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Drayno

The right to shoot tyrants, not deer

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Possibly, but you were ruled by some dumb king 10,000 miles away and we went on to form the greatest country the world has ever known and that's not just a personal opinion. That's historical fact.

Other then the Greatest Nation bit, obviously.

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Other then the Greatest Nation bit, obviously.

Don't be jelous.

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The cops right now that abuse there power to an extent that is well, gross and well protected. To think the Second Amendment will save you from a govermental force of that of the United States is fooling onesself. The Second Amendment is so out dated that it has become pointless as to what it was intended to do. You see well organized malitials should also have black hawk helo`s and tanks and Jets, everything needed to defend against a tyrant. As we see there is absalutely no opposition to a tyrant type government such as the US if the goverment wanted to cruch private gun owners they could no matter what pea shooter one has.

Hey, I saw Red Dawn.......... :blush: ( the original )

Edited by Sakari

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Don't be jelous.

why would I be jealous of a country where I'd be paid moneky feed, have no support, no syllabus, 40 kids in a poorly resourced classroom... at least the only things teying to kill me in my country are the wildlife and the weather - not my government or neighbours.

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Yes they pulled it off because they brought in French and Prussian officers to train them to fight like a regular army instead of an armed mob. And given one of the causes of the Revolution was that the British wanted the colonists to stop fighting the Natives and trying to take their land the issue of right is quite debatable. Not sure where the hell the Canada rant came from. Sorry if historical fact doesn't fit with your cultural myths but that's just the way things are.

Where did you learn your history ? The Revolution War was fought over Taxation without representation first and then over several other issues. Read the damn Declaration of Independence and it mentions nothing about fighting Indians except when the British engaged them to fight Americans.. But indeed the colonization of America does have several dark nasty chapters but most of those werent by believers of freedom but federal policies. Next your gonna tell me the Civil War was about slavery.

Incase youve never read it it explains why we split from England and theres some very accurate books that describe this pre Revolution episode in great detail.

http://www.archives....transcript.html

Edited by AsteroidX

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why would I be jealous of a country where I'd be paid moneky feed, have no support, no syllabus, 40 kids in a poorly resourced classroom... at least the only things teying to kill me in my country are the wildlife and the weather - not my government or neighbours.

Man you got it all wrong. Yea some places are like that but most places aren't. As for pay, don't listen to the occupiers. Noone is working for monkey feed unless they choose too. You really should come visit.. Seems that the foreign propaganda against us is working.

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at least the only things teying to kill me in my country are the wildlife and the weather - not my government or neighbours.

How cemented over does the world's parking lot have to get before we stop worrying about "wildlife" walking in from the last vestiges of nature it has left? People kill tens of millions of animals every single day in the world so us consumers can have that breast or filet on our plate. Those animals are unlucky as all hell they're not as cute as Jennie's pretty kitty cat. It's animals who need to worry about us because we're destroying the natural environment. Worry about jellyfish sandwiches, and other such things that a humanist might have the moral capacity to care about.

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If the King had given then some seats in the commons and a thrown a lordship or two at the colonies, then in a few years the American Colonies would have simply federated themselves like Australia did in 1900.

My American History prof held to the theory that without the Revolution that America would have broken up into several nations. So New England, Virginia, Pennslyvania, and whatever the Borders had. Seems the cultural groups that settled the US did not like each other.

Oh I see, so that's what it is. And you've even further unwittingly justified the 2nd Amendment by admitting that sometimes governments do not represent us adequately. That is a very fine reason to have the right to bear arms.

Does the Congress represent the interests of the American people today? Do I think my Congress represents my best interests? My best interests are to pay my bills and live and love in peace with my fellow man. Even people who live across an arbitrary line drawn by government.

...what are you talking about? The whole point of the debate was that the British believed they were representing the colonialists. The Americans disagreed and wanted their own people in Parliament. This argument disolved into a shooting match. I'm not sure what you do but when I feel a representive isn't holding to my best interests I vote them out. I don't need a gun to do that.

Where did you learn your history ? The Revolution War was fought over Taxation without representation first and then over several other issues. Read the damn Declaration of Independence and it mentions nothing about fighting Indians except when the British engaged them to fight Americans.. But indeed the colonization of America does have several dark nasty chapters but most of those werent by believers of freedom but federal policies. Next your gonna tell me the Civil War was about slavery.

Incase youve never read it it explains why we split from England and theres some very accurate books that describe this pre Revolution episode in great detail.

http://www.archives....transcript.html

You need to read my post again. I very clearly stated that the core issue of the Revolution was about representation. But since you know so much about the causes of the rebellion you'd know that the Quebec Act, which blocked off the rapid western expansion of American settlers, was noted as one of the Intorlerable Acts. Having the right to seize Native land and stop French settlers to be able to follow their religion and laws doesn't strike me as very noble. Plus it wasn't always federal policy that drove forward those dark periods but individual settlers or states that then when running to the federal government for help when the Native fought back. Though federal governments did set out some rather nasty policies when it came to the Natives. Such as the government of Thomas Jefferson.

