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AsteroidX

Israel airstrikes in Syria (confirmed)

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I believe, from watching TV, that Iran will eventually become our friend, like THEY never were, without a shot fired. Something doesn't seem right there... too predictable based upon western and foreign media. Either it's a slow buildup to war, based on the rash decision to invade Iraq, or it's a complete BLUFF. By both sides. Corporations working together to mold society through evil means. Utter deception.

Patriotism is the highest form of collectivism.

There are NO war upon nations anymore. But there is a war on individuals in nations... A war led by corporate interest. Interest that has infected GOV.

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Like North Korea? Oh wait....

Where has Iran directly threatened to wipe out another country?

I have never seen evidence of this, only twisting of words.

The last War Iran was involved in was with Iraq and it was Iraq who attacked Iran. (they where pushed to do it by the US)

It's funny how everyone says Iran is dangerous but they haven't attacked anyone in 214 years!

Now look at Britain, US and Israels track record of attacking other countries and their involvement in wars.... LOL

I don't believe western propaganda, however I certainly don't listen to Iranian propaganda either.

My belief is what I said, it is my belief and I hope to god I am very wrong.

If Iran is so peaceful and has no hostile intentions then why is it practically ever week it shows off it latest military breakthrough?

Why does an oil producing nation spend billions on nuclear power when it has all the resources it needs?

I have Iranian friends and they believe the nuclear program is for power needs as apparently power shortages are rife in Iran. So instead of building conventional power stations to supply their needs now they embark on a nuclear program that is taking years and still could be many years away from the first power station. Pull the other one.

There is a saying I believe in 'when your walking on eggs, don't hop'.

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If Iran is so peaceful and has no hostile intentions then why is it practically ever week it shows off it latest military breakthrough?

Why does an oil producing nation spend billions on nuclear power when it has all the resources it needs?

I have Iranian friends and they believe the nuclear program is for power needs as apparently power shortages are rife in Iran.

With this logic, why go to the moon? Why build the Hoover Dam? It'll take years! We already had all the resources we needed. What were we building ICBMs and hydrogen bombs, B-52s and nuclear submarines for? Only when it comes to Iran, military breakthroughs are what signifies bad intentions?

Iran doesn't have all the resources it needs, that's just another infamous talking point from the gossip mill. Listen to your Iranian friends and stop believing the propaganda. They're 70 million people in an energy-deficient nation. Maybe Iran doesn't want to pollute itself with Carbon Dioxide, Sulfur Dioxide, Nitrogen Oxides, Methane, Mercury, etc. If they have nuclear power they can export their oil and profit from selling it. They can import refined gasoline to power vehicles and machinery. Iran will benefit greatly from having a broader energy footprint.

It doesn't even matter why they want nuclear energy. They're entitled to it, no matter why they want it. You might not like that. Iran might be scary for some reason. But they're entitled to it no matter how many spooky stories we hear about. We're going to have to man up and deal with it on the world stage from a legal standpoint, for better or for worse.

Can we worry about the attacks from the countries that are attacking and stop worrying about words being said about the countries that aren't?

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I don't believe western propaganda, however I certainly don't listen to Iranian propaganda either.

My belief is what I said, it is my belief and I hope to god I am very wrong.

If Iran is so peaceful and has no hostile intentions then why is it practically ever week it shows off it latest military breakthrough?

Why does an oil producing nation spend billions on nuclear power when it has all the resources it needs?

I have Iranian friends and they believe the nuclear program is for power needs as apparently power shortages are rife in Iran. So instead of building conventional power stations to supply their needs now they embark on a nuclear program that is taking years and still could be many years away from the first power station. Pull the other one.

There is a saying I believe in 'when your walking on eggs, don't hop'.

Irans military breakthroughs are nothing spectaculer the reason the iranian regime seems to promote them so much is for deterance, from fear of a western/israeli attack.

An oil rich nation turning to nuclear power?

its one of the smartest things a nation could do.

Oil is a finite resource and every nation knows its going to come to an end, building a nuclear

power infastructure will maintain a secure future fpr your nation. Besides selling most of your oil abroad rather relying on it at home, could be extreamly profitable.

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I don't believe western propaganda, however I certainly don't listen to Iranian propaganda either.

My belief is what I said, it is my belief and I hope to god I am very wrong.

If Iran is so peaceful and has no hostile intentions then why is it practically ever week it shows off it latest military breakthrough?

Why does an oil producing nation spend billions on nuclear power when it has all the resources it needs?

I have Iranian friends and they believe the nuclear program is for power needs as apparently power shortages are rife in Iran. So instead of building conventional power stations to supply their needs now they embark on a nuclear program that is taking years and still could be many years away from the first power station. Pull the other one.

There is a saying I believe in 'when your walking on eggs, don't hop'.

