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Irrelevant

how the spirit world world really works!

103 posts in this topic

With a Buddhist upbringing I naturally have most of my life believed in some sort of re-birth process, although not that it is a good thing, but a process somehow to be sidestepped so as to enter Nirvana.

Nowadays I tend to think that happens but that is just an automatic thing of no significance, since the personality and memories are destroyed with the death of the body and all you have left is a disembodied life spirit. The person dies; any rebirth is a new person.

This is the key point; whether or not the personality and memories are preserved, and the evidence from aging and certain diseases fairly clearly shows that these are dependent on healthy brain.

I believe that the information of you, your, memories, your experiences and personality are indeed stored somewhere. If not on purpose then simply a matter of infinity and finite arrangements of matter. If there is any spiritual reality, then your brain is an antenna for conciousness not a generator. The information of you that you need at the moment is being channeled and temporarily cached in the brain. Yes if you monkey with the receiver the reception will be gone or fuzzy. This is backed up by current brain science in that memories seem to be recreated everytime they are recalled instead of accessing a biological storage.

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Hi,

This is a invitation to all believers in the Non-Corpereal world to discuss how it works, how it interacts with us and how we as the creations of God interact with it.

I would ask we be respectful to each other.

I'm curious to know what others opinions are on how it works. (I have a reasonable understanding)

What happens when we die? We merge with the universe and for a moment we know ultimate truth, then depending upon our own karmic debts most of us will then go through a process of descending from this realization, swirling downward towards entropy until ultimately we become yet another discrete observer in the universe and hence we are born into a new life.

Where do we go? That depends on a multitude of factors such as your own beliefs, your own expectations, your own desires, and your karmic debts.

What do you think it will be like? It will be like falling through memory, time, color, energy, and space all at the same time like one crazy psychedelic trip.

Will you see God or is he invisible both in the Corpereal and noncorpereal worlds? You will see God, but not in the way you are used to seeing, you will see God within yourself, and yourself within God.

How can we grow spiritually there or do we grow at all? Ultimately this is up to you. If you value and seek truth then you will continue to have opportunities to do so. You will have many, many, perhaps an infinite number of lives or experiences of lives to grow yourself spiritually. But it is up to you to chose to use your time to do this and to seek out the things that lead to growth in this way, and avoid the things that hamper that growth.

How do we receive messages from spirits? We receive messages from parts of ourselves, you may think you see your dead grandma, and you do in that you see the part of her that is within yourself. The illusion of separateness is created by your consciousness to make sense of experience and process information, this illusion manifests itself into reality in our world of discreet conscious entities, but in the world of non-discreteness the illusion only persists if you do not realize that it is an illusion. In that sense, the messages your receive from spirits are really realizations that you are having within yourself, things that perhaps you need to hear, need to see, need to understand, but that you were unable to do so within the manifested world of separateness, and so once that illusion is no longer objectively true, only subjectively true, you can now hear and understand the things that the illusion was preventing you from understanding before. Often these are things you already know in your heart to be true, but that you doubted when confronted with the illusion of separateness. And so once the illusion is broken, you can understand these things and if your consciousness is not ready to confront a world of non-separateness then you will perceive these realizations as coming from separate discrete spiritual beings. Recognize that these beings represent parts of your own self and are not separate beings.

How can we tell if these are divine spirits or Evil spirits? (How can we test them or reasonably know what the level of spirit is trying to connect with us) They are parts of your own conscious mind. The evil parts within yourself can manifest as evil spirits and this can be terrifying. The divine parts within the self can be represented as divine spirits. Recognize them as parts of your own self, and do not be afraid. They cannot hurt you so long as you recognize their true nature. Whether divine or evil, accept them as part of yourself and try to take this opportunity to rid yourself of the fear you have regarding them.

Does are emotional state directly influence the type of spirit that is connecting with us? Because the spirits are representations of parts of our own selves, often parts that we either neglected or that we love most of all, your emotional state directly influences them, and a negative emotional state, like a state of fear or hatred, can manifest itself as an evil being. Similarly, an emotional state of love and compassion can be manifested as a divine being. Recognize your emotions as yours, Come to terms with your emotions and accept them. Do not be afraid of your own self.