There's been a lot of myth building around the American Revolution and while some hold some truth to them, others go against historical facts. There often seems to be a desire to paint the Founding Fathers and those behind the Revolution as saints and pure hearted men. This wasn't always the case. They were still just men and many looked to make a profit on the quest to freedom.

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...what are you talking about? The whole point of the debate was that the British believed they were representing the colonialists. The Americans disagreed and wanted their own people in Parliament. This argument disolved into a shooting match. I'm not sure what you do but when I feel a representive isn't holding to my best interests I vote them out. I don't need a gun to do that.

Yes, we disagree and want good representation, and then we rise up and reach for it, and get it. That's what I'm talking about. Even before the 2nd Amendment existed, we had the right to rise up and blow those British crooks away. Don't dream this imaginary dream that we don't have that right now, with the 2nd Amendment representing.

Now there's a shooting match going on in Syria, as there was in Libya. As there could have been in Egypt but thankfully there was not. In every case it's the spirit of '76. Some people call it "the Arab Spring" because they just had to jam their little ethnic group rhetoric in there. It doesn't matter what personal characteristic someone has, it's all the same for everyone in the world, always has been, still is today.

How can we be this comprehensively ignorant of every case of government killing its own people throughout the history of mankind? It's happening right under our noses, will you wake up please? The US government is the most warmaking government in the world today. Why this blind faith in government sir? What is the source of this trust? Do you understand that the biggest slaughterer of American life is the US government sir? Do you understand what the US government did to her own people in the Civil War, the divine right to legally put us to our deaths depending on a trial by often-paranoid peers. Do you understand what the US government did to the Native Americans living on this soil? To people with different colored skin. To millions of foreigners now dead and buried because they lived under bureaucrats our government didn't find politically agreeable.

We're worried about the wildlife outside our door, and the weather? I am astonished.

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My American History prof held to the theory that without the Revolution that America would have broken up into several nations. So New England, Virginia, Pennslyvania, and whatever the Borders had. Seems the cultural groups that settled the US did not like each other.

He probably is not so wrong. America before 1770 was all but homogeneous, colonies were directed by half a dozen different denominations of pretty radical ( to not say fanatic) bible thumpers, additionally there were the liberals who wanted some more breathing space than what Europe could offer and political refugees like the Irish Scots. If they could not find a common enemy I doubt they would have found common ground.

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He probably is not so wrong. America before 1770 was all but homogeneous, colonies were directed by half a dozen different denominations of pretty radical ( to not say fanatic) bible thumpers, additionally there were the liberals who wanted some more breathing space than what Europe could offer and political refugees like the Irish Scots. If they could not find a common enemy I doubt they would have found common ground.

Incidental characteristics. Picking up guns and defending oneself doesn't require Bibles or diversity.

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Incidental characteristics. Picking up guns and defending oneself doesn't require Bibles or diversity.

That always depends on how you want to see that. Without a common enemy Corp's history teacher's scenario is more than likely. And naturally for the Puritans, Quakers and liberals there was no better enemy than Farmer George.

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That always depends on how you want to see that. Without a common enemy Corp's history teacher's scenario is more than likely. And naturally for the Puritans, Quakers and liberals there was no better enemy than Farmer George.

History is rich with scenarios of revolution having nothing to do with Puritans, Quakers, liberals or "King" George.

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History is rich with scenarios of revolution having nothing to do with Puritans, Quakers, liberals or "King" George.

Quite so, the point is not the revolution, the point is that they would have been at each others throat sooner or later had there been no revolution. In fact, if you look at the current state in the US one can suppose that it just has been dormant for 250 years.

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Quite so, the point is not the revolution, the point is that they would have been at each others throat sooner or later had there been no revolution. In fact, if you look at the current state in the US one can suppose that it just has been dormant for 250 years.

You're nitpicking about the US revolution in particular over incidental characteristics that have zero causality to it occurring again and again anywhere and eventually everywhere in the world. If we want to stick with the reasons people rise up against their controllers, that'd probably be a good idea.

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You're nitpicking about the US revolution in particular over incidental characteristics that have zero causality to it occurring again and again anywhere and eventually everywhere in the world. If we want to stick with the reasons people rise up against their controllers, that'd probably be a good idea.

Reread the whole thing, we are not talking about no reasons for no uprising, we are talking about the reason why suddenly 13 very diverse settling streams came together. And how they did not like each other very much before that.

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Reread the whole thing, we are not talking about no reasons for no uprising, we are talking about the reason why suddenly 13 very diverse settling streams came together. And how they did not like each other very much before that.

