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xFelix

Gun Control News

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Posted (edited)

What do you guys think of this article?

Would you agree that gun control is just counter productive to the goal it has been intended to serve?

Would you agree that some form of gun control is necessary?

Let's keep it civil though, no need to act as savage as our politicians make us seem.

Edited by xFelix
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I think having a handgun for protection in your own home is acceptable.However I really dont think the constitution was really taking the future into consideration with the "Right To Bear Arms" passage,and of course the NRA will back the constitution to the hilt.At the end of the day it is not the legal gun permits that are causing the problem, it's the illegal purchase and use of all types of firearms that is the problem.Health and safety checks should be carried out in a more diligent fashion as some mental health patients seem to able to buy arms.It IS a difficult step and I really would like to see some changes in the right to bear arms ammendment,but no I dont have the complete answer.

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It's easy and clear to work out.

Will a nut case or criminal who is going to break the law and kill people going to care about getting a gun legally and with a license? No. So what difference will it make? Good honest people will not be able to defend themselves against criminals or nut cases or the government.

Also you don't want the US to become the UK.....

I think having a handgun for protection in your own home is acceptable.However I really dont think the constitution was really taking the future into consideration with the "Right To Bear Arms" passage,and of course the NRA will back the constitution to the hilt.At the end of the day it is not the legal gun permits that are causing the problem, it's the illegal purchase and use of all types of firearms that is the problem.Health and safety checks should be carried out in a more diligent fashion as some mental health patients seem to able to buy arms.It IS a difficult step and I really would like to see some changes in the right to bear arms ammendment,but no I dont have the complete answer.

So if the government decided to start putting everyone into death camps and had full military control hand guns would be enough to stop it?

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What's so bad about gun control?

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What's so bad about gun control?

Watch the video.

Anyhow, I cant believe abc is running this story. Maybe that governmnet AP phone records thing really backfired. No pun intended.

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The video does not take insular laws, and how they don't work, into context.

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I think our founding fathers were smarter than you think and were taking the future into consideration when giving us the right to bear arms. Maybe they didn't know they types of weapons we have now would exist but they knew government and knew someone would decide we shouldn't have them at all at some point.

Of course we need some gun control but it fails to keep them out of the hands that steal them or get them by illegal means. My problem with some of the laws that deal with people with mental difficulties its too broad. They want to band anyone that has ever seen a psychologist for any reason from getting one.

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There is a drastic difference between a Gun Ban and Gun Control.

Gun control can be just as easy as screening people who purchase guns, ensuring that they do not have a history of violent tendencies.

Yes criminals don't care, but the person who has snapped and will snap again they more then likely will go through the proper channels.

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Posted (edited)

It's easy and clear to work out.

Will a nut case or criminal who is going to break the law and kill people going to care about getting a gun legally and with a license? No. So what difference will it make? Good honest people will not be able to defend themselves against criminals or nut cases or the government.

First, good honest people should have no problem passing checks so I think that point is moot.

Second, the argument you’re making is “criminals are just going to end up breaking them, so there’s really no point in making laws.” Do you really think thats a good argument?

Edited by Odin11
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First, good honest people should have no problem passing checks so I think that point is moot.

Second, the argument you’re making is “criminals are just going to end up breaking them, so there’s really no point in making laws.” Do you really think thats a good argument?

if it's the criminals that are the problem then why make the laws for normal people? They want to take automatic weapons away from everyone, not just put checks in place. The checks will be for normal handguns etc and if they go the ay of Canada where they cna class you as mentally unstable without reason... Then this isn't going to go well is it. You probably don't evne know why your country has the 2nd Amendment and what they fought against.

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Laws are for everyone, not just criminals or "normal people".

Actually, it is hard to tell what "they" want, since there is no real discussion taking place. Gun control is a pretty wide field, with lots of different rule-sets. Right now, only the extremes are in the focus of intention, which is not helping the case at all.

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if it's the criminals that are the problem then why make the laws for normal people? They want to take automatic weapons away from everyone, not just put checks in place. The checks will be for normal handguns etc and if they go the ay of Canada where they cna class you as mentally unstable without reason... Then this isn't going to go well is it. You probably don't evne know why your country has the 2nd Amendment and what they fought against.

Why be rude? No really? Why do you make the assumption that I’m ignorant of U.S history? Why make the assumption that I’m anti-gun or anti- 2nd Amendment? This is the first time I’ve said anything in a gun control topic, you know nothing of my views on guns. The only thing you can take from my post is that I disagreed with your bad argument. This is why it’s near impossible to have real discussions about gun control. All you saw was that I disagreed with you, and then you just assumed that I’m anti-gun and called me ignorant. How is that helping?

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Why be rude? No really? Why do you make the assumption that I’m ignorant of U.S history? Why make the assumption that I’m anti-gun or anti- 2nd Amendment? This is the first time I’ve said anything in a gun control topic, you know nothing of my views on guns. The only thing you can take from my post is that I disagreed with your bad argument. This is why it’s near impossible to have real discussions about gun control. All you saw was that I disagreed with you, and then you just assumed that I’m anti-gun and called me ignorant. How is that helping?