Why can't we see spirits Because here in the discreet physical world of separateness your mind is contained within your body for the most part, and so your mind is unable to manifest spirits (which are extensions of your own self) into physical reality. They are extensions of yourself and you are somewhat limited as to how you can experience and deal with these parts of yourself in discrete reality. When you move into non-discrete reality, your mind for the most part is no longer limited by a physical system, it thus can express itself in many different ways. Think of when you are asleep and dreaming, when you dream you are experiencing an artificial state of non-discreetness. Your mind can create people, spirits, emotions, places...but these things are not real, they are just a projection of your own self. This is what happens in non-discreet reality, only you are fully conscious and it is absolutely real to you. It is like lucid dreaming in a way, you have some control over what happens, but parts of your mind can be at odds, some people call this spiritual warfare.

Lucid dreaming is a perfect example. In order to successfully lucid dream, you must realize that you are dreaming during the dream. Once you realize this, you are able to control the dream. This is exactly the same with the world of non-discreetness. Once you realize what it is and that everything going on is a projection of your own mind, you are able to control it, and if you are ready, you will leave it behind and come to know ultimate truth.

There's many more questions than written here, if you know the answer to one or perhaps more please share what your thoughts are on these.

I had fun with this, Just throwing some things out there as food for thought. I cannot prove anything I have said. It is merely some idea's I have thought of when researching and thinking about this subject. Enjoy :)

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Here's a grim thought: (loosely quoting Robert Bly quoting someone else) "If you do not learn in this life all you get is an apartment in the land of the dead".

Then what should you learn, if that is the word he used? Learn to remember what you forgot is a common spiritual answer with no practical value unless you already sense what that means.

Conscience is based on the individual's reaction to seeing something in pain... some people just don't really have it.

A person could be singing bloody murder in a death metal band for decades without it ever altering their conscience in a negative way.

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Posted (edited)

Here's a grim thought: (loosely quoting Robert Bly quoting someone else) "If you do not learn in this life all you get is an apartment in the land of the dead".

Then what should you learn, if that is the word he used? Learn to remember what you forgot is a common spiritual answer with no practical value unless you already sense what that means.

Conscience is based on the individual's reaction to seeing something in pain... some people just don't really have it.

A person could be singing bloody murder in a death metal band for decades without it ever altering their conscience in a negative way.

  1. Learn how to learn.
  2. Learn how to think.
  3. Think about what to learn.
  4. Learn about what you think.
  5. Repeat.

Edited by Einsteinium

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4. Learn about what you think.

wow, that one hit me like a zen koan.

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Posted (edited)

More advanced aliens will learn to use their minds to travel distances instead of spaceships. There is no need to use the resources to travel great distances when you understand that their are folded dimensions that out number the unfolded ones. No need to go anywhere, because in stirng theory anyway you are already there in seven dimensions. It's merely a matter of tuning your mind into the available information that's right here with you at all times. I suspect many 'spirit' encounters are also extraterrestrial. It sounds a little tin hat like. But the physics is there.

Absolutely.

One can travel the universe and link minds with beings from all parts of real time /space, and from past times which remain stored in the memory of the cosmic consciousness.

I explain it as being linked into a cosmic consciousnes, which is sort of like a mental internet, and huge hive mind, on steroids. There is a "physical" network of linkages established right through the universe, including within our galaxy, ( the nearest one is physically within our solar system) that were "designed and built" or grown, perhaps, for this purpose, and which can be used by anyone capable of reaching out to them.

I've been using them for over a half century now, since i gained "enlightenment" and access to the cosmic consciousness. I dont give a damn what anyone else believes, this is as real to me as the physical world i live in and share with others, and many of my most wondrous moments, and knowledge and understandings, have come from these travels and the minds I share in them.

(But Ive had many wondrous moments in my physical life on earth as well and shared much knowledge and understanding with earth intelligences in human bodies.) The universe is a truly wondrous place.

Edited by Mr Walker
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Posted (edited)

Absolutely.

One can travel the universe and link minds with beings from all parts of real time /space, and from past times which remain stored in the memory of the cosmic consciousness.

