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docyabut2

Zimmerman trial

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hmmm well I think he is guilty personally. First off: the kid didn't have a weapon, unless you call ice tea and skittles as one. Second: He was on the phone with his girlfriend. Third: Treavon was shot in the back.

Trayvon marchers: 'We want an arrest. Shot in the chest'

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-31/news/os-trayvon-martin-naacp-march-sanford-20120331_1_trayvon-marchers-arrest-chest

Not sure till the trial proceeds, but I believe all the reports are trayvon was shot in the chest.

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hmmm well I think he is guilty personally. First off: the kid didn't have a weapon, unless you call ice tea and skittles as one. Second: He was on the phone with his girlfriend. Third: Treavon was shot in the back.

That's interesting. I hadn't heard that before. Are you sure?

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White racists will undoubtedly get behind the argument of self-defense...will even embrace George Zimmerman as a hero. The rest of the population can see how wrong and ill-advised Zimmerman's series of choices and actions were the night Martin died.

I don't buy that. You don't have to be a "White racist" to think that he *might* have been forced to defend himself if he thought that his life was in danger. You also don't need to be a "Black racist" to think that George *might* have provoked and/or threatened Trayvon after he was told to let the police handle the situation. That's why we should let the facts shape our views, not vice versa.

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hmmm well I think he is guilty personally. First off: the kid didn't have a weapon, unless you call ice tea and skittles as one. Second: He was on the phone with his girlfriend. Third: Treavon was shot in the back.

What if his head was pounded into the pavement? What if there was a struggle for his gun?

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By the way, can you explain where I gave you a racist impression? Siding with George is not racist.

George *might* have murdered Trayvon in cold blood. That remains to be seen. Ideologues on both sides never needed any stinking facts since they "knew" what happened before the trial even began. Their agendas and narratives are tiresome. Let's see what happens in court, and let the chips fall where they may. By the way, you were unfairly criticized, and I would like somebody to post just one specific example of racism in your posts. If such accusations and allegations can't be backed up with facts, not bull****, an apology is in order. I think that's fair.

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The guy shot an unarmed teen. Simple, put him away for as long as possible.

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The guy shot an unarmed teen. Simple, put him away for as long as possible.

Simple minded maybe. Tell you what - you let a guy break your nose and knock you smooth down to the ground THEN straddle you and pound your head into the ground until you are losing consciousness and then get back to me with how simple it all is...
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What if his head was pounded into the pavement? What if there was a struggle for his gun?

OK, well why would that have happened anyway? Why was Zimmerman close enough for Martin to pound his head into the pavement or struggle for the gun? Zimmerman should NOT have followed Martin his car, and certainly NOT stopped his car, gotten out and gone up to him. There should have been no contact, no close proximity. Zimmerman overstepped his authority by playing cop. He knew the police were on their way. All he said the young man was doing was walking along. He didn't say he saw Martin trying to jimmy a window or the lock on a car door. That is not just provocation for going vigilante and taking the law into one's own hands. That makes Zimmerman guilty, plain and simple.

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OK, well why would that have happened anyway? Why was Zimmerman close enough for Martin to pound his head into the pavement or struggle for the gun? Zimmerman should NOT have followed Martin his car, and certainly NOT stopped his car, gotten out and gone up to him. There should have been no contact, no close proximity. Zimmerman overstepped his authority by playing cop. He knew the police were on their way. All he said the young man was doing was walking along. He didn't say he saw Martin trying to jimmy a window or the lock on a car door. That is not just provocation for going vigilante and taking the law into one's own hands. That makes Zimmerman guilty, plain and simple.

He shouldn't have followed Trayvon Martin. That's true. However, you and I don't know what happened after that. That's why we have a court system. It could be that George Zimmerman was forced to save his own life. It could be that he murdered Trayvon Martin in cold blood. Again, you and I don't know for sure, and it's up to a *fair, honest* jury to decide. I apologize if you have psychic powers.

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That is not just provocation for going vigilante and taking the law into one's own hands. That makes Zimmerman guilty, plain and simple.

