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redsquare

End of the world !

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So over the last few months (or maybe even few years ) I have been noticing strange weather patterns. Like on a winters day it could be really warm or a summer day really cold and I don't ever remember this happening when I was younger. Also my friend was telling me about natural disasters over the last decade and he told me they are getting worse (as in there are more and more happening). And to top it all of I have been reading about lots of different animals dropping dead all over the world without any explanation or cause. Is it just me or is something a bit off here ? Anyone care to explain al this weird stuff that's been happening over the last decade ?

I didn't know what forum this topic should be in so I picked natural disasters.

Much appreciated to anyone who can help.

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dont worry people have always been weirded out by the weather, i read a book from 1886 where people say exactly the same things we say. weird amount of rain, seasons late or early, its pretty funny how our ancestors complain about the weather the same as us. and theres also always been people who think the worlds gunna end. every generation thinks their more informed than the last.

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heres a bit fro the book

It certainly is most wretched weather. At all events it is so now at the

time I am writing, and if it isn't particularly unpleasant when I come

to be read it soon will be.

It always is wretched weather according to us. The weather is like the

government--always in the wrong. In summer-time we say it is stifling;

in winter that it is killing; in spring and autumn we find fault with it

for being neither one thing nor the other and wish it would make up its

mind. If it is fine we say the country is being ruined for want of rain;

if it does rain we pray for fine weather. If December passes without

snow, we indignantly demand to know what has become of our good

old-fashioned winters, and talk as if we had been cheated out of

something we had bought and paid for; and when it does snow, our

language is a disgrace to a Christian nation. We shall never be content

until each man makes his own weather and keeps it to himself.

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heres a bit fro the book

It certainly is most wretched weather. At all events it is so now at the

time I am writing, and if it isn't particularly unpleasant when I come

to be read it soon will be.

1886 produced some of the worst weather in American history. In 1883 Krakatoa blew its stack and plunged the planet into several years of volcanic cold. 1886 was part of that. Temperatures of 42 below were reported from Wichita. 40 below was reported from Hopkinsville, Kentucky. Stillwater, Oklahoma, then just three years old got some 40 below weather. At that time settlers were just switching from soddies to the new clapboard houses. Insulation wasn't as good in the new houses. Whole familes froze to death in the new houses, while those in the old-fashioned soddies survived. 7000 cattle froze to death in the Cherokee strip. Across the northern plains, cattle died by the tens of thousands. Charles Russell painted "The Last of 5000." People who owned major ranches were reduced to collecting cattle bones to sell for fertilizer; many just packed up and headed east. It was the death of open range. The ranching industry realized it couldn't survive if it didn't take better care of the land and petitioned Congress to change the open range laws.

If that wasn't enough, the summer of 1886 produced a severe drought and was followed by another severe winter and another drought in 1887. This part of the world never recovered.

But, relax. I wouldn't expect the world to end just yet. What we're seeing may be the first serious effects of climate change, but I'd wait a few more years before pronouncing sentence.

Doug

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Posted (edited)

1886 produced some of the worst weather in American history. In 1883 Krakatoa blew its stack and plunged the planet into several years of volcanic cold. 1886 was part of that. Temperatures of 42 below were reported from Wichita. 40 below was reported from Hopkinsville, Kentucky. Stillwater, Oklahoma, then just three years old got some 40 below weather. At that time settlers were just switching from soddies to the new clapboard houses. Insulation wasn't as good in the new houses. Whole familes froze to death in the new houses, while those in the old-fashioned soddies survived. 7000 cattle froze to death in the Cherokee strip. Across the northern plains, cattle died by the tens of thousands. Charles Russell painted "The Last of 5000." People who owned major ranches were reduced to collecting cattle bones to sell for fertilizer; many just packed up and headed east. It was the death of open range. The ranching industry realized it couldn't survive if it didn't take better care of the land and petitioned Congress to change the open range laws.

If that wasn't enough, the summer of 1886 produced a severe drought and was followed by another severe winter and another drought in 1887. This part of the world never recovered.

But, relax. I wouldn't expect the world to end just yet. What we're seeing may be the first serious effects of climate change, but I'd wait a few more years before pronouncing sentence.

