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Saru

Is proof of alien life a risk to society ?

425 posts in this topic

nopeda, on 11 February 2013 - 01:46 PM, said:

I don't believe in any fabric of space-time, or ether, or that concept by any other name. Whether or not photons have mass doesn't change the fact that if they leave an emitter at 186K mps and arrive at an object that's moving 14K mps in the direction of the emitter, the combined velocity should 200K mps. And if it's moving at 14K away from the emitter the combined velocity should be 172K mps. You seem somehow comfortable accepting the idea that the velocity of all light arriving at this planet should arrive at the same velocity relative to it, but regardless of the emitter's velocity relative to it. Most people do, yet so far no one else in this forum has been able to explain any way that could possibly be the case, or even seems to appreciate the significance of why it would have to be adjusted. It is appreciated and discussed here though:

http://www.alternati...itterEffect.htm

Maybe the Voyager probes might give some indication when they enter Interstellar space and can offer some new readings? Perhaps not so much an aether, but as you suggested a magnetic sheath such as the Heliopause?

Perhaps that might control the overall velocity of the solar system itself keeping matter restricted to a balance for want of a better word? I am comfortable with the idea of light arriving at earth all at the same speed, because it seems this is what I would consider something of a stabilised region, for instance, if we have 2 people on the ground throwing a ball to each other, and 2 people on a plane throwing a ball to each other, the ball is relative to earth in both cases. The ball will not have the planes velocity added to it as one throws it to another, it will be the same velocity as the ball on the ground (of course considering perfect conditions, that is the people throw a ball of the same weight with exactly the same force) perhaps the solar system is a way of keeping these restrictions in place? If so, all light in the solar system would be at a speed relative to the system itself, but that could possibly be based on the heliopause itself, offering as you have suggested differing speeds under differing conditions relative to each other. One system might have a different speed of light to us, making physics somewhat variable across the Universe, there is a team here in Australia thinking along those lines, they have hypothesised that constants change across the Universe, they speak of "Alpha", as opposed to labelling a resistance:

Maybe some probes will have different readings if they ever get far enough away. Your impression with the ball is incorrect though. Their velocity is relative to the Earth in both cases yes, but the velocity of the plane certainly is added unless the plane it at rest relative to the Earth, and therefore hopefully sitting on the ground. The velocities of emitting bodies relative to Earth have to be added or at least accounted for somehow too, since they also exist.

I haven't heard about the "Alpha" before but my impression is that it's the degree to which electromagnetic radiation influences matter, and if so then I can see how that might change in different adjustment and lack of adjustment type areas of space. It seems that could involve countless problems possibly even changing the stucture of things if virtual photons are really a significant aspect of atoms.

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Maybe some probes will have different readings if they ever get far enough away. Your impression with the ball is incorrect though. Their velocity is relative to the Earth in both cases yes, but the velocity of the plane certainly is added unless the plane it at rest relative to the Earth, and therefore hopefully sitting on the ground. The velocities of emitting bodies relative to Earth have to be added or at least accounted for somehow too, since they also exist.

Maybe I have it wrong, or maybe I just explained myself badly. I was considering the plane and the earth as models for a co-ordinate systems. Reading back I may have been a step in front of myself there. What I had tried to convey was that to relative observers the motion of the ball would remain constant, because both reference frames are at a uniform velocity. But if an interstellar medium is indeed nothing, then I admit I am not sure why the reference frames must be identical, we assume so because matter appears to be constant going by deep space observations. Perhaps your idea of differing frames might explain Hoyle's genuine anomalies?

I haven't heard about the "Alpha" before but my impression is that it's the degree to which electromagnetic radiation influences matter, and if so then I can see how that might change in different adjustment and lack of adjustment type areas of space. It seems that could involve countless problems possibly even changing the stucture of things if virtual photons are really a significant aspect of atoms.

Indeed, which should also support your idea of a variable speed of light?

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Go to google, click on "images", then type in, "Coast to Coast Tim DeVoe visitor".

Look at the photos & the reddish alien should show somewheres on the top line of photos.

I am Tim & I have the original photo. I had made many larger copies of the original photo and gave the copies over the years to people who were interested in having a copy for themselves.

The photo was taken in the state of Maine.

Edited by ionizerusa

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What proof? Have i missed something? Did they discover something?

And no i think people wouldnt even care if someone would say " Hey they found aliens! " " Oh really well i'm running late for work cya.. " Only if some sort of big ET crafts roll in like in independence day then maybe people would give it a second thought...

Such discovery would only fascinate us, people who are waiting for that day...

Until then we can talk theory..

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Maybe I have it wrong, or maybe I just explained myself badly. I was considering the plane and the earth as models for a co-ordinate systems. Reading back I may have been a step in front of myself there. What I had tried to convey was that to relative observers the motion of the ball would remain constant, because both reference frames are at a uniform velocity. But if an interstellar medium is indeed nothing, then I admit I am not sure why the reference frames must be identical, we assume so because matter appears to be constant going by deep space observations. Perhaps your idea of differing frames might explain Hoyle's genuine anomalies?

