The Sphinx Temple

[poppet]

greeting everyone first post so be gentle..

below is a link to a narrated slide show presented by Robert Temple who believes he has discovered the location of no less than severn 4th dynasty or before pharaohs.

Also on the same link is a slide show from the Osiris shaft lasting 20 minutes which helps put into context the huge weight of the sarcophagus's that were lowered down into the Giza plateau.

http://www.egyptiand...multimedia.html

here is a image of the valley temple with the Sphinx temple still hidden from view the Sphinx temple was not excavated until 1936 .

here is a image inside the Sphinx temple with what appears to be a hole in the bedrock.

here we can see a 100 ton worked piece of granite brought 500 miles up from Aswan and sunk into the bedrock of the temple.

you can also see that the granite block was sunk into the bedrock before the temple was constructed, as the temple wall is built over the top.

this image shows the block coming out of the north side wall of the temple.

this is one of three found on the Giza plateau and may have been used as a cable guide that fits into the recessed slot in the granite block, and was this how they lowered 40 to 60 ton objects safely down into their resting places.

i find this evidence quite compelling ,did a pharaoh die and after his burial have a temple built over his resting place ,have archoloigists mistakenly took this piece of granite as to only be a drainage channel, and as Robert Temple suggests it is actually a cable conduit.

if he is right and the tombs of Cheops and co are found in the locations that Robert has pointed too, then it's going to put a big question mark over the pyramids being built for their tombs is it not.

[wolfknight]

I have been to Giza and have seen the Sphinx. I have been inside the Pyramids. If there is anything under the Sphinx the government will not that dig there.

[lakeview rud]

Poppet, welcome to UM. Temple is considered a 'fringie' by many on this site so beware. The 100 ton granite block sunk into the temple floor and below the temple wall is indeed a curious piece. The small blocks seem to just be 'fill', used afterward to just level the floor in that area. As to its function, who knows, but if you speculate on that without evidence, be prepared to be peppered with comments. Best wishes and I hope this thread gets some good responses.

[Tutankhaten-pasheri]

Interesting post, very interesting. I watched the video and was impressed at face value level. I am not competent to question all his research and wait to see what experts say about this, to me, unknown mystery. I would question the sharp endings to the "cable" conduits if that was actually the point where any cable did a downward turn, and I question the rather sharp curve in one of these conduits. This seems to indicate it was built curved to avoid existing structure, yet if these cable were to lower a sacophagus into some deep tomb chamber, I would have thought that the tomb would be the first part of construction and the builders be able to construct straight conduits on a virgin site. I think Temple raises some interesting questions, though I suspect that, sadly, there will never be any excavation to see the truth. Unless Egyptian state soon collapses, then I'm sure somebody will be fast on the scene with some dynamite......

And no, I was not tempted to buy the book of the video.........

Edited February 14, 2013 by Atentutankh-pasheri

[docyabut2]

Interesting, the buried shaft is similar to the mysterious shafts and small blocks in the great pyramid. Like who ever contructed the great pyramid also contructed the Sphinx and the temple.Maybe its where Khufu is buried. I consider the sphinx was built side ways in front of the great pyramid that belong to kuhfu pyramid, just like all the other pictures of sphinxs place sideways, not faced foward , in front of some monument.

Edited February 14, 2013 by docyabut2

[poppet]

Thanks for the welcome lakeview rud

I’m not here to win any battles or sell any books, I first came across this info nearly two years ago and to be honest thought it would be the next big thing, bigger than finding king tut ,obviously the Egyptian antiquities know about this new research because it was they who gave Robert unprecedented access to the Osiris shaft and the temple’s ,maybe in Egypt’s present climate they have decided that if there is something down there, then it’s better off staying down there at the moment.

As for Robert Temple being “fringie” it’s the message not the messenger that interests me ,if you take a look around the Egyptian dawn web site he has shared all his photos and also the only valley temple excavation report to everyone ………no need to buy his book.

And if you would like the dates that he and Ioannis Liritzis have suggested for some of the structures at Giza then he has posted them for free also.

