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British MPs know nothing about Europe

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The European Commissioner for Trade has spoken of his bewilderment and frustration at just how little most British MPs know about the European Union as the debate intensifies about the UK’s membership.

Karel de Gucht told The Independent: “It’s really amazing how little a lot of British politicians know about Europe. They should get better acquainted with it.”

He made the comments while warning that it would be “madness” and a “disaster” for Britain to leave the EU and put vital trade benefits at risk, possibly at the cost of tens of thousands of jobs.

Mr De Gucht, who is currently tasked with negotiating a free trade agreement between the EU and the United States, urged British leaders not to indulge in a “blame game” with Brussels for the UK’s economic and social problems. “It’s really amazing how little a lot of British politicians know about Europe,” the former Belgian Foreign Minister said. “You need decision on the basis of facts and figures and arguments, not on the basis of myths.

“Why don’t people tell the truth about the EU?”

...

In his role as Trade Commissioner – a post previously held by Lord Mandelson – the Belgian politician is currently leading negotiations for a landmark agreement to abolish all business tariffs between the EU and the US.

Arguing that this would benefit every household of four by an average of £466 a year and boost GDP by 0.5 per cent – and that a common language means Britain stands to benefit the most – Mr de Gucht said: “It would be clear madness to get out at this moment in time.”

He added: “If this deal were to go about it would result in jobs in the hundreds of thousands [across the EU], so we are giving you the best argument to stay in the European Union by negotiating this deal with the United States,” he said.

More: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/top-eu-official-british-mps-know-nothing-about-europe-and-pulling-out-of-the-eu-would-be-a-clear-disaster-for-britain-8605212.html

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Well, the leftie marxist Independent would say that, wouldn't they. We need the Daily Mail for the objective, unibiased Truth about Europe.

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Well, that's an easy reply isn't it. Let's not focus on what is written just on the source.

The european commissioner adjusted his entire point of view to a newspaper. Sure.

Mr de Gucht also warned that politicians stoking public anger about the EU to avoid taking responsibility for the country’s problems – and false stories in the press – increased the chances of the UK leaving.

“We don’t want you to love Europe, love should be kept for personal relationships. But look at your own interests and ‘de-dramatise’ all this. I was reading a story that I was amazed by – it was about whether you could re-use jam jars for school fetes. Somebody was making jam for fetes but saying they are not able to do that anymore [because of EU regulations]. Why would we bother about that?”

Tory minister Ken Clarke’s decision to dismiss UKIP as “clowns” also came in for criticism from Mr de Gucht, who said that arguments by eurosceptics should be countered by facts and statistics showing the EU was the “best investment,” rather than indulging in insults.

“It’s a populist party, and during a crisis people prefer easy arguments and easy solutions,” he said of UKIP. “What you should not do is call them clowns, because then you are saying to voters you are voting for clowns, and the risk is the voter says: ‘So what? It’s my damn right to vote for a clown’.”

...

“You have problems with employment, with budget deficits, with fiscal policy. A lot of the problems you are facing are homemade, they are not from Europe. You are not going to resolve your crisis by engaging in a blame game. Everybody has problems, but we are in a better position to solve them together.

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those who believe in the european project know that Britain leaving would be a major blow - the EU will continue without us. just as we will without them, but its right for any self governing nation to govern itself. a truly independent Britain is the way forward. the EU is so far removed from what we find acceptable. the people of this nation want out. we've had ex-chancellor Lawson come out and say its time for Britain to leave. We also witnessed the peoples wishes. in recent elections we witnessed the United Kingdom Independence Party take 26% of the vote. from a standing start. something never done in British politics. and this was achieved in the wake of a smear campaign by the Tory Party. calling them clowns fruitcakes etc.. and worst of all launching a search by Tory party members of all the social media outlets like twitter/facebook accounts etc of UKIP party members trying to find something which would undermine and discredit UKIP's political rise. guess what none of it worked. if UKIP can poll 26% of the vote in a general election they'll form a coalition government.

It doesnt matter what the europeans think. The United Kingdom want out. simple as that.

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Sounds like perhaps the EU knows nothing about Britain either...

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Well, the leftie marxist Independent would say that, wouldn't they. We need the Daily Mail for the objective, unibiased Truth about Europe.

