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and then

Russia is taking a stand

31 posts in this topic

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4380847,00.html

I am surprised by this. I think the "short guy syndrome" may be about to start a regional, maybe even global, war. Putin is laying markers and Netanyahu is going to have to retreat or fight. My guess is he will not retreat - he really cannot. Putin will not use nukes to defend Syria and he CANNOT win in a conventional conflict. This kind of adventurism is caused by him taking advantage of a weak, feckless and politically scandalized American president. THIS is why weak leaders are dangerous.

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They keep telling us to stay out of it but yet they don't. I doubt they start a war they know where it could lead.

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They keep telling us to stay out of it but yet they don't. I doubt they start a war they know where it could lead.

I hope you are right. This actually worries me. Putin is a hardcase and I think he doesn't respect our president and sees an opportunity to flex his muscles. It could be bad. If Netanyahu is seriously considering striking Iran, he could use the confusion of a Syrian conflict to cover for it.

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Netanyahu started this..... Should never have done airstrikes in Syria.

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the report does not say that deal was done before the uprising which was in 2009

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In all my years we have been living under threat of nuclear war on this planet. It gets depressing and I wish those leaders would start thinking about their citizens instead of their egos.

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http://www.ynetnews....4380847,00.html

I am surprised by this. I think the "short guy syndrome" may be about to start a regional, maybe even global, war. Putin is laying markers and Netanyahu is going to have to retreat or fight. My guess is he will not retreat - he really cannot. Putin will not use nukes to defend Syria and he CANNOT win in a conventional conflict. This kind of adventurism is caused by him taking advantage of a weak, feckless and politically scandalized American president. THIS is why weak leaders are dangerous.

Yet that report is a bit misleading as it does not mention those same Russian warships paying friendly visit to Israel earlier. There is no Russian v Israeli animosity that I see. Large numbers of Israelis are from Russia, and many are far more Russian than Jewish, claiming Israeli citizenship by one only great grandmother, or even less. In 2010, I think, IDF were on exerecises in Russia

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Yet that report is a bit misleading as it does not mention those same Russian warships paying friendly visit to Israel earlier. There is no Russian v Israeli animosity that I see. Large numbers of Israelis are from Russia, and many are far more Russian than Jewish, claiming Israeli citizenship by one only great grandmother, or even less. In 2010, I think, IDF were on exerecises in Russia

This is true but do you not feel Putin is tweaking the situation for his own prestige and other benefit? It seems dangerous to me - not the shipping, the missile technology will cause Israel to make a decision that could escalate the entire situation out of control. Assad doesn't need these missiles to defeat the "rebels". These missiles are entirely for use against any aircraft that might decide to intervene in the slaughter. I have no horse in this race because no matter who wins there, the west loses but I still think it barbaric what is happening to the elderly and the young and innocent. I hope your instinct is correct in this TP

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I hope your instinct is correct in this TP

So do I, and I really think there are no problems here that will get significantly bigger. We know little things can start big wars, like Sarajevo in 1914, but these are simply triggers for a war that would have happened anyway. Appart from the unending Jewish v Arab hate fest, I see no underlying reason for any serious war to develope. There will be no WWIII over Syria. I look with greater concern at China now claiming Okinawa.

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http://www.ynetnews....4380847,00.html

I am surprised by this. I think the "short guy syndrome" may be about to start a regional, maybe even global, war. Putin is laying markers and Netanyahu is going to have to retreat or fight. My guess is he will not retreat - he really cannot. Putin will not use nukes to defend Syria and he CANNOT win in a conventional conflict. This kind of adventurism is caused by him taking advantage of a weak, feckless and politically scandalized American president. THIS is why weak leaders are dangerous.

Are you serious? Russia has one of the strongest militaries in the world.

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.

btw...

I like the title of this topic... "Russia is taking a stand."

Reminds me of the desire of my heart = Tsar Michael standing up.

.

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Posted (edited)

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4380847,00.html

I am surprised by this. I think the "short guy syndrome" may be about to start a regional, maybe even global, war. Putin is laying markers and Netanyahu is going to have to retreat or fight. My guess is he will not retreat - he really cannot. Putin will not use nukes to defend Syria and he CANNOT win in a conventional conflict. This kind of adventurism is caused by him taking advantage of a weak, feckless and politically scandalized American president. THIS is why weak leaders are dangerous.