We are talking sir, about the right to kill tyrants, not deer. You're talking about the minutia of the US revolution thinking you have any relevance to the topic at hand.

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How can we be this comprehensively ignorant of every case of government killing its own people throughout the history of mankind? It's happening right under our noses, will you wake up please? The US government is the most warmaking government in the world today. Why this blind faith in government sir? What is the source of this trust? Do you understand that the biggest slaughterer of American life is the US government sir? Do you understand what the US government did to her own people in the Civil War, the divine right to legally put us to our deaths depending on a trial by often-paranoid peers. Do you understand what the US government did to the Native Americans living on this soil? To people with different colored skin. To millions of foreigners now dead and buried because they lived under bureaucrats our government didn't find politically agreeable.

Maybe you should just move Yamato if you think the US government is going to start murdering people at any moment. Most other Western countries don't have this fear. I know I'm not expecting the Canadian government to go bathing in blood any time soon.

And there is no blind faith sir. Just just no endless fear of mass murder. If the US government is truly as evil as you seem to think they are do you really think a few lines of legislative law is going to stop them?

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Maybe you should just move Yamato if you think the US government is going to start murdering people at any moment. Most other Western countries don't have this fear. I know I'm not expecting the Canadian government to go bathing in blood any time soon.

And there is no blind faith sir. Just just no endless fear of mass murder. If the US government is truly as evil as you seem to think they are do you really think a few lines of legislative law is going to stop them?

well, looking at just that issue we don't see big picture here. there are planty of good things in usa.

i've been to every continent except antarctika, in at least 15 countries, in my life, most are owesome, but i would not want to live in any of them. regardless how safe they are, after all it only takes once. if you get shot\stabed in safest country in the world, does it matter that it that was safest country, does it???

i understand every american that doesn't accept a notion to move out, and respect this pov. imo there is nowhere to move from usa. some do move out, but i think of it as good riddance.

so i respect those that fight for their right where they are, not run away with their tail between their legs somewhere safe.

america is what americans make of it.

gvmnt however isn't always helping, but we manage.i noticed another thing here, immigrants that came here from all over the world love this country more than some who was born here.guess they can't see what they got, they are usually those that have not visited other countries.

Edited by aztek

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Oh sure there are lots of reasons to love living in America. As with most Canadians I have family and friends who have moved to American and are perfectly happy with the lives they're making for themselves. Though on the flip side they don't seem to think the government is an oppressive monster waiting to kill them as some of our members seem to think. Just seems logical to me that if you're living in fear of your government and think being armed is the only way to hold off this fear then it's time to find another place to live.

Edited by Corp

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Oh sure there are lots of reasons to love living in America. As with most Canadians I have family and friends who have moved to American and are perfectly happy with the lives they're making for themselves. Though on the flip side they don't seem to think the government is an oppressive monster waiting to kill them as some of our members seem to think. Just seems logical to me that if you're living in fear of your government and think being armed is the only way to hold off this fear then it's time to find another place to live.

well, as we see what our gvmnt does around the world, i would not rule anything out, better be prepeared, than not. wont hurt.

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Maybe you should just move Yamato if you think the US government is going to start murdering people at any moment. Most other Western countries don't have this fear. I know I'm not expecting the Canadian government to go bathing in blood any time soon.

And there is no blind faith sir. Just just no endless fear of mass murder. If the US government is truly as evil as you seem to think they are do you really think a few lines of legislative law is going to stop them?

The US government is murdering people already. Wake the F up.

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How cemented over does the world's parking lot have to get before we stop worrying about "wildlife" walking in from the last vestiges of nature it has left? People kill tens of millions of animals every single day in the world so us consumers can have that breast or filet on our plate. Those animals are unlucky as all hell they're not as cute as Jennie's pretty kitty cat. It's animals who need to worry about us because we're destroying the natural environment. Worry about jellyfish sandwiches, and other such things that a humanist might have the moral capacity to care about.

Most of this country is green space (or, as it's Australia, brown space).

However, we do have some of the world's most venomous X (spiders, snakes, jellyfish, octopuses, fish, mammals...) and most of them are insane enough to actually chase after you rather then as most sane animals do, which is hide from humans.

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Most of this country is green space (or, as it's Australia, brown space).

However, we do have some of the world's most venomous X (spiders, snakes, jellyfish, octopuses, fish, mammals...) and most of them are insane enough to actually chase after you rather then as most sane animals do, which is hide from humans.

Then I won't involve myself in how you choose to defend yourself from this insanity of nature against the humanity in Australia, while I ask you to do the same for me over here.

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I agree with aztek. For most Americans, moving is for pussies. Those that usually move in regards to how they feel about America don't move because they're afraid of the government. They move because they hate America, like Johnny Depp. Who knows how things would go down in the event of something real bad but I sure as hell ain't leaving. I'm going to fight and stand on the side of right.

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