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Frank Merton

Why are male homosexuals so talented

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What I'm going to say pertains to Vietnam; I don't know how applicable it might be in other cultures.

When I was growing up there were effeminate men ("he has women's ways") and they were seen as naturally to be the actors and designers and dancers and poets and so on, but back then Vietnamese never talked about sex and I was oblivious. Neither me nor my friends could imagine a man preferring another man over a woman, so the reality never occurred to us.

Nowadays gays are more open and western contact and movies and so on make it all obvious. I don't think Vietnamese are homophobic except when they come under influence of missionaries, and most missionaries are not appreciated, but that's something else.

A couple weeks ago I talked with my high school son about gays in his school, and he said there are quite a few. They are popular too, because they are so funny. I then asked him to say that to me in English, and he used the word "funny." I asked if he meant strange or entertaining, and he said entertaining -- they are witty, tell good jokes, understand what is with all the teachers and bullies, and so on.

There is probably something in our natures or genes about all this -- I don't know -- but if there is, it stands to reason that the same genes that influence our sexual orientation also influences other aspects about our personalities. I doubt that one could say any group like that is more or less talented, but perhaps more exhibitionistic, more expressive, more flexible, more inventive. Who knows?

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freetoroam you forgot Freddie Mercury, he was a gay artist. Best singer ever.

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freetoroam you forgot Freddie Mercury, he was a gay artist. Best singer ever.

oh yeah, he isn`t even on the list. :unsure2: I haven`t even heard of half of them myself, that list has even got a window dresser on there! It must be an old list when gay was not the in thing in the industry, some gay must have paid google to get that list made up and to keep their name off there.

I wonder how many of the "gay" artists are really gay, some maybe saying they are now because it will get them a part or fame easier. There was a time when being gay was only behind closed doors, now the doors are kept open all the time, it seems not being gay in the entertainment industry today is so yesteryear.

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The real question should be why were the artists from the past, who left a great impact on our culture, disproportionately homosexual?

When you think of painting you think of Mona Lisa. Leonardo was a homosexual.

When you think of sculpture, you think of David. Michelangelo was a homosexual.

When you think of literature, you think of the beautiful homoerotic sonnets by Shakespeare, or Herman Melville's fascination with male beauty.

Modern novel: Proust, Thomas Mann, Mishima.

Music: Tchaikovsky.

And this is just a tip of iceberg. Whoever questioned the importance of homosexuals to our speacies should have this in mind. Without us the world would be less civilised place and our culture would be significantly poorer.

Thats a very broad generalization. Maybe when you think of painting you think of the mona lisa, or david or shakespere ect. I'm confident that that is not even close to being remotely accurate in any way. The spectrum of the history of the arts is vast as is the people that appreicate them.

So the world is more civilized and cultural due to homosexuals, wow, I guess a thank you is in order. (Note: didn't Leonardo design incredible war machines designed to kill thousand more effectivly?)

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Natural selection and survival mechanism....homosexuality is not the norm in all cultures and is generally rejected and dissapproved of... so the homoexuals have to learn harder than the majority and develop some "tricks" so they will be accepted and thus survive.. these tricks are the stereotypes that they are said to be.. so basically what i'm saying is their talents are not any more innate than the rest of the people, however they have to strive more than the majority for acceptance which means more flexing of the brain muscle and more searching within oneself, and all the things that results in including discovering/developing a personal talent.

I was once researching about whether mothering is learned or an instinct. One scientist holds the opinion that it's learned and suggests "that the extraordinary plumpness of newborn humans, much fatter than other infant primates, is an attempt to convince their parents that they are worth rearing. Even an infant's smile becomes [...] part of its strategy to seduce its mother." Maybe the same is happening with homosexuals.

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This is my first stab at starting a theme, and I'm sticking my neck out. Still, it is something I've noticed. Not all homosexuals I'm sure are artists, and I don't know enough of them to have any idea, but it sure seems to me that they loom large in the arts -- acting, dancing, decorating, writing, fashion, design, even hairdressing. Homosexuals compose maybe two percent of the population (if you include people who've had some such experience then maybe ten percent) but they are at least a third to half of these artistic areas. I travel a lot and this applies around the world -- not just in the West but certainly in Asia too.

Is this true or an illusion? If true, why?

It is true to a degree, and I think it has to do with a need to please. Growing up as a homosexual is a difficult thing to do, especially 20-30 years ago before it slowly started making it into the main stream. From a psychological perspective this would create a desire to please people and to generate as much outside positive attention, or even negative, as possible. I don't know for sure however, this is just the musing of a man with a tad bit of insight into this particular issue.