Robert Temple Explains The Challenge Posed To Egyptology By A New Dating Technique

http://www.freemasonrytoday.com/features/item/240-getting-at-the-truth-about-ancient-egypt

I didn’t join um to promote anyone , I have no guru’s ……..it’s only the information that I’m interested in .

Peace.

[cladking]

I inadvertantly looked at the wrong slideshow first. It is just fascinating. He ends up

say "we have to find out what's underneath Giza". Truer words were never spoken.

He also says several very large stalagmites are in the valley temple. Imagine!!!!!!!!!!!

I have no time now... ...but later...

[lakeview rud]

Poppet, I agree on the message, not the messenger. One thing I liked about his book on the Sphinx were the many, many detailed photographs. I also disagree about when someone points out something someone has gotten wrong and uses that as an excuse to condemn everything that person says. Baseball players get paid very well for batting .300; I think valid points and theories should be investigated regardless of the source.

[Strong Flower]

Very Interesting. Ancient people did in fact have a sophisticated form of technology. I also found out that the Olmec heads were carved using a convex lens and the Sun.

[jaylemurph]

Very Interesting. Ancient people did in fact have a sophisticated form of technology. I also found out that the Olmec heads were carved using a convex lens and the Sun.

I wasn't aware that any Mesoamerican culture had glass -- indeed, as Stone Age people, I'd be curious to know how they managed to create glass, since in the Old World, they didn't have until the first or second century CE, and that's millennia after Stone Age technology.

--Jaylemurph

[Everdred]

Robert Temple Explains The Challenge Posed To Egyptology By A New Dating Technique

http://www.freemason...t-ancient-egypt

The OSL dating for the Pyramid of Menkaure is quite interesting, especially since its lower end overlaps with the carbon dating results, both of which disagree with traditional dating.

[pallidin]

Those pics are AMAZING.

On the 4'th pic(with the man) I can only imagine how the builders had no idea of a modern human sitting in their construction. Stunning to think about.

Also, I noticed the very small horizontal "channel" leading towards(or away from) the massive vertical block in the background.(3'rd pic)

Wonder what's behind that massive vertical block.

Edited February 16, 2013 by pallidin

[poppet]

Poppet, I agree on the message, not the messenger. One thing I liked about his book on the Sphinx were the many, many detailed photographs. I also disagree about when someone points out something someone has gotten wrong and uses that as an excuse to condemn everything that person says. Baseball players get paid very well for batting .300; I think valid points and theories should be investigated regardless of the source.

I think Robert Temple has taken flack from the “fringies” and the mainstream Egyptoligists, he spent nine months trying to obtain permission to use the new dating system on all the pyramids (permission is only granted when no fewer than six departments have agreed army/navy/airforce/secret service) only to have a meeting with Hawass in his Giza office who screwed his written permission up and throw it back in his face telling Robert that he was the chief authourity and above all the others.

Personally I enjoyed The Sphinx Mystery and he did a very good interview on Gardeners world which is well worth a watch.

http://blip.tv/gardi...orld-24-3894655

lots of images here

http://www.sphinxmys...hotographs.html

whether the Sphinx started life as the jackal god Anubis is a bit of a hot potato ,interesting theory and there are coffin texts/ spells and utterances that all mention a jackal lake but whether that is the location of the Sphinx or yet another undiscovered structure is a matter of opinion.

With the Sphinx being at least 4000 years old the function of the structure has most likely changed many times.

I recently spent some time in peru and Bolivia were I met with Dr Robert Schoch ,the very mention of Robert Temple sent Schoch into a savage rant and I was quite taken aback, when he had calmed down I tried to explain the cable conduit theory and Schoch knew absolutly nothing about it, I found this very puzzling as those two have been having a lituary ding dong for a while now and I would have thought Schoch would have been up to speed on anything new concerning the Sphinx and Sphinx temple.

Schoch gave me his e mail address a few days later and asked me to send him on this new information , but I am still waiting for a reply.