I explain it as being linked into a cosmic consciousnes, which is sort of like a mental internet, and huge hive mind, on steroids. There is a "physical" network of linkages established right through the universe, including within our galaxy, ( the nearest one is physically within our solar system) that were "designed and built" or grown, perhaps, for this purpose, and which can be used by anyone capable of reaching out to them.

I've been using them for over a half century now, since i gained "enlightenment" and access to the cosmic consciousness. I dont give a damn what anyone else believes, this is as real to me as the physical world i live in and share with others, and many of my most wondrous moments, and knowledge and understandings, have come from these travels and the minds I share in them.

(But Ive had many wondrous moments in my physical life on earth as well and shared much knowledge and understanding with earth intelligences in human bodies.) The universe is a truly wondrous place.

I have been wondering MW, at the nature of what we call the "spirit world". It has occurred to me on many occasions that the 'dimension' or 'space' of the spirit world might actually be the experience of moving through this collective mind and it's various niches. After all inside a single mind could be considered a dimension all it's own. Much like cyberspace as you mentioned. I have been to other places aswell, but I wonder if these places are mental constructs of a collective mind. If I can make places in my mind in dreams why can't the collective make vast places in its. Maby physical reality is nothing but a collective mind construct. The dreaming.

Edited by Seeker79

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Posted (edited)

So moving on...

We have discussed the conscience but will move on to the spirit.

The spirit has a mind and a body just as the physical has a body and a mind. The physical mind is similar to a animals mind, the spirits mind is the growth of the person in relation to heart, forgiveness, (as we saw in Jesus) .In between these two minds that exist in a horizontal plane is two other other minds. The conscience and The prophets mind.

The prophets mind and the conscience exist in a vertical relationship direct to God. You can visualise this concept as standing 4 square within yourself, or as a Cross with prophets mind on top , conscience beneath it and physical and spiritual minds on either side, making a square. (Please note the kingdom of Heaven is also a square with gates.)

Now I know we have all heard our conscience when we done something we shouldn't, a voice that tells you to say sorry or buy flowers...you conscience pains you, so lets not pretend we don't have a conscience. We also know we have a physical brain, and we have a spiritual brain..so these concepts are nothing new.The conscience is compass, some obviously have a broken or distorted compass that does not point true north.

The prophets mind is another aspect where you receive divine inspiration or food (as in receiving the holy spirit) in divine aspects. The prophets mind allows you to see visions, hear voices and feel comfort in times of deep sorrow with Gods grace.

Now before we get all uppity please remember that this mind called " the prophets mind " was written in the Gospel of Mary as taught by Jesus. This book by Mary is the oldest direct book we have in history closest to the life of Jesus and was buried by the Asines ( the group Jesus belonged too , as opposed to the Pharisees or Sadducees respectively ) and is part of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

The Prophets mind allows interpretation of dreams as in Joseph's case, revelation or to receive the authority of God, the prophets mind forms a relationship of give and take with Devine spirits and God..

There is one other mind...This is called The Evil Mind.

What is the Evil Mind? This mind is connected to the physical mind only, and lives outside the 4square frame work. It is the remanent of the fall in the garden of Eden. This mind is connected to evil elements and is how we are tempted by lesser Spirits. They form a relationship of give and take with this mind, that mind in turn forms a relationship of give and take with the physical mind. This is how sudden anger, temptation to steal or hurt yourself/others comes from.

You may say that there's 3 distinct levels here : those mostly controlled by the evil mind, those mostly controlled by there physical mind, those who are controlled by the prophets mind ( as in Jesus case for example). I would suggest that most are in the middle with good and bad fighting over them.

This aspect covers the internal relationship we have with ourselves, please view the teaching Jesus gave in the Gospel of Mary. Any one of these minds can take the leading role at times, it's a question of training, reading and understanding scripture is a form of training that we do led by our conscience so it can point true north.

Some of this may be new to you but I'd suggest experiment it for yourself...before making a comment I ask you to be aware where your thinking may be coming from.

Edited by Irrelevant

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So moving on...

We have discussed the conscience but will move on to the spirit.

The spirit has a mind and a body just as the physical has a body and a mind. The physical mind is similar to a animals mind, the spirits mind is the growth of the person in relation to heart, forgiveness, (as we saw in Jesus) .In between these two minds that exist in a horizontal plane is two other other minds. The conscience and The prophets mind.