Right, and given the format, all you have to do is read the headline and you are perfectly informed of *what goes on in the world*

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Posted (edited)

I won't pretend to know the ins and outs of the deal being negotiated but (even assuming it goes ahead and would bring us money), there's more to being a country than making money. And I think a lot of people here are tired of being stymied in pursuit of justice by EU regulations and being dragged down by association. The EU is failing and countries with any sense will be getting out while they can.

Edited by Setton
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those who believe in the european project know that Britain leaving would be a major blow - the EU will continue without us. just as we will without them, but its right for any self governing nation to govern itself. a truly independent Britain is the way forward. the EU is so far removed from what we find acceptable. the people of this nation want out. we've had ex-chancellor Lawson come out and say its time for Britain to leave. We also witnessed the peoples wishes. in recent elections we witnessed the United Kingdom Independence Party take 26% of the vote. from a standing start. something never done in British politics. and this was achieved in the wake of a smear campaign by the Tory Party. calling them clowns fruitcakes etc.. and worst of all launching a search by Tory party members of all the social media outlets like twitter/facebook accounts etc of UKIP party members trying to find something which would undermine and discredit UKIP's political rise. guess what none of it worked. if UKIP can poll 26% of the vote in a general election they'll form a coalition government.

It doesnt matter what the europeans think. The United Kingdom want out. simple as that.

Don't you think its going to set a precedent for Scotland if the UK leaves the EU? After all if its better to be independant than part of a Union why would Scotland stay in the UK?

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I won't pretend to know the ins and outs of the deal being negotiated but (even assuming it goes ahead and would bring us money), there's more to being a country than making money. And I think a lot of people here are tired of being stymied in pursuit of justice by EU regulations and being dragged down by association. The EU is failing and countries with any sense will be getting out while they can.

In many instances people only recieve justice when a case goes through the domestic court's and arrives at the European courts.

The EU is no more failing than Britain is failing. It is the shortcomings of the economic model we all follow which is failing us and it is failing Britain more than most.

Br Cornelius

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The EU is no more failing than Britain is failing. It is the shortcomings of the economic model we all follow which is failing us and it is failing Britain more than most.

And yet, we are the ones having to bail out other countries who didn't bother to manage their finances as well. Kind of suggests the opposite.

Regardless of the reasons, the recent elections are pretty clear; a lot of people want to get out now and get back to being the independent nation we once were.

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Posted (edited)

Don't you think its going to set a precedent for Scotland if the UK leaves the EU? After all if its better to be independant than part of a Union why would Scotland stay in the UK?

its up to each country to decide their future. if the Scottish feel their future prosperity lies out side of the United Kingdom. then thats their right to choose. either way its up to the people to decide. - for me the EU is making it harder for us to remain members. they constantly attack our economy in the sense of the financial sector, we stupidly handed over our fishing grounds destroying our own fishing industry. 80% of EU fish come from British waters. mainly by the fishing fleets from Spain, Portugal and France. were losing Billions a year. were hamstrung, forbidden from making our own trade policy. we pay the EU to throw rubbish in our own landfill sites. we was ordered by EU rules to force the Royal Mail to open up its profitable side of the business to other EU companies. at each passing treaty were are being marginalised by the EU. the UK has been out voted on every issue for the last three years. we could go on and on. take this week, as reported on EuroNews channel. the EU at it again stabbing us in the back, when eu lawmaker, whose name i cannot remember except for him being Spanish said the European Parliament does not accept British sovereignty over the Falkland Islands. and this is going on all the time. Yesterday they the EU went further. Barroso came out in his speech saying he wants to set out the frame - plans for a European federation. and in doing so they are already looking for another treaty, or treaty change giving the EU even more powers. Barroso said The commission will, therefore, set out its views and explicit ideas for treaty change in order for them to be debated before the European elections." "We want to put all the elements on the table, in a clear and consistent way, even if some of them may sound like political science fiction today. They will be reality in a few years' time."

Does any British Citizen see his or herself self as a future small European backwater, lost as part of some Federation.

UKIP Nigel Farage, yesterday-

Edited by stevewinn
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"They will be reality in a few years' time."

