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ali smack

should drugs be legalized?

   36 members have voted

  1. 1. should drugs be legalized?

    • no.
      8
    • yes. only to help people get off drugs such as crack, heroin.
      1
    • yes. just legalize everything and allow people to take what they want.
      16
    • yes. only soft drugs such as cannabis
      5
    • yes. but have some sort of regulations put in place, legalize cannabis but don't legalize really hard drugs.
      6

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58 posts in this topic

drugs are a thorny issue and I see both sides of the story. Clearly what is going on now isn't working.

I'm not sure what the answer is.

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I think it comes down to personal preference ali.

those who take drugs will always argue for their legalisation, whilst people that don't take them want to see them kept illegal, except for the small amount of open-minded non-users who aren't worried about other people who want to take them.

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They should be legalized. We should have the right to decide what we will or won't consume. The State should have no say in our personal decisions as long as they don't directly interfere with the rights of others. I doubt that drugs will be legalized in most countries. Both criminals and law enforcement make a mint from the eternal war on drugs. Legalizing drugs will destroy herds of cash cows for both groups. In fact, I would be shocked if all American states scrapped their *marijuana* laws. More people will be put in cages for smoking plants in their own homes.

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If we legalise drugs and tax them, can I stop paying out so much freaking money from my wages and in every other kind of tax?? lol.

I can see some benefits, they would be more regulated. Hopefully people buying weed from chemist (or wherever they get it from??) would not be having someone try and push a harder drug on them and there wouldn't be risk of anything extra added that could be dangerous.

Legalising them wouldn't encourage me to buy them, I don't take drugs, I don't smoke and drink alcohol about 3 times a year. I'm guessing it would maybe encourage more people to try them as they would be easily available (I don't currently have any drug dealer contacts) but lots of teenagers would anyway.

Hmmm, not sure, I am undecided on this one.

Not only would consumers avoid dangerous substances but they would be able to buy exactly what they wanted based on marketing and customer reviews. The free market regulates itself by virtue of the free flow of information. Want a mellow smoke to help you sleep? Try this one. Want something to keep you alert and focused? Try this bud right here. Are you naturally nervous or hyper already? Best avoid this particular bud in this jar over here....and so on.

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Well I've voted yes to soft drugs such as cannabis.

If you can get past the smell it's actually a natural progression from cigarettes.

Tbh these facts about ecstasy are not exactly reassuring me despite the optimism.

What would let me sleep at night is if they legalise ecstasy with alcohol going the other way.

That's the only way this will work because booze dehydrates you seriously.

There's too many Leah Betts out there and I bet none of them had water or soft drinks.

So if this unlikely scenario did occur I still wouldn't touch ecstasy.

Heroin is a little bit sordid but tbh this methadone isn't working.

I've heard more stories of people not recovering than actually do.

I'm certain methadone isn't a placebo but it dosn't wean you off heroin as effectively as a nicotine patch does to a smoker.

It's just a stopgap measure for junkies who are going cold turkey.

I can't really comment on cocaine apart from the fact it eats your nose away.

However crystal meth should never be made legal in any shape or form.

It dosn't really matter if these junkies choose the manner of their passing away.

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Posted (edited)

I voted yes to legalize all drugs and let people decide, but I understand and fully support the admission that it will be up to more local authorities to decide, that is, authorities closer to their own communities and their own people, sub-federal authorities at the very least (i.e. Welsh, Scottish, or English law as opposed to the entire UK). Here in the US, we leave Texas and Oregon to decide whether their own citizens should be put to death. As well, we should leave it up to Texas and Oregon to decide what substances people are allowed to put in their own bodies. There are many valid concerns regarding this, of course. And many of the most profound concerns should be determined by what the substance in question happens to be. Case law is taken on a case-by-case basis, over matters far graver and more dangerous than this one (e.g. deliberate killing vs. accidental), so I see no good reason why this issue should be any different.

Cannabis is going to be the key that unlocks the cure to cancer, it's going to be the key to cure Alzheimers, it's going to heal the disorders of the brain. It's going to be the hero of the 21st century of medicine, throwing down the greatest plagues modern medicine has still not been able to cure. Let's put the old myths away and stop hobbling our progress over politics and corporate interests, let us embrace the science today.

http://www.jci.org/articles/view/25509

Edited by Yamato
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I voted yes, let people take what they want.

This way there can be rules and regulations in place to ensure that drugs are 'safe' (as safe as can be), taxed, and regulated.