All velocities are relative to particular objects. Since all most people seem to consider is the velocity of things relative to the surface of the Earth they don't seem to appreciate how meaningless that is in space. Your interpretation of it relative to a ball in a plane seems to need some improvement, from my pov. To your credit from my pov, you are the only other person in this forum who I've encountered who seems even able to appreciate anything strange and unexplained about this topic. No offense, but you are one of the last people I thought would ever be able to appreciate such things. It's a nice surprise.

nopeda, on 12 February 2013 - 06:12 PM, said:

I haven't heard about the "Alpha" before but my impression is that it's the degree to which electromagnetic radiation influences matter, and if so then I can see how that might change in different adjustment and lack of adjustment type areas of space. It seems that could involve countless problems possibly even changing the stucture of things if virtual photons are really a significant aspect of atoms.

Indeed, which should also support your idea of a variable speed of light?

My guess would be that in an adjustment area both free and virtual photons would be influenced.

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Go to google, click on "images", then type in, "Coast to Coast Tim DeVoe visitor".

Look at the photos & the reddish alien should show somewheres on the top line of photos.

I am Tim & I have the original photo. I had made many larger copies of the original photo and gave the copies over the years to people who were interested in having a copy for themselves.

The photo was taken in the state of Maine.

Can you post a link to it? If it's too long you can go here:

http://is.gd/

and make a shorter link for it.

Where and how did you get the original photo?

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Can you see Nicole Kiddman in the photo ? Now Thats a Photo i could have ! :tu:

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actually it is a threat to corrupt and rogue government(s) like the American government hell bent on being in control and manipulate the American people and let's just say the whole world if it was allowed and of other nations didn't have the means to protect and defend themselves.but this also goes to all government(s) hell bent on keeping people in the "dark" and remaining in control for their own interest and benefits and believe me people its not in our best interest and benefit what the governments have in store for us.no matter what government its from meaning from earth they are all corrupt,deceitful and want to remain in power.so in other words of course its their best interest to make people afraid and keep aliens existence a secret and etc.disclosure on the E.T presence its like walking on dynamite for them.also it would eliminate the control that the governments. have on the people.because let me tell you people the governments do not have the peoples or humanities best interest at heart!!!!especially the united states government.also Its only a threat if your one of the illuminati,nwo,Freemasons and especially the reptilian E.T race or any of the malevolent E.T races.and these false religions and gods!!!religion is another control system,just like governments,and certain other systems.

Edited by King Cobra 1408

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I have to say that the presentation of alien life existing alone would not harm us much. But if the aliens decided to socialize with us and be in our society I think that the many stupid people out there that are so full of themselves would probably ruin it for everyone else. Just look at District 9. This is a wonderful example of how aliens would be treated if they weren't as advanced as we thought they were, I feel as though I've gone off on a tangent and I have, but to further the point, the people will harm the people, no questions about it.

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I hope we don't contact or get contacted by any alien life. I am sure one of our Governments would some how cause a war.

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We have no need to worry ! THe More I see the more I read,the more I know . They are really a lot smarter than that,they Are Still Laughing until they pee-n-there little Green space suits ! ANd In Space no one can hear you scream when that happens ! LoL ! :alien::no:

Edited by DONTEATUS

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also if your the NWO,skull and bones society,the Illuminati,reptilians,evil entities and beings,and evil force and like i said corrupt governments all over the world.but people don't be afraid these so called leaders and government officials don't care for us and don't have our best interest at heart either.they will say anything to win us over even if they don't mean it and do it.they want us to be afraid and fear and hate each other and etc.these government officials are just pretenders and puppets to the people and evil dark forces with the real power behind the scenes!!!

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No doubt Christianity would probably say the aliens are demons or have been sent by Satan, blah blah blah.

I'd personally feel really happy about it. I can't explain it. Though I'm not sure why any advanced race would want to associate with us...mankind is disgusting and still so primitive in so many ways.

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E.Ts E.Ts E.Ts hell yeah and by that i mean the benevolent and good ones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! its only a danger if your a religious nut,corrupt governments malevolent evil and corrupt secret societies and evil beings and entities other than no no dangers

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If the aliens want their amnesty and Obama phone, they better hurry up !

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Any bets on how long the wait is? Can I go to the movies ? :tu:

See Y`az later !

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First contact , or one of many contacts?

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Not me. Not too many Aussies I reckon. Dead set, as a species, this scardey cat stuff seems a bit embarrassing to me. I think the article is exaggerated something ridiculous, but I must admit, The Huffington Post does appear rather dramatic to me most of the time.

Anyhow, example:

OK, true. But honestly, was this any sort of a shock?? To anyone? Did it have any major impacts? It was bloody interesting, and now it's old hat. It was only weeks after the magnificent announcement, when another was found, and another, and another.......

The world did not fall apart, it did not stop in it's tracks. People said Hrrmmmmzzzzz, that is cool! Some said "AMAZING! I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS!!!" Then we all went to work, and paid our Mortgages.