[media=]

[/media]

Seems so hateful and like he loves war. :whistle:

They show military power as a deterrent. Imagine if this was a playground and some nasty spiteful kid (that's Israel by the way) Kept getting it's bigger friend to bully you (that's the US by the way) and took your lunch money everyday... Wouldn't you want to show that you won't stand for this?

Also you failed to provide evidence of Iran's threat to nuke Israel.....

I really don't get how you can honestly think Iran would nuke Israel. They would be nuked in return and they are intelligent enough to know that. What kind of weird world do you live in? Are you really that brainwashed by the media? lol Please use some common sense.

Edited by Coffey

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If the Iranians persist, at some point all of their installations will be destroyed. It seems so stupid.

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[media=]

[/media]

Seems so hateful and like he loves war. :whistle:

They show military power as a deterrent. Imagine if this was a playground and some nasty spiteful kid (that's Israel by the way) Kept getting it's bigger friend to bully you (that's the US by the way) and took your lunch money everyday... Wouldn't you want to show that you won't stand for this?

Also you failed to provide evidence of Iran's threat to nuke Israel.....

I really don't get how you can honestly think Iran would nuke Israel. They would be nuked in return and they are intelligent enough to know that. What kind of weird world do you live in? Are you really that brainwashed by the media? lol Please use some common sense.

No my partner was married to an Iranian and has lived in Iran. I still have Iranian friends and even they are nervous about their countries actions.

I have no evidence of anything it is my own fear of what could happen.

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay ( they later claim it was for rape). They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

You want me to believe the leaders are playing with a full deck of cards? Do they really care about how many people would die in a war? I don't know but look at Syria, they have no problem killing there own.

Thats all I have to say on it to be honest. You want to believe they are a peace loving nation thats up to you are your right to have your opinion.

I choose to think something else because of what people have told me that have lived in that country. (So I have been brainwashed by people who live or have lived in Iran, if I can't believe them where should I get information. That is my right to have my opinion.

I really want to believe you as I have absolutely no desire for a war, let alone nuclear. I also have no hatred towards Iranian people, but even they have been protesting against the leaders.

I don't know why you are taking it so personally if you are so sure you are right.

Edited by skookum
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No my partner was married to an Iranian and has lived in Iran. I still have Iranian friends and even they are nervous about their countries actions.

I have no evidence of anything it is my own fear of what could happen.

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay. They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

You want me to believe the leaders are playing with a full deck of cards? Do they really care about how many people would die in a war? I don't know but look at Syria, they have no problem killing there own.

Thats all I have to say on it to be honest. You want to believe they are a peace loving nation thats up to you are your right to have your opinion.

I choose to think something else because of what people have told me that have lived in that country. That is my right to have my opinion.

I really want to believe you as I have absolutely no desire for a war, let alone nuclear. I also have no hatred towards Iranian people, but even they have been protesting against the leaders.

I don't know why you are taking it so personally if you are so sure you are right.

Those who support Iran's rights to nuclear power here are demonstrably too intelligent to actually believe their own rhetoric. They know there is really no way a nation would absorb the kind of pain and universal ostracism that has attended this effort JUST to create nuclear energy for peaceful purposes. Power plants and medical isotopes could have been in place long ago with minimal international involvement in HELPING Iran to achieve them. Offers of free nuclear fuel and isotopes were made - and refused. Uranium enrichment facilities were spread out over the whole country and placed in extremely hardened deep under ground bunkers. Iran is interested in only one thing and it will have it soon enough. I think that is unstoppable at this point. But if one marks this thread and pulls it up in a few months or a year or two when the news hits the paper that Iran has indeed *gasp* tested a nuclear weapon, everyone who ridiculed this premise will just say - well, doesn't matter, they had a perfect right to the weapon - IT'S ONLY FAIR AFTER ALL. And that attitude is childish in the extreme IMO. It presupposes all nations to be equal and that no nation other than the most powerful (America) is ever likely to be a threat in the world....childish.
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So allowing countries with Governments that are not politically very stable even with their own people is a step in the right direction for a safer world?

BTW I have no love for America or the UK in the way they have conducted themselves in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

Edited by skookum

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So allowing countries with Governments that are not politically very stable even with their own people is a step in the right direction for a safer world?

BTW I have no love for America or the UK in the way they have conducted themselves in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

Understood, and deservedly so with the possible exception of the initial involvement in Afghanistan which I felt was justified and still do. But This really is a different question isn't it? An Iranian nuclear weapon will not be a good thing for the world. It will inevitably raise tensions in an already volatile area that the whole world has a stake in keeping at peace to the extent possible. But I think that naysayers aside, it's too late now to stop an Iranian bomb. And the same people who decry an American or Israeli intervention to stop such a bomb will continue to blame both for any consequences that flow from that bomb - watch it happen. It's ridiculous.