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Ooh goody, I can use my favourite drugs graph again! :D

gl201003_p5f1.jpg

Clearly shows alcohol and tobacco are more harmful than ecstasy, cannabis, LSD. So it makes little sense for them to be so widely available and other drugs to have such harsh penalties. I'd vote decriminalisation over legalisation, as in Portugal, where the drug user is treated as a patient not a criminal, the aim being to get people off drugs, not lock them up.

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Posted (edited)

Ooh goody, I can use my favourite drugs graph again! :D

gl201003_p5f1.jpg

Clearly shows alcohol and tobacco are more harmful than ecstasy, cannabis, LSD. So it makes little sense for them to be so widely available and other drugs to have such harsh penalties. I'd vote decriminalisation over legalisation, as in Portugal, where the drug user is treated as a patient not a criminal, the aim being to get people off drugs, not lock them up.

Quoted for truthery.

If you look at Yamato's final paragraph he might have even found a possible cure for cancer.

And here's me thinking cannabis was a poor man's cigarette with a bit of a whiff.

While ecstasy without something less dangerous than alcohol is as harmless as a smartie.

Though LSD does have you experiencing some really wild trips and hallucinating.

I've got a funny feeling that you omitted crystal meth because you know in your heart of hearts it's even more dangerous.

Even the handling and preparation of the stuff is a hazard within itself.

It's little graphs like this that make me more determined to criminalise alcohol.

Despite all this possible out- patient care for junkies do you believe that methadone can wean you off heroin?

I still think though it's a pretty good idea legalising cannabis because they are not a load of hopeless cases.

My cousin has many bouts of clear thinking because of it.

Edited by Medium Brown

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Quoted for truthery.

If you look at Yamato's final paragraph he might have even found a possible cure for cancer.

And here's me thinking cannabis was a poor man's cigarette with a bit of a whiff.

While ecstasy without something less dangerous than alcohol is as harmless as a smartie.

Though LSD does have you experiencing some really wild trips and hallucinating.

I've got a funny feeling that you omitted crystal meth because you know in your heart of hearts it's even more dangerous.

Even the handling and preparation of the stuff is a hazard within itself.

It's little graphs like this that make me more determined to criminalise alcohol.

Despite all this possible out- patient care for junkies do you believe that methadone can wean you off heroin?

I still think though it's a pretty good idea legalising cannabis because they are not a load of hopeless cases.

My cousin has many bouts of clear thinking because of it.

As far as I'm aware, crystal meth IS methamphetamine, which IS on the graph. Fourth from the left.

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Posted (edited)

As far as I'm aware, crystal meth IS methamphetamine, which IS on the graph. Fourth from the left.

Got ya! But I can't believe it's floundering behind alcohol.

In my honest opinion I thought that would be the most evil substance.

With alcohol coming a close second followed by crack cocaine and heroin.

Still the tried and tested system of using a graph can confound even the deepest of suspicions.

It's just all those " before and after" photos showing crystal meth addicts old before their time.

However you can easily get a liver infection in your early twenties from alcohol poisoning.

Some of these guys are even younger than some of the " afters" photos from the meth addicts.

And they are just about alive and kicking.

Tbh I wouldn't touch both of them with a bargepole not even for recreational purposes.

But I'm quite partial to a drink at a social occasion still.

Edited by Medium Brown

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Posted (edited)

Got ya! But I can't believe it's floundering behind alcohol.

In my honest opinion I thought that would be the most evil substance.

With alcohol coming a close second followed by crack cocaine and heroin.

Still the tried and tested system of using a graph can confound even the deepest of suspicions.

It's just all those " before and after" photos showing crystal meth addicts old before their time.

However you can easily get a liver infection in your early twenties from alcohol poisoning.

Some of these guys are even younger than some of the " afters" photos from the meth addicts.

And they are just about alive and kicking.

Tbh I wouldn't touch both of them with a bargepole not even for recreational purposes.

But I'm quite partial to a drink at a social occasion still.

The study is here, if you're interested. Alcohol scores highly on both harm to the user and harm to others, whereas meth scores highly on harm to the user, but much lower on harm to others.

1-s2.0-S0140673610614626-gr3.jpg

Edited to add: I like graphs :w00t:

Edited by Queen in the North

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The study is here, if you're interested. Alcohol scores highly on both harm to the user and harm to others, whereas meth scores highly on harm to the user, but much lower on harm to others.