I did not assume you are anti gun, but if you knew anything about the 2nd amendment you would certainly want fully auto.semi auto assault rifles.

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First, good honest people should have no problem passing checks so I think that point is moot.

Second, the argument you’re making is “criminals are just going to end up breaking them, so there’s really no point in making laws.” Do you really think thats a good argument?

It is a good argument if the purpose of the law is to eliminate guns in the hands of the wrong people. If the purpose of the law is something else, unstated, then perhaps not.

Most of the time any given law creates more unintended consequences than it does achieve its stated goals.

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It is a good argument if the purpose of the law is to eliminate guns in the hands of the wrong people. If the purpose of the law is something else, unstated, then perhaps not.

Most of the time any given law creates more unintended consequences than it does achieve its stated goals.

The top line: Indeed.

Second line: Do you have an example for what you have in mind? Do you have a general distrust towards your lawmakers?

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The top line: Indeed.

Second line: Do you have an example for what you have in mind? Do you have a general distrust towards your lawmakers?

I hope so. The trust of the public has certainly not been earned in recent years.

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Same question to you then: Any examples?

(I am not trying to prove anything here, but being in Germany, and thus pretty far away from everyday lawmaking in the US, I'd just like to get some arguments)

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Posted (edited)

examples?? if you don't see them, (and they are, right in your face), than i don't see any point for anyone to waste their time on that, buddy.

but in case you missed the train that hit you. how about jump in home brake ins in uk after heandgun ban, same for australia, how about highest murder\brake in rate in dc during handgun ban. the links are like in dozens of threads, i'm not reposting them, if you debate on the subject you should have read them before, but than again, if you ask these questions, you pbly just ignore inconvinient facts, and play ignorance.

and also just in case you mised it too, almost entire american population, has a general distrust towards lawmakers, i would think it would be pretty clear for someone that is on this board and posts (and one would hope reads as well), would be cristal clear.

Edited by aztek

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Posted (edited)

examples?? if you don't see them, (and they are, right in your face), than i don't see any point for anyone to waste their time on that, buddy.

but in case you missed the train that hit you. how about jump in home brake ins in uk after heandgun ban, same for australia, how about highest murder\brake in rate in dc during handgun ban. the links are like in dozens of threads, i'm not reposting them, if you debate on the subject you should have read them before, but than again, if you ask these questions, you pbly just ignore inconvinient facts, and play ignorance.

I wasn't talking about gun control, but this:

(...)

Most of the time any given law creates more unintended consequences than it does achieve its stated goals.

But thank you for being in attack mode again.

Edited by FLOMBIE

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Posted (edited)

Same question to you then: Any examples?

(I am not trying to prove anything here, but being in Germany, and thus pretty far away from everyday lawmaking in the US, I'd just like to get some arguments)

There are scandles uncovered almost every week in which elected officials have been involved in. I assume even more are not uncovered. Questionable decisions are made that benefit the lawmakers. Of course we try to vote someone else in, but it's more of the same. When hundreds of elected officials vote straight down the party lines, you know there are many unethical among them. When un-related stuff is added to bills to get it passed, you know there is corruption. There are not many reasons to trust our lawmakers.

Edited by Myles
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There are scandles uncovered almost every week in which elected officials have been involved in. I assume even more are not uncovered. Questionable decisions are made that benefit the lawmakers. Of course we try to vote someone else in, but it's more of the same. When hundreds of elected officials vote straight down the party lines, you know there are many unethical among them. When un-related stuff is added to bills to get it passed, you know there is corruption. There are not many reasons to trust our lawmakers.

I see, thank you. That is at least something. :)

(...)

how about jump in home brake ins in uk after heandgun ban, same for australia,

Not quite: Property crime in the UK

how about highest murder\brake in rate in dc during handgun ban.

Well, of course. Insular laws are destined to fail.

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Posted (edited)

yes, quite abit.

The Government's latest crime figures were condemned as "truly terrible" by the Tories today as it emerged that gun crime in England and Wales soared by 35% last year.

Criminals used handguns in 46% more offences, Home Office statistics revealed.

(NOW WHERE DO THEY GET HANDGUNS,?? IF NO ONE HAS THEM, ALL LAW ABIDING FOLKS, SURRENDERED THEM, I GUESS THAT PUTS A HUGE HOLE IN THE ARGUMENT, IF LAW ABIDING CITIZENS DON'T HAVE THEM, AND NONE ARE FOR SALE LEGALY, CROOKS WONT HAVE ANYWHERE TO STEAL THEM FROM.

ANOTHER FALLACY FALLS APART LIKE HOUSE OF CARDS.)

Firearms were used in 9,974 recorded crimes in the 12 months to last April, up from 7,362.

It was the fourth consecutive year to see a rise and there were more than 2,200 more gun crimes last year than the previous peak in 1993.

Figures showed the number of crimes involving handguns had more than doubled since the post-Dunblane massacre ban on the weapons, from 2,636 in 1997-1998 to 5,871.

