "Horus, uniter of two lands" does not mean it is Horus, think like an Egyptian.

Harwer (Haroeris), or "Horus the Elder" was the mature god represented in these stories who battles Seth for 80 years until the tribunal of gods finally awards him his rightful place on the throne of all Egypt. Finally, as Har-Mau or Harsomptus (Horus the Uniter), Horus fulfills this role of uniting and ruling over Egypt, though he is sometimes identified as the son of Horus the Elder and Hathor in this role, for example, at Edfu and Kom Ombo, and called by the name Panebtawy "Lord of the Two Lands".

According to the Turin Canon, the late predynastic rulers of Egypt were "followers of Horus". By the time of the unification of Upper and Lower Egypt, the ruler was Horus. On the palette in the Cairo museum that shows King Narmer, considered a candidate for the first ruler of a unified Egypt, Horus is shown holding a rope that passes through the nose of the defeated northern rival. Hence, some Egyptologists believe that the source of the mythological conflict between Horus and Seth may have been the predynastic struggle to unite Upper and Lower Egypt

http://www.touregypt...m#ixzz2PAQCiPCx

.

Harsomptus had a different name because he was a real person. His name alone substantiates the claim that he was possessed or thought of as being the spirit of his biological father, Horus.

The Harsomtus version of Horus can be traced back to the Pyramid Texts as Har-mau or "Horus the uniter." The idea is the king as upholder of the unification of North and South Egypt. Since in temple dogma the divine child of a god and goddess could be thought a manifestation of the pharaoh, Harsomtus is used merely as "filling" in a sacred triad. He is e.g. the son of the elder Horus and Hathor at Edfu temple. Similarly at the temple of Kom-Ombo the same couple are the parents of Harsomtus under the name of Pa-neb-tawy or "lord of the Two Lands."

http://www.philvaz.c...etics/HORUS.htm

This concept, that the ba of Horus would be incarnated is, as you said yourself, common in Egyptian themes. The pharoah's all claimed to be incarnations of Horus. There is no functional difference between a God incarnating in the Pharoah, than possessing him. Also no functional difference between possession and the recipient's mind being controlled by the God. I think the only contention left is whether or not the Egyptians believed what they were saying, and I think it should be clear that they did. (The alternative of course, that "divine mandate" was just something the ruling class used to control the population... which is most likely true later; however it is possible that it was based on an actual phenomenon which is the foundation of this belief and mythology.)

Pyramid texts ca. the 25th Century BC describe the nature of the Pharaoh in different characters as both Horus and Osiris. The Pharaoh as Horus in life became the Pharaoh as Osiris in death, where he was united with the rest of the gods. New incarnations of Horus succeeded the deceased pharaoh on earth in the form of new pharaohs.

Look at it this way, two gods screw and have a human baby. What happened? You have a new biological body, with the mind of the father inside it.

I don't see how anyone could argue against mind control or possession being a possible explanation of this.

Edited by prometheuslocke

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OK, when will that happen? I have plans this weekend.

You have some time. Enjoy it.

The "mind control" in these lawsuits wasn't the quantum physics baloney you've been slicing. The were unethical but conventional psychological experiments done on people who were not properly informed of the nature of what they had signed up for. Look them up.

Which you vehemently denied existed at all, not one post ago. Your knowledge of the subject is lacking... you do not know what technology was being used, because the documentation of it was destroyed. Why are you continuing to present your opinion here as fact, clearly you are not aware of much of the history or details surrounding MK-Ultra.

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As an aside, can I get a show of hands on this question please: scowl, Emma, Harte, kmt_sesh

Would you associate the phenomenon described in Quantum Leap (Dr. Samuel Beckett), with mind control?

Y/N

You mean the TV show? The fictional TV show?

Um, no. It isn't, and I fail to see how anything you've posted for the last however many pages supports your argument.

This is getting more and more vague.

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You mean the TV show? The fictional TV show?

Um, no. It isn't, and I fail to see how anything you've posted for the last however many pages supports your argument.

This is getting more and more vague.

I fail to see how you all do not see how controlling the body of one person with the mind of another is akin to mind control.

What do you think mind control is?

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I fail to see how you all do not see how controlling the body of one person with the mind of another is akin to mind control.

That would be one definition.

What do you think mind control is?

Fiction, just like the television show Quantum Leap which you are citing as a factual reference.

That's why you still have not been able to provide any evidence that it exists.

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As an aside, can I get a show of hands on this question please: scowl, Emma, Harte, kmt_sesh

Would you associate the phenomenon described in Quantum Leap (Dr. Samuel Beckett), with mind control?

Y/N

and to you, what do the words 'on knees with bent arms" mean?

I fail to see how you all do not see how controlling the body of one person with the mind of another is akin to mind control.

What do you think mind control is?

Mind control is taking control of the mind by another person or device.

One persons mind taking control of another persons body (having a direct affect on the muscles) is not mind control.