Obama was intentionally set up for such a time as this.

On many American forums I visit, Americans are too caught-up in their own

Obama-related 'Greek tragedies' to worry about the Middle East.

.

Edited by AlasBabylon

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Are you serious? Russia has one of the strongest militaries in the world.

What great military advantage does Russia have that would let it win in a conventional war

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What great military advantage does Russia have that would let it win in a conventional war

People tend to think of either nuclear war or conventional war as they

have known it... but there may be other... more advanced... weaponry.

Vladimir Putin has been in control of Russia since New Year's Eve, 1999.

Shortly aftewards, he said Russia's navy base in Syria would be rebuilt.

Putin has had over 13 years to rebuild Russia... more time than Hitler had

to rebuild Germany. What new V-2 rockets... that is... what new technology

might Putin's Russia now possess ??

.

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People tend to think of either nuclear war or conventional war as they

have known it... but there may be other... more advanced... weaponry.

Vladimir Putin has been in control of Russia since New Year's Eve, 1999.

Shortly aftewards, he said Russia's navy base in Syria would be rebuilt.

Putin has had over 13 years to rebuild Russia... more time than Hitler had

to rebuild Germany. What new V-2 rockets... that is... what new technology

might Putin's Russia now possess ??

.

The answer to that can only be given by history. Could the have a doomsday ray ? Maybe but not likely.

Are you serious? Russia has one of the strongest militaries in the world.

Very serious. I agree that Russia has a large and capable military but they are not even close to be as well supplied or trained or experienced as our military in the US. It's just not even in the same order of magnitude any more. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Russians cannot fight and cause severe damage to any enemy. But a straight up fight with conventional weapons they will not win and they know it. And God forbid the day when we have to prove it.
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The answer to that can only be given by history. Could the have a doomsday ray ? Maybe but not likely. Very serious. I agree that Russia has a large and capable military but they are not even close to be as well supplied or trained or experienced as our military in the US. It's just not even in the same order of magnitude any more. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Russians cannot fight and cause severe damage to any enemy. But a straight up fight with conventional weapons they will not win and they know it. And God forbid the day when we have to prove it.

In ancient times, the great Babylonian empire that had conquered the [known] world

thought the same way about Cyrus' "weak" Persia.

Babylon was vastly superior... very wealthy and extremely strong... or so the Babylonians thought...

until Cyrus conquered Babylon.

" Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

.

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There is a vast difference between under estimating your enemy and being realistic. Putin did have a long time to rebuild the Russian military, and I admit that, I will even go as far as to say he advanced the Russian military under his leadership but we must still be realistic about the state the Russian military is in. The Russian navy is no where near the level of the US navy and I doubt anyone would be willing to argue that, the US navy is starting to put rail guns on ships for testing. The Russian air force is no where near the level of the US air force, the US had 5th generation fighter aircraft since 1990 and Russia just started producing prototypes of 5th generation fighter aircraft in 2010. That just leaves the Russian army and the US army to compare and I feel safe to say that the US army is more advanced, I will admit the training for both is probably about the same but it can not be over looked that because of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan that a decent amount of the US army is rather experienced in actual combat which no level of training can prepare you for.

Lastly this isn't the 1930's and 1940's, advancing and rebuilding a military now is far more time and resource consuming and far more difficult then back then.

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In ancient times, the great Babylonian empire that had conquered the [known] world

thought the same way about Cyrus' "weak" Persia.

Babylon was vastly superior... very wealthy and extremely strong... or so the Babylonians thought...

until Cyrus conquered Babylon.

" Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

.

Oh yeah? Well MY dad can beat up YOUR dad - any day :w00t: Seriously though, I'm not disrespecting the fighting spirit of a Russian force. But they have been too lean too long to fight a straight up conventional war and prevail. Cyrus took advantage of the arrogance and inept leadership of the Babylonians in their decline. America's forces are at their peak technologically. Do I expect that to continue? NOPE. Obama is well on his way to changing that situation.

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This speech was made by Putin in July 2012 where "Syria" was mentioned.

http://youtu.be/dnHjw5cOUkE

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Posted (edited)

Putin did have a long time to rebuild the Russian military...

... this isn't the 1930's and 1940's, advancing and rebuilding a military now is far more time and resource consuming and far more difficult then back then.

