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soulpowertothenthdegree

Man invented religion

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Amen!

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A lot of things are.

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I agree with you man invented religion,however the breakdown of society is probably more out of a lack of religion( in the form of a moral code).If you know the difference between right and wrong, chances are those attitudes were instilled in you via a religious discipline at a young age.Also, as far as I know mankind is the only materialistic species to have ever existed.

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I agree with you man invented religion,however the breakdown of society is probably more out of a lack of religion( in the form of a moral code).If you know the difference between right and wrong, chances are those attitudes were instilled in you via a religious discipline at a young age.Also, as far as I know mankind is the only materialistic species to have ever existed.

I don't know about that. You don't need religion to have a moral code. The Greeks called it ethics. I really don't think religion can really provide a fair and equitable system for all peoples. Religion has be used to promote a lot of societies evils like slavery, persecution, war, etc.... I think most people are better off under a secular system where religion is irrelevant and you do what is just. If your religion says you can't eat meat, fine, but your neighbor should be free to eat according their traditions. Same with who you spend your life with, as long as you're dealing with consenting adults. Yet thousands die every year for just that under religous laws. I think religion is the worst way to implement a moral system.

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But you believe your energy gets re-located, and you only take your knowledge of experiences to learn from and utilize in your next existence? Sounds like religion to me, LOL.

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I don't know about that. You don't need religion to have a moral code. The Greeks called it ethics. I really don't think religion can really provide a fair and equitable system for all peoples. Religion has be used to promote a lot of societies evils like slavery, persecution, war, etc.... I think most people are better off under a secular system where religion is irrelevant and you do what is just. If your religion says you can't eat meat, fine, but your neighbor should be free to eat according their traditions. Same with who you spend your life with, as long as you're dealing with consenting adults. Yet thousands die every year for just that under religous laws. I think religion is the worst way to implement a moral system.

I agree you don't need religion to provide a moral code,however you have to admit that most religions do provide moral guidance and you can't blame the evils of the world solely on religious thought.
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I agree you don't need religion to provide a moral code,however you have to admit that most religions do provide moral guidance and you can't blame the evils of the world solely on religious thought.

This is my sole complaint for those who skewer religion (s). Because they have been guilty of some crimes they are implicated in all routinely. If a person does not want to have a relationship with the Creator then that is their choice - no problem. But to be so agitated that others DO choose to have such relationship seems unnecessary to me.
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This is my sole complaint for those who skewer religion (s). Because they have been guilty of some crimes they are implicated in all routinely. If a person does not want to have a relationship with the Creator then that is their choice - no problem. But to be so agitated that others DO choose to have such relationship seems unnecessary to me.

may be the point is , seek your god in your own way , but we shall be watchful .

christ was killed by the church leaders of jewersalem... the metaphor is that if any (all) church leaders got their hands on god... they would kill him as swiftly as posable , and make up the crime in the process , and pay for the evidance that convicts god of the crime .

point in fact , go into any or all churchs... with out exception ... and talk about god ... you will not be welcome .

to be more careful with my claim ... do not talk about the religon of the church , but define the word "god" and show reason and data of gods reality ... any you will likly be asked to leave and removed by force .

talking about god in the church is not simply forbidden , it will get you attacked verbaly and physicaly .

church and religon have no intrest of connection to god , or more carefully ... religon makes up a god , and gets upset if the real guy shows up .

i point to christ as my exsample .

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please note that religon is a good and nessasary thing in a persons life . god is order and seeking god is the single greatest selfish act any person can do . churches serve a good and useful function ... but frankly speaking , worship of god is not much more than word craft and civil functions masked in meetings of good people for civil bonding...

you can not worship a thing that is forbidden to speak of .

...or...

a young man who can not speak to a girl because he likes her so much is not worshipping her.