If you remember Quantum Leap, Sams mind was swapped with the mind of another. He was in their body in the past while they found themselves in his body in the future. Mind swapping is not mind control.

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Remote Neural Stimulation and Recording

The type of "mind control" we talk about at MoFK has nothing to do with subconscious messages through advertising and television. It's not related to flickering lights, or "brain wave entrainment." For the effects we have noticed, these things are really, really stupid suggestions as mechanisms.

Real mind control involves the activation and suppression of action potentials, the firing of an individual neuron, in a pattern which creates a real effect in the brain of humans. Neurons fire in patterns, and in groups, and the result of these firing patterns is thoughts, feelings, movements, etc. It is scientifically possible to cause these firing patterns to be activated remotely, without the use of an implant, by "injecting" electricity into individual neurons using advanced technology.

For the last 5 decades, U.S. intelligence has done a significant amount of research and development into a technology called "TEMPEST." This technology was originally used in order to reconstruct usable information from monitors, integrated circuits, etc in order to remotely surveil electronic devices. Later, technology was developed which was able to do the reverse, and cause these machines to act in a certain manner.

Human brains are, for our purposes, just advanced machines. Their actions, and your consciousness, are the product of electrical impulses, and the technology surrounding "TEMPEST" could be modified to take control of, and remotely surveil the thoughts and feelings of human beings.

Throw in a "bit" of neuroscience research, and you have the proverbial Manchurian Candidate... and with a bit of infrastructure buildout, Orwell's prophesy fullfiled.

There's proof that this technology is perfected, and it's all around you. A Lockheed Martin researcher spoke about it publicly in 1999, and it may have gotten him killed. John Norseen had a lot to say about mind control. NASA has talked about its potential use in airports. There are a significant number of victims complaining about it all over the world.

http://www.usnews.co...hive_033992.htm

http://www.maebrusse...t airports.html

http://www.washingto...7011001399.html

It appears the United States Military used it to cover up the existence of a network of spy satellites.

http://unduecoercion...cams-razor.html

There's a significant amount of public research in the field

http://www.nature.co...ll/nn.3265.html

http://www.scienceda...20626172721.htm

http://www.scienceda...90429132228.htm

imagine where the military is: http://istina.rin.ru...l?sait=1&id=360

MoFK has been shown a pattern in history, we believe it is a map and a signature, proving that the 'voice of god' technology, has been given to humanity.

http://unduecoercion...vil-empire.html

It's Mark on history

http://unduecoercion...and-demons.html

How it works

http://unduecoercion...tum-charge.html

Relation to religion

http://unduecoercion...-and-devil.html

Why we care

http://unduecoercion...to-victims.html

ONLY MIND CONTROL THATS BEING DONE IS BY MEDIA, RELIGION, GOVERNMENT AND SOCIETY

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That would be one definition.

Fiction, just like the television show Quantum Leap which you are citing as a factual reference.

That's why you still have not been able to provide any evidence that it exists.

You make up things to further your argument over, and over. It's a p*** poor habit. I never cited it as factual reference, I used it to show you that nobody here has a clue what mind control actually is. It's pretty funny that every single person arguing against me has now basically shown that they just simply do not understand what they are arguing about.

You included.

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So you cite a fictional example of something you think is mind control - that has no bearing at all on your original argument - and claim some form of debating victory over everyone because no I've else can see what the hell you're getting at.

So what if Quantum Leap is mind control?! It does nothing to bolster your original argument and if anything only makes it look flimsier as its obvious you don't really have an argument.

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So you cite a fictional example of something you think is mind control - that has no bearing at all on your original argument - and claim some form of debating victory over everyone because no I've else can see what the hell you're getting at.

So what if Quantum Leap is mind control?! It does nothing to bolster your original argument and if anything only makes it look flimsier as its obvious you don't really have an argument.

Quantum Leap is not the point. I'm merely showing you something that is obviously mind control, and letting you show your true colors, that you will argue against whatever I say based on principle. The story inside quantum leap is about a quantum physicist, who uses a machine in order to take over the mind of random people throughout space and time. He controls their actions completely. There is no question that it is machine assisted mind control.

The fact that this group first disagrees that Quantum Leap depicts a form of "mind control," and then once called out, falls back on the position that its a "fiction story" anyway, just proves my point even more. This group is not attempting to have a discussion, you are arguing for the sake of winning.

It closely parallels a large portion of our discussion, whether or not Egyptian mythology in general, and the Dendera crypt reliefs in particular have any relation to mind control. I believe both show significant evidence of this, even in classical literature, though nobody has interpreted the reliefs as I have. That does not make me wrong. When I provide convincing evidence of this, it i summarily ignored by this group. Several posts later, many of you will then claim to have refuted my argument, when in fact, you have not. It's getting boring.

Not one of you has answered the most important question I see relating to these reliefs (aside from Harte, I think, who does not agree with my "visual" interpretation of the image, which is supported by the inscriptions).