Nice to see he's waiting for the vote before saying that. Oh wait...

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Looking forward to the day Britain leaves the EU. We won't look back.

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The only real disaster, was joining up with the EU in the first place........ I bet Spain and Greece wished they never bothered

.

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The only real disaster, was joining up with the EU in the first place........ I bet Spain and Greece wished they never bothered

.

I suspect you are not applying anything like the correct perspective here. Both countries joined after emerging from long periods of right wing military disctatorships. They had crap economies and they both gained massively from their membership of the EU. They gain economically and in terms of political stability.

The problem they face now is a global economic one which is far more accute for them because they never really addressed the economic flaws in their own economic models. I can guarantee that they would have reset their currency and been through another bout of right wing dicatorship by now if it wasn't for the EU.

Hatred for the other, which is really what you all are expressing, is no anacdote for the real economic fundamentals of what the EU has done to stabalize and grow the European economy over the last 50years.

Br Cornelius

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I suspect you are not applying anything like the correct perspective here. Both countries joined after emerging from long periods of right wing military disctatorships. They had crap economies and they both gained massively from their membership of the EU. They gain economically and in terms of political stability.

The problem they face now is a global economic one which is far more accute for them because they never really addressed the economic flaws in their own economic models. I can guarantee that they would have reset their currency and been through another bout of right wing dicatorship by now if it wasn't for the EU.

Hatred for the other, which is really what you all are expressing, is no anacdote for the real economic fundamentals of what the EU has done to stabalize and grow the European economy over the last 50years.

Br Cornelius

it doesn't matter cornelius...it's clear you're heavily invested in the european project...but put to a referendum the people of the UK will vote to get out....but then, let's be honest, it won't be unless the political elite are sure that the outcome will be an 'in' vote...

why not have a vote tomorrow cornelius?? or more realistically in say 6 weeks time....why don't the politicians want a democratic process here??

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The problem is the UK could have it's own trade deals we the US, Commonwealth and rest of the world, without any other country having a say. This would be a better deal for the UK, which is still one of the most powerful countries in the world. Scotland one the other hand would be a very small, not powerful country which nobody would have to listen to. The fact that both the EU and US want to the UK to stay in the EU in my view means we should leave. They seek to control, we seek to be free of that control. Long Live The British Ideal's.

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The problem is the UK could have it's own trade deals we the US, Commonwealth and rest of the world, without any other country having a say. This would be a better deal for the UK, which is still one of the most powerful countries in the world. Scotland one the other hand would be a very small, not powerful country which nobody would have to listen to. The fact that both the EU and US want to the UK to stay in the EU in my view means we should leave. They seek to control, we seek to be free of that control. Long Live The British Ideal's.

totally agree. the yanks to be fair say one thing in public and another behind the scenes. the US want to keep the EU on side. friendly. - There is only one political party who can give this country its self belief and confidence back and thats UKIP. the whole load of rubbish going on currently about referendums in 2017 which is at the backend of the next parliament. and you can bet your bottom dollar if labour get elected they'll repeal the bill and the same old crap will continue. the Three main parties cannot and will not leave Europe. you want out of Europe there is only one option UKIP.

on the issue of UKIP - UKIP currently has the fastest growing party membership of any party - while its a known fact, membership in the other three parties Labour, Tory and Lib Dems is all falling. its estimated that by 2020 they struggle to fund themselves. in a bid to stop their decline the current lot will introduce a bill whereby they'll propose in the future political parties will be funded by the public purse. they'll spin it that they are doing it to make politics fairer for all. so each party as a equal amount of funding. but in truth its a desperate bid to stay alive politically and stop self funding parties breaking the status quo.

Call me DAVE what has changed.Dave remember this

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totally agree. the yanks to be fair say one thing in public and another behind the scenes. the US want to keep the EU on side. friendly. - There is only one political party who can give this country its self belief and confidence back and thats UKIP. the whole load of rubbish going on currently about referendums in 2017 which is at the backend of the next parliament. and you can bet your bottom dollar if labour get elected they'll repeal the bill and the same old crap will continue. the Three main parties cannot and will not leave Europe. you want out of Europe there is only one option UKIP.

on the issue of UKIP - UKIP currently has the fastest growing party membership of any party - while its a known fact, membership in the other three parties Labour, Tory and Lib Dems is all falling. its estimated that by 2020 they struggle to fund themselves. in a bid to stop their decline the current lot will introduce a bill whereby they'll propose in the future political parties will be funded by the public purse. they'll spin it that they are doing it to make politics fairer for all. so each party as a equal amount of funding. but in truth its a desperate bid to stay alive politically and stop self funding parties breaking the status quo.