Doug

The world will not end, but we are in serious **SNIP** if both Krakatoa and Laki erupt within the same year:

The system erupted over an eight-month period between 1783 and 1784 from the Laki fissure and the adjoining Grímsvötn volcano, pouring out an estimated 14 km3 (3.4 cu mi) of basalt lava and clouds of poisonous hydrofluoric acid and sulfur dioxide compounds that killed over 50% of Iceland's livestock population, leading to a famine that killed approximately 25% of the island's human population.

The Laki eruption and its aftermath caused a drop in global temperatures, as sulfur dioxide was spewed into the Northern Hemisphere. This caused crop failures in Europe and may have caused droughts in India. The eruption has been estimated to have killed over six million people globally, making the eruption the deadliest in historical times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laki

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8624791.stm

.

Edited by Waspie_Dwarf
From the rules: 3c. Profanity: Do not use profanity, crude language or attempt to deliberately bypass the profanity filters.

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The system erupted over an eight-month period between 1783 and 1784 from the Laki fissure and the adjoining Grímsvötn volcano, pouring out an estimated 14 km3 (3.4 cu mi) of basalt lava and clouds of poisonous hydrofluoric acid and sulfur dioxide compounds that killed over 50% of Iceland's livestock population, leading to a famine that killed approximately 25% of the island's human population.

The Laki eruption and its aftermath caused a drop in global temperatures, as sulfur dioxide was spewed into the Northern Hemisphere. This caused crop failures in Europe and may have caused droughts in India. The eruption has been estimated to have killed over six million people globally, making the eruption the deadliest in historical times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laki

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8624791.stm

1783. Some of my chronologies reach that far back. I'll have to take a look.

Hot Springs Chronology (Available online from NCDC): severe winter storm in 1784. 100% of trees show growth reduction. First year of recovery, growth is 1.573 standard deviations below the seven-year mean. Second year, it's 0.506 standard deviations low. Did not fully recover until 1787. I guess so!

There was another major storm in 1788. Got any volcanos to go with that one?

Lake Winona Chronology (Also available from NCDC): Mild winter storm in 1784. Not very impressive Much bigger one in 1788.

McCurtain County Wilderness (Also available at NCDC): Small storms in 1784 and 1786. The big storm is still 1788.

There are four other published chronologies (Blue Mountain, Drury House, Gee Creek, Mount Magazine and Roaring Branch; all available from NCDC) an unpublished one (Crystal Mountain) and one that still hasn't been read yet (Lake Winona 2), any of which might show storms resulting from that eruption. In addition, almost any chronology world-wide that gets back that far should show it with the possible exception of tropical ones.

Krakatoa's eruption in 1883 produced that nasty set of storms that hit the Midwest in 1886 (Actually, the effects continued in 1888.). That's five years after the eruption. So the 1788 storm could well be a delayed effect of Laki. Anyway, tree rings confirm a climate disturbance, apparently an after-effect of the Laki eruption.

I just finished the first round of re-writes following initial peer review yesterday. This is the first release of information resulting from it. I'm still shooting for journal submission by fall. The name of the article is: "Tree Ring Reconstruction of Winter Storms in the Ouachita Mountains of Oklahoma and Arkansas." I'll post the link here as soon as I have one to post.

Doug

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Yes, it is 'the end', read the Bible. There are a lot of reasons to believe it too. If you really wanna know what's going on, email me privately cos a lot of people don't like to hear the truth! K

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Just watch out if Yellowstone blows its stack

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Bizarre weather and natural disasters do seem to be getting more frequent, but are they really? Or is it just that we have the technological means to track these things more accurately and hear about things happening in other countries that we may not have previously heard about?

I don't know really to be truthful. I do actually believe that the end of our world (well more our existance, I think the Earth will still be here) will come through natural disasters. But hopefully not anywhere in the too close future!

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The globe is warming up: this should have an effect, but so far it seems difficult to pick it out of the statistical noise. From time to time here and there records are bound to be broken, and it means nothing.

Yellowstone or some similar super-volcano is not going to do its things without lots of stuff leading up to it, so we will be warned. Nothing happening now on that front.

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The globe is warming up: this should have an effect, but so far it seems difficult to pick it out of the statistical noise. From time to time here and there records are bound to be broken, and it means nothing.

