Naga of Mekong River in Nongkhai Thailand

[Rezaque-SG]

Anyone care to share new findings of Naga said to reside in Thailand's murky Mekong River. Legend has it till now every Buddhist Lent in October its being said to release or shoot countless/dozen fireball in the air. Till now scientist dispute saying that the fireball is the cause of built up methane under water.

The thing that puzzles me is what/who lit up the gas, and why does it always happen after ending Buddhist Lent???

[Frank Merton]

What is "Buddhist Lent?"

[Abramelin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vassa

[Frank Merton]

I was hoping you would tell me in tell me in your own words. Many, as you may know, resent associating Vassa with Lent.

[Abramelin]

If you mean me, I think Rezaque used a common term used for British publications:

Thai: พรรษา, phansaa), also called Rains Retreat, and sometimes called Buddhist Lent in English language publications. (This is anachronistic as the so-called Buddhist Lent was established by the Buddha around 500 years before the birth of Christianity.) Vassa is the three-month annual retreat observed by Theravada practitioners.

[Commander CMG]

It is believed that the Naga launches the fireballs as a way to pay respect to Buddha on the day of the full moon at the end of Buddhist Lent, at least that is my understanding. The Naga Fireballs are obviously released by man, I don’t think the Naga’s underwater kingdom sells fireballs. The Naga fireballs are just a show to Lord Buddha and possibly to Naga itself, in fact they make quite a festival of the event now.

What is the Naga? Do we believe there is a golden crested serpent, type creature in the Mekong River. This river is the home to some huge monster cat fish or perhaps a miss-identified snake, skimming the surface while it crosses the river. The river lends itself well to great stories of unexplained river monsters.

Welcome to UM R-SG

[Frank Merton]

Who knows what monsters lurk in the Mekong -- but, hey, the Buddha was a Ganges man.

[keninsc]

There's a lot of large fish and such in the Mekong. I don't know much about it, I was up north around Da Nang.

[psyche101]

It is believed that the Naga launches the fireballs as a way to pay respect to Buddha on the day of the full moon at the end of Buddhist Lent, at least that is my understanding. The Naga Fireballs are obviously released by man, I don’t think the Naga’s underwater kingdom sells fireballs. The Naga fireballs are just a show to Lord Buddha and possibly to Naga itself, in fact they make quite a festival of the event now.

What is the Naga? Do we believe there is a golden crested serpent, type creature in the Mekong River. This river is the home to some huge monster cat fish or perhaps a miss-identified snake, skimming the surface while it crosses the river. The river lends itself well to great stories of unexplained river monsters.

Welcome to UM R-SG

Hi Xsas

The general consensus is that they are some type of plasma phenomenon. These things have been reported for a very long time, and any number from tens to thousands can be seen in a night ranging from baseball to basketball size. It is believed this phenomena is simply not catalogued nor understood but more along the lines of natural phenomena.

Cheers.

[Simbi Laveau]

Who knows what monsters lurk in the Mekong, -- but, hey, the Buddha was a Ganges man.

the Naga have versions world wide.They are from the same lore as Garuda ,who is merely Vishnus mount in Hinduism ,but a major God to the Thais and Indonesians .Where there is Garuda ,there must be the Naga .

Buddha is,worshipped by all ,not just the Hindus.

There are versions of Garuda in Japan ,China ,and Vietnam .....ahem .I have a Vietnamese statue of Garuda .

. There is even a possible correlation between the Naga and the voodoo Loa the Simbi. Many similarities . But in voodoo,there is no definative correlation for Garuda .

Edited February 19, 2013 by Simbi Laveau

[Frank Merton]

There are versions of Garuda in Japan ,China ,and Vietnam .....ahem .I have a Vietnamese statue of Garuda .

All I can figure is someone bought one down in the tourist areas -- you can get practically any deity down there, 'cause I can assure you Garuda is not in any Vietnamese pantheon I ever heard of, and is not a Buddhist icon around here.

Not that it matters; if I wanted to set one up, there would be no hassle from anyone.

[Simbi Laveau]

All I can figure is someone bought one down in the tourist areas -- you can get practically any deity down there, 'cause I can assure you Garuda is not in any Vietnamese pantheon I ever heard of, and is not a Buddhist icon around here.

Not that it matters; if I wanted to set one up, there would be no hassle from anyone.

He probably isn't called Garuda .

His name in China and Japan ,are quite different .

I have a statue of Kali ma from Vietnam too ,and I'm sure she's not call Kali ,but she had eight arms ,each with a weapon .

She is probably considered a demon in Vietnam .

Carvings of garuda in Vietnam

.

http://www.learnnc.org/lp/editions/vietnam-cambodia/598

Ahh,cham sculpture,which is Vietnamese ...there seem to be quite a lot of cham sculptures of Garuda in the Danang museum .

If you google it ,many of garuda,all found in Vietnam ,all in Vietnam museums ,can be found .

http://www.superstock.com/preview.asp?image=4290-9070&imagex=5&id=18405218&productType=3&pageStart=0&pageEnd=100&pixperpage=100&hitCount=182&filterForCat=&filterForFotog=

Edited February 19, 2013 by Simbi Laveau

[Frank Merton]

Ah, now I know; you are looking at Cham artifacts -- a culture that occupied the southern parts of Vietnam about a thousand years ago and was basically Hindu.

[Simbi Laveau]

Ah, now I know; you are looking at Cham artifacts -- a culture that occupied the southern parts of Vietnam about a thousand years ago and was basically Hindu.

Umm hmmm.

