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Arpee

Satanism: Another look at the spiritual "war"

34 posts in this topic

There are many forms of Satanism and Luciferianism out there. I am only speaking of what I researched and my interpretation.

Most people would probably say "Why would someone choose Satan over God?". They ask this question because they already have beliefs about what "God" and "Satan" is. Obviously, Satanists do not see "God" and "Satan" in the same way as "God" believers do.

To God-believers, Satan is an evil being against God and God is seen as being stronger than Satan.

To Satanists, Satan is represents opposition to control and is seen as being Natural and therefore more powerful and reoccurring.

God is a force of Unity (which some may refer to as "Harmony" or "Love"). Unity forces the individual to give up its individuality and to do whatever the groups tells him or her to do. Unity, in this sense, is indeed control. The Unity of God however, is servitude. God is the Unity/Love itself and those within it are being control by God (the force of the Unity/Love) to do whatever it wants.

Satan is a force of Diversity (Which some may refer to as "Individuality" or "Difference/Change"). Diversity manifests itself by forming individuals and keeping these individuals growing in their preferences/choices in order to keep the differences alive. In this sense, it is true that Satan is indeed a force of Separation.

When God and Satan clashes into each other, it creates Conflict, Wars, Arguments.

Conflicts (Wars, Fights, Hatred) is the result of Differences (Satan) trying to be forced into Sameness or Unity (God). If one of these two are chosen whether it be God or Satan, then things will be more peaceful, here is how:

If everybody would be the same in Unity (God) then there would be no Conflicts.

Likewise, if everybody would just accept that we're all different (Satan) then there would be no Conflicts.

Conflicts comes from the need to Control. Hatred, Anger, Sadness means that you are disappointed because things are not as you wish for them to be. Accepting that we are all different and don't have to be the same will help get rid of this Hatred, Anger, and Sadness towards others.

Likewise, if everybody were exactly the same under Unity/God sacrificing their individuality, then there would be no need to "want" anything, no room to "expand" , and no disappointed because everything is already decided to be the same.

So, this is why Satanists choose Satan. It is about taking the other side of the force - freedom over control.

What do you think about everything I've said here (especially in the regards to war)?

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Posted (edited)

There really is no war being fought at all. War implies there are two willing participants. Satanists/Luciferians quite frankly couldn't care less what anyone else believed, unless they were genuinely interested in their beliefs. There is only really a one sided fight, Godmongers believing that they themselves are the wrath of God, and they must attack and disrespect all who oppose God.

It is a given though, when you have any two people with strong beliefs and total faith in those beliefs.. As long as they respect each other you will notice no conflict, but as soon as one crosses the line... Well, there's conflict.

Q: Am I a Satanist?

A: Absolutely not.

Q:Would Godmongers call me a Satanist?

A: Absolutely.

Q:Do I specifically care what they believe?

A: Not in the least, they can think that I am Satan himself for all I care... Now, the second they decide to make offensive statements, or accusations of which actually effect me... Then I care.

Q:Have I ever actually become violent over my beliefs being disrespected?

A:Not in the least.

Edited by xFelix
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To be as "free" as Satanism seems to imply, then there would be no restraint on behavior at all. It's an interesting thesis but I really think it does not account for the fractiousness and destructiveness of an unbridled human nature. There is a such thing as true evil in the world. Ask the parents of the little 8 year old girl raped and murdered in Florida recently by a sex offender. Not saying this person was a Satanist. Just that he probably felt the need to be totally "free" in his actions as well.....

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To worship Satan (whatever "worship" might possibly mean) strikes me as being deliberately perverse and obnoxious, just for the sake of getting a rise out of superstitious people. Either that or its the height of superstition itself.

Satan was the creation of the Zoroastrians, picked up by the Jews during the Exile and linked with their "Shatan" that we see in the Book of Job, later made into a Christian version of Pan with cloven hooves and horns. In short, he has a colorful history, but no such being ever actually existed, and I think deep down almost everyone now understands that.

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To be as "free" as Satanism seems to imply, then there would be no restraint on behavior at all. It's an interesting thesis but I really think it does not account for the fractiousness and destructiveness of an unbridled human nature. There is a such thing as true evil in the world. Ask the parents of the little 8 year old girl raped and murdered in Florida recently by a sex offender. Not saying this person was a Satanist. Just that he probably felt the need to be totally "free" in his actions as well.....

The sociopath is typically free of such ethical or emotional constraints. They need to be identified for the sake of society.

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There really is no war being fought at all. War implies there are two willing participants. Satanists/Luciferians quite frankly couldn't care less what anyone else believed, unless they were genuinely interested in their beliefs.

The "war" is subtle. If there is a group trying to force everyone to believe in God in their way to have sameness/unity (like controlling religions), then of course Satanists and those who believe in Individuality would have to go against that because it's something that directly opposes free-will and individuality.