And you know what? Some didn't give a hoot. Such would not even impact muy daily routine, and many others too. It would be awesome, and be the topic of conversation in some circles. But earth shattering? Outside of the UFO Phenomena and the ETH, it is a big fast moving world out there.

Sorry, I consider myself agnostic, and I do not see such news "shaking up my world", it would be intensely interesting, and if an Alien claimed to be God, I would want to see his passport first. Heaven I imagine has a rather unique stamp.

Does anyone still believe the end of days is actually going to happen in some biblical apocalypse? Here I mean, in the forum, and the real world, I know there are silly fundies in the world, heck some people still pay good money to listen to David Icke speak, but outside of the deliberately nutty, do people still go for this? Surely we have had enough "doomsdays" for people with half a brain to catch on? Heck, even I as a kid remember getting the day of school because the end of the world was supposed to happen in the early 70's. At the time it was"Cheers, thanks crackpots - free day!!" but how many times can one fall for this crap?

Nothing "scaredy cat" about being "shaken up", P101. I just mean it would cause a lot of interest, buzz, and yeah, some fear. The point I was badly trying to make is that people are looking for answers to life and that's why God - whatever flavor a person settles on - is being sought in the first place. A superior intelligence with vastly superior , almost magical technology, would easily be considered that answer for most. And as several here have pointed out, as a person of faith in the God of the Bible, I would apply what I believe to be proofs of scripture if this new intelligence started claiming to be God. That's all.

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I hope we don't contact or get contacted by any alien life. I am sure one of our Governments would some how cause a war.

To be quite honest, I do not think they would...not initially. They would want to make contact and I really think that the likes of NASA would have a far bigger influence on any government decisions.

If the aliens come in peace, the real threat would not be our governments on how they deal with them, it would be our governments on how they deal with US.

The elite of this world do not want Joe Bloggs getting in the way of any form of contact with aliens, we will be kept at bay and if we persist on getting close...well, I reckon we would be shot at the most or locked away in some secret bunker at least.

The panic on the streets by some and the rush by others insisting the aliens took them back with them would be the bigger threat, and the governments know it.

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The devil is in the details.

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I truly feel that all that noise about people going into a panic if alien life was discovered is nonsense. Yes there will be some crazy people building shelters for the end of the world and some hardcore religious people protesting with signs but mostly religions will change there views about it one way or another like theu have with other things. Mostly people would think its actually pretty cool.

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No risk until proven threat to us.. simple..

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The point I was badly trying to make is that people are looking for answers to life and that's why God - whatever flavor a person settles on - is being sought in the first place. A superior intelligence with vastly superior , almost magical technology, would easily be considered that answer for most. And as several here have pointed out, as a person of faith in the God of the Bible, I would apply what I believe to be proofs of scripture if this new intelligence started claiming to be God. That's all.

Years ago I started trying to think realistically about the possibility that God does exist. Here's a list of basic things I came up with to help with that attempt:

1. If God exists he almost certainly would have to be an alien.

2. If there is a creator associated with this planet, all

who refer to him refer to the same being regardless of what

they call him or what they think about him.

3. Nothing that happens is supernatural, so anything gods do

would be natural for them.

4. If God exists and wants things to be as they are, he

could not provide proof of his existence because doing

so would change things too much.

5. Since the terms omnipotent and omniscient appear to

make themselves impossible, it's unrealistic to try assigning

those particular characteristics to God if he exists.

6. Since disbelief is a form of belief, the degree of faith a

person has that God does not exist is what determines how

strong an atheist he or she is, or is not.

7. People who have put their faith in a belief often/usually find

it impossible to comprehend the ability of considering the possibility

that God does not exist and also the possibility that he does.

8. People who have put their faith in a belief often/usually find

it impossible to comprehend much less appreciate basic number 2.

9. People who claim to be strong atheists often/usually asburdly

try to deny their own faith that God does not exist...faith which is

a necessary part of being a strong atheist.

10. Whether God exists or not it seems apparent that life must have

originated from lifelessness to begin with, and may do it fairly often.

11. We should not allow what appear to be conflicting or unlikely

beliefs encouraged by other people--however absurd--to contaminate

and interfere with our own attempts to think about this topic

realistically.

12. We should not allow childlike and unrealistic attempts at comparing

the concept of gods with those of childlike ideas like the tooth fairy,

the Easter Bunny, invisible pink unicorns, spaghetti monsters etc

encouraged by other people--however absurd--to contaminate and interfere

with our own attempts to think about this topic realistically.

13. If gods exist they would necessarily have to be technologically

advanced far beyond we humans on Earth, to the point that they became

gods.

14. If God exists he almost certainly would not be restricted to any

particular body, form, or gender. (disclaimer: I refer to God as "he" out

of convenience and because that's how we are encouraged to refer to "him"

in most if not all canonical texts.)

15. If God exists it seems most likely that he has as much influence

over the content of canonical texts as he wants to have.

16. If God exists, it seems quite clear he makes use of the evolutionary

method of creation.

17. If there are things which people consider to be spiritual, they are

most likely actually physical in ways we just can't appreciate yet.

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