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Knight Of Shadows

Punishments In Islam : Adultry

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there has been too much talk about islamic laws

one of those talks is the punishment of adultry

as many already know the punishment of adultry in islam

is lashing for non-married individuals both men a women

while it's stonning to death for married individuals both men and women

now let along that these laws were made in period of time in middle ages

and should not have been brought into this age

somehow they found their way into this age unfortunatly

now when a person look at such punishment it's just too harsh .. brutal non-human act

even to me as a muslim i view it very harsh and uncalled for

maybe back in middle ages it was acceptable but no way it's acceptable these days

now however when we look on conditions required to apply this punishment

there is one critical requirement before any judge can apply this punishment

which is : requirement of four people who witnessed the adultry

that means exactly what it says that four grown people have witnessed the act fully in their own eyes

this is nearly impossible but it was meant to be this way

the reason this condition was made so the punishment would be more of scarecrow than an actual punishment

and the witnesses would be tested for their honesty and should one of them proved to be lying

or has been somewhere else when the act was in action etc etc

his testimony would be overlooked

so even if 3 people witnessed the act .. the punishment would not happen because it did not meet requirement

personally i think it's nearly impossible to get four witnesses who witness adultry in act

well unless the people doing adultry are so stupid lol

so that leads to conclusion that the punishment is more of fear wall than an actual punishment

a thing to be noted : that neither family of woman or man commiting adultry

has the right to kill them " honor kill " or in anyway harm them

pushiments are done by islamic court and judges and witnesses not individuals

and should one of family members kill ( sister, brother, wife , etc etc ) that killer

will meet islamic punishment of killing .. which is death

opinions are welcome

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Posted (edited)

is lashing for non-married individuals both men a women

while it's stonning to death for married individuals both men and women

KoS, just as you mention the above... I have heard and read articles on the women being brutally punished, but not the men.. Have you any news article that speaks of the men being equally punished? Any news article on that would be helpful...

I am not hoping anyone gets punished, in fact, I do not believe adultery should be in the hands of law and order... Marriage is personal between two people, what they do is their business ... If they wish to divorce each other, then so be it.. But so many think that itself is wrong too...

I hate to see any religion being used as law against anyone ..There is no freedom, just dictation..

To me, real freedom is, being able to follow whatever path you want, dress how you want, eat what you want, marry whom ever you choose and, only when it suits you, divorce if you both can't make it work, marriage is your business and no one elses, go where you want, get educated where you see fit, have kids, don't have kids, live where you love most, be free to go out and have fun, become an Atheist, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, or even take up yoga..Whatever...Point is, that to me is called freedom, and to live like that, does not need any religious law involved...

now when a person look at such punishment it's just too harsh .. brutal non-human act

even to me as a muslim i view it very harsh and uncalled for

maybe back in middle ages it was acceptable but no way it's acceptable these days

KoS, I see where you are coming from and I am with you on this very point.

Thing is, if these people are living with a law that dates back so far ( as you point out ) then with you being one who is against it and feel it is harsh, I am willing to bank, a number of Muslims felt the same as you back then too, but see the law is still forced regardless who thinks what? If things have not changed from back then to present day, I hardly think they ever will change..

Stoning to death should have went out with the dark ages long ago.

which is : requirement of four people who witnessed the adultry

that means exactly what it says that four grown people have witnessed the act fully in their own eyes

this is nearly impossible but it was meant to be this way

Thing is, a group of four people can easily turn against a certain person or couple ( rows or whatever ) and make up their own tales to have a woman stoned to death...

Again, I cannot handle religion, and I am not pin pointing one faith, I cannot bare any of it... I like my own ways, I am free in my own right and in my own way.

Edited by Beckys_Mom
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Glad I'm not a Muslim, I would be under a big pile of rocks.