To be as "free" as Satanism seems to imply, then there would be no restraint on behavior at all. It's an interesting thesis but I really think it does not account for the fractiousness and destructiveness of an unbridled human nature. There is a such thing as true evil in the world. Ask the parents of the little 8 year old girl raped and murdered in Florida recently by a sex offender. Not saying this person was a Satanist. Just that he probably felt the need to be totally "free" in his actions as well.....

Not "feeling" free, but using free-will, and if you actually believed in free-will you would not be raping and murdering people. *SOME* people who choose to be Satanists just do so to take an opposition to mainstream religions or because they are taught that Satan is evil and therefore they use Satanism as they label to hide behind and do harmful things. Satanism is about selfishness, individuality, and free-will. To control others is against individuality and definitely against free-will.

To worship Satan (whatever "worship" might possibly mean) strikes me as being deliberately perverse and obnoxious, just for the sake of getting a rise out of superstitious people. Either that or its the height of superstition itself.

Who says that their doing it just to get a rise out of superstitious people? Maybe some, but not all.

Satan was the creation of the Zoroastrians, picked up by the Jews during the Exile and linked with their "Shatan" that we see in the Book of Job, later made into a Christian version of Pan with cloven hooves and horns. In short, he has a colorful history, but no such being ever actually existed, and I think deep down almost everyone now understands that.

Not really, it is true that some identify Ahriman (God of darkness) with Satan, but did you know some even associate him with Yahweh? By the way, Satan is much older than that since some associate it him with Set (God of Darkness and Chaos) or they associate Satan with the darkness itself (Abzu, Chaos, Nu) which would mean that Satan is as old as religion itself.

A red being with horns and tails represents nature (Horns/Tails) and passion (redness).

Satan does exist, and does not exist depending on how you choose to define the word. If "Satan" means "adversary" as in an enemy of Yahweh/God, then many "Satan" spirits exist. If "Satan" means "The Devil" a powerful force of evil against "God/Yahweh" then I would say Satan still exists because there is two main ways of looking at stuff (As we know Yin-Yang, Darkness-Light, Selfishness-Servitude, etc.)

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Yea that's what I said. Either they are damn superstitious themselves or they are doing it to get a rise out of the superstitious.

Anyone who believes in an anthropomorphized personalization of evil, let alone who "worships" it, qualifies as superstitious, at a minimum.

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Yea that's what I said. Either they are damn superstitious themselves or they are doing it to get a rise out of the superstitious.

Anyone who believes in an anthropomorphized personalization of evil, let alone who "worships" it, qualifies as superstitious, at a minimum.

"evil" is an opinion - a label. One man's "evil" may be another man's "good". People are apply different labels (good/evil) to the same actions. By the way, I never said anything about Satan being an "anthropomorphized". Satan is a force, as is God. Jesus is an individual. I doubt the entirety of these forces can be in one body. Even Christians will admit that Jesus is not 100% God but 1/3 of God in the trinity.

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Yea that's what I said. Either they are damn superstitious themselves or they are doing it to get a rise out of the superstitious.

Anyone who believes in an anthropomorphized personalization of evil, let alone who "worships" it, qualifies as superstitious, at a minimum.

What's the issue with superstition? Most people are superstitous in one way or another, so why are you presenting it as some sort of problem when it is actually a world spread phenomena that has saved countless lives? Superstition has a long history of preventing wars, resolving conflicts between people, and even providing peaceful environments for people to flourish..

Anyone who truly believes in free will would also believe that others also should be given free will. Therefor anyone who believes they can do as they wish, would not do as they wish onto others in a hurtful manner because it would be impeding on their free will. I'm tired of hearing this ridiculous argument saying "so you can murder people?!", no they can't. What they can do is whatever they want as long as it doesn't interfere with others' abilities to do what they want.

By the way: No, most who decide to worship a different deity are not doing so to be repulsive. They are doing it because they believe in that deity and what it has to offer.

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I said that I think that deep down almost everyone understands that there is nothing like Satan. Obviously that is only "almost" everyone.

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That you are free to worship anything you want to worship doensn't mean you have to.

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I said that I think that deep down almost everyone understands that there is nothing like Satan. Obviously that is only "almost" everyone.

Again, how are you defining "Satan"? If you are defining it as a "Pure Evil" that exists, then yea, I would say under that definition Satan doesn't exist since "Evil" is a label and people have many different labels for the same thing. One man's "good" is another man's "evil".

By Satan I mean a force of Change and Difference.

By God I mean a force of "Unity" which most would call "Love" - that I see as control.

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I said that I think that deep down almost everyone understands that there is nothing like Satan. Obviously that is only "almost" everyone.

See this is where you are wrong Frank, the largest portion of the world's religions today completely disagree with you. Most people believe in Satan, they just believe in him as the super villain where others believe him to be the hero.

That you are free to worship anything you want to worship doensn't mean you have to.

The simple act of posting that statement is repulsive. You are free to use your mind and understand why, but you don't have to.

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Well, Arpee avoids the issue by redefining Satan. To me what he says is not what "Satan" means, and he will generally be misunderstood as a result.