Yellowstone or some similar super-volcano is not going to do its things without lots of stuff leading up to it, so we will be warned. Nothing happening now on that front.

I wouldn't be so sure.... there are many minor quakes around Yellowstone everyday..... it is very active

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Posted (edited)

Bizarre weather and natural disasters do seem to be getting more frequent, but are they really? Or is it just that we have the technological means to track these things more accurately and hear about things happening in other countries that we may not have previously heard about?

I don't know really to be truthful. I do actually believe that the end of our world (well more our existance, I think the Earth will still be here) will come through natural disasters. But hopefully not anywhere in the too close future!

Bizarre weather is statistically significantly up, but natural disasters (none weather related) are about the same.

The desire for an end-times is a psychological need built around our understanding of the cyclic nature of all living systems. We like and need a beginining-middle-end to all stories. However there is no reason to believe that the planet sees things in that way and the determining factor is the life of the sun - which has at least a few billion years left to burn.

Cultures such as ours tend to have a much shorter life cycle (between a few 100 years and a few thousand years) so there is every possibility that our culture may meet an end soon - but that should never be confused with the world experiencing an end times event which is highly unlikely.

Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius
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I didn't mean it's the end of creation and the earth. that's permanent. like everyone has said even though there are natural disasters, and even if yellowstone blows, the earth will recover.

i didn't mean the end of all mankind, like the end of civilisation like when the dinosaurs were killed etc, as the Bible says man will inherit the earth. We're meant to be here forever - meaning each generation after generation will still live on earth. It's our gift, we're not supposed to be wiped out by an asteroid etc. There won't be an apocalypse like that.

I mean Armageddon. I mean the judging of good and evil. People deciding which side they're on, whether they care about good or bad. God will read hearts and sort people. Only the people who don't kill, steal, rape, etc (most prison inmates that are truly guilty - not the sorry ones). You do your vacuum cleaning every now and again at home, get rid of the dirt. God will do that soon. Whether anyone believes it or not. He's not gonna sit and watch man tear the earth apart forever. He says he'll ruin those who ruin earth. They should leave earth alone.

No one is born evil, no one's born wanting to kill or hurt people. Bombers and kidnappers are not born that way. People maybe don't like to think what makes them like that. Satan drives it to oppose God. Simple as. I'm gonna leave my comment at that cos I know how many haters they're are. But my conscience is clear, I've told the truth.

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I wouldn't be so sure.... there are many minor quakes around Yellowstone everyday..... it is very active

We just had a half-dozen small quakes in Oklahoma - yesterday. As far as I know, there isn't a volcano getting ready to bury Oklahoma City. Just some injection wells, most likely.

Doug

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as the Bible says man will inherit the earth. We're meant to be here forever - meaning each generation after generation will still live on earth. It's our gift, we're not supposed to be wiped out by an asteroid etc. There won't be an apocalypse like that.

A hundred and sixty years ago they didn't believe that anything ever went extinct because that would imply that God had made a mistake and found it necessary to remove something. But God doesn't make mistakes, so no creature could ever go extinct and all those dinosaur fossils had to be around somewhere.

Since then we've lost the dodo and passenger pigeon. The ivory-billed woodpecker teeters on the edge, if it isn't gone already. And several hundred species are threatened and/or endangered. I really hope you're not as wrong about people as your predecessors were about other now-extinct species.

Doug

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The globe is warming up: this should have an effect, but so far it seems difficult to pick it out of the statistical noise.

It's actually quite easy to pick out, even without statistics, using the lists of global temperature anomalies (NCDC (Hansen) list, HadCrut3 and others). Other types of data are a little more complicated, to be sure.

Doug

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What might seem impossible to man isn't impossible to God. Part of fixing the earth is going to be replacing extinct animals, or creating more.. we don't know what he might do, but it'll solve the problem and rescue the eco system permanently. He knows how to fix it, he made it after all. I miss blue whales, they were stunning as a kid I loved them.

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Oh it's blatant the world is warming up , just look how much water was in africa 100 years ago, and the shrunken pond they call a lake now. And the ice caps are frighteningly gone. I watched a documentary on the polar regions and seeing the struggle animals go through.. they're innocent and don't deserve what we're doing to earth.