Here he is in Cambodia too .

http://www.superstock.com/preview.asp?image=1566-712711&imagex=9&id=16377799&productType=3&pageStart=0&pageEnd=100&pixperpage=100&hitCount=182&filterForCat=&filterForFotog=

http://www.superstock.com/preview.asp?image=1848-455590&imagex=52&id=15502742&productType=3&pageStart=0&pageEnd=100&pixperpage=100&hitCount=182&filterForCat=&filterForFotog=

If it were the Hindu version,he would have Vishnu on his back .

There are even Naga statues in Cambodia .

http://www.photostocksource.com/enlarge-160302002-bayon-naga-serpent-statue-angkor-thom-siem-reap-cambodia.php

Edited February 19, 2013 by Simbi Laveau

[Mr.United_Nations]

Isn't there ment to be a giant Ray size of a man?

[Commander CMG]

Hi Xsas

The general consensus is that they are some type of plasma phenomenon. These things have been reported for a very long time, and any number from tens to thousands can be seen in a night ranging from baseball to basketball size. It is believed this phenomena is simply not catalogued nor understood but more along the lines of natural phenomena.

Cheers.

Hi Xsas

The general consensus is that they are some type of plasma phenomenon. These things have been reported for a very long time, and any number from tens to thousands can be seen in a night ranging from baseball to basketball size. It is believed this phenomena is simply not catalogued nor understood but more along the lines of natural phenomena.

Cheers.

Hi Psyche,

Good to see you again, thanks for that.

I had read about the natural phenomena believed to be behind the fireballs but wasn't sure if these are seen all year round or just on the day of the full moon at the end of Buddhist Lent.

Am I correct in assuming, the fireballs are seen throughout the year at all times?

[PlanB]

Nagas are pretty prevalent in Cambodian religious imagery. You often see seven-headed versions adorning wats (temples) and accompanying Buddha in depictions of him. Apparently, Cambodians believed that they were descended from the nagas, an ancient reptilian race. Super-surprised this hasn't been mentioned in an episode of Ancient Aliens yet.

[rashore]

Welcome to UM Rezaque-SG

Interesting thread, I have a woeful lack of reading on Eastern critters.

[Simbi Laveau]

Nagas are pretty prevalent in Cambodian religious imagery. You often see seven-headed versions adorning wats (temples) and accompanying Buddha in depictions of him. Apparently, Cambodians believed that they were descended from the nagas, an ancient reptilian race. Super-surprised this hasn't been mentioned in an episode of Ancient Aliens yet.

Are you familiar with the Naga Kanya PlanB ? She's awesome .

[PlanB]

Are you familiar with the Naga Kanya PlanB ? She's awesome .

Only through visual depictions. I think she's more prevalent in India and Hinduism, though I may be wrong, whereas my family practiced Theravada Buddhism.

[psyche101]

Hi Psyche,

Good to see you again, thanks for that.

I had read about the natural phenomena believed to be behind the fireballs but wasn't sure if these are seen all year round or just on the day of the full moon at the end of Buddhist Lent.

Am I correct in assuming, the fireballs are seen throughout the year at all times?

Gidday Mate

Pleasure to see you around again.

Yes, they are seen throughout the year, but are abundant around October, and vary from year to year, but most claims only go back to the 60's however, locals claim a far longer history. Some years there are heaps, some years hardly any, it is also not restricted to the Mekong, but the smaller surrounding lakes produce these as well. Hang on mate, I have a good link stashed here someplace, I had a look at them sometime ago when mcrom mentioned them in the ET section. Fascinating stuff.

Here it is - LINK

I like this part, it is quite relevant:

Scientists get involved

Contrary to most other ghostly apparitions around the world, Naga fireballs have been observed by thousands of people and captured on numerous photographs and movies.

Most local people believe in the mythical explanation involving nagas. In 2002 there arised a scandal when independent Thai TV channel iTV reported that they observed the following: each time when Laotian soldiers shot some tracer bullets in the air, Thai side of river was greeting this with cheerful shouts. TV reporters thus proved that sometimes "fake" naga balls are greeted.

This report met with stiff resistance of local people expressing even hate towards iTV.

Government of Thailand decided that scientists should be involved and explanation should be provided. A kind of "dreamteam" of Thai experts was established, at the same time rising heated debates about the intrusion of science in traditional myths.

In 2003 thermal scanners and five teams of scientists were stationed in several spots along the river in Rattanawapi district (Thailand). A team was located also at the most famous observation spot - at the Naga temple in Phon Phisai town. There were rumours about the involvement of specific submarine in research.

Some scientific reports mention an upward movement of gas bubbles in Mekong water. According to them - as the gas bubbles reached the surface, the gas started to burn and rised up like a glowing orange bubble.

Phosphine? Methane?

Earlier some scientists considered that the most likely reason for flames is phosphine (PH₃). This gas, especially in the presence of the diphosphine (P₂H₄), is capable of spontaneous flammability. Thus one can assume that bubbles of this substance may rise from the sediments of Mekong and, as it reaches the atmosphere, burn with yellow - orange flame. Small amount of this substance quickly is consumed in flames, and, as the burning bubble rises up in the air, it disappears.

Possible source of phosphine might be a chemical reaction in the river sediments - bacterial reduction of phosphate in decaying organic matter.

Often is mentioned another gas - methane, which, theoretically, if mixed with the same phosphine and some other gases at very specific conditions may experience spontaneous ignition.

...or hoax?

There remained unsolved issues though:

• Phosphine is not a light gas, it is heavier than air. Naga lights though rise up in the air very quickly.
  
• When phosphine burns, it produces dense, white and highly toxic cloud. None of these effects (luckily) have been observed on Mekong.
  

Cheers.