The prophets mind and the conscience exist in a vertical relationship direct to God. You can visualise this concept as standing 4 square within yourself, or as a Cross with prophets mind on top , conscience beneath it and physical and spiritual minds on either side, making a square. (Please note the kingdom of Heaven is also a square with gates.)

Now I know we have all heard our conscience when we done something we shouldn't, a voice that tells you to say sorry or buy flowers...you conscience pains you, so lets not pretend we don't have a conscience. We also know we have a physical brain, and we have a spiritual brain..so these concepts are nothing new.The conscience is compass, some obviously have a broken or distorted compass that does not point true north.

The prophets mind is another aspect where you receive divine inspiration or food (as in receiving the holy spirit) in divine aspects. The prophets mind allows you to see visions, hear voices and feel comfort in times of deep sorrow with Gods grace.

Now before we get all uppity please remember that this mind called " the prophets mind " was written in the Gospel of Mary as taught by Jesus. This book by Mary is the oldest direct book we have in history closest to the life of Jesus and was buried by the Asines ( the group Jesus belonged too , as opposed to the Pharisees or Sadducees respectively ) and is part of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

The Prophets mind allows interpretation of dreams as in Joseph's case, revelation or to receive the authority of God, the prophets mind forms a relationship of give and take with Devine spirits and God..

There is one other mind...This is called The Evil Mind.

What is the Evil Mind? This mind is connected to the physical mind only, and lives outside the 4square frame work. It is the remanent of the fall in the garden of Eden. This mind is connected to evil elements and is how we are tempted by lesser Spirits. They form a relationship of give and take with this mind, that mind in turn forms a relationship of give and take with the physical mind. This is how sudden anger, temptation to steal or hurt yourself/others comes from.

You may say that there's 3 distinct levels here : those mostly controlled by the evil mind, those mostly controlled by there physical mind, those who are controlled by the prophets mind ( as in Jesus case for example). I would suggest that most are in the middle with good and bad fighting over them.

This aspect covers the internal relationship we have with ourselves, please view the teaching Jesus gave in the Gospel of Mary. Any one of these minds can take the leading role at times, it's a question of training, reading and understanding scripture is a form of training that we do led by our conscience so it can point true north.

Some of this may be new to you but I'd suggest experiment it for yourself...before making a comment I ask you to be aware where your thinking may be coming from.

I don't think scripture has anything to do with it. Visions and connection with the great spirit were around in north America and other places long before middle Eastern dogma took root in the world.

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The Cube is based on salt. It is an ancient way of saying the Kingdom will come into physical reality; the cube also represents the element of Earth. That said, I do not see God wanting to contain Himself in any kind of shape. Religion has a compulsion for containment/control...God cut all that loose and now here we are in the wild universe. Wild does not mean chaos. Cabala takes the cube to its furthest extent of symbolism, kingdom included, but is always containment be they orbs or the cube. The mind above, the heart, the sides and below etc. all representing aspects of God. In my opinion all that dissolves as contact with God is established.

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There is no need to use the resources to travel great distances when you understand that their are folded dimensions that out number the unfolded ones. No need to go anywhere, because in stirng theory anyway you are already there in seven dimensions.It sounds a little tin hat like. But the physics is there.

.

there are eleven dimensions in string theory seeker- 10 spatial, and 1 temporal- and all of them (except the temporal one) aren't just folded up, they're incredibly small, many, many orders of magnitude smaller than atoms. so if the aliens are using them to travel, they really aren't going anywhere fast.

there was a lot of hysteria and charlatanry in the late 1800's-early1900's, when the fourth dimension was postulated, and mediums all jumped on the idea that that was where the spirit plane existed, as they failed to realise that the 4th dimension was the temporal one, not an extra spatial one.

the physics quite simply AREN'T there i'm afraid.