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No my partner was married to an Iranian and has lived in Iran. I still have Iranian friends and even they are nervous about their countries actions.

I have no evidence of anything it is my own fear of what could happen.

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay ( they later claim it was for rape). They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

You want me to believe the leaders are playing with a full deck of cards? Do they really care about how many people would die in a war? I don't know but look at Syria, they have no problem killing there own.

Thats all I have to say on it to be honest. You want to believe they are a peace loving nation thats up to you are your right to have your opinion.

I choose to think something else because of what people have told me that have lived in that country. (So I have been brainwashed by people who live or have lived in Iran, if I can't believe them where should I get information. That is my right to have my opinion.

I really want to believe you as I have absolutely no desire for a war, let alone nuclear. I also have no hatred towards Iranian people, but even they have been protesting against the leaders.

I don't know why you are taking it so personally if you are so sure you are right.

Because I also have Iranian friends, who live just like I do.... They don't have that sort of thing happening in front of them....

I don't hear about people running into schools over there with automatic weapons and killing kids. Does that mean America is dangerous?!

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Because I also have Iranian friends, who live just like I do.... They don't have that sort of thing happening in front of them....

I don't hear about people running into schools over there with automatic weapons and killing kids. Does that mean America is dangerous?!

Coffey, what about his other point?

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay ( they later claim it was for rape). They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

Surely you don't approve of such behavior by that government? And excusing evil by pointing to other's bad behavior is unacceptable to most thinking people.

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Coffey, what about his other point?

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay ( they later claim it was for rape). They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

Surely you don't approve of such behavior by that government? And excusing evil by pointing to other's bad behavior is unacceptable to most thinking people.

Of course I don't, but I don't approve of Israel murdering children because they Palestinian either.

Just like I don't approve of the US, UK etc bombing Afghanistan and Iraq and murdering THOUSANDS of children.

So how come US, UK and Israel are allowed Nukes based on the exact same thing?

Do you approve of those things?

Can you not see the hypocrisy here?!

US, UK and Israel cause mass genocide... Where has Iran ever been involved in mass genocide?

That should be the rule of owning a nuke... Has a country been involved in mass genocide.. if yes they shouldn't be allowed nukes.

Edited by Coffey

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Of course I don't, but I don't approve of Israel murdering children because they Palestinian either.

Just like I don't approve of the US, UK etc bombing Afghanistan and Iraq and murdering THOUSANDS of children.

So how come US, UK and Israel are allowed Nukes based on the exact same thing?

Do you approve of those things?

Can you not see the hypocrisy here?!

US, UK and Israel cause mass genocide... Where has Iran ever been involved in mass genocide?

That should be the rule of owning a nuke... Has a country been involved in mass genocide.. if yes they shouldn't be allowed nukes.

I won't argue that mistakes were made in Iraq and Afghanistan but characterizing those actions as murder is wrong, IMO. But that aside, what you seem to be saying is that because America is guilty then the world should allow a country that executes young people for appearing to be gay, cuts off body parts as a form of judicial sanction and routinely threatens other countries -especially Israel - with physical attack - though by proxies, is acceptable. If you find that acceptable then the obvious trail of logic is that when Iran has a nuke, you will excuse any action they take with it for the same reasons. The two cannot be so lightly separated IMO.

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If the Iranians persist, at some point all of their installations will be destroyed. It seems so stupid.

Persists with what? Making medical isotopes?

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Persists with what? Making medical isotopes?

Ex, how long are you going to take such an embarrassing uber legalistic view of this situation? So unless courtroom quality proof can be offered for Iran working on components - including the most important one, fuel, - then you cannot even imagine that they might be trying to position themselves for a bomb? Do you require such a standard for ANYTHING else you discuss? Frankly, people will stop taking what you say seriously if you keep up such an illogical pattern of absolute denial. NO ONE in the world community any longer doubts Iran's intentions in this NOR do they think it is a beneficial course for the world. You know, it is possible to acknowledge their attempt for nukes yet not approve of specific actions being considered against them - you just have to be honest about where you stand.

edit to clarify that when I say NO ONE I mean world governments that aren't doing billions in business with Iran.

Edited by and then

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Persists with what? Making medical isotopes?

Nuclear weapons ;)

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I won't argue that mistakes were made in Iraq and Afghanistan but characterizing those actions as murder is wrong, IMO. But that aside, what you seem to be saying is that because America is guilty then the world should allow a country that executes young people for appearing to be gay, cuts off body parts as a form of judicial sanction and routinely threatens other countries -especially Israel - with physical attack - though by proxies, is acceptable. If you find that acceptable then the obvious trail of logic is that when Iran has a nuke, you will excuse any action they take with it for the same reasons. The two cannot be so lightly separated IMO.