Guilty of what? Feel free to be specific.

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Posted (edited)

Guilty of what? Feel free to be specific.

Acting reckless and causing the death of another, with or without intent... That's what he's being charged with, and that's what he did and admitted to doing.. His entire defense is just an excuse as to why he did it...

By the way, regardless of what happened after he got out the truck... Florida Common Law specifically states that if you create a dangerous situation for yourself you can't defend yourself from it. You "defending" yourself would just be you further breaking the law. You create a dangerous situation, you walk away.

Btw: There is no such thing as a legitimate crime watch anywhere in the United States that accepts the pursuing/confronting of suspicious persons. What he did was beyond that of a crime watch captain.

Oh and one last note, you try following a cop until he becomes paranoid.. Then approach him and when he asks what you problem is, reply "I don't have a problem" while reaching for your pockets.. You want to know what happens? Very high chance you get much more than a couple little cuts... Oh cops can defend themselves but not teens? Oh and him saying he was reaching for his phone... Would it make sense for him to walk up to Trayvon to then call the police on him? Would you walk up to someone to then whip your phone out and call the cops?

If Zimmerman walks away from this, he's basically walking away from jumping in front of a moving car and then shooting the driver dead because he felt his life threatened by the driver.

Edited by xFelix
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Acting reckless and causing the death of another, with or without intent... That's what he's being charged with, and that's what he did and admitted to doing.. His entire defense is just an excuse as to why he did it...

By the way, regardless of what happened after he got out the truck... Florida Common Law specifically states that if you create a dangerous situation for yourself you can't defend yourself from it. You "defending" yourself would just be you further breaking the law. You create a dangerous situation, you walk away.

You don't know that. Yes, he shouldn't have pursued Martin, but he had a right to shoot him *if* Martin tried to kill him. That kind of self defense is allowed by all states and most countries. We don't know what happened, so we can't *fairly* pass judgment until we do.

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Martin came up on him tried to rob him he though Zimmerman was a pushover and he got shot for it.

Martin was a thief.

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Posted (edited)

You don't know that. Yes, he shouldn't have pursued Martin, but he had a right to shoot him *if* Martin tried to kill him. That kind of self defense is allowed by all states and most countries. We don't know what happened, so we can't *fairly* pass judgment until we do.

How do I not know that, he admitted it out of his own mouth, with his lawyer sitting next to him.

Then again, he has changed his story a couple times, why not one more time right?

Remember when he kept saying that he stopped pursuing when the dispatcher said not to? Well that was before Trayvon got shot, guess what had to happen to place Zimmerman all the way out there between houses shooting an unarmed teen? You guessed it, he had to pursue after the dispatcher said to stop. So he lied? Hmmm...

He said the teen punched him completely unprovoked, but then says the teen punched him when he reached for his pocket.. So he lied again?

He said he was defending himself, even though he is the aggressor who was chasing the teen down like he was the law... He was the one that reached for his pocket to grab his "phone" while confronting someone he clearly told dispatch he believed to be dangerous.

Then there's those people who say "I never knew reaching for your pockets in an argument was a crime", no it is not. I tell you what it is though, a threat against your life. Every police officer in the entire country can verify that. Put your hands in your pockets and they will all say the same thing. "Get your hands out your pocket, it's for your safety and mine". Do it again and watch how quickly they become aggressive and frisk you down... Why? Most if not all potentially fatal actions require your hands. If you want to shoot/stab/taze/choke/strike someone, you have to use your hands. Thus, hiding your hands from plain view while arguing/confronting someone is a threat against their life, much more so when you are the one that initiated the confrontation.

There's still that question I asked too... Would any of your run after someone you believe to be dangerous, approach them and then reach for your pocket to pull out your phone and call 911? Does that make any sense to any of you at all?

(Before any of you say yes cause he was crime watch, I'll repeat myself... There isn't a single legitimate crime watch in the entire country that allows it's members to pursue a suspicious person. If you pursue someone, you are not doing it because of crime watch duties..)

