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Burmese Muslims given two-child limit

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YANGON, Myanmar -- Authorities in Myanmar's western Rakhine state have imposed a two-child limit for Muslim Rohingya families, a policy that does not apply to Buddhists in the area and comes amid accusations of ethnic cleansing in the aftermath of sectarian violence.

One Region in Myanmar Limits Births of Muslims

Sectarian violence in Burma first flared nearly a year ago in Rakhine state between the region's Rakhine Buddhists and Muslim Rohingya. Mobs of Buddhists armed with machetes razed thousands of Muslim homes, leaving hundreds of people dead and forcing 125,000 to flee, mostly Muslims.

Since the violence, religious unrest has developed into a campaign against the country's Muslim communities in other regions.

Burmese Muslims given two-child limit

Human Rights Watch has accused the authorities in Rakhine of fomenting an organized campaign of “ethnic cleansing” against the Rohingya.

Since then, violence against Muslims has erupted in a few other parts of the country. Containing the strife has posed a serious challenge to Mr. Thein Sein’s government as it tries to make democratic reforms. It has also tarnished the image of opposition leader Daw Aung San Suu Kyi, who has been criticized for failing to speak out strongly in defense of Muslims.

One Region in Myanmar Limits Births of Muslims

YANGON, Myanmar: Opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi and Islamic leaders expressed dismay over decisions by authorities in western Myanmar to restore a two-child limit on Muslim Rohingya families, a policy that does not apply to Buddhists and follows accusations of ethnic cleansing.

Opposition leader Suu Kyi Slams two-child limit for Myanmar Muslims

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Barbaric. I do not support Islam as a religion because it is also a political system and is bent on subjugation of other cultures - this is indisputable from the words of their texts. BUT... to selectively tell any population that they cannot have children is unacceptable. It seems like harmful, hurtful discrimination of the highest order.
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Not going to agree with the first part but liking how we can agree on your latter thought and then. Cheers mate.

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Not that I condone their action but a Buddhist woman was raped and killed by a Muslim, they think, and that is why the monks attacked them.

http://www.alternet.org/world/buddhist-myanmar-monks-gone-wild

Maybe they feel if they don't control their population their Buddhist nation will become a Muslim nation.

"The population growth of Rohingya Muslims is 10 times higher than that of the Rakhine (Buddhists)," Win Myaing said. "Overpopulation is one of the causes of tension."

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Let nobody repeat the lie that Buddhism is a non-violent religion from this day forward.

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Not that I condone their action but a Buddhist woman was raped and killed by a Muslim, they think, and that is why the monks attacked them.

http://www.alternet....monks-gone-wild

Maybe they feel if they don't control their population their Buddhist nation will become a Muslim nation.

oh yeah ? how about thousands of muslims were litarly massacared by buddhist in Myanmar ?

it was not over a rape .. it was going toward ethnic cleansing

using that logic all racial groups should attack and kill each other

coz no racial or religion group is " criminal free "

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Posted (edited)

Indeed no religion is perfect. Some might have better track records but history proves Buddhism has veered toward violence before and there are sacred texts that approve it. Good thing most don't follow them.

Edited by Leave Britney alone!

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Not going to agree with the first part but liking how we can agree on your latter thought and then. Cheers mate.

And to you LBa. I think if you study the Qur'an and Hadith literature you will see the accuracy of my first statement but regardless, the second part is true. My daughter was found on a cold November morning about 5 blocks from a Beijing police station just bundled up on a curb. NO child should be deprived of their life or existence if it can be helped and these people reduce it to a statement of religious intolerance.
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And to you LBa. I think if you study the Qur'an and Hadith literature you will see the accuracy of my first statement but regardless, the second part is true. My daughter was found on a cold November morning about 5 blocks from a Beijing police station just bundled up on a curb. NO child should be deprived of their life or existence if it can be helped and these people reduce it to a statement of religious intolerance.

man i thought every time you claimed dumb thing said in Quran i proved it wrong

why do you presist on such claims ?

don't tell me study of koran and hadith .. you don't know jack about quran and hadith

you told hadith told by tabari : while hadiths are told by only few known people in islam called hadith tellers

and regarding quran you have no room to argue .. you been proved false everytime you post

would you please stop nonsense and empty accusations ?

and most aweful claim is when you say : study hadith and koran when you don't know any thing about both

except what you copy and past from hate sites

thank you !