1-s2.0-S0140673610614626-gr3.jpg

Edited to add: I like graphs :w00t:

I'll bring in the proposal to criminalise alcohol to Jim Dobbin tomorrow.

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I'll bring in the proposal to criminalise alcohol to Jim Dobbin tomorrow.

B-but.. you cannae take away my alcohol! It's socially acceptable, not like them nasty life ruining drugs!

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B-but.. you cannae take away my alcohol! It's socially acceptable, not like them nasty life ruining drugs!

It's just crying out for a thread but I won't...

We've got enough redundancies without adding breweries and pubs to the pot.

So your little graph is going to be gathering cobwebs until this thorny issue rears it's ugly head again.

But that won't stop me agonising over binge drinkers and drunk drivers.

While some of them under the influence have this sudden urge to fight everybody.

But according to the Government cigarette smoking is the bigger problem.

I'm sorry but that dosn't strike me as a home wrecker...

Btw I'm stil going with my original gut feeling about Cannabis.

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Got ya! But I can't believe it's floundering behind alcohol.

In my honest opinion I thought that would be the most evil substance.

With alcohol coming a close second followed by crack cocaine and heroin.

Still the tried and tested system of using a graph can confound even the deepest of suspicions.

It's just all those " before and after" photos showing crystal meth addicts old before their time.

However you can easily get a liver infection in your early twenties from alcohol poisoning.

Some of these guys are even younger than some of the " afters" photos from the meth addicts.

And they are just about alive and kicking.

Tbh I wouldn't touch both of them with a bargepole not even for recreational purposes.

But I'm quite partial to a drink at a social occasion still.

The almighty graph does not lie! ;)

But seriously though I have known people who were doing a lot of crystal meth, and none of them look like the people you see in those pictures, a few of them did do some prison time, and all of them to my knowledge do not touch the stuff anymore. Many of the dangers and early aging that comes from meth, comes not from the chemical itself, but from other chemicals that are present as impurities in the stuff as a result of shoddy manufacturing processes. Methamphetamine is still a schedule II drug, ranked lower on the federal scale than cannibus, heroin, lsd, and others. It can and still is prescribed to certain people for treating various medical conditions. One of which is weight loss (as a diet drug) although I doubt any respectable doctor still prescribes it for this use.

And it still baffles me that we give out amphetamines to kids like candy for 'ADHD' which I believe is WAY over-diagnosed and wrongfully diagnosed much of the time. In highschool the second most easily available drug was amphetamine right behind alcohol, kids who were prescribed to it would just not take it and sell it at school. You want to know the real gateway drug? Just look in your medicine cabinet. Legal prescription drugs, had they been included on that graph, would be right behind alcohol.

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Posted (edited)

The almighty graph does not lie! ;)

But seriously though I have known people who were doing a lot of crystal meth, and none of them look like the people you see in those pictures, a few of them did do some prison time, and all of them to my knowledge do not touch the stuff anymore. Many of the dangers and early aging that comes from meth, comes not from the chemical itself, but from other chemicals that are present as impurities in the stuff as a result of shoddy manufacturing processes. Methamphetamine is still a schedule II drug, ranked lower on the federal scale than cannibus, heroin, lsd, and others. It can and still is prescribed to certain people for treating various medical conditions. One of which is weight loss (as a diet drug) although I doubt any respectable doctor still prescribes it for this use.

You want to know the real gateway drug? Just look in your medicine cabinet. Legal prescription drugs, had they been included on that graph, would be right behind alcohol.

So basically these " before and after" photos were just used for shock and awe?

To really hammer home the message that crystal meth is really,really bad.

But in reality they used the addicts that just took a really dodgy batch.

It's just like heroin if the manufacturers like to make their product on the cheap.

It still feels like Russian Roulette with both drugs if you want my honest opinion.

But I'm still encouraged by the fact that you can lose weight as a consquence.

Tbh all these crystal meth addicts do have thin,emancated bodies.

But yet again that and the cracks in their face could be again due to a dodgy batch.

I actually crossed swords with Riyeh over prescription drugs.

Now he's out of the picture I feel quite vindicated that I wasn't fighting a hopeless cause.

I just knew there was something not quite right about them despite them easing pain.

It's not too hard to overdose from an aspirin.

But they should have the instructions on how to take them on the outside rather than the inside.

It's makes we wonder what source that graph actually comes from.

Maybe some government think- tank or a pharmaceutical company.

It's still pretty accurate despite that glaring omission.