Edited by xFelix

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Posted (edited)

If it was a cop in uniform that stop Trayvon, Trayvon, most liking would have stopped and giving them a explantion.There are many block watch captains black and white that admit they have followed someone in their neighborhoods they thought were supicious.They should give these captions a glow in the dark jacket with a big saying Block Watch on it to let a person know who is followed them . It a sad thing what happen but Zimmerman may have been doing his job.He did say he got out of the car to get a address, when Trayvon attacked him and beat him up, which is self defence in the shooting.

I believe there are withness that will claim T was on top of Z ,so it was mostly likely Z yelling on the 911 tape while T was beating on him. Z had injuries on the back of his head and a broken nose ,while T had injuries to the hands.

Edited by docyabut2

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Martin came up on him tried to rob him he though Zimmerman was a pushover and he got shot for it.

Martin was a thief.

Who knew this forum had so many psychics? We might as well dispense with the jury system.

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How do I not know that, he admitted it out of his own mouth, with his lawyer sitting next to him.

Then again, he has changed his story a couple times, why not one more time right?

Remember when he kept saying that he stopped pursuing when the dispatcher said not to? Well that was before Trayvon got shot, guess what had to happen to place Zimmerman all the way out there between houses shooting an unarmed teen? You guessed it, he had to pursue after the dispatcher said to stop. So he lied? Hmmm...

He said the teen punched him completely unprovoked, but then says the teen punched him when he reached for his pocket.. So he lied again?

He said he was defending himself, even though he is the aggressor who was chasing the teen down like he was the law... He was the one that reached for his pocket to grab his "phone" while confronting someone he clearly told dispatch he believed to be dangerous.

Then there's those people who say "I never knew reaching for your pockets in an argument was a crime", no it is not. I tell you what it is though, a threat against your life. Every police officer in the entire country can verify that. Put your hands in your pockets and they will all say the same thing. "Get your hands out your pocket, it's for your safety and mine". Do it again and watch how quickly they become aggressive and frisk you down... Why? Most if not all potentially fatal actions require your hands. If you want to shoot/stab/taze/choke/strike someone, you have to use your hands. Thus, hiding your hands from plain view while arguing/confronting someone is a threat against their life, much more so when you are the one that initiated the confrontation.

There's still that question I asked too... Would any of your run after someone you believe to be dangerous, approach them and then reach for your pocket to pull out your phone and call 911? Does that make any sense to any of you at all?

(Before any of you say yes cause he was crime watch, I'll repeat myself... There isn't a single legitimate crime watch in the entire country that allows it's members to pursue a suspicious person. If you pursue someone, you are not doing it because of crime watch duties..)

I agree with all or most of your points about the unwise pursuit. My point is that we don't know why George shot Trayvon. It could have been murder. It could have been self defense. If someone repeatedly pounded your head into a concrete sidewalk (if that's what happened), you and most people would do what it took to stay alive. Zimmerman was not trustworthy, and his decisions were wrong, but I need evidence for his conviction, not opinions. My *theory* is that the shooting was an act of self defense during a struggle that was caused by George's stupidity. We can agree on the fact that George set the whole tragic chain of events in motion by making idiotic choices.

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The only reason this trail is being done, because of mob justice. Everyone forgets that travon's girlfriend tried to talk him into not oig back to confront zimmerman. Should zimmermon have been following him no, not after the 911 operater told him not to.

Don't worry the jurry will be told to find him guilty. If they find him innocent, the riots will return.

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I agree with all or most of your points about the unwise pursuit. My point is that we don't know why George shot Trayvon. It could have been murder. It could have been self defense. If someone repeatedly pounded your head into a concrete sidewalk (if that's what happened), you and most people would do what it took to stay alive. Zimmerman was not trustworthy, and his decisions were wrong, but I need evidence for his conviction, not opinions. My *theory* is that the shooting was an act of self defense during a struggle that was caused by George's stupidity. We can agree on the fact that George set the whole tragic chain of events in motion by making idiotic choices.