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A completely unacceptable policy.

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man i thought every time you claimed dumb thing said in Quran i proved it wrong

why do you presist on such claims ?

don't tell me study of koran and hadith .. you don't know jack about quran and hadith

you told hadith told by tabari : while hadiths are told by only few known people in islam called hadith tellers

and regarding quran you have no room to argue .. you been proved false everytime you post

would you please stop nonsense and empty accusations ?

and most aweful claim is when you say : study hadith and koran when you don't know any thing about both

except what you copy and past from hate sites

thank you !

KoS everything I ever copied and pasted was referenced FROM the Qur'an. I am not spreading lies.

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Posted (edited)

KoS everything I ever copied and pasted was referenced FROM the Qur'an. I am not spreading lies.

yes you are spreading lies when you post line like

" kill your nighbors " and claim it complete line without copying the rest of it which could says " if they attacked you and tried to kill you "

that's called proagenda spreading .. lies is the exact word for it .. half true intended to spread certain mentality

that's what they call " one sided point of view "

every thing you ever posted was half true .. part of verse and leaving the second important verse out

like that previous post you did in another topic you didn't bother to clear

i hereby challenge you to give me your best shot in debate in topic of your choosing

we'll see then if your debate hold any ground at all " even though am almost sure you won't "

based on what you been posting .. you never ever studied Quran or Hadith

you don't know meaning of verses .. the events those verse were directed to among other things

you don't know about Hadith and who tells them

you can't tell the difference between hadith teller and historian

my challenge stand should you want to engage in debate let me know when and where you posting it

surely not here though it's no the topic for it

peace

Edited by Knight Of Shadows
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Both of your mono-theisms are barbaric and silly.

These are PEOPLE. Religion doesn't define most people on this planet. There are people suffering and dying and all you can talk about is whose God has a bigger penis.

And Then; try envisioning these people as 'potential Christians' and see if you feel any different.

If there is a religion that deserves any bashing in this thread it's Buddhism. They have received a free pass for far too long. Reincarnation is one of the key teachings in Buddhism, so why don't the Buddhists remove themselves from worldly problems as their religion dictates, allow the Muslims to die and reincarnate further up or down the ladder to Nirvana? Or is it a matter of; they aren't Buddhists in this life so they aren't going to attain Nirvana this time around, so it's OK to kill them.

It illustrates quite plainly (except of course to zealots), that even the most well intended doctrines can turn deadly in the hands of the mob. And that goes for all religions.

Now play nice, boys.

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yes you are spreading lies when you post line like

" kill your nighbors " and claim it complete line without copying the rest of it which could says " if they attacked you and tried to kill you "

that's called proagenda spreading .. lies is the exact word for it .. half true intended to spread certain mentality

that's what they call " one sided point of view "

every thing you ever posted was half true .. part of verse and leaving the second important verse out

like that previous post you did in another topic you didn't bother to clear

i hereby challenge you to give me your best shot in debate in topic of your choosing

we'll see then if your debate hold any ground at all " even though am almost sure you won't "

based on what you been posting .. you never ever studied Quran or Hadith

you don't know meaning of verses .. the events those verse were directed to among other things

you don't know about Hadith and who tells them

you can't tell the difference between hadith teller and historian

my challenge stand should you want to engage in debate let me know when and where you posting it

surely not here though it's no the topic for it

peace

Nice try KoS. I admit I am no scholar of the Hadiths OR the Qur'an or the sunnah. I don't want or need to be. Perhaps you can explain the following verses and how each is being taken out of context?