Iran would not nuke Israel. It is just silly to even think that.

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So allowing countries with Governments that are not politically very stable even with their own people is a step in the right direction for a safer world?

What should somebody else in the world "allow" your country with your government? Sovereignty is a wonderful thing, when you're taking your own for granted and defiling someone else's.

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Coffey, what about his other point?

This is a country that hangs 15 and 16 year old boys publically because it suspects they are gay ( they later claim it was for rape). They stone women, they cut of peoples body parts. Thats just a few of the things.

Surely you don't approve of such behavior by that government? And excusing evil by pointing to other's bad behavior is unacceptable to most thinking people.

And we bomb civilians that we suspect they are disagreeable. We electrocute people, torture people, have over a million abortions a year, gamble, prostitute, start wars on countries that never attacked us, starve millions of people to death with sanctions, proliferate more arms than any other country in the world. Who's going to rabble rouse about us out there and make you think their voices are legitimate? That reflection in that mirror is nothing I'd wear.

If cutting off body parts is going to be raised as the reason to rabble rouse about Iran then our officials should get busy with their next shameless display of hypocrisy while they're subsidizing other countries who stone women blah blah blah.

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Iran would not nuke Israel. It is just silly to even think that.

Then their leadership should stop hinting/alluding to it at every opportunity. But I have explained the danger many times here and it is NOT an overt Iranian attack on Israel. I don't desire to explain it yet again.

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Then their leadership should stop hinting/alluding to it at every opportunity. But I have explained the danger many times here and it is NOT an overt Iranian attack on Israel. I don't desire to explain it yet again.

I posted a video with their President saying how he doesn't want a nuke and wants peace. LOL

Can you find a video of Israels president saying they want peace?!

I have never once seen any evidence of these threats. Every time someone has shown em these threats they are clearly not threats, they are comments on how someone can't get away with doing horrible things, which is true. As a religious man he will mean it in a God won't put up with that without punishment. Which i agree, Israel should be held accountable for their crimes against humanity.

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And we bomb civilians that we suspect they are disagreeable. We electrocute people, torture people, have over a million abortions a year, gamble, prostitute, start wars on countries that never attacked us, starve millions of people to death with sanctions, proliferate more arms than any other country in the world. Who's going to rabble rouse about us out there and make you think their voices are legitimate? That reflection in that mirror is nothing I'd wear.

If cutting off body parts is going to be raised as the reason to rabble rouse about Iran then our officials should get busy with their next shameless display of hypocrisy while they're subsidizing other countries who stone women blah blah blah.

Ahh again with the wannabe utopian stuff... No matter how hard one tries it is impossible to EQUATE all countries such that no one can be separated and found to be more of a threat. If you feel that the Iranian government is just an average group of human beings, no different than the US House or Senate or the military leaders in the US then that is your prerogative Yam. I'm all full up on crazy here - not buying yours.

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Ahh again with the wannabe utopian stuff... No matter how hard one tries it is impossible to EQUATE all countries such that no one can be separated and found to be more of a threat. If you feel that the Iranian government is just an average group of human beings, no different than the US House or Senate or the military leaders in the US then that is your prerogative Yam. I'm all full up on crazy here - not buying yours.

There's nothing Utopian about any of that. If foreigners have a legitimate right to intervene in our internal affairs over any conceivable crap that they don't agree with personally or politically, then that reflection in the mirror will be justified.

Every government is disagreeable to me. It's just a fashion show, the special interests you care about.

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I posted a video with their President saying how he doesn't want a nuke and wants peace. LOL

Can you find a video of Israels president saying they want peace?!

I have never once seen any evidence of these threats. Every time someone has shown em these threats they are clearly not threats, they are comments on how someone can't get away with doing horrible things, which is true. As a religious man he will mean it in a God won't put up with that without punishment. Which i agree, Israel should be held accountable for their crimes against humanity.

Yet every other nation who makes a statement is branded as western propaganda and lies.

Obviously in the west we read it as 'Israel needs to be wiped off the map 'when what he really meant was 'Israeli's should all come and live in Iran'

Like the Stealth fighter. Western propaganda read it as 'we have a fighter who can evade radar and strike before you know we are here'. Yet what they meant was ' our fly boys really liked the look of the F22 so we built one to keep them happy'

They reported their new stealthy anti ship subs. Blimey propaganda led us to believe 'It is a stealth sub that cannot been seen so can attack carriers and destroyers in the area with anti ship missiles' What they really wanted to say was 'We had a load of turquoise paint and thought they would look nice painted in them.

Same as the new monkey space program. A huge amount of Iranians live in poverty, with lack of basic facilities so obviously the most sensible for a Government is to start spending billions on a space program.

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