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While I think adultery is a horrible act of betrayal I don't think anyone should die for it. Some religious practices should not be followed. I'm glad Christians stopped burning witches. So much of the time no one thought these people to be a real witch they just had it in for them. I strongly suspect Islamic law is used in the same way. It would not be hard to find 4 people to say they saw someone cheating. I suspect it is used to get back at someone for something and this practice should be stopped. A husband should have no right to murder their wife I don't care if she was cheating. He also should have no right to beat her. Which seems often the fate of women under Islamic law.

You would be afraid to stand your ground with your husband or anyone as a woman or you could be accused of adultery. Perfect tool to keep women in their place. Laws against adultery may of been meant to cover men but they are way more often used against women.

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So many times these types of things are the result - not of the religion, but of the religious...

I don't say that to demean all or even most of the religious people - heck I consider myself one - but I also can see that bigotry will grab any excuse to exercise itself - and often relgion is a ready excuse...

So, sometimes it doesn't really matter what the relgion intended... it's what the bigot thinks it intends....

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KoS, just as you mention the above... I have heard and read articles on the women being brutally punished, but not the men.. Have you any news article that speaks of the men being equally punished? Any news article on that would be helpful...

I am not hoping anyone gets punished, in fact, I do not believe adultery should be in the hands of law and order... Marriage is personal between two people, what they do is their business ... If they wish to divorce each other, then so be it.. But so many think that itself is wrong too...

I hate to see any religion being used as law against anyone ..There is no freedom, just dictation..

the islamic law in it's original form does not give advantage to men over men in punishment wise

there is number of incidents were couple " man and woman " commited adultry and stonned to death

it's too graphic though . you can simply google man stonned to death

but as long as islamic laws goes .. it's applied to both

i don't view my religion as dictating really .. but then again because i choosed it

no one forced on me .. i was atheist in my early days for 5 years

but then again everyone got their own prospecitve and experinces

To me, real freedom is, being able to follow whatever path you want, dress how you want, eat what you want, marry whom ever you choose and, only when it suits you, divorce if you both can't make it work, marriage is your business and no one elses, go where you want, get educated where you see fit, have kids, don't have kids, live where you love most, be free to go out and have fun, become an Atheist, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, or even take up yoga..Whatever...Point is, that to me is called freedom, and to live like that, does not need any religious law involved...

nothing in above i don't agree with

KoS, I see where you are coming from and I am with you on this very point.

Thing is, if these people are living with a law that dates back so far ( as you point out ) then with you being one who is against it and feel it is harsh, I am willing to bank, a number of Muslims felt the same as you back then too, but see the law is still forced regardless who thinks what? If things have not changed from back then to present day, I hardly think they ever will change..

well back in those days it was full of wars and violence such acts were considered somehow normal

like crucifxation and fighting to death for money etc etc

Stoning to death should have went out with the dark ages long ago.

and i wish it has been left in those days but unfortunatly some people didn't leave it

it's long other topic of why such things exist these days

why some people " wanted " them to exist these days

Thing is, a group of four people can easily turn against a certain person or couple ( rows or whatever ) and make up their own tales to have a woman stoned to death...

well not any 4 group of people account would be taken into account especially people who have crudge against the accusers

the witnesses should have at least good reputation and no shady history

otherwise their account will be overlooked " based on koran "

إِنْ جَاءَكُمْ فَاسِقٌ بِنَبَأٍ فَتَبَيَّنُوا أَنْ تُصِيبُوا قَوْمًا بِجَهَالَةٍ فَتُصْبِحُوا عَلَى مَا فَعَلْتُمْ نَادِمِينَ

if someone corrupted come with a news investigate least you cause harm to people unaware and you become regretfull of what you did

Again, I cannot handle religion, and I am not pin pointing one faith, I cannot bare any of it... I like my own ways, I am free in my own right and in my own way.

well i can respect that faith is not something that can be shoved down people's mouth of heads i think it can only be accepted

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So many times these types of things are the result - not of the religion, but of the religious...

I don't say that to demean all or even most of the religious people - heck I consider myself one - but I also can see that bigotry will grab any excuse to exercise itself - and often relgion is a ready excuse...