Qur'an: surah 2 verses 191-193

2 : 244

2 : 216

3 : 151

and my favorite 8 : 12

These verses bespeak of terrible violence against non-believers...PERIOD....that is their only offense. Islam is a religious/POLITICAL system of belief which wants to subjugate and exercise control over all humanity. PERIOD. I like you KoS and I have tried to be a civil individual regarding your beliefs because they are important and it is not my place to condemn anyone but when you condemn me and say basically that I lie then I must defend myself.

Both of your mono-theisms are barbaric and silly.

These are PEOPLE. Religion doesn't define most people on this planet. There are people suffering and dying and all you can talk about is whose God has a bigger penis.

And Then; try envisioning these people as 'potential Christians' and see if you feel any different.

If there is a religion that deserves any bashing in this thread it's Buddhism. They have received a free pass for far too long. Reincarnation is one of the key teachings in Buddhism, so why don't the Buddhists remove themselves from worldly problems as their religion dictates, allow the Muslims to die and reincarnate further up or down the ladder to Nirvana? Or is it a matter of; they aren't Buddhists in this life so they aren't going to attain Nirvana this time around, so it's OK to kill them.

It illustrates quite plainly (except of course to zealots), that even the most well intended doctrines can turn deadly in the hands of the mob. And that goes for all religions.

Now play nice, boys.

Welcome to UM Almagest. You are a bit tardy to the discussion but you are welcome anyway. I do not hate Muslims, neither do I want them killed or even suppressed EXCEPT when they attempt to control me or my way of life. Frankly, with the evidences of the past decade it is foolish to defend Islam as a "religion of peace". The facts do not support this claim. The facts point to a clash of "civilizations" that is setting the world up for one hellish war soon. Dissecting the causes and laying blame is an exercise in futility imo. It is unstoppable and it is coming relatively soon, I think.

Notice the next few post after this statement of mine. I probably will be alluded to as a hater or some such. I will be told that I am desiring the end of the world and the destruction of many people. All because I expressed a BELIEF about the words of scripture. When people talk about you with such vehemence it makes you wonder what they are so invested in that they cannot just quietly read what seems to them an erroneous opinion. They can't though. Thought like mine MUST be suppressed you see.....

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Welcome to UM Almagest. You are a bit tardy to the discussion but you are welcome anyway. I do not hate Muslims, neither do I want them killed or even suppressed EXCEPT when they attempt to control me or my way of life. Frankly, with the evidences of the past decade it is foolish to defend Islam as a "religion of peace". The facts do not support this claim. The facts point to a clash of "civilizations" that is setting the world up for one hellish war soon. Dissecting the causes and laying blame is an exercise in futility imo. It is unstoppable and it is coming relatively soon, I think.

Notice the next few post after this statement of mine. I probably will be alluded to as a hater or some such. I will be told that I am desiring the end of the world and the destruction of many people. All because I expressed a BELIEF about the words of scripture. When people talk about you with such vehemence it makes you wonder what they are so invested in that they cannot just quietly read what seems to them an erroneous opinion. They can't though. Thought like mine MUST be suppressed you see.....

We should consider ourselves lucky to live in countries where this kind of persecution does not happen. I'm well aware of your affinity for eschatology. I was formerly Cradle of Fish, but I forgot my password and figured it was time for a more relevant username. Almagest comes from the Arabic Al-Majisti, which means 'Greatest' and is the name we know Claudius Ptolemy's Great Treatise by because it practically fell out of use in Europe until it was re-introduced by Islamic scholars.

I agree that Islam cannot be described as a religion of peace until it acts like it, but I think that applies to all religions. It shouldn't be our responsibility to reign in their fanatics, it should be the responsibility of moderate Muslims. And they do it, it just isn't as newsworthy as the bad things that happen. I'm of the opinion that people are generally peaceful until they are given a reason not to be, and it seems like the Us versus Them mentality that pervades monotheism is a major reason. But as demonstrated by the recent events in Myanmar, the phenomenon isn't restricted to monotheistic religions. What's saddest of all is we have all these religions promising peace, but people still do stuff like this to one another.