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Posted (edited)

.

there are eleven dimensions in string theory seeker- 10 spatial, and 1 temporal- and all of them (except the temporal one) aren't just folded up, they're incredibly small, many, many orders of magnitude smaller than atoms. so if the aliens are using them to travel, they really aren't going anywhere fast.

there was a lot of hysteria and charlatanry in the late 1800's-early1900's, when the fourth dimension was postulated, and mediums all jumped on the idea that that was where the spirit plane existed, as they failed to realise that the 4th dimension was the temporal one, not an extra spatial one.

the physics quite simply AREN'T there i'm afraid.

That's interesting, I'm glad you got the one temporal part right ( most people miss that bit), and the temporal dimension is an illusion, but incredibly small dimensions is exactly what I was talking about.invision, if you will, a dimension that is incredibly small yet every particle in existence exists in it. This is what a dimension that is folded up means. The unfolded dimensions are the three that we know about. the incredibly small ones still have every peice of matter in them. Infact this is what's needed for string theory to work, because the strings need these different dimensions to vibrate in. yes that means every string, which means all strings in one tiny dimension at one time is also speculated to be the 'spin' on subatomic particles. The seven 'tiny' dimensions are still in the state that the other three were pre big bang. 7 dimensions are united, 3 are expanded, 1 is temporal... But if you look at the logic, why there is only 10, then you might realize that the temporal dimension is not really a dimension at all. ;)

Edited by Seeker79

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I don't think scripture has anything to do with it. Visions and connection with the great spirit were around in north America and other places long before middle Eastern dogma took root in the world.

Ah ha! Lol just kindling ..

That's the thing, this is not about scripture but considering that some would label this heretical I decided to bring the words of Jesus into it to cut them off before they got that chance..

This is a internal teaching, it is to show clearly how we can identify with ourselves. you will notice i give reference to scripture but usually don't bother to quote it, if i do its the first line, this is how jesus did it and i like to follow that practice. Also, it's no surprise that many religions encompass this way of thought, Except non have so clearly laid it out. (I have referred to the Prophets mind as that is what Jesus called it, some may call it by another name but its essentially the same in principal) If its not clear I can describe it in another way, I used the cross as a symbolism purely to assist in the reader being able to visualise the concept.

I will repeat the kingdom of Heaven is square with 12 gates.. I haven't got to that yet but when I do it will be easy for anybody to understand that symbolism. Since Gods logos pertains to family as the core , this should be interesting to those who understand that family is the most important part of Gods plan.

This is not a guess.

Also we are yet to discuss the actual spirit world and how it's made up. What is paradise, what is the garden, has anybody entered the kingdom of heaven, does the kingdom need to come on earth first? This will also encompass all faiths and dispensational figures through the ages and give insight as to why forgiveness is such a important teaching. I will show you why you must forgive, not just that you follow these words from Jesus as commandments but what happens if you don't! This will be a sad story for some but I hope it encourages some to be quick to forgive 70x7 if need be!

Perhaps we shall also get to the point of the garden of Eden , what happened there is the reason why we have had so many problems throughout human history, this is the origin of " the evil mind" that was previously mentioned and its connection to the physical mind. The Garden of Eden is a concept, but some have gone looking for it and even claimed to have found it.

Perhaps we will get to the origin of languages also.

Perhaps we shall get to why there is so many different faiths and how they can all be right yet all wrong to varying degrees ( those who stand strong in there individual faith being the one true faith will be gunning for me with that statement , but I ask you to hear me out) , no one is the be all and end all.

And perhaps at the end we shall get to the reason for these world wars ( not what you think, but should be obvious that its internal ) and what is happening in the present age, certainly this is the time of the "quickening" .

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Oh, And perhaps we shall discus the God Particle..it may surprise you that God in inside you more than you are! And yet he is trapped inside you because you were given free will.

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Posted (edited)

The God particle is a religious name for the scientific discovery of the Higgs Field

Edited by Irrelevant

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Posted (edited)

Cool. I'll be interested in what you have to say. I have been to places in the spirit world that I call the garden, and so have others, but in truth these places may just be different worlds or constructs of more complicated themes.

I don't think its the "garden of Eden". The biblical imagery and stories in genesis seem to be discussing the transition of humanity from hunter gatherer to agragarian societies which has indeed led to all the problems in the world. The garden of Eden in this context is still here on earth and really represents a way of life ivining with the land. I believe that living with the rythems of nature is what mankind is supposed to be doing, both from an evolutionary stand point and from a spiritual one.