[Strong Flower]

@jaylemurph I wasn't aware that any Mesoamerican culture had glass -- indeed, as Stone Age people, I'd be curious to know how they managed to create glass, since in the Old World, they didn't have until the first or second century CE, and that's millennia after Stone Age technology.

mm I'd be curious to know as well

Edited February 16, 2013 by Spore

[cladking]

this image shows the block coming out of the north side wall of the temple.

this is one of three found on the Giza plateau and may have been used as a cable guide that fits into the recessed slot in the granite block, and was this how they lowered 40 to 60 ton objects safely down into their resting places.

These are called 'proto-pulleys" by orthodoxy and assumed to have the sort of function

you propose. I seriously doubt they were intended for such a purpose.

Let's hope the new regime in place is more interested in learning the truth.

[Harte]

Mekaure's pyramid has never been unequivocally dated because his reign has never been actually defined.

The date given by thermoluminescence agrees fairly well with the presumed date, though.

The problem Egyptology faces is that their dates are dependant on many other things not conclusively dated. The entire timeline they were going by was thrown off by more than a hundred years when a fairly conclusive date for the explosion of Thera was obtained a few years ago.

Harte

[jaylemurph]

@jaylemurph I wasn't aware that any Mesoamerican culture had glass -- indeed, as Stone Age people, I'd be curious to know how they managed to create glass, since in the Old World, they didn't have until the first or second century CE, and that's millennia after Stone Age technology.

mm I'd be curious to know as well

Oh, so this wasn't an example of actual evidence/legitimate theorization.

How boring. Might as well tell people they were carved with Dalek projected energy weapons...

--Jaylemurph

[questionmark]

Oh, so this wasn't an example of actual evidence/legitimate theorization.

How boring. Might as well tell people they were carved with Dalek projected energy weapons...

--Jaylemurph

Besides the little fact that the old world indeed had glass before the second century BC, in fact the ancient Egyptians had glass from a tradition handed down to them since the 5th millennium BC. But I don't think we let little details like that bother us.... especially if the rest of the statement is intellectual diarrhea

[lakeview rud]

The photo of the "proto pulley" in Cladking's post got me to thinking about a possible use. To me it would make an ideal 'braking' device especially if used with say a wooden cylinder. The wooden cylinder (log?) would also help with that sharp edge on the 100 ton granite piece that one of the others commented on.

Also, after viewing some of Temple's commentary, I'd like to ask Cladking (and any other readers of the Pyramid Texts) to verify if anywhere in them the phrase "Anubis by the causeway" is in fact mentioned as this would certainly bolster his argument that the Sphinx at one time resembled the jackal god of the dead. Thanks.

[cladking]

Also, after viewing some of Temple's commentary, I'd like to ask Cladking (and any other readers of the Pyramid Texts) to verify if anywhere in them the phrase "Anubis by the causeway" is in fact mentioned as this would certainly bolster his argument that the Sphinx at one time resembled the jackal god of the dead. Thanks.

Not even the causeway appears in the PT in the orthodox interpretation. In my interpretation

the causeway is most probably a small part of the "winding watercourse" but not an important

part to the rituals. It could, at least in theory, be the "knst-canal" but I believe this term applied

only to what Petrie called the NE trench.

In the PT Anubis appears only on the pyramid top but at low altitudes this was on the winding

watercourse.

It appears that the Sphinx was a representation of Tefnut (phenomenon of downward) but the

human face is not explicable by this theory. I believe there is a representation of Shu (phenom-

enon of upward) under the NE corner of G1 as the Mafdet Linx and this is the location of the so-

called "hall of records". I have no clue how Cayce might have been able to predict this but the PT

seem fairly clear on the issue. While I believe I understand the PT the language is such as to

be open to some small interpretation if you don't know the rules. One of the rules was likely not

to make direct statements per se but rather to "imply" what you want the reader to know. Direct

statements were anathema to the builders because they knew that everything was tentative. The

few things stated directly tended to be definitional or true by definition.

There is room for modification of my theory on this issue since Tefnut was normally depicted as a

human with a lion head rather than vice versa.