Then again, if he set the stage he cannot claim self-defense in Florida. He also did not defend himself. Trayvon's autopsy showed no signs of Zimmerman fighting back.. The only fight that occured was him pulling his gun and taking a single shot at Trayvons heart.

Btw: If someone were pounding my head against the ground because I threatened their life, I would fight back in an attempt to break free and run. Maybe i'd get an assault charge for it, but that's assault vs murder.... Id take assault.

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Then again, if he set the stage he cannot claim self-defense in Florida. He also did not defend himself. Trayvon's autopsy showed no signs of Zimmerman fighting back.. The only fight that occured was him pulling his gun and taking a single shot at Trayvons heart.

Btw: If someone were pounding my head against the ground because I threatened their life, I would fight back in an attempt to break free and run. Maybe i'd get an assault charge for it, but that's assault vs murder.... Id take assault.

Maybe there were no signs of Z fighting back because he straight up got his butt kicked, not because he didn't try to defend himself.

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Should zimmermon have been following him no, not after the 911 operater told him not to.

Technically, there is no floridan law saying you must follow what a 911 operator tells you...

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Technically, there is no floridan law saying you must follow what a 911 operator tells you...

I didn't cite a law. But, if your on the phone with a 911 operater it is usaully best to follow their instructions. Note, I did not say always.

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Then again, if he set the stage he cannot claim self-defense in Florida. He also did not defend himself. Trayvon's autopsy showed no signs of Zimmerman fighting back.. The only fight that occured was him pulling his gun and taking a single shot at Trayvons heart.

Btw: If someone were pounding my head against the ground because I threatened their life, I would fight back in an attempt to break free and run. Maybe i'd get an assault charge for it, but that's assault vs murder.... Id take assault.

He can claim self defense if he thought that Trayvon was trying to kill him. Neither you nor I know if that's the case. The fact that there were no wounds, indicative of George fighting back before the fatal shot, proves absolutely nothing by itself. It *could* show that Trayvon beat up George before he was shot.

How do you know that George "threatened" Trayvon's life? What did he do or say (before the fatal shot) to show that he planned to murder Trayvon? In any event, in the pounding scenario, you might not get the choice between hurting and killing. The next pound could be the last one.

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There's plenty of bothersome (understatement) aspects about this case already in the record that I could go on about, but re: the struggle on the ground, I want to know what Zimmerman was ever doing with his hands.

There was screaming for a significant period- I think considering the circumstances, it was a significant period of time- and Zimmerman claims they were on the ground during all that screaming, and so what was Zimmerman doing, but just laying there... screaming? Seriously, what was the man ever doing with his hands during that time?

The only time he mentions using his hands was shortly before the gunshot... that he said tried to get Martins hand(s)? off of his mouth/nose?. Btw, I don't recall if he said he thought Martin was trying to shut him up, or if he thought Martin was trying to smother him. Maybe he meant Martin was smothering him in the process of attempting to shut him up, heck I don't know. (The man appeared to lose articulation when it came to conveying precisely the way events occurred that night.)

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There's plenty of bothersome (understatement) aspects about this case already in the record that I could go on about, but re: the struggle on the ground, I want to know what Zimmerman was ever doing with his hands.

There was screaming for a significant period- I think considering the circumstances, it was a significant period of time- and Zimmerman claims they were on the ground during all that screaming, and so what was Zimmerman doing, but just laying there... screaming? Seriously, what was the man ever doing with his hands during that time?

The only time he mentions using his hands was shortly before the gunshot... that he said tried to get Martins hand(s)? off of his mouth/nose?. Btw, I don't recall if he said he thought Martin was trying to shut him up, or if he thought Martin was trying to smother him. Maybe he meant Martin was smothering him in the process of attempting to shut him up, heck I don't know. (The man appeared to lose articulation when it came to conveying precisely the way events occurred that night.)

Last night on HLM, there is a man witness number six on tape, saying he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman and Zimmerman was screaming help.

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