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Alternative universes: Do they exist?

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If the universe is infinite, then every possible combination of galaxies, clusters of galaxies, even Einsteinian spaces, will occur over and over, infinitely -- not in any pattern, but by chance here and there.

Any infinite set can be subdivided into an infinite number of infinite subsets. Therefore in the infinite number of worlds where duplicates of all of us exist, there will always be an infinite subset where the history continues exactly as it continues here, even though the vast, vast majority of the "us's" take off on new histories.

My main point however is that all of this may one day be deducible from what we know, but it isn't now, and even if we can demonstrate that the concept is real, we can never have any contact of any sort with these other "us's" -- rough calculations put even the nearest so far away as to be beyond human comprehension, and well outside our event horizon (the horizon where the space containing receding objects is going away from us fast than lightspeed).

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From what I understand of MWI, once the world splits by decoherence they are isolated. There are other "you"s but they are just as much the original as you are.

Not sure how much I believe of it.

This is another kind of infinity of the universe, the one where each quantum decision the universe must make is resolved by creating whatever number of new universes is needed to duplicate the probability of each possible outcome of the decision. This one doesn't actually reach infinity unless the core it is splitting from already is infinite, but very quickly becomes so big it might as well be infinite from our perspective. What you say about the decoherence is necessarily true.

About the matter of believability, I wouldn't worry about it. Most physicists don't. This is I guess why the Copenhagen interpretation is popular, even though it makes no sense (at least to me -- I would be delighted if someone could set me straight, but good luck, I've poured over this stuff a lot already). The thing is, science is not about belief.

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There is nothing in physics stopping it from existing, but it's formation has no vector. In this way not everything physically possible is circumstantually possible. Unless some highly advanced race or being decided to make one for some unknown purpose I guess. However by virtue of our own awareness we know we are possible. In deterministic infinities with random components we are sure to exist in all states or have and will exist again.

For something to exist it must have a way of coming into existence. As in your example, there probably is no way for a solid gold planet to evolve, so even in an infinite universe no such thing will be found.

We know life as we know it can come into existence, since we have an example at hand. However, that is the only form of life we can be sure of -- other forms of life may seem likely but are speculations.

God is another issue entirely. Super-beings on their Kryptons may exist, provided there are ways for them to evolve, but how does one evolve God? My reaction is that if you are going to have a universe with God in it, it is better to just start it out with God already in it.

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Most probably think this is a silly belief, but it's one that I hold.

I believe when we dream our "soul" or subconscious is in an alternate universe. A real tangible thing. I can elaborate further if someone would like me to, but I'll leave it at that for now.

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About the matter of believability, I wouldn't worry about it. Most physicists don't. This is I guess why the Copenhagen interpretation is popular, even though it makes no sense (at least to me -- I would be delighted if someone could set me straight, but good luck, I've poured over this stuff a lot already). The thing is, science is not about belief.

From what I've read the many-worlds interpretation is somewhat popular, supported by theoretical physicists like Michio Kaku and Stephen Hawking.

I think the most unpopular is "consciousness causes collapse", its a throw back to vitalism and contradictory with natural science/natural history.

Edited by Rlyeh

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From what I've read the many-worlds interpretation is somewhat popular, supported by theoretical physicists like Michio Kaku and Stephen Hawking.

I think the most unpopular is "consciousness causes collapse", its a throw back to vitalism and contradictory with natural science/natural history.

I still can't wrap my head around that. Just by observing something collapses the wave function.

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I still can't wrap my head around that. Just by observing something collapses the wave function.

I think because "observation" is kind of ambiguous. It's not as simple as just looking at a particle, there is a direct interaction.

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Dont forget frank merton that the other you would be saying that you are the copy not him.

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I suppose the math works out that way, but that other you and me are not you and me.

It's not you and me, but they will be exactly like us in everyway, and so will their world. They will live on a planet called Earth and David Cameron is the Prime Minister of Great Britain on that planet. And these people will mirror our actions. As I speak there is another me on that other Earth writing the exact same post on the exact same thread on the exact same website with all the members of that website exactly the same as all those and this one.

However that other me and that other Earth would be mind-bogglingly far away. They would be 10 x 10^188 metres far away. To put that into perspective, the known universe is only 1.475884 X 10^27 metres in length.

Edited by TheLastLazyGun
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I believe when we dream our "soul" or subconscious is in an alternate universe. A real tangible thing. I can elaborate further if someone would like me to, but I'll leave it at that for now.

My dream alternate universe is a very strange place.

I suppose the math works out that way, but that other you and me are no you and me.

If that other me's environment, history and self is exactly the same as mine, he would be me, wouldn't he? He'd be just in a different location in the multi-verse. What separates my feeling of me here from his feeling of me there except location?

I know I'm me here and he's me somewhere else, I think that would be the only difference. In an infinite multi-verset there are also many (an infinite number of) me's everywhere with every possible variation of environment and history.

There also would be many (infinite) variations of me genetically. These me's would be slightly or dramatically different from this me, variations of me who I would not recognize as me. I suppose these variations would not really be me at all, but would be more like relatives.

In spite of the excellent posts here of contrary view, I still don't think all this would be a physical infinity. Maybe I just don't like infinities, but as I have said before, for an infinite multi-vese to exist, it must already exist as that infinity, in time and space. This would mean everything has already happened. From our perspective, the past has already happened, of course, but the future has already happened as well.

The infinite future is a physical reality within this infinite physical multi-verse. If the future hasn't happened yet, this puts a limit on this infinity somehow in my view. In this sense, there exists an infinite past, but this infinity would stop at the present. Only if the future is included in this infinity could this infinity exist.

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Yes, for though there can be an infinite number of universes within the multiverse and and infinite number of possible futures, all universes must be at the same point in time. I think there would be a universal time that is constant for all and that to move between one universe and another will not move you through time, simply a different reality to what you have left. I think travel to the future will be impossible, there will be to many contradictions, though as for travel to the past, well, that is another affair.....

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Yes, for though there can be an infinite number of universes within the multiverse and and infinite number of possible futures, all universes must be at the same point in time. I think there would be a universal time that is constant for all and that to move between one universe and another will not move you through time, simply a different reality to what you have left. I think travel to the future will be impossible, there will be to many contradictions, though as for travel to the past, well, that is another affair.....

There could be infinite universes. If so then all of those infinite universes will, altogether, have infinite times.

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There could be infinite universes. If so then all of those infinite universes will, altogether, have infinite times.

Perhaps the word time is not sufficient because we see it in terms of minutes, hours, days etc. Perhaps entropy would be better term. Alternate universes may have been formed at different times in that one may have been formed before the other, but entropy would occur at the same rate for all. It is of course possible that events in one universe may have progressed faster, though not in terms of time, more of how people have progressed in technology etc. But this would not mean they are ahead of us in time as we see it, simply more advanced. Then there is the possibility of events turning out differently in an alternate universe that would make it seem theywere in the future. For instance, in this universe you move into new house on March first. On February 24 you visit alternate universe and you other self is already moving into new house, but he is not further advanced in time, simply events in his universe happend differently and the previous occupant was able to move out five days earlier. Complicated, but I hope I make some sense.....

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