The kingdom of heaven. I don't know. Some consider merger with god nirvana and heaven. In this context heaven is a state. I have seen a white city amongst a sea of rolling grass, but the images of such places are most certainly just symbols so that a mind can put it into context. It's hard to say. Heaven and hell seem to be states of mind.

As for the "god particle". I remain reserved. Finding a little particle on a graph where they thought it should show up is a long long long way from prooving that this little anomaly is actually responsible for gravity and the field that permiates everything. It seems that the business side of things for the hadron might be pressuring the non scientific elements of the project to come up with results. Especially after failing to proove hawking radiation. I dunno. We will see I guess.

Edited by Seeker79

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Posted (edited)

I have been wondering MW, at the nature of what we call the "spirit world". It has occurred to me on many occasions that the 'dimension' or 'space' of the spirit world might actually be the experience of moving through this collective mind and it's various niches. After all inside a single mind could be considered a dimension all it's own. Much like cyberspace as you mentioned. I have been to other places aswell, but I wonder if these places are mental constructs of a collective mind. If I can make places in my mind in dreams why can't the collective make vast places in its. Maby physical reality is nothing but a collective mind construct. The dreaming.

In my opinion based on my experiences, there are two forms of consciousness. Our own singular individual, organic based consciousness and the cosmic consciousness ( i do not know the nature of this consciousness or its means of storage.)

The cosmic consciousness is connected iinto our own consciousness and we into it. Because ALL conscious entities are linked to the cosmic consciousness, we can link to them via the cosmic consciousness just as I am now linked to you via the web. But just as the web stores all our conversations, the cosmic consciousness stores all our memories. and experiences. Hence i can go into the cosmic consciousness and interact with my father when he was a young man. I can ride his bsa motorbike with him to a dance and be with him when he meets my mother for the first time.

I am not truly interacting with him but with the pattern of his consciousness within the cosmic consciousness. Most of the places I travel to are real places inhabited by real conscious minds whom i can piggy back on or mix with, and whose physical vision knolwedge and understanding i can, to a limited extent, also share. For example if i am travelling in the mind of a spider like rigger on a light sail ship in the centre of the galaxy, I can see what he sees, but I cant understand his language,Ior the tools he may be using. I am my own consciousness looking out from within him; but i "get to him" via the linkage of the cosmic cnsciousness which connects him and me, like the internet connects you and me.

Edited by Mr Walker

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Posted (edited)

I will expand on the various states of the spirit world. The garden of Eden was the direct realm where Adam and Eve (the first humans to become spiritually self aware and first holy people) shared with God. It is different to The Garden where those who practice Islam go. The Islam Garden is similar to Paradise (Christian realm) but is slightly lower than the highest levels of Paradise.

When Jesus said to the sinner crucified on the Right side of him that he will be with him in Paradise it was a little vague as there's many realms in paradise, he is not in the highest realm of paradise that Jesus can go to. However Jesus out love for Christians chooses to stay in the lower realms of Paradise so he can embrace them all.

This is a sad thing for Jesus TBH. This concept suggests , and asks the reader to imagine there's 2 islands (although there's many levels in Paradise, more than 2). There's a island that has not much food, it's beautiful , but on the island there's Food in abundance and much more beautiful. Jesus has a 1person boat that allows him to row there, but only him..so out of love he waites on poor island to be with his followers. Would you leave your family and go to the other island? Of course not! You to would stay with them, to leave them would be selfish, so that is why he stays in the lower realms by choice, out of love.

There's 3 main levels of the spirit world. (5 actually including hell and the kingdom of heaven) these are : 1) lower realms, the spirits of these realms connect with those on earth most like themselves, and in a certain states of mind we all usually connect with them to a extent, especially if one is seriously depressed or angry.. 2) the middle realm, This is where the majority live including some from all religions. (Yes frank you will find the good natured atheists in this realm too) 3) higher realm. This is the Divine Realm where the best of the best go from nearly all religions, In here we find the higher order spirits (also called divine spirits) these connect with you and offer support when your most aware spiritually.