XFelix, however, persists with a more conventional understanding, and seems to think that I am repulsive if I use my mind and understand it is all absurd.

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Satan is much older than that since some associate it him with Set (God of Darkness and Chaos)

Though many would not equate Set with this mythical "Satan". Set does not serve the same function and he is not an "evil" counterpart to Osiris or Horus, though he is generally not a great person to know. More like a creepy sinister uncle, as the young Horus found out, but not "Satan".

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Posted (edited)

Though many would not equate Set with this mythical "Satan". Set does not serve the same function and he is not an "evil" counterpart to Osiris or Horus, though he is generally not a great person to know. More like a creepy sinister uncle, as the young Horus found out, but not "Satan".

As I said before "Evil" can mean anything. One's person idea of Evil is not another. It was the Abrahamic faiths that called Satan "evil". That is their opinion. Satan and Set is the same. The Lord of Darkness and Chaos that was associated with the planet Saturn.

Edited by Arpee

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Though many would not equate Set with this mythical "Satan". Set does not serve the same function and he is not an "evil" counterpart to Osiris or Horus, though he is generally not a great person to know. More like a creepy sinister uncle, as the young Horus found out, but not "Satan".

Of course Satan is not to be identified with Set. He was just blowing air asserting it. The Zoroastrian association makes much more sense.

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Well, Arpee avoids the issue by redefining Satan. To me what he says is not what "Satan" means, and he will generally be misunderstood as a result.

XFelix, however, persists with a more conventional understanding, and seems to think that I am repulsive if I use my mind and understand it is all absurd.

Nobody is avoiding an issue by redefining anything. Satan is the bad guy to Godmongers, and the hero to Satanists. Actually speaking the ones who redefined him are the God mongers. They openly admit that he was not only a being of good nature, but one of immense intelligence. Then they insert a story of how such a wise and good being opposes their God and bam remember God destroys all who oppose.. Now he is the root of all evil etc etc etc.

I simply turned your own rationalization against you. Saying that someone can do as they wish but it doesn't mean they have to is ridiculous.. But saying someone can believe what they want, but they don't have to is just outright outlandish. Whether we choose to believe what we want or not, or our very reasoning is none of your concern unless it directly affects you. Does someone else viewing Satan as the good guy cause you any harm?

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My main problem is this idea of "worship." Why do we want to do it and why would a deity with any sense want it? The only individuals I've ever wanted to worship were women, and that is a different thing.

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My main problem is this idea of "worship." Why do we want to do it and why would a deity with any sense want it? The only individuals I've ever wanted to worship were women, and that is a different thing.

To most Satanists, "worship" of Satan just means working for, increasing the influence of the Satanic force of Change, Difference, and Diversity.

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My main problem is this idea of "worship." Why do we want to do it and why would a deity with any sense want it? The only individuals I've ever wanted to worship were women, and that is a different thing.

That's a really cool story, how does this relate to others? If you don't want to worship anything, don't. It's completely irrational to sit there and take a stance of "I dont want to worship anything, so everybody else has to not worship with me"...

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Posted (edited)

Belief in "Satan", and also in "God", free people to do bad things to those who do not follow their religion. The religionists firm belief in this superstition does not allow them to step "outside the box". As to them, these mythical creatures really exist, then everybody in the universe is subject to their beliefs, and there is no scope not to be part of this "system". There is a constant subtext, sometimes close to the surface or even in full view, and sometimes deeper and slyer, that to not believe is actually the same as being a follower, with or without self awareness, of this "Satan". This is no "spiritual war", it is a war by the superstitious believers on all others. Implying, even weakly, that non believers are doing the work of "Satan", is one of the steps to Auschwitz and other man made hells on Earth. This is a matter of this desire to have the "other" as the eternal enemy, a phrase used by the nazis against the Jews.

Edit. Actually when I say "religionists", I really mean Christians as they seem to be the ones with these issues. I was just trying to be a little less confrontational :)

Edited by Tutankhaten-pasheri
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When I go to Temple I get on my knees and bow to the big Buddha they generally have, and twice a day I light joss sticks before the shrine in my house to my parents.

Most people call this "worship," but that makes no sense. I'm fully aware that the Buddha is dead or in Nirvana (if that is something other than "dead"), and my parents have long ago reincarnated, so there is nothing to worship.

Commemoration by means of traditional ritual expression is how I see it.

Now as to "worship" by serving and obeying, what is wrong with the words "serving" and "obeying?"

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Implying, even weakly, that non believers are doing the work of "Satan", is one of the steps to Auschwitz and other man made hells on Earth.

And who's fault is this? Satanists? Atheists (Non-believers)? Or the people actually doing the killing like the God believers?

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As I said before "Evil" can mean anything. One's person idea of Evil is not another. It was the Abrahamic faiths that called Satan "evil". That is their opinion. Satan and Set is the same. The Lord of Darkness and Chaos that was associated with the planet Saturn.

No

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