So, sometimes it doesn't really matter what the relgion intended... it's what the bigot thinks it intends....

thats a major problem

you would look if you search in stonning to death in google

you would find most accounts done by religious militants or crazy folks

even in the true core of religion that punishment exist but it's not done like that

you don't grab people humilate them and put them in hole and stone them to death just coz you overheard something

you can't even do that if you witness it .. four people as eyewitnesses .. far fetched

but again unfortunatly people who shout about them self being muslims

no longer follow islam in it's true core

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While I think adultery is a horrible act of betrayal I don't think anyone should die for it. Some religious practices should not be followed. I'm glad Christians stopped burning witches. So much of the time no one thought these people to be a real witch they just had it in for them. I strongly suspect Islamic law is used in the same way. It would not be hard to find 4 people to say they saw someone cheating. I suspect it is used to get back at someone for something and this practice should be stopped. A husband should have no right to murder their wife I don't care if she was cheating. He also should have no right to beat her. Which seems often the fate of women under Islamic law.

You would be afraid to stand your ground with your husband or anyone as a woman or you could be accused of adultery. Perfect tool to keep women in their place. Laws against adultery may of been meant to cover men but they are way more often used against women.

not just women .. the law applies to men as well actually

i was watching a documentry of women being sold as slaves in india .. disguised as brides

and it pains me that some of places such things occured was muslim village

however there was glimpse of hope as the person doing investegation of the matter and uncover it was also muslims

islam in it's true form prohibit violence against women

mohammad last words before death were : O People, it is true that you have certain rights with regard to your women, but they also have rights over you. Remember that you have taken them as your wives only under Allah’s trust and with His permission. If they abide by your right then to them belongs the right to be fed and clothed in kindness. Do treat your women well and be kind to them for they are your partners and committed helpers. And it is your right that they do not make friends with any one of whom you do not approve, as well as never to be unchaste

once person asked mohammad why Koran says it's ok to beat women ?

mohammad answered by holding his toothpick stick and poke the man hands with it

and told him .. that's how hard you allowed to beat them

that's why we take our religion from hadith as well as koran because it explains to us what we may misunderstand

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Posted (edited)

the islamic law in it's original form does not give advantage to men over men in punishment wise

there is number of incidents were couple " man and woman " commited adultry and stonned to death

it's too graphic though . you can simply google man stonned to death

but as long as islamic laws goes .. it's applied to both

All I was asking was a news article that speaks of a man being punished for adultery, for I have never seen any.. I have however seen a few on women being punished, but never the men.. I guess I wont either... I am not looking to offend you personally Kos, ( certainly not ) but I struggle to believe men go punished for the same thing..What is written in some book, does not mean it is followed directly..

Edited by Beckys_Mom
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well not any 4 group of people account would be taken into account especially people who have crudge against the accusers

the witnesses should have at least good reputation and no shady history

otherwise their account will be overlooked " based on koran "

You don't find 4 people witnessing a couple of people having sex would put them out of "no shady history" category.

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You would be afraid to stand your ground with your husband or anyone as a woman or you could be accused of adultery. Perfect tool to keep women in their place. Laws against adultery may of been meant to cover men but they are way more often used against women.

I agree with every word of that, especially the highlighted part..

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All I was asking was a news article that speaks of a man being punished for adultery, for I have never seen any.. I have however seen a few on women being punished, but never the men.. I guess I wont either... I am not looking to offend you personally Kos, ( certainly not ) but I struggle to believe men go punished for the same thing..What is written in some book, does not mean it is followed directly..

i told you beckys there is articles and news of couples being stonned to death man and woman

and another news where only man was stonned but they're too graphic to put here

just write in google " man stonned to death "

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Posted (edited)

i told you beckys there is articles and news of couples being stonned to death man and woman

and another news where only man was stonned but they're too graphic to put here

just write in google " man stonned to death "

I did what you suggested... All I could find was this one that was done in Africa - http://news.bbc.co.u...ica/8347216.stm They stoned the man and thought they would spare the girl until after she gives birth..So then she too will be stoned...Goodness knows what they did with the baby...sigh..