I know I've argued against your views as being fatalistic before, but I don't dislike you because of it. On the contrary, I find those with a lot of views opposed to mine more interesting to talk to. All I'd say is that Christians have been assuming that the End Times have been just around the corner since the very first followers of Christ, and time and time again it nothing has happened. Eschatology is based on a lot of assumptions, for one who says that the Israel of the end times necessarily is on this planet? We could be ten years, or a hundred, or a thousand, away from such an event if it is going to occur. For all we know a Gamma-Ray Burst might hit us tomorrow and wipe us all out. I think it's better to live as though these things aren't going to happen, and that includes resisting the fatalistic train of thought that such a war in inevitable.

I am worried about the future of the Middle East, if we have a large number of Islamic Republics dominated by different sects of Islam it could easily erupt into quite a sizable war. Millions of people who did nothing wrong except being born in the wrong country at the wrong time may die over the actions of a few fanatics. But I don't see it as the end of the world. It would take something drastic for rational powers such as the USA, China and Russia to bring their nuclear arsenal to the table and turn a regional conflict into a world one.

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Nice try KoS. I admit I am no scholar of the Hadiths OR the Qur'an or the sunnah. I don't want or need to be. Perhaps you can explain the following verses and how each is being taken out of context?

Qur'an: surah 2 verses 191-193

2 : 244

2 : 216

3 : 151

and my favorite 8 : 12

These verses bespeak of terrible violence against non-believers...PERIOD....that is their only offense. Islam is a religious/POLITICAL system of belief which wants to subjugate and exercise control over all humanity. PERIOD. I like you KoS and I have tried to be a civil individual regarding your beliefs because they are important and it is not my place to condemn anyone but when you condemn me and say basically that I lie then I must defend myself.Welcome to UM Almagest. You are a bit tardy to the discussion but you are

give me the complete verses am not familiar of the numbers of verses in english-translated Quran

so write me the verses and i will find them in my arabic version then address them

and i only accuse you of lying on certain bases which i explained in my previous posts

that they are half true taken one part of verse into account and leaving the rest out

and other times you just don't have enough knowledge on the verses or whom they directed to

so write down those verses you refeering to and i'll be more than happy to address them

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We should consider ourselves lucky to live in countries where this kind of persecution does not happen. I'm well aware of your affinity for eschatology. I was formerly Cradle of Fish, but I forgot my password and figured it was time for a more relevant username. Almagest comes from the Arabic Al-Majisti, which means 'Greatest' and is the name we know Claudius Ptolemy's Great Treatise by because it practically fell out of use in Europe until it was re-introduced by Islamic scholars.

I agree that Islam cannot be described as a religion of peace until it acts like it, but I think that applies to all religions. It shouldn't be our responsibility to reign in their fanatics, it should be the responsibility of moderate Muslims. And they do it, it just isn't as newsworthy as the bad things that happen. I'm of the opinion that people are generally peaceful until they are given a reason not to be, and it seems like the Us versus Them mentality that pervades monotheism is a major reason. But as demonstrated by the recent events in Myanmar, the phenomenon isn't restricted to monotheistic religions. What's saddest of all is we have all these religions promising peace, but people still do stuff like this to one another.

I know I've argued against your views as being fatalistic before, but I don't dislike you because of it. On the contrary, I find those with a lot of views opposed to mine more interesting to talk to. All I'd say is that Christians have been assuming that the End Times have been just around the corner since the very first followers of Christ, and time and time again it nothing has happened. Eschatology is based on a lot of assumptions, for one who says that the Israel of the end times necessarily is on this planet? We could be ten years, or a hundred, or a thousand, away from such an event if it is going to occur. For all we know a Gamma-Ray Burst might hit us tomorrow and wipe us all out. I think it's better to live as though these things aren't going to happen, and that includes resisting the fatalistic train of thought that such a war in inevitable.

I am worried about the future of the Middle East, if we have a large number of Islamic Republics dominated by different sects of Islam it could easily erupt into quite a sizable war. Millions of people who did nothing wrong except being born in the wrong country at the wrong time may die over the actions of a few fanatics. But I don't see it as the end of the world. It would take something drastic for rational powers such as the USA, China and Russia to bring their nuclear arsenal to the table and turn a regional conflict into a world one.