Putin has ruled Russia now for almost 14 years...

and those are just the years we know about.

Hitler raised Germany from the depths of depression

to a world power in much less time and with much fewer

resources.

To put it in a nutshell... if Putin has not developed

and perfected a space-based "bug zapper"... I will be

very disappointed.

.

Edited by AlasBabylon

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Putin has ruled Russia now for almost 14 years...

Hitler raised Germany from the depths of depression

to a world power in much less time and with much fewer

resources.

To put it in a nutshell... if Putin has not developed

and perfected a space-based "bug zapper"... I will be

very disappointed.

.

So you believe that Russia under Putin is a model for how the world should be run? How, exactly, do you think he could make things better?

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Posted (edited)

So you believe that Russia under Putin is a model for how the world should be run? How, exactly, do you think he could make things better?

I could write a thesis about what is wrong with the current world order...

and the unique position of post-Soviet Russia... with it's 1000 year Orthodox

Christian, Tsarist legacy... and its 70 years of getting to know the antichrist

enemy up close and personal. Russia... and the world... are at a critical time

in history... the current world order is falling as we type [although many

may not see and/or understand it.] It's not up to us to decide who will reign.

God has already chosen the One who will inherit the earth when Babylon falls.

.

Edited by AlasBabylon

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Putin has ruled Russia now for almost 14 years...

and those are just the years we know about.

Hitler raised Germany from the depths of depression

to a world power in much less time and with much fewer

resources.

To put it in a nutshell... if Putin has not developed

and perfected a space-based "bug zapper"... I will be

very disappointed.

Hitler did raise Germany to a world power in less time and with less resources but the cost and time of doing so is drastically different from back then. If you can not understand the vast difference in cost and time it took to develop the technology and weapons from back then to what it takes today to develop new weapons and technology then I don't really know how I can possibly explain it to you. If you honestly think the development, production, and time cost of lets say a Panzer IV is comparable to that of lets say a T-90 then you are just being delusional.

Even if Putin is this great leader you believe him to be that could turn Russia into a military superpower like the USSR was at its peak it still doesn't change two simple facts. First Russia fell greatly after the Cold War while the US didn't so at best Russia would be playing keep up to the US since it never stopped advancing it's military technology. When the US started producing its first 5th generation figther jet it took Russia a further 20 years just to make a prototype aircraft that was comparable and even years later it is stil in the prototype stage and not into production. Second the US spends about 682 billion dollars on the military while Russia only spends about 90.7 billion dollars so the US is spending about 7.5 times the amount of money on the military then Russia. With the cost it takes to develop and maintain a modern military there is no possible way Russia can match the US while only spending a fraction of the money

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Hitler did raise Germany to a world power in less time and with less resources but the cost and time of doing so is drastically different from back then. If you can not understand the vast difference in cost and time it took to develop the technology and weapons from back then to what it takes today to develop new weapons and technology then I don't really know how I can possibly explain it to you. If you honestly think the development, production, and time cost of lets say a Panzer IV is comparable to that of lets say a T-90 then you are just being delusional.

Even if Putin is this great leader you believe him to be that could turn Russia into a military superpower like the USSR was at its peak it still doesn't change two simple facts. First Russia fell greatly after the Cold War while the US didn't so at best Russia would be playing keep up to the US since it never stopped advancing it's military technology. When the US started producing its first 5th generation figther jet it took Russia a further 20 years just to make a prototype aircraft that was comparable and even years later it is stil in the prototype stage and not into production. Second the US spends about 682 billion dollars on the military while Russia only spends about 90.7 billion dollars so the US is spending about 7.5 times the amount of money on the military then Russia. With the cost it takes to develop and maintain a modern military there is no possible way Russia can match the US while only spending a fraction of the money

In your secular estimations you forget something very important.

Again... I will use the Babylon/Cyrus analogy.

Babylon was the most powerful, most wealthy empire on the planet...

it had conquered the [known] world. Seemingly... no one was able

to make war against Babylon... the Babylonians laughed at the idea

of a weaker king from the east standing up against their behemoth.

Cyrus' Media-Persia kingdom wasn't as powerful or as wealthy...

but Cyrus had something Babylon did not... the anointing of God.

[isaiah 45:1]

.

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