The only other one I found after that was a man stoned to death in Africa for murder, carried out by muslims..

The entire issue stoning to death is too disturbing for words, but I think you already know this...I saw some pictures and thought, enough, I couldn't look at any more..

If my husband committed adultery and I found out about it? At first I would be a bit shocked because I always thought my hubby is too lazy to do that lol.. Then if confirmed, I'd give her ( his bit on the side ) the mother in laws address and number, tell her she has a new best friend...That itself is punishment enough for anyone. lol

The way I view it is, if you want my husband, take the mother in law too, and you have a deal lol :P

Edited by Beckys_Mom

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I did what you suggested... All I could find was this one that was done in Africa - http://news.bbc.co.u...ica/8347216.stm They stoned the man and thought they would spare the girl until after she gives birth..So then she too will be stoned...Goodness knows what they did with the baby...sigh..

The only other one I found after that was a man stoned to death in Africa for murder, carried out by muslims..

The entire issue stoning to death is too disturbing for words, but I think you already know this...I saw some pictures and thought, enough, I couldn't look at any more..

If my husband committed adultery and I found out about it? At first I would be a bit shocked because I always thought my hubby is too lazy to do that lol.. Then if confirmed, I'd give her ( his bit on the side ) the mother in laws address and number, tell her she has a new best friend...That itself is punishment enough for anyone. lol

The way I view it is, if you want my husband, take the mother in law too, and you have a deal lol :P

am sure if you ask him he would prefer to be stonned :D

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I did find a few instances where men were stoned to death. This one happened to a Pakistani soldier.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/13/pakistani-soldier-stoned-to-death_n_2866681.html

Here is a couple of other cases.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/15/somali-man-stoned-to-deat_n_392503.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-202_162-3037907.html

It was much easier to find and far more instances for women. Too many to put all the links here.

http://www.muslimwomennews.com/n.php?nid=6932

Here's a link that tries to explain this law. Haven't had a chance to read it all yet but thought you might find it interesting.

http://www.islam-watch.org/authors/65-khan/999-stoning-death-for-adultery-in-islam-missing-stoning-verse-of-quran-eaten-by-goat.html

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I don't care if they are stoning men or women the law is barbaric and should go by the way of the dinosaur.

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am sure if you ask him he would prefer to be stonned :D

Over here being stoned has a completely different meaning lol...

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Over here being stoned has a completely different meaning lol...

exactly :D

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Posted (edited)

A clip from a national newspaper

Two teenage sisters have been shot dead in Pakistan – because they danced in the rain.

Noor Basra, 15, and Noor Sheza, 16, were killed after a clip of the cavorting caused outrage in their ultra-conservative town.

Their mother Noshehra was also shot. The three were killed by five gunmen.

Police suspect that the murders were ordered by the sisters’ stepbrother to restore the family’s “honour”.

The sisters were filmed six months ago break-dancing as the heavens opened.

They were wearing traditional shalwar kameez trouser suits and green and purple headscarves.

One flashes a smile in the clip, which has gone viral on the internet.

The girls were filmed running around with two younger children outside the family’s stone bungalow in Chilas in the deprived northern region of Gilgit.

Their older brother is suing stepbrother Khutore and the gunmen, who are all thought to be on the run

Check out all the latest News, Sport & Celeb gossip at Mirror.co.uk http://www.mirror.co...4#ixzz2YZuFMLao

Follow us: @DailyMirror on Twitter | DailyMirror on Facebook

The murders follow the scandal last year of the case of four women who were killed on the orders of tribal elders for singing and dancing with men at a wedding party in the remote north-western Pakistan village of Kohistan.

The group of clerics, called a Jirga, condemned the women to death after decreeing they had stained their families’ names by “fornication.”

Under strict Sharia law, men and women are not allowed to dance together.

However, it is always the woman, not the man, who is punished.

fullywired

Edited by fullywired

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A clip from a national newspaper

Two teenage sisters have been shot dead in Pakistan – because they danced in the rain.