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Posted (edited)

there is a time before the big bang called void . there is a place after the last black hole called void .

if you ever make the journie there , know that you look into it to lose its hold upon you .that you see into it, you are seeing into it... there is you... and there is the void ... in the void there is only the void , there can not be two .... and you will be free of it .

let me tell you a story .

reality as you know it is the dimension of the soul, it is the interface of location and delta/ change .

but you are more than a change of motions equation , the force still equals mass by volume on change of location in time , but you are more than record keeping and formula's.

you are alone in a space that is not black or bright , color is a fantacy you have heard of but do not remember . size is a concept that you understand in the academic but has nothing to do with void .

cosmic or atomic , they are than same thing in the void .

eon's or nanoseconds , they feel the same in the void , for nothing changes .

nothing changes on the scale of the cosmic .... nothing changes at the atomic .

for as far as the mind can reach on a cosmic scale , there is not a single point that is unique or diffrent , even when looking to that which is magnitudes smaller than an atom .

nothing is , and nothing changes in void .

it is not black or white , it is not hot or cold , it has no color or smell .

void is infinite .

void is where there are only the infinites .

void is something that you understand in an academic sense , when you do a math problem and feel the open space of the paper .

void is feeling in your mind in the gray noise and back ground static when your a hamradio operator. void is the hunger you feel when your audance claps , and roars . void is the horizon when your on your forth day of transpac , thousands of miles from land .

void is the next step beyond the runners high , that place where you become the action , rytems and pain is replaced with bliss .

we all have our path to void , no person living has not an understand of what void is .

there is no greater or lesser understanding of void , each point of veiw is personal and unique .

void is the darkness insight is painted upon .

void is the blank sheet of paper a writer looks at befor the first word is pen'd

void is what was before the first child comes , and your wife looks at you with concern .

void is the scream in the dark when you stand at the grave of a good man and husband of 30 years who has left you , void is the feeling after

'what am i going to do now?'.

god is one of the meny infinites .

god is the void as much as he is in the void .

all the infinite's are as much the void as they are in the void .

void is the absence of all things finite .

awareness is the answer to god being in the void .

until you have been there , do not second guess god.

as a post script ; to all my christian friends . give me hell as a vacation spot to the void . a lake of fire is a resort compared to void ....

that all assumes ... assuming god is not there in void , and that you become the awareness nature of the infinites .

...kinda standing in for god...

the funny thing about void... it does not alow two of anything.

you can not have two of anything in void ... kind of like haveing two eternitys.

or two infinite spaces...

having two magnetic feilds that do not sense each other... but do the same thing togather .

two of the same thing does not happen in void .

so either god is there ... or you are. and its not a good day for you if you visit void .

Edited by onereaderone

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you can not say this... talk about void state in a muslim or christian church... and it does not go over well in a bar on foot ball night either .

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there is a time before the big bang called void . there is a place after the last black hole called void .

if you ever make the journie there , know that you look into it to lose its hold upon you .that you see into it, you are seeing into it... there is you... and there is the void ... in the void there is only the void , there can not be two .... and you will be free of it .

let me tell you a story .

reality as you know it is the dimension of the soul, it is the interface of location and delta/ change .

but you are more than a change of motions equation , the force still equals mass by volume on change of location in time , but you are more than record keeping and formula's.

you are alone in a space that is not black or bright , color is a fantacy you have heard of but do not remember . size is a concept that you understand in the academic but has nothing to do with void .

cosmic or atomic , they are than same thing in the void .

eon's or nanoseconds , they feel the same in the void , for nothing changes .

nothing changes on the scale of the cosmic .... nothing changes at the atomic .

for as far as the mind can reach on a cosmic scale , there is not a single point that is unique or diffrent , even when looking to that which is magnitudes smaller than an atom .

nothing is , and nothing changes in void .

it is not black or white , it is not hot or cold , it has no color or smell .

void is infinite .

void is where there are only the infinites .

void is something that you understand in an academic sense , when you do a math problem and feel the open space of the paper .

void is feeling in your mind in the gray noise and back ground static when your a hamradio operator. void is the hunger you feel when your audance claps , and roars . void is the horizon when your on your forth day of transpac , thousands of miles from land .

void is the next step beyond the runners high , that place where you become the action , rytems and pain is replaced with bliss .

we all have our path to void , no person living has not an understand of what void is .

there is no greater or lesser understanding of void , each point of veiw is personal and unique .

void is the darkness insight is painted upon .

void is the blank sheet of paper a writer looks at befor the first word is pen'd

void is what was before the first child comes , and your wife looks at you with concern .

void is the scream in the dark when you stand at the grave of a good man and husband of 30 years who has left you , void is the feeling after

'what am i going to do now?'.

god is one of the meny infinites .

god is the void as much as he is in the void .

all the infinite's are as much the void as they are in the void .

void is the absence of all things finite .

awareness is the answer to god being in the void .

until you have been there , do not second guess god.

as a post script ; to all my christian friends . give me hell as a vacation spot to the void . a lake of fire is a resort compared to void ....

that all assumes ... assuming god is not there in void , and that you become the awareness nature of the infinites .