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Could be part of gay culture. They could be influenced by what they see. I once asked a gay man what was the deal with gay mannerisms. I didnt understand them. People call it feminine, but I have never seen a woman act or talk like that. He simply said I think it's culture. I saw other gay men behaving this way and I looked up to them, so I must have picked up on it.

As to the arts..... Well through out history performance and art always attracted misfits and libral thinkers. I think gay men did fit in well with these sub cultures because they could find acceptance ( and each other) there where they otherwise would not have. I think it's a sub culture niche that continues to this day.

It's not unlike American inner cities cities being filled with African Americans. After the abolishment of slavery to the ending of Jim crow laws and segregation, there was a movement of black people to cities to look for work because none of them owned any land. This racial cycle of poverty haunts us to this day.

Socioeconomics has a lot to do with niches that subgroups tend to occupy.

I too have no idea what is up with the manerisms. Honeslty I know at least 2 gay people that I knew before they came out, and suddenly after coming out they instantly developed those manerisms that you speak of. Again though I think this falls onto my last post, as a way to get as much reinforcing attention as possible whether or not it is positive. I am gay, and never developed or understood the need to behave that way, but I also had understanding friends and family and once I got the courage to come out never felt alienated or abandond by them.

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Natural selection and survival mechanism....homosexuality is not the norm in all cultures and is generally rejected and dissapproved of... so the homoexuals have to learn harder than the majority and develop some "tricks" so they will be accepted and thus survive.. these tricks are the stereotypes that they are said to be.. so basically what i'm saying is their talents are not any more innate than the rest of the people, however they have to strive more than the majority for acceptance which means more flexing of the brain muscle and more searching within oneself, and all the things that results in including discovering/developing a personal talent.

I was once researching about whether mothering is learned or an instinct. One scientist holds the opinion that it's learned and suggests "that the extraordinary plumpness of newborn humans, much fatter than other infant primates, is an attempt to convince their parents that they are worth rearing. Even an infant's smile becomes [...] part of its strategy to seduce its mother." Maybe the same is happening with homosexuals.

This isn't entirely accurate. The Japanese had openly gay samurai, in fact it was usually expected that a samurai would take on a young teen to train and have sex with. They often had life long partnerships having sex with the 1 man they were bound to, of course many also had sex with women but there was no implied rules against that as opposed to taking on more male partners. The Celtics also had a lot of males sex, although you were expected to also make babies. Some of the Native American tribes actually revered gay people. They had a third sex for them and they often became the spiritual leaders of their tribes. In fact, almost every culture that developed outside of the scope of the Abrahamic religions had homosexuality and didn't care. I do however agree that it is likely the case that they felt the need to strive for more in order to be accepted and feel fulfilled. The last part seems pretty ridiculous though. Most women will tell you that mothering is something that comes with having the child, some obviously have more paternal instinct than others but the same can be said with animal mothers.

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Posted (edited)

This isn't entirely accurate. The Japanese had openly gay samurai, in fact it was usually expected that a samurai would take on a young teen to train and have sex with. They often had life long partnerships having sex with the 1 man they were bound to, of course many also had sex with women but there was no implied rules against that as opposed to taking on more male partners. The Celtics also had a lot of males sex, although you were expected to also make babies. Some of the Native American tribes actually revered gay people. They had a third sex for them and they often became the spiritual leaders of their tribes. In fact, almost every culture that developed outside of the scope of the Abrahamic religions had homosexuality and didn't care. I do however agree that it is likely the case that they felt the need to strive for more in order to be accepted and feel fulfilled. The last part seems pretty ridiculous though. Most women will tell you that mothering is something that comes with having the child, some obviously have more paternal instinct than others but the same can be said with animal mothers.

Hey thanks for sharing this information.

Do you know if homosexuality is openly practiced and accepted as a norm anywhere now? I mean historically it's well known that homosexuality was the norm in Sodom.

As for mothering..yeah it's true that "Most women will tell [me] that mothering is something that comes with having the child". If you're interested in the subject explore more arguments for and against this. I enjoyed it. I never believed mothering is an instinct. I've always thought of it as something learned. So it was enlightening to see how and why it's not baseless to believe so.

Edited by goodconversations

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Hey thanks for sharing this information.

Do you know if homosexuality is openly practiced and accepted as a norm anywhere now? I mean historically it's well known that homosexuality was the norm in Sodom.