There's many levels inside these 3 main levels. We can call the these spiritual states :Formation Spirits, Growth Spirits, Complete Spirits.

The Area where one Goes (after the life review) is determined by that Spirits level of Growth. Positions here on Earth mean nothing except some things we might say you get a little reward for, a feather in your cap for example.However for the most part it's determined by the state of growth the spirit was able to achieve. Not surprisingly Children because of there pure nature do naturally go to highest realms. There is vast distantce between these 3 main levels.

I tragicaly lost my Wife and 3 children so occasionally I'm able to visit them and vice versa, my children are in a higher realm than my wife.i have taken a chastity vow since that time and now work to bring them and God Glory. I know some day we will see each other again.

So with the spirit world not only is it broken in levels it's broken by groups, the Christians have there Suburb (suburb as a concept) the Muslims have there suburb, Hindu, Confusionist, Leverite Kabbala, all spiritual leaders have there own pockets. They can meet but return to the place naturally where they feel the most comfortable.

Not all spiritual leaders are in the higher realms. In hell exist powerful war lords that naturally have servants just as they did here, the servants here followed them there being that is where there most comfortable, these war lords can trap a higher level Spirit too. You may ask how is this possible? The spirit world knows your sins, if you allow them to condem you in your heart to the point you feel so bad you may never escape this state. Similar to here if you allow others to put you down for your mistakes you take that on, may become depressed or even suicidal. NO! If your condemned by others you must not let them Define you! You must point out the good you do and believe it, don't take on these burdens. Only the most powerful can escape these really lower realms so don't go there at risk of your eternal life!

So I have spoken about the state of Jesus which is sad TBH, we love him so much we must lift our game out of Love for him! Now let's review a tyrant..Hitler! This b****** was chained by a Angel. His current state is chained to a wall naked. This is even sader, the ones whom he persecuted are in hell too. Why are they there? Because there full of hate, we have sent many Angels there to try assist them but because of the damage hitler did they like to throw stones at him (don't go there to see this). They struggle to forgive and hold onto such negative emotion that they can't acend to higher levels. They could easily but many are so angry because of what happened to them in the physical world..

This is why you must forgive! You will be stuck in the lower realms if you hold onto hate or passionate anger, it blocks you! Let it go if you hold such a grudge. Forgive them....even young Stephen the first Christian To be killed was blessing those who stoned him (this story is close to the beginning of the book acts, read Stephens words, particularly " for if you knew this you would not have crucified The Lord of Glory")

Black magic and psychics .. Many here claim this! Do you know who I am then!? Probably not..your working in the lower realms for the most part even though your spiritually open. Black magic : is a way to utilise the lower realms to do the will of the living by offering these spirits a gift...2 frogs legs, 1 piece of hair..lol and so on. To those who practice this: You could try curse me and may succseed for a short moment, but I assure you my friends will smash you and your family to pieces if you try! Your warned! You will loose all spiritual protection.

This will conclude somewhat this aspect, we will move on to Sin, something we all have done , the different types of Sin and how that's paid/indemnified. How is it that some sin is paid out upto 7 generations, this is spoken in the bible.

Edited by Irrelevant

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Posted (edited)

I will repeat the kingdom of Heaven is square with 12 gates.. I haven't got to that yet but when I do it will be easy for anybody to understand that symbolism. Since Gods logos pertains to family as the core , this should be interesting to those who understand that family is the most important part of Gods plan.

This is not a guess.

Nice guesswork but the kingdom of heaven is not a walled structure. Jesus said to Mary: I was not recognized. But I have recognized that the All is being dissolved, both earthly things and heavenly. Salvation is the most important part of God's plan.

Edited by markprice

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Posted (edited)

Nice guesswork but the kingdom of heaven is not a walled structure. Jesus said to Mary: I was not recognized. But I have recognized that the All is being dissolved, both earthly things and heavenly. Salvation is the most important part of God's plan.

No its not a guess, it's in the bible Mark, including the description..".each gate is as a pearl." However it's symbolism so I shall give the description of that symbolism, and this is not a guess either.

Are you going to make me start quoting full scripture? Let's move beyond that archaic style please, but note I quoted the first line as is the tradition with Jesus so you and anybody else can find it if you still feel the need.