...kinda standing in for god...

the funny thing about void... it does not alow two of anything.

you can not have two of anything in void ... kind of like haveing two eternitys.

or two infinite spaces...

having two magnetic feilds that do not sense each other... but do the same thing togather .

two of the same thing does not happen in void .

so either god is there ... or you are. and its not a good day for you if you visit void .

After reading all of this i sit and think if ignorance is bliss,then i prefer to stay ignorant to this topic :lol: I followed what you were saying up to a point then you lost me.You kind of went in a circle of void is nothing or it is everything then back again.Though that may have been your point,im not sure :lol:

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I agree you don't need religion to provide a moral code,however you have to admit that most religions do provide moral guidance and you can't blame the evils of the world solely on religious thought.

Sure most religions provide a moral code, some are good, but it can be rather spotty. Is it moral to put someone to death for being gay or someone accused of witchcraft? (Still going on in many parts of the world.) I think the Greeks and philosophers of the Age of Reason were on the right track of using reason rather than religion as a base for morality. I am part of a religion, I'm a Pagan. My moral base is not the same as Abrahamic religions. It is more related to ethics and reason than it is to rules given by a god (humans) 3000 years ago. My Father was an atheist and didn't use religion to teach me right from wrong. He used reason. Because he taught me to reason there are many things ideas my Father ascribed too that I don't. That is how I taught my kids. I think it works better than brainwashing the sky god is going to send you to hell it you don't behave.

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Posted (edited)

I agree where did the laws of moral behavior that we are judged on , do not kill ,steal, cheat, or lie come from, if not from religion.

Edited by docyabut2

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It's kinda interesting that criminals tend to be very religious, in a dumb, superstitious sort of way, while atheists tend to be moral and honest and kind people in an intelligent sort of way.

I think some people need religion to do what is right, and as a result they assume that is the everyone is. The fact, however, is that there are others who do what is right simply because it is right, and don't need the religious threat.

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Sure most religions provide a moral code, some are good, but it can be rather spotty. Is it moral to put someone to death for being gay or someone accused of witchcraft? (Still going on in many parts of the world.) I think the Greeks and philosophers of the Age of Reason were on the right track of using reason rather than religion as a base for morality. I am part of a religion, I'm a Pagan. My moral base is not the same as Abrahamic religions. It is more related to ethics and reason than it is to rules given by a god (humans) 3000 years ago. My Father was an atheist and didn't use religion to teach me right from wrong. He used reason. Because he taught me to reason there are many things ideas my Father ascribed too that I don't. That is how I taught my kids. I think it works better than brainwashing the sky god is going to send you to hell it you don't behave.

I agree these things happen in the name of religion,what I'm saying is that they are not exclusive to religious thought. Plenty of crimes against humanity have occurred in the name of reason.Hitler's reason for genocide was he needed someone to blame for Germany's troubles after WW1,that and he wanted to create a perfect Aryan race.Would things have went completely different had Hitler grown up religious? Maybe, maybe not.

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Hitler does not strike me as having been a religious man; superstitious to be sure, but not pious in any sense. More the opposite.

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Hitler does not strike me as having been a religious man; superstitious to be sure, but not pious in any sense. More the opposite.

That's my point,Hitler was not a religious man.Would things have went differently had he had a religious upbringing. And while we're at it how about Lenin and Stalin and Mao and Pol Pot.

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I'm not sure what your point is; it can be argued that Communism as it was back then was a sort of religion -- in fact a Christian cult. It has the apocalyptic and historic world view of Christian Europe, the social utopianism and egalitarianism, and the sense of the inherent evil or sinfulness of humanity -- all subconsciously derived from Christian thinking that Marx grew up in.