We agree on much. And I hope you understand that I am not Satan incarnate, drooling over the prospect of mass death just so I can escape away to some place of eternal bliss. Actually I view "heaven" as a continuation of my consciousness in the presence of that force which created us all. I hope that it will be an existence of love and joy because we will continue learning and developing and finally have no need to hurt others any longer - especially when it is done just for the pleasure of hurting them.

The reason I believe that the anointed One is coming soon is because the scriptures are pretty inclusive of all the signs that will precede His arrival and many are blaring from the TV daily. If, as you say, it is a hundred years hence then so be it. My life here will end probably within 20 years or less - if I am true to the longevity of my parents - and at death I will finally know the truth....or nothing at all...

My longing for Christ's return isn't about punishment for anyone - it's about wanting the world to finally be healed of the pain and brokenness that makes life a misery for so many. Most of us try to "first, do no harm" but there is only so much that can be done against the tide of destructive natures that abound in the world.

Glad to see you back - as I recall we debated hotly from time to time but I still respect you for your opinions :)

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Indeed no religion is perfect. Some might have better track records but history proves Buddhism has veered toward violence before and there are sacred texts that approve it. Good thing most don't follow them.

I'd be interested to read these sacred texts. Can you point out which sutras or shastras they're contained in?

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the situation in Burma ... actually "Myanmar" to be accurate ... is political ..... not religio ....

:no:

why do you guys don't want to see the difference ? just a it is in the MIddle East //

be strong with knowledge then ... only ... then be :

401073_415826898515330_641174377_n.jpg

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Posted (edited)

I'd be interested to read these sacred texts. Can you point out which sutras or shastras they're contained in?

Those sacred texts with excerpts were presented on this thread.

Examples were given from Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra, White History of the Tenfold Virtuous Dharma, Arya-Bodhisattva-gocara-upayavishay a-vikrurvana-nirdesha Sutra, Upayakaushalya Sutra, and the Kalachakra Tantra which particularly, "describes an eschatological war in which the army of the bodhisattva king of Shambhala finally conquers and annihilates the Muslim forces in order to destroy the barbarian religion and to reestablish Buddhism." [The Oxford Handbook of Religion and Violence]

=============================================================

In addition a preview of Buddhist Warfare, also published by Oxford, is available online.

Edited by Leave Britney alone!

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LASHIO, Myanmar — It was a terrifying sight: hundreds of angry, armed men on motorcycles advancing up a dusty street with no one to stop them.

Shouting at the top of their lungs, clutching machetes and iron pipes and long bamboo poles, they thrust their fists repeatedly into the air.

The object of their rage: Myanmar's embattled minority Muslim community.

Myanmar Mosque, Muslim Orphanage Burned After Alleged Immolation Of Buddhist Woman

No end in sight. Send in the peacekeepers.

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Posted (edited)

Let nobody repeat the lie that Buddhism is a non-violent religion from this day forward.

Then you should quote texts from Buddhist scriptures that support the decision. I think you'll have a hard time finding even one.

+++

EDIT:

Ah, I stand corrected:

Those sacred texts with excerpts were presented on this thread.

Examples were given from Mahayana Mahaparinirvana Sutra, White History of the Tenfold Virtuous Dharma, Arya-Bodhisattva-gocara-upayavishay a-vikrurvana-nirdesha Sutra, Upayakaushalya Sutra, and the Kalachakra Tantra which particularly, "describes an eschatological war in which the army of the bodhisattva king of Shambhala finally conquers and annihilates the Muslim forces in order to destroy the barbarian religion and to reestablish Buddhism." [The Oxford Handbook of Religion and Violence]

=============================================================

In addition a preview of Buddhist Warfare, also published by Oxford, is available online.

But something tells me that, even though it is in Buddhist scriptures, it is not according to the words of Buddha himself.

.

Edited by Abramelin
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~snip

But something tells me that, even though it is in Buddhist scriptures, it is not according to the words of Buddha himself.

.

Those are not from any scriptures Abe ... note the source ... it is History as noted by a Buddhist Kingdom Historian

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