As for mothering..yeah it's true that "Most women will tell [me] that mothering is something that comes with having the child". If you're interested in the subject explore more arguments for and against this. I enjoyed it. I never believed mothering is an instinct. I've always thought of it as something learned. So it was enlightening to see how and why it's not baseless to believe so.

Yeah I suppose I will have to look into it more. It is something I have always assumed to be true. It would seem that child rearing and care would be instinctual otherwise the death rate of children or offspring would have been extremely high pre-written/cultural development or among species that do not tend to pass down knowledge.

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otherwise the death rate of children or offspring would have been extremely high pre-written/cultural development or among species that do not tend to pass down knowledge.

i believe it was. If not for this reason (which by the way Sarah Hrdy, the scientist i referred to, found evidence for), then for medical reasons... infections and complications etc... not to mention the environment..

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This is my first stab at starting a theme, and I'm sticking my neck out. Still, it is something I've noticed. Not all homosexuals I'm sure are artists, and I don't know enough of them to have any idea, but it sure seems to me that they loom large in the arts -- acting, dancing, decorating, writing, fashion, design, even hairdressing. Homosexuals compose maybe two percent of the population (if you include people who've had some such experience then maybe ten percent) but they are at least a third to half of these artistic areas. I travel a lot and this applies around the world -- not just in the West but certainly in Asia too.

Is this true or an illusion? If true, why?

I think thats a broad generalization,im sure theres some lazy men that are gay

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Posted (edited)

This is my first stab at starting a theme, and I'm sticking my neck out. Still, it is something I've noticed. Not all homosexuals I'm sure are artists, and I don't know enough of them to have any idea, but it sure seems to me that they loom large in the arts -- acting, dancing, decorating, writing, fashion, design, even hairdressing. Homosexuals compose maybe two percent of the population (if you include people who've had some such experience then maybe ten percent) but they are at least a third to half of these artistic areas. I travel a lot and this applies around the world -- not just in the West but certainly in Asia too.

Is this true or an illusion? If true, why?

I think it is true to some extent. I've noticed male homosexuals to be oftentimes extremely talented in art and business.

I have no idea why, and it's just my perspective in my small world, so I'm not saying it's globally true.

But yes, I have noticed that.

Edited by pallidin

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Well we know that it takes both male and female for creation... if there is an abundance of both energies in one body perhaps it leads to an explosion in the arts?

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what I wanna know is where do I get me a talented FEmale homosexual ...

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This is my first stab at starting a theme, and I'm sticking my neck out. Still, it is something I've noticed. Not all homosexuals I'm sure are artists, and I don't know enough of them to have any idea, but it sure seems to me that they loom large in the arts -- acting, dancing, decorating, writing, fashion, design, even hairdressing. Homosexuals compose maybe two percent of the population (if you include people who've had some such experience then maybe ten percent) but they are at least a third to half of these artistic areas. I travel a lot and this applies around the world -- not just in the West but certainly in Asia too.

Is this true or an illusion? If true, why?

I expect it's most probably because those careers- acting, dancing, fashion etc- were and probably still are those in which being "flamboyant" and all the other stereotypical forms of gay behaviour were accepted and thought of as nothing unusual, and so tended to attract people who tilted in that direction, at a time when (for example) if one worked in a factory or down a Mine, then you'd keep very quiet about it. It's almost certainly purely about social acceptance.

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what I wanna know is where do I get me a talented FEmale homosexual ...

Interesting observation.

Homosexuals talents are not any more innate than the rest of the people, however they have to strive more than the majority for acceptance which means more flexing of the brain muscle and more searching within oneself, and all the things that results in including discovering/developing a personal talent.

A related post asks:

Why is homophobia so commonplace?

Why in our society is homosexuality hated and frowned upon. The same with Bisexuality regarding men.

But lesbianism and Bisexuality regarding women is thought as fine.

Anyone know why this is the case?

Because the world is still a patriarchal place.

Homo/bisexality is against the norm (being straight). This makes homo/bisexuality a shameful and degrading act. Thus it's more shameful and degrading when done by the superior sex (males) than when done by the inferior sex (females). Also, all homosexual males are stereotyped as tender and soft in their feelings which are qualities associated with the weak sex (females) unlike the strong sex (males) which exhibits better judgment and thinking abilities making it a tough sex.

I guess the answer is: stereotyping

I think the answer to why female homosexuals seem to be (in number) less talented than male homosexuals is: female homoexuals have to strive less for accptence as they have less on stake than male homosexuals.