As for salvation that was never part of the Logos, its a countermeasure, the need for salvation happened because the first holy family ( in the garden of Eden ) failed..satan became the ruler of this earth , that is Jesus words .you can read all about Gods anger towards satan for what happened In the first book...I shall also give a full a description of this failure, since many think the apple was a apple, a tree a tree..the symbolism is very easy to understand once you capture the essence of it instead of being bound by the lettering of it. You might ask who wrote Genesis. However this is getting away from the topic of the Symbolism involving The Kingdom Of Heaven. A place no human has ever entered in the spirit world, since it must come on earth first.

Edited by Irrelevant

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I had a real good long look at the Gate many years ago. Why would God require more than one gate? If you are referring to John's vision and symbolism you would need to be a trained adept as he was to accurately discern what was implied with layers of symbolism, but you are right: that is not the point. The Gate does not even connect to walls; there is a pillar on each side under a rainbow-like arch...wow that was a long time ago--but walls and multiple gates are not necessary because nobody is getting past that without a thorough understanding of Evil. Evil is the force that prevents entrance and beyond that any structure is superfluous.

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Are you going to make me start quoting full scripture? Let's move beyond that archaic style please, but note I quoted the first line as is the tradition with Jesus so you and anybody else can find it if you still feel the need.

As for salvation that was never part of the Logos, its a countermeasure, the need for salvation happened because ...

What you said was "The family is the most important part of God's plan". If you are going to make declarative statements based on the bible then the bible should not contradict you, right?

Mathew 10:37, 35-36, 12:48 etc. etc.

Mark 10:29

Luke 48-49, 53 etc.

You are saying there was no need for Jesus' mission in God's plan because He didn't need a plan for salvation in the first place. Then nothing in the bible was a part of God's plan. I mean come on, countermeasures have to be a part of any intelligent Plan. If God planned for nothing to happen...you see what I mean.

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People always quote the Christian bible as being the final authority on spiritual matters. This is simply just not correct. It is but one of many important spiritual texts. Here are some passages from a book I consider to be just as true as the Christian bible- The Bhagavad Gita

Never the spirit was born; the spirit shall cease to be never;Never was time it was not; End and Beginning are dreams!Birthless and deathless and changeless remaineth the spirit for ever;Death hath not touched it at all, dead though the house of it seems!Who knoweth it exhaustless, self-sustained,Immortal, indestructible,shall suchSay, I have killed a man, or caused to kill?Nay, but as when one layethHis worn-out robes away,And, taking new ones, sayeth,These will I wear to-day!So putteth by the spiritLightly its garb of flesh,And passeth to inheritA residence afresh.

Whatever you do, make it an offering to me -- the food you eat, the sacrifices you make, the help you give, even your suffering.

Those who consciousness is unified abandon all attachment to the results of action and attain supreme peace. But those whose desires are fragmented, who are selfishly attached to the results of their work, are bound in everything they do.

There has never been a time when you and I have not existed, nor will there be a time when we will cease to exist. As the same person inhabits the body through childhood, youth, and old age, so too at the time of death he attains another body. The wise are not deluded by these changes.

That one I love who is incapable of ill will, and returns love for hatred. Living beyond the reach of I and mind, and of pain and pleasure, full of mercy, contented, self-controlled, with all his heart and all his mind given to Me -- with such a one I am in love.

To the illumined man or woman, a clod of dirt, a stone, and gold are the same.

Fear not what is not real, never was and never will be. What is real, always was and cannot be destroyed.

Edited by Einsteinium

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Nobody alive on this planet can tell you how the spirit world works. Some may tell you they have the answers or are "enlightened" but the truth is, you aren't going to know until you are dead. Personally, even though I won't have and will never have scratched the surface, I base my expectations and vision of the afterlife based on my own experiences and not religious texts.

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Nobody alive on this planet can tell you how the spirit world works. Some may tell you they have the answers or are "enlightened" but the truth is, you aren't going to know until you are dead. Personally, even though I won't have and will never have scratched the surface, I base my expectations and vision of the afterlife based on my own experiences and not religious texts.

:tsu: As do I. Personally I think that anyone who claims to be enlightened most certainly is not.

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