Noor Basra, 15, and Noor Sheza, 16, were killed after a clip of the cavorting caused outrage in their ultra-conservative town.

Their mother Noshehra was also shot. The three were killed by five gunmen.

Police suspect that the murders were ordered by the sisters’ stepbrother to restore the family’s “honour”.

The sisters were filmed six months ago break-dancing as the heavens opened.

They were wearing traditional shalwar kameez trouser suits and green and purple headscarves.

One flashes a smile in the clip, which has gone viral on the internet.

The girls were filmed running around with two younger children outside the family’s stone bungalow in Chilas in the deprived northern region of Gilgit.

Their older brother is suing stepbrother Khutore and the gunmen, who are all thought to be on the run

Check out all the latest News, Sport & Celeb gossip at Mirror.co.uk http://www.mirror.co...4#ixzz2YZuFMLao

Follow us: @DailyMirror on Twitter | DailyMirror on Facebook

The murders follow the scandal last year of the case of four women who were killed on the orders of tribal elders for singing and dancing with men at a wedding party in the remote north-western Pakistan village of Kohistan.

The group of clerics, called a Jirga, condemned the women to death after decreeing they had stained their families’ names by “fornication.”

Under strict Sharia law, men and women are not allowed to dance together.

However, it is always the woman, not the man, who is punished.

fullywired

in islamic laws the people who shot the sisters would be put to death .. i wouldn't blame the religion if people bend it to suit their needs :D

i blame the people .

that post already in middle east section

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I don't think a State needs to be involved in peoples sex lives. What goes on between a man and woman, man and man or woman and woman is their business and their problem. If your partner is fooling around get a divorce or work it out either way it is a civil matter. I don't care how many witnesses there are it should not be a capital offense. Want me to respect your relgion, then put an end to the non sense.

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I don't think a State needs to be involved in peoples sex lives. What goes on between a man and woman, man and man or woman and woman is their business and their problem. If your partner is fooling around get a divorce or work it out either way it is a civil matter. I don't care how many witnesses there are it should not be a capital offense. Want me to respect your relgion, then put an end to the non sense.

i don't want you or anyone to respect my religion that' their bussiness

i only want to illustrate and make clear things people did not know or did not understand about islam

as i have seen that many of people who keep crackdown on islam don't know anything about it

well except what they see on news by crazy people

my goal is compare those people actions to islamic laws that were applied in middle ages

and by that compare it's possible to know that these people are acting on their own .. not by islam laws

and even more important . they are breakin islamic laws by those actions

that's my purpose

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It is like having a bad law on the books, as long as it is there some idiot is going to use it. Take this:

once person asked mohammad why Koran says it's ok to beat women ?

mohammad answered by holding his toothpick stick and poke the man hands with it

and told him .. that's how hard you allowed to beat them

Wouldn't just saying "No it is not ok to beat a woman." be better. All that you said, about having to have 4 people witness the adultery and how it is impossible for that happen is non sense. The reason all this stoning and honor kill is going on is your religious laws are about as clear as mud. Until you have a reformation like the Christians have done your going to have insanity. Even then then it is not all for the best. When I comes to the Abrahamic religions the best thing y'all could do is toss the books, get a pencil and eraser and start over.

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It is like having a bad law on the books, as long as it is there some idiot is going to use it. Take this:

Wouldn't just saying "No it is not ok to beat a woman." be better. All that you said, about having to have 4 people witness the adultery and how it is impossible for that happen is non sense. The reason all this stoning and honor kill is going on is your religious laws are about as clear as mud. Until you have a reformation like the Christians have done your going to have insanity. Even then then it is not all for the best. When I comes to the Abrahamic religions the best thing y'all could do is toss the books, get a pencil and eraser and start over.

people do many things .. but weather what they do is approved by islamic laws is the question should be asked

and if one knows those things well enough would know that these people are actually going against islam laws and teachings

however i will get into women in islam topic in depth more in another topic

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that post already in middle east section

Sorry about that ,I don't read that section

fullywired

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