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Ban to fail students who challenge science

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As American science students struggle to compete with the global competition, Oklahoma is moving forward with a law that could ban Biology teachers from failing students who argue that humans co-existed with dinosaurs. The state legislator’s committee in charge of education standards has approved a law that would forbid teachers from penalizing students who argue against widely accepted scientific theories, such as evolution and climate change.

http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/22/making-it-illegal-to-fail-science-students-who-argue-humans-co-existed-with-dinosaurs/

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The state legislator’s committee in charge of education standards has approved a law that would forbid teachers from penalizing students who argue against widely accepted scientific theories, such as evolution and climate change. ...

As far as the latter is concerned, it does sometimes seem as if there is a rigorous campaign to suppress people from expressing heretical opinions on the Climate change question, (you see it often enough here, how anyone who does express any question concerning the matter is dismissed as a loony creationist right-wing nutter), and in that respect at least, they might perhaps be able to argue that they're protecting freedom of speech, I suppose. Failing students who express doubt about climate change? That does sound rather totalitarian.

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Ok that bill is an actual good one for education, it so that kids can actually debate subjects instead of just automatically failing. They still have to get the correct answers on the tests and the work but now they can pretty much have discuss their beliefs without getting completely shafted.(Well besides looking like a complete idiot for going against the class and teacher but that only happens on some of the more religious theories).

Honestly would of been useful because I would of question things especially on the science front because in school they barely touched on anything and left the information kind of vague on certain subjects and god forbid you asked a teacher a question that makes sense but disagrees with what the book says.

Edited by Jinxdom
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Yes, I think it's good because it opens the doorway to challenging given views and actually delving into the knowledge. I bet it can be fun for some students to debate about theories, even the widely accepted ones. As long as they are taught to argument well and not ignore science , but to use it in their reasoning and where they perhaps find flaws. Could be interesting at the least.

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A student should be free to BELIEVE anything they want.... but, i think it's the teacher's job to teach what the scientific consensus is. The correct answer on the test must agree with that consensus?

consensus |kənˈsensəs|noun [ usu. in sing. ]general agreement: a consensus of opinion among judges | [ as modifier ] : a consensus view.ORIGIN mid 17th cent.: from Latin,‘agreement,’ from consens- ‘agreed,’ from the verb consentire .

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Every student should be free in there beliefs however when a test says 'When did the dinosaur's die out?' the answer should be 65 Million Years Ago. As that is the scientifically recognized time period of the mass extinction of most dino's.

If the question was 'When do you think the dino's died?' Then they can put down what ever they think.

But since this is science class the answer needs to be scientific, if they can't come up with a scientific theory or evidence to back up there claims then the answer is just a belief.

~Thanato

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As far as the latter is concerned, it does sometimes seem as if there is a rigorous campaign to suppress people from expressing heretical opinions on the Climate change question, (you see it often enough here, how anyone who does express any question concerning the matter is dismissed as a loony creationist right-wing nutter), and in that respect at least, they might perhaps be able to argue that they're protecting freedom of speech, I suppose. Failing students who express doubt about climate change? That does sound rather totalitarian.

Liberals are actually the new Nazis, not conservatives as teh liberal mmedia wouyld have you blelieve. Liberals rigorously and now often violently, suppress all opinions that go against their asinine belief system. Political correctness is nothing more than massive censorship of differering opinions. Think about it, you can lose your job if you say teh wrong word or words. Now that is censorship. Man made global warmiong is the biggest scam on earth at the moment.

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Liberals are actually the new Nazis, not conservatives as teh liberal mmedia wouyld have you blelieve. Liberals rigorously and now often violently, suppress all opinions that go against their asinine belief system.

God forbid that science classes should actually teach science, rather than everyone's opinion.

Political correctness is nothing more than massive censorship of differering opinions. Think about it, you can lose your job if you say teh wrong word or words.

Words such as "I voted for Obama".

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Well this is interesting. I don't see why a student would be failed for having their own opinions- if they are also doing the assigned schoolwork correctly. If they refuse to do their schoolwork correctly because they will not use scientific fact, then they should fail.

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A science "test" is not the place to express their opinions.

Since when did getting an answer wrong become "having a different opinion"?

Edited by Stellar
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A science "test" is not the place to express their opinions.

Since when did getting an answer wrong become "having a different opinion"?

I think about 15-20 years ago (give or take a few years) when it became more important for children to have high self-esteem then to learn.