Call me DAVE what has changed.Dave remember this

[media=]

[/media]

Peter Hitchens calls Cameron Mr Slippery, he is right.

My political party also wants to leave the EU. However I also want Ireland to rejoin the UK, with Ireland still in the EU we can't do trade and regulation agreements with Ireland, we have to do them with the EU. This mean the EU will still have some economic control over Britain. Also US support for the IRA in Northern Ireland harmed the UK, so I don't want that US to be able to back terrorist groups in the UK from a country with a land border with the UK. We need to take back control of the British Isles and the waters around them. Other countries like Iceland, Norway and Denmark need to understand that the UK controls the North Sea, we decide how much fish they can have, how much oil and gas they have, not the US and not the EU. My party is called the British Isles nationalists, but it is small with only a dozen members. So I will be voting for UKIP in the EU elections, then I will be voting Conservative in the general election and I just voted Conservative in the local elections. I can't vote for UKIP in UK elections because I find some of their policies are just to get votes. I hate a flat tax and their defence policy is stupid. However for the sake of getting out the EU I hope many people vote UKIP and they become the third party and join a coalition with the Conservatives.

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its up to each country to decide their future. if the Scottish feel their future prosperity lies out side of the United Kingdom. then thats their right to choose. either way its up to the people to decide. - for me the EU is making it harder for us to remain members. they constantly attack our economy in the sense of the financial sector, we stupidly handed over our fishing grounds destroying our own fishing industry. 80% of EU fish come from British waters. mainly by the fishing fleets from Spain, Portugal and France. were losing Billions a year. were hamstrung, forbidden from making our own trade policy. we pay the EU to throw rubbish in our own landfill sites. we was ordered by EU rules to force the Royal Mail to open up its profitable side of the business to other EU companies. at each passing treaty were are being marginalised by the EU. the UK has been out voted on every issue for the last three years. we could go on and on. take this week, as reported on EuroNews channel. the EU at it again stabbing us in the back, when eu lawmaker, whose name i cannot remember except for him being Spanish said the European Parliament does not accept British sovereignty over the Falkland Islands. and this is going on all the time. Yesterday they the EU went further. Barroso came out in his speech saying he wants to set out the frame - plans for a European federation. and in doing so they are already looking for another treaty, or treaty change giving the EU even more powers. Barroso said The commission will, therefore, set out its views and explicit ideas for treaty change in order for them to be debated before the European elections." "We want to put all the elements on the table, in a clear and consistent way, even if some of them may sound like political science fiction today. They will be reality in a few years' time."

Does any British Citizen see his or herself self as a future small European backwater, lost as part of some Federation.

UKIP Nigel Farage, yesterday-

Good response. :) Being on the opposite side of the world I have to declare my ignorance on a lot of issues regarding the EU. I do think it was a good idea for the UK not to adopt the Euro, the idea of a unified currency is nice in theory, but it seems to have the effect of accumulating power and wealth in Germany and France at the expense of the poorer and smaller nations. Competition is too important to capitalist systems and I think that applies to currency as well.

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The scottish attitude to democracy:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2325679/Nigel-Farage-bundled-police-van-barricaded-inside-pub-going-promote-Scottish-election-candidate.html

'nazi scum'

lol.

how totally out of touch are these utter muppets? don't they see the irony in calling farage a 'racist' but shouting at him to 'go home' at the same time?

pmsl.

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I don't want to be a member of anything that has in the past been run by devious pond life like Lord (what a sick joke) Mandleson.

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The Germans are practically begging us to stay in to help boost the Economies of France and Mediterranian countries,according to yesterdays news.I cannot see why we should bother,when was the last time France and the others helped us.they veto every vote in Brussels,and wont even allow us to deport a known terrorist.

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I swear some British are more chauvinistic than the Americans.

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