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This is my first stab at starting a theme, and I'm sticking my neck out. Still, it is something I've noticed. Not all homosexuals I'm sure are artists, and I don't know enough of them to have any idea, but it sure seems to me that they loom large in the arts -- acting, dancing, decorating, writing, fashion, design, even hairdressing. Homosexuals compose maybe two percent of the population (if you include people who've had some such experience then maybe ten percent) but they are at least a third to half of these artistic areas. I travel a lot and this applies around the world -- not just in the West but certainly in Asia too.

Is this true or an illusion? If true, why?

this is not true it may seem that way because society have "gay jobs"

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Posted (edited)

this is not true it may seem that way because society have "gay jobs"

That is too simplistic; there is more to it than that. I suspect that part of the genetic complex that goes into a gay man also has other effects on his personality. We see something similar in gay women, where you see athletic excellence and noticeable military achievement and so on.

We cannot deny such realities by insisting that 100% show the tendecies; inheritance and ensuing events make for far more complicated a picture, but I think we can say that there are associations that go beyond stereotypes. The fact that these associations also go beyond culture tends in my mind to negate arguments that it has to do with acceptance by some professions and not others. Even cultures that are quite open to gays see, if anything, even more of these associations.

Edited by Frank Merton

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Posted (edited)

That is too simplistic; there is more to it than that. I suspect that part of the genetic complex that goes into a gay man also has other effects on his personality. We see something similar in gay women, where you see athletic excellence and noticeable military achievement and so on.

We cannot deny such realities by insisting that 100% show the tendecies; inheritance and ensuing events make for far more complicated a picture, but I think we can say that there are associations that go beyond stereotypes. The fact that these associations also go beyond culture tends in my mind to negate arguments that it has to do with acceptance by some professions and not others. Even cultures that are quite open to gays see, if anything, even more of these associations.

what talents do you talk of?

most gay ppl areppl who have mixed ethnical genetics that what might confusing you

but overall gay ppl are not anymore talented than non gays

gay ppl jus have "gay jobs"

like a male hair dresser

its jus not many straight men who become hair dresser because its a "gay job"

%90 chance that a gay male will be hired or even pursue that career before a straight male as a hairdresser

gay ppl are not more talented

and gay ppl have a mental problem

being gay is an mental disorder

being confused bout urgender and how to repoduce can only be explained as being a mental disorder..

so the ppl u think are "talented gay ppl"

are talenetd straight ppl with a mental disorder

Edited by MR.Blueprint

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Posted (edited)

most gay ppl areppl who have mixed ethnical genetics that what might confusing you

Oh no not again... Seriously?

what talents do you talk of?

most gay ppl areppl who have mixed ethnical genetics that what might confusing you

but overall gay ppl are not anymore talented than non gays

gay ppl jus have "gay jobs"

like a male hair dresser

its jus not many straight men who become hair dresser because its a "gay job"

%90 chance that a gay male will be hired or even pursue that career before a straight male as a hairdresser

gay ppl are not more talented

and gay ppl have a mental problem

being gay is an mental disorder

being confused bout urgender and how to repoduce can only be explained as being a mental disorder..

so the ppl u think are "talented gay ppl"

are talenetd straight ppl with a mental disorder

Edited by Coffey
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what talents do you talk of?

most gay ppl areppl who have mixed ethnical genetics that what might confusing you

but overall gay ppl are not anymore talented than non gays

gay ppl jus have "gay jobs"

like a male hair dresser

its jus not many straight men who become hair dresser because its a "gay job"

%90 chance that a gay male will be hired or even pursue that career before a straight male as a hairdresser

gay ppl are not more talented

and gay ppl have a mental problem

being gay is an mental disorder

being confused bout urgender and how to repoduce can only be explained as being a mental disorder..

so the ppl u think are "talented gay ppl"

are talenetd straight ppl with a mental disorder

the crap that comes out of your mouth is astonishing. i think westboro could use a guy just like you.

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the crap that comes out of your mouth is astonishing. i think westboro could use a guy just like you.

Hahaha, that tickled me.

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Hahaha, that tickled me.

if we all become gay

we will die out

this world consist of dummies

ppl dont even know the point of life

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Posted (edited)

if we all become gay

we will die out

this world consist of dummies

ppl dont even know the point of life

OK smart *** do you realise without gay couples we would also have more of a problem with over population... Now that could be evolution... Where as what you are trying to imply with your crazy theories is not.

Edited by Coffey
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