Unadjusted figures showed overall recorded crime in the 12 months to last September rose 9.3%, but the Home Office stressed that new procedures had skewed the figures.

http://townhall.com/...banned-n1464528

After the ban, more than 160,000 law-abiding citizens gave up their handguns. The idea was to stop gun violence. But ironically, crime-related gun violence jumped a whopping 40 percent in the two years after the ban. And since then, gun crime has continued to soarat an alarming rate.

http://frontpagemag....sh-gun-control/

ALSO THIS

7 Gun Control Facts That Are Actually Myths

Edited by aztek
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Dr. Suzanna Hupp Testimony Before Congress on the 2nd Amendment

Luby’s Cafeteria Massacre survivor Dr. Suzanna Gratia Hupp testifying to Congress on why good Americans obeying bad gun laws leads to death and suffering. The former Texas House Representative shared her story about her parents being killed before her eyes by a shooter in a Luby’s Restaurant. Due to gun restrictions, she had left her gun in her car that fateful day. Ever since, she has been spreading the word about a right-to-carry law would have probably saved her parents’ lives.

How can that be, when guns kill almost 30,000 Americans a year? Because while we hear about the murders and accidents, we don't often hear about the crimes stopped because would-be victims showed a gun and scared criminals away. Those thwarted crimes and lives saved usually aren't reported to police (sometimes for fear the gun will be confiscated), and when they are reported, the media tend to ignore them. No bang, no news.

This state of affairs produces a distorted public impression of guns. If you only hear about the crimes and accidents, and never about lives saved, you might think gun ownership is folly.

But, hey, if guns save lives, it logically follows that gun laws cost lives.

Suzanna Hupp and her parents were having lunch at Luby's cafeteria in Killeen, Texas, when a man began shooting diners with his handgun, even stopping to reload. Suzanna's parents were two of the 23 people killed. (Twenty more were wounded.)

Suzanna owned a handgun, but because Texas law at the time did not permit her to carry it with her, she left it in her car. She's confident that she could have stopped the shooting spree if she had her gun. (Texas has since changed its law.)

Today, 40 states issue permits to competent, law-abiding adults to carry concealed handguns (Vermont and Alaska have the most libertarian approach: no permit needed. Arizona is about to join that exclusive club.) Every time a carry law was debated, anti-gun activists predicted outbreaks of gun violence after fender-benders, card games and domestic quarrels.

What happened?

John Lott, in "More Guns, Less Crime," explains that crime fell by 10 percent in the year after the laws were passed. A reason for the drop in crime may have been that criminals suddenly worried that their next victim might be armed. Indeed, criminals in states with high civilian gun ownership were the most worried about encountering armed victims.

In Canada and Britain, both with tough gun-control laws, almost half of all burglaries occur when residents are home. But in the United States, where many households contain guns, only 13 percent of burglaries happen when someone_s at home.

Taken from http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2010/06/23/guns_save_lives_106057.html

On his Tuesday evening broadcast, Glenn Beck hosted a special guest panel comprising people who have survived the unspeakable atrocity of rape. What’s more, these guests maintain that their attack might have been prevented if they had been equipped with a means of self-defense. Many of the attacks occurred in gun-free zones, underscoring the reality that people of goodwill were left defenseless, while those with an intent to do harm still found a way to wreak their havoc.

Included on the panel was Amanda Collins, who was raped at gunpoint in a garage situated on her college campus. Her attacker, James Biela, had already raped two other women and murdered a third. He is now serving his sentence on Death Row.

It can and has certainly been argued that Collins, who was trained in the proper use of guns from childhood, could have stopped her attacker had she been carrying a weapon, and perhaps even saved other lives Biela would target next. According to Beck, Collins did in fact own a gun and had a concealed carry license but it was illegal to carry the firearm on her college campus.

“I was denied the one equalizing factor that I had,” she said.

Another panelist, Kim Corban Weeks was attacked and raped in her own home by an intruder. She escaped after convincing her attacker that she would not report the crime, but eerily, he remained at her residence to speak with her for an hour after the incident. Eventually he was apprehended and is now serving 24 years to life. Weeks is now an avid supporter of gun rights and is married to a police officer.

Taken from http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/02/26/survivors-of-rape-speak-out-against-gun-control-i-was-denied-the-one-equalizing-factor-that-i-had/

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Posted (edited)

@aztek:

That is completely different from what you have claimed before. You were talking about a raise in break-ins, now you have changed the subject, and also posted a very biased article. The rate went up, and is now steadily declining. All your articles fail to mention that. I have to leave the house now, so I will elaborate more on this later on. For now, I leave this link of a pdf by the UK House of Parliament. Please have a look at the chart on page 5.

http://www.parliament.uk/briefing-papers/sn01940.pdf‎

Edited by FLOMBIE

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and brake ins did rise. so proves my link. read it again.

so my links are biased but yours are not?? lol, of course.

So are gun-related crimes, domestic burglary, retail burglary, (from the article), those are brake ins, and armed robbery.

don't waste your time trying to elaborate more on this later on. there is nothing you can show me, that i have not seen before.

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