The so called god most closely associuated with the winding watercourse is "set" whom, I believe

was the name of the water which appeared atop the plateau.

I doubt this has been helpful but I can assure you that there is no major (or minor) interpretation

of the PT that will closely support your contention. "Anubis" as the Sphinx is probably a remarkably

good guess but largely unsupportable directly. I think "Wepwawet" might be an even better guess

but still unsupportable directly. Wepwawet is the "other jackal" whom I believe represented the means

of building at ground level where Anubis was the primary director of building on the pyramid top.

Something is under the NE corner as disclosed by the gravimetric scan.

[cladking]

The photo of the "proto pulley" in Cladking's post got me to thinking about a possible use. To me it would make an ideal 'braking' device especially if used with say a wooden cylinder. The wooden cylinder (log?) would also help with that sharp edge on the 100 ton granite piece that one of the others commented on.

Are you picturing the device being pulled into a rotating drum at right angles?

I do not endorse this site or their contentions but on page 3 there is a good drawing of the proto pulley;

http://archiv.ub.uni-heidelberg.de/propylaeumdok/volltexte/2011/1096/pdf/Mueller_Roemer_Englische_Fassung_Pyramidenbau_2011.pdf

I believe that these were used to fasten stones together in the quarry in such a manner that

they could be accelerated in unison for their flight to the pyramid. They are essentially merely

couplers.

[+DieChecker]

here is a image inside the Sphinx temple with what appears to be a hole in the bedrock.

I thought the actual Sphinx was sitting on solid rock, and the temple was built in what was once a quarry right in front of the Sphinx.

here we can see a 100 ton worked piece of granite brought 500 miles up from Aswan and sunk into the bedrock of the temple.

you can also see that the granite block was sunk into the bedrock before the temple was constructed, as the temple wall is built over the top.

I'll give you that the block does appear to be very unusual and probably should be followed up on.

Judging off the Sphinx pic and this follow up pic, the granite block runs in almost directly from the north?

this is one of three found on the Giza plateau and may have been used as a cable guide that fits into the recessed slot in the granite block, and was this how they lowered 40 to 60 ton objects safely down into their resting places.

I thought that Hawass and others had dated the Osiris sarcophogi to th 6th dynasty?

http://www.drhawass....iris-shaft-giza

The idea that the proto-pully could be used with a granite block with a slot in it to lower large objects into various pits does have some merit to it, IMHO. Nothing weird needs to be imagined for that to have occurred.

Edited February 17, 2013 by DieChecker

[cladking]

The idea that the proto-pully could be used with a granite block with a slot in it to lower large objects into various pits does have some merit to it, IMHO. Nothing weird needs to be imagined for that to have occurred.

Nothing weird, no.

But the fact is these are usually found out in the desert. This implies they were used out in the desert.

[+DieChecker]

Nothing weird, no.

But the fact is these are usually found out in the desert. This implies they were used out in the desert.

The pully thing is found in the desert? I'd not heard that. Let me look around.....

Edit: The first little bit of online stuff I found says that these proto-pullys have been found a various pyrmaid sites. It also suggests that these were not used to slide ropes over, but may have been used to hold ropes in place and provide leverage. Because everyone found so far is granite and has a rough surface which would have damaged any rope run over it very quickly.

http://books.google....o pully&f=false (2nd occurance of "proto-pully" on Page 103)

Edited February 18, 2013 by DieChecker

[lakeview rud]

Re the proto-pulley; I think we can agree that it was used somehow in conjuction with ropes as a means to either re-direct a pulling force or to perhaps slow down the movement of the ropes. Die Checker's statement that they had a rough surface may re-inforce the idea of their use as a 'brake'. There's no way of knowing for sure unless we can pick one up in a heiroglyphic scene now that we know what to look for. There seems to be enough room in the hole that Temple is standing in to have a wood cylinder in place perpendicular to the granite piece and then have this device mounted perpedicular to that log to provide some control. Of more immediate concern to me is getting someone to confirm his contention that he found stalactite (or stalagmite) stones in the Valley Temple area as the probability of that type of stone being brought to Giza is extremely low.