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Posted (edited)

I agree where did the laws of moral behavior that we are judged on , do not kill ,steal, cheat, or lie come from, if not from religion.

I agree with this, religion has given us the basis that our civilisation is built on, as we move forward if these morals are passed on through education we no longer need religion. There is also a line of thinking that suggests we never even needed religion for this though. Communities where members respected each other flourished and through natural selection a system of respect and morals grew regardless of religion.

It's kinda interesting that criminals tend to be very religious, in a dumb, superstitious sort of way, while atheists tend to be moral and honest and kind people in an intelligent sort of way.

I think this is a media fallacy rather than the truth, even though you may have experienced it yourself it reminds me of one of those 'my grandma smoked 40 a day and lived to be 100' stories, true to your own experiences but not true in general.

That's my point,Hitler was not a religious man.Would things have went differently had he had a religious upbringing. And while we're at it how about Lenin and Stalin and Mao and Pol Pot.

If Hitler was a religious man (I guess you mean he had a mindset based more on morals) he never would have reached the position of power that he held.

Edited by Junior Chubb

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i think if you tell a idea to 1000 people at least 800 will misunderstand you.

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Unfortunately, it does not go without saying that in our examination we must avoid the fallacy that in the last decades has frequently been used as a substitute for the
reductio ad absurdum
: the
reductio ad Hitlerum
.
A view is not refuted by the fact that it happens to have been shared by Hitler.

I actually read "Mein Kampf" I don't know if he was but there was a lot of references that were pro Christianity in it. He was a politician and sadly like so many American politicians he knew how to pay the religion card. I am amazed how many people get sucked into voting some crook into office because of his or her supposed religion. He was raised in a Catholic house hold, does that mean anyone who is raised in a Catholic house will turn into a Hitler. Is that not the same fallacy as saying he was an atheist therefore all atheist are Nazis or Communist. Guilt by association doesn't fly well in a good debate.

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I'm not sure what your point is; it can be argued that Communism as it was back then was a sort of religion -- in fact a Christian cult. It has the apocalyptic and historic world view of Christian Europe, the social utopianism and egalitarianism, and the sense of the inherent evil or sinfulness of humanity -- all subconsciously derived from Christian thinking that Marx grew up in.

Communism was not and is not a Christian cult,you're reaching.If Marx was Christian it did not translate into his philosophy.The point is this,you cannot blame the ills of society on the belief in a diety. You can trace most of societies problems to these sources: Money...Power....Greed.
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It's kinda interesting that criminals tend to be very religious, in a dumb, superstitious sort of way, while atheists tend to be moral and honest and kind people in an intelligent sort of way.

I think some people need religion to do what is right, and as a result they assume that is the everyone is. The fact, however, is that there are others who do what is right simply because it is right, and don't need the religious threat.

That is a huge generalisation you are making there.

Here is a list of 10 people who have given Atheists a bad name too ...

http://listverse.com/2010/06/05/10-people-who-give-atheism-a-bad-name/

Alfred Kinsey - Biologist and Pedophile

Napoleon Bonaparte

Thwan Shwe - Military Dictator, Burma

Kim Jong Il

Jeffrey Dahmer (claims to have discovered religion in prison by some accounts but not before)

Jim Jones (I disagree with this one actually) but the quote says that:

He said that he “took the church and used the church to bring people to atheism”. In 1978, 909 people at the restricted communist “sanctuary” he presided over in Jonestown, Guyana, committed “revolutionary suicide” at his command.

Benito Mussolini

"he tried to associate Fascism with Catholicism in order to garner dwindling support (however his widow made it clear that he was still staunchly atheist)."

Mao Zedong - Leader Communist Party China

"He also targeted anyone with links to the Chinese Nationalist Party as well as anyone who posed a threat to him. Five million were executed in death camps. 36 million were persecuted and tortured. There were even instances of cannibalism."

Pol Pot

Joseph Stalin

Oh and there is this guy: Israel Keyes, Serial Killer who committed suicide and an atheist.

http://www.examiner.com/article/atheism-becoming-media-whipping-boy-after-serial-killer-offs-himself

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