Between the two images, the figures described as ka change their position, in one they appear to me (and I think anyone that actually looks at the picture), to be praying or worshipping Harsomptus. In the second, they are united in a male-female relationship, and ignoring Harsomptus. WHY?

I've taken the liberty of putting together this diagram for you.

dendera_comparison.png

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I'm going to go ahead and claim victory, once again.

At this point I'd like to leave you all with a little message. There is truth in fiction.

1984

THE MATRIX

QUANTUM LEAP

STARGATE SG-1

BLADERUNNER (DADOES)

MINORITY REPORT

TOTAL RECALL

STAR WARS

BACK TO THE FUTURE

ALIEN

COCOON

These movies all have common themes, not only that, but many of them originated from the same artists. Once humanity knows that this technology not only exists, but has an extraterrestrial origin, that will tell you one of two things.

1) Robert Zemeckis and Phillip K. Dick knew about it, a long time ago.

2) or, they were "inspired," using the very same technology.

<3 (I couldn't leave without giving you something to tear up... I'm right, by the way. :) )

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What victory?

Seriously???

I have been reading this thread for long and all i have seen is

- UM-ers asking you for evidences, links, peer reviewed material to back up your claims

- you brushing aside all such request, beating around the bush, providing links to your own MOFK website as proof for your claims. That doesn't hold.

-you providing fictional references to back your claim

-You screaming victory as if this were a battlefield, which is quite humorous

in short all i see is Delusion backed by illusion.

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Posted (edited)

What victory?

Seriously???

I have been reading this thread for long and all i have seen is

- UM-ers asking you for evidences, links, peer reviewed material to back up your claims

- you brushing aside all such request, beating around the bush, providing links to your own MOFK website as proof for your claims. That doesn't hold.

-you providing fictional references to back your claim

-You screaming victory as if this were a battlefield, which is quite humorous

in short all i see is Delusion backed by illusion.

You think they had tesla coils and energy weapons in Egypt. If you do not see similarities between Mythology and fiction, and the possibility that both are influenced by an outside force, then I imagine you have everything figured out. It must be nice to know absolutely everything about everything.

Edited by prometheuslocke

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What victory?

Seriously???

I have been reading this thread for long and all i have seen is

- UM-ers asking you for evidences, links, peer reviewed material to back up your claims

- you brushing aside all such request, beating around the bush, providing links to your own MOFK website as proof for your claims. That doesn't hold.

-you providing fictional references to back your claim

-You screaming victory as if this were a battlefield, which is quite humorous

in short all i see is Delusion backed by illusion.

You have to remember Spartan that his view of victory is not normal, like someone claiming victory as they come in dead last in a race or claiming victory in a fight as they lay on the mat while their opponent looks down on them.

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Posted (edited)

You have to remember Spartan that his view of victory is not normal, like someone claiming victory as they come in dead last in a race or claiming victory in a fight as they lay on the mat while their opponent looks down on them.

My victory is more akin to Fight Club, which you can add to the list of movies above. I have been on the sideline, coaching you all the whole time. I have tossed fight winning weapons into the ring for you to use, but you have ignored them, and your opponent seized them instead. To my dismay, you have allowed the truth to pummel you into another ring, over and over again. You pretend that you are not being hit, but it is obvious from the sidelines. Just because your enemy is unseen, does not mean you are not losing.

Your loss is not against me, but rather against yourselves. You have failed to come out of this ring with more knowledge than when you entered, despite the truth staring you in the face, the whole time. Rather, your eyes have been beat shut, and they are now swollen and drunk with the wrath of the father of lies.

Edited by prometheuslocke

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Posted (edited)

My victory is more akin to Fight Club, which you can add to the list of movies above. I have been on the sideline, coaching you all the whole time. I have tossed fight winning weapons into the ring for you to use, but you have ignored them, and your opponent seized them instead. To my dismay, you have allowed the truth to pummel you into another ring, over and over again. You pretend that you are not being hit, but it is obvious from the sidelines. Just because your enemy is unseen, does not mean you are not losing.

Your loss is not against me, but rather against yourselves. You have failed to come out of this ring with more knowledge than when you entered, despite the truth staring you in the face, the whole time. Rather, your eyes have been beat shut, and they are now swollen and drunk with the wrath of the father of lies.

Speaking of ignoring, I showed you where you were wrong about Quantum Leap but you conveniently ignored it.

To show you some of your self imposed illusion, In post #87 you said this at the very beginning "You are in luck, I've been saying aliens are behind it, since the first post!" If you reread all your posts between the first and number 87, in none of them do you discuss or even mention aliens using mind control.

Your claimed victories are indeed not victories but IMO the desperate attempt by someone who has had their hypothesis refuted at nearly every point and does not or can not conceive that they are wrong. I am sure that you will continue to ignore the facts and evidence in favor of the fantasy and will continue to claim your hollow victories but in the end it is not good to delude yourself.

Edited by Quaentum

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