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People are not good and evil, saints and sinners, sheep and goats. People are people. They are selfish and generous, kind and cruel, honest and dishonest. What is more important is that when the bad side of someone comes out, there are reasons -- maybe not reasons we know about, but there are reasons. If we knew the whole story about anyone, we would understand.

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What might seem impossible to man isn't impossible to God. Part of fixing the earth is going to be replacing extinct animals, or creating more.. we don't know what he might do, but it'll solve the problem and rescue the eco system permanently. He knows how to fix it, he made it after all. I miss blue whales, they were stunning as a kid I loved them.

Somewhere in the Bible (Book of Job?) it says: "Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God." If memory serves, it was in reference to doing something stupid, like jumping off a tall building and expecting God to save you. I think it not wise to tempt the gods.

Doug

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Oh hon you don't need to explain to me about people with a good and a bad side.. I've met it all. The only reason I mentioned it is because people were freaking out there'd be an end of the human race. That's not going to happen. And you may not believe in the Bible at all, but one day you'll see what i mean. And there's bad sides to people and then there's terrorists etc. i'm sorry but I don't condone stuff like that.

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Yeah Doug, Satan said that to Jesus at one point, you know, leap of faith an all.. he probably looked him in the face funny and said 'i doubt it.. you jump' hahahaha. 'of you go, let me know how that turns out!' then shouting after him... 'mind the big rocks' (don't mind me, just having a laugh)

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The Bible says lots of things; in one place it says the meek will inherit the earth, in another (I think in Solomon) it says the earth abides forever.

I've never really been able to pin down end-of-earth stuff except in highly allegorical passages or in places that are historical refrences to the Jewish revolution and Roman destruction of the Temple.

I think the point I was trying to make about good and bad people went over your head. There is no such thing as saint and sinner. We are all both, and when we do evil things there are background aspects the judgmental people of this world choose to disregard so that they can not forgive. According to the Bible the only one who has the right to judge is God, not anyone else, and that is probably because he knows the whole story and therefore easily forgives.

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The timing for the end, the judgement day as people call it, is all calculated in the Bible. I'm still learning to understand it!! And there's a scripture that says the end will be exactly as the days of Noah, i.e. people doing normal everyday things and it'll be here 'like a thief in the night' - completely unexpected timing.

You're right, God does forgive, and a lot easier than we do. As for 'saints and sinners' - everyone is born a 'sinner', or not 100% perfect, I agree everyone has a bad side to them somewhere, everyone can be driven to do bad things given the right motive etc, been there done that, but what my point was for this post is that because Satan is pushing people to ruin God's creation. People were asking about the earth being destroyed in an apocalypse or man becoming extinct like the dinosaurs. I was explaining that it'll be unrepentant evil people destroyed, and not all of man, and not the earth or animals.

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Posted (edited)

I didn't mean it's the end of creation and the earth. that's permanent. like everyone has said even though there are natural disasters, and even if yellowstone blows, the earth will recover.

i didn't mean the end of all mankind, like the end of civilisation like when the dinosaurs were killed etc, as the Bible says man will inherit the earth. We're meant to be here forever - meaning each generation after generation will still live on earth. It's our gift, we're not supposed to be wiped out by an asteroid etc. There won't be an apocalypse like that.

I mean Armageddon. I mean the judging of good and evil. People deciding which side they're on, whether they care about good or bad. God will read hearts and sort people. Only the people who don't kill, steal, rape, etc (most prison inmates that are truly guilty - not the sorry ones). You do your vacuum cleaning every now and again at home, get rid of the dirt. God will do that soon. Whether anyone believes it or not. He's not gonna sit and watch man tear the earth apart forever. He says he'll ruin those who ruin earth. They should leave earth alone.

No one is born evil, no one's born wanting to kill or hurt people. Bombers and kidnappers are not born that way. People maybe don't like to think what makes them like that. Satan drives it to oppose God. Simple as. I'm gonna leave my comment at that cos I know how many haters they're are. But my conscience is clear, I've told the truth.

Does the bible mention nuclear weapons, or maybe they did not know about them then?!

Anyway, back to the weather, as shown it has always and will always change, may not be suited to our needs, but we are not the only ones living on this planet, and before us there were other creatures, so who knows what is in store for the future and what other creatures may take our place which will be suited.

Edited by freetoroam
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