Edited by Medium Brown

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Putting someone in jail is taking away their liberty and therefore wrong. You do it then only to prevent some worse wrong -- to protect society. There are very few cases where use of drugs requires such action to protect society.

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Posted (edited)

If soft drugs where legalised then someone such as myself who doesn't associate with scumbags would have the chance to try cannabis instead of having to look for them on the floor. :yes:

Even though I only voted for the legalisation of soft drugs I would like to see LSD and other drugs with hallucinogenic properties freely available as well at chemists.

Edited by yearofthehater

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It's makes we wonder what source that graph actually comes from.

Maybe some government think- tank or a pharmaceutical company.

It's still pretty accurate despite that glaring omission.

I gave you the link to where it came from.

David J Nutt, Leslie A King, Lawrence D Phillips, on behalf of the Independent Scientific Committee on Drugs

The ISCD was formed to investigate drug harm free from political pressure to say DRUGS ARE BAD, YO.

And:

Funding Centre for Crime and Justice Studies UK

which is a charity. So, not the government or a pharmaceutical company :tu:

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Putting someone in jail is taking away their liberty and therefore wrong. You do it then only to prevent some worse wrong -- to protect society. There are very few cases where use of drugs requires such action to protect society.

I would say the best example of that is probably alcohol. Alcohol related violence, drunk driving, these are times when jail may be required.

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I gave you the link to where it came from.

The ISCD was formed to investigate drug harm free from political pressure to say DRUGS ARE BAD, YO.

And:

which is a charity. So, not the government or a pharmaceutical company :tu:

They might be a charity but their totally unaware of prescription drugs.

Still I don't think they are being ecominical with the truth.

But I'm glad they are still be able to promote their drug- free message without government interference.

I just feel they need to be pointed in the right direction but as I said it's not their fault.

But a pharmaceutical company or government think- tank would do it intentionally.

They don't have any guilty feelings about having people hooked on prescription drugs.

Tbh Coffey is more of an expert on this than me but you could always search for Scott Tipps.

He hasn't got an official website but there might be isolated articles.

Good luck!

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So basically these " before and after" photos were just used for shock and awe?

Yes, absolutely they were used for shock and awe. Don't get me wrong meth is very bad for you, but they found the worst possible before and after pictures that they could find.

To really hammer home the message that crystal meth is really,really bad.

But in reality they used the addicts that just took a really dodgy batch.

It's just like heroin if the manufacturers like to make their product on the cheap.

It still feels like Russian Roulette with both drugs if you want my honest opinion.

Well with meth, almost all batches are really dodgy. Just because of the nature of the manufacturing process and the fact that most people who make it do not know any chemistry, but they are just following a recipe . Batches wind up containing a lot of the chemicals used during the manufacturing process which nobody in their right mind would want to consume. Definitely is like playing Russian Roulette with both drugs!! But this is more a consequence of the fact that they are not legal. If they were legal and regulated then the purity would be consistent and known. Many of the Russian roulette type dangers with illegal drugs is not because of the pure drug itself, but because of the shoddy manufacturing processes and residual chemicals left over.

But I'm still encouraged by the fact that you can lose weight as a consquence.

Tbh all these crystal meth addicts do have thin,emancated bodies.

But yet again that and the cracks in their face could be again due to a dodgy batch.

I have heard people jokingly call it "the Jenny crank diet", but the truth is not all people on meth lose weight. Some people even gain weight! It all depends on the individual and their reaction to the drug. It varies from person to person.

I actually crossed swords with Riyeh over prescription drugs.

Now he's out of the picture I feel quite vindicated that I wasn't fighting a hopeless cause.

I just knew there was something not quite right about them despite them easing pain.

It's not too hard to overdose from an aspirin.

But they should have the instructions on how to take them on the outside rather than the inside.

It's makes we wonder what source that graph actually comes from.

Maybe some government think- tank or a pharmaceutical company.

It's still pretty accurate despite that glaring omission.

deaths1.gif

Here is another graph! Showing number of deaths per year from various drugs, prescription drugs included. As you can see death from prescription drug use far outweighs the deaths from all illegal drugs combined.

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I doubt that it exists, but I'd like to see some sort of age-adjusted or "years of life lost" comparison of that sort.

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I doubt that it exists, but I'd like to see some sort of age-adjusted or "years of life lost" comparison of that sort.

So would I. I'm sure alcohol and tobacco would come out on top again though.

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