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500 years ago, saying earth is not flat was wrong. now we know better.

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i would personally fail those students anyway. i respect their opinion, but...

they came to school to learn, and more so to prepare themselves to be out in real world. if you have not learned that sometimes you have to say\do things, in real world, that ppl expect you to do, not what you think should be done, you deserve an F. you have not learned how to act in real world.

if you go on a job interview and tell ppl there, they don't run their buissnes right, you will get a boot, that is a real world, if you want to change the way their buissnes works, do it when you are in a position to do so. and shut your mouth before you get there, that is a real world.

Edited by aztek

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500 years ago, saying earth is not flat was wrong. now we know better.

You do know that 500 years ago very few people thought the world was flat. I'm not sure when or why this myth began. Since people first went to sea (and probably before that) they knew the world couldn't be flat else they would not see the tops of the masts (or any tall object) before seeing the hull (base of object).

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it doesn't matter what ppl knew,

SAYING it was not flat was wrong, becouse church said it was flat, thus this is how it is, (kinda reminds me of something today).

just ask Giordano Bruno he knows.

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it doesn't matter what ppl knew,

SAYING it was not flat was wrong, becouse church said it was flat, thus this is how it is, (kinda reminds me of something today).

just ask Giordano Bruno he knows.

Did they ever have that as dogma? I think what people like him and Copernicus got in trouble for was questioning the earth-centric model of the Solar system.

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IIRC the Catholic sticking point wasn't the shape of the earth but it's position in the Divine Cosmos.

Church said "centre of the solar system" if you disagreed it was off to the Inquisition with you.

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Give them no marks for those specific questions and other work they turn in, and if they still pass then they pass.

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IIRC the Catholic sticking point wasn't the shape of the earth but it's position in the Divine Cosmos.

Church said "centre of the solar system" if you disagreed it was off to the Inquisition with you.

That's it. It was the heliocentrism vs. geocentrism.

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Why would this only be in science? Is it ok for students to argue in history that the holocaust or slavery never happened? How about in English and a student says that they don't believe in punctuation, can they be failed? It is fine for students to say that they don't agree with something, but they would need a real reason to do so, something better than 'because x said so'....if a student can do that then fine argue it, but it won't change the right answer on a test....I don't think that differing opinions should be failed just because they are different, but there also needs to be some sort of way to prevent students from creating chaos in the classroom with this law just because they can

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Man made global warming IS a debatable topic. Climate change is not. The climate is shifting. We can argue till the cows come home as to whether it is natural cycle, a solar/celestial cycle or created by burning of fossil fuels...doesn't matter. The Climate IS shifting. Sadly the debate roars on and nothing gets discussed on what will be done to deal with the long term ramifications...

Sorry, that is a rant I have had many times...who cares what is causing it? If you do not prepare for the likelihood that this will be a long term proposition...everyone loses.

As far as man walking with dinosaurs....

mq503d1c85.jpg

Show me the evidence...and I am not talking about ridiculous footprints in mud...(so stupid)...show me human bones in the same stone and earth strata layers as dinosaur bones...oh...i see...they have never found any...go figure...maybe there is a reason for that.

Expressing one beliefs is all fine and dandy but science AND developing technologies depend on facts...not a "belief".

Just my opinion of course.

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What about standardized tests like the SAT and the ACT? Not to mention college-level science at a non-christian school.

How are these students going to get a job at NASA or any place that cares about science, for real?

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it doesn't matter what ppl knew,

SAYING it was not flat was wrong, becouse church said it was flat, thus this is how it is, (kinda reminds me of something today).

just ask Giordano Bruno he knows.

Also most people knew that the world was flat. That's why crossing the Atlantic wasn't done until the very end of the 15th century (with the exception of a small viking colony in Newfoundland).

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Ok that bill is an actual good one for education, it so that kids can actually debate subjects instead of just automatically failing.

Yes, because trying to refute decades of archaeological research using tried and tested methods of dating fossils proving that humans didn't even exist during the age of the dinosaurs is actually a step forwards for science.

Really America? When something is inconclusively proven to be true, it cannot be debated. Pure and simple.

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What about standardized tests like the SAT and the ACT? Not to mention college-level science at a non-christian school.

How are these students going to get a job at NASA or any place that cares about science, for real?

They won't. They'll end up being televangelists who rob naive people for money or claim they can cure "the gay".

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