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ambelamba

The ultimate rebellion against God

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Be moral. Be ethical. Be compassionate. Be considerate to fellow lifeforms. Be kind to the nature. Be altruistic and egalitarian. Don't be selfish and greedy.

Always act on moral ground. That's the ultimate rebellion against God, who created us to watch us suffer for entertainment.

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I think you have some issues that need working out there buddy. ;)

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RJ, people "translate" God to be as they are themselves... which is why some people won't believe he exists. I agree with raven, but self reflection and some counseling never hurts either :).

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Well, to me maltheism is a quite logical conclusion. :/

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RJ, people "translate" God to be as they are themselves... which is why some people won't believe he exists. I agree with raven, but self reflection and some counseling never hurts either

Thanks, and while I'm sure he is referring to the "christian/muslim/jewish" God, he should have at least specified. Different religions and different Gods all have different messages. Lol. So he needs to pick a specific God to rebel against or he's in for one hell of a fight ;)

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Be moral. Be ethical. Be compassionate. Be considerate to fellow lifeforms. Be kind to the nature. Be altruistic and egalitarian. Don't be selfish and greedy.

Always act on moral ground. That's the ultimate rebellion against God, who created us to watch us suffer for entertainment.

Pal, if you are an atheist, you have no interest in rebelling against some fictious entity. And if you are a theist, it would seem pretty dumb to rebell against sombody infinetly superior to you...

So I really don´t see where your comment fits in. You seem to have some weird personal issues that are bothering you.

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Thanks, and while I'm sure he is referring to the "christian/muslim/jewish" God, he should have at least specified. Different religions and different Gods all have different messages. Lol. So he needs to pick a specific God to rebel against or he's in for one hell of a fight ;)

Meh, let's take them all! If we play our cards right, half of them will wipe out the rest. And then, when the victors are weakened, we strike!

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I think Ron's statement makes some sense. Think about how everyone had to live let's say before the 18th Century. What were the circumstances of their lives compared to us living now in the 21st Century? Did people suffer quite a bit?

It seems to me that all our modern conveniences that make our lives easier and more comfortable were invented by us, not by some God. God didn't seem to care that in the past there was sickness with no medical care, no sanitation, people lived under the divine right of kings, few laws to protect the peasants, which were most people, insufficient housing and food, etc., etc.

Even today, how many are living in the same kinds of conditions?

Can we blame God for all this (whatever God people believe in)? I think we can, as presumably God created all of this. I'd like to hear reasons why God is not responsible for our suffering.

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Be moral. Be ethical. Be compassionate. Be considerate to fellow lifeforms. Be kind to the nature. Be altruistic and egalitarian. Don't be selfish and greedy.

Always act on moral ground. That's the ultimate rebellion against God, who created us to watch us suffer for entertainment.

Wisdom, Compassion, Liberalness, Abundance, Nonconformity, Learning, Idealism are the attributes of a Reformed Druid. Looks like you are just about there. So why, my friend, do you hang on to concept of the Abrahamic god as an entity separate from the Universe? To rebel against god there most be something to rebel against. In my point of view as a Pantheist to rebel against god is rebel against myself, To hate and be angry with god is to hate and be angry at myself. That doesn't really fly with idea of "Thou art God." Self loathing only brings grief and the inability to change. I am not telling you what to believe or think, I am only saying give it some thought. Everyone walks their own path no one can walk it for them. Take a ride out away from the lights and look at the stars, who knows, you might end up seeing yourself looking back.

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That's the ultimate rebellion against God, who created us to watch us suffer for entertainment.

Replace 'God' with 'mom & dad' and thats probably exactly what a little child would think after getting a good spanking and being told 'no telly for a week'.

This besides the obvious fact we create about 95%, if not more, of all suffering our very selves. Directly or indirectly.

Given we are free of wil, I think we should look in the mirror - at all levels - before blaming some 'one' else.

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Who is saving who, is it god saving his people, or is it his people saving him?

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_as_the_Devil

"Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we called it the word of a demon, than the Word of God." - Thomas Paine

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My understanding is that the Abrahamic god is simply the process of the objective universe.

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Posted (edited)

Well, to me maltheism is a quite logical conclusion. :/

So you're saying our suffering is god-inflicted, not self-inflicted?

I was beaten to it, cheers Phaeton :)

I think you should ask yourself are you driftwoods or captains steering your own boat in this river we're all in, river of life. You can't change the flow, and most of us ain't able to make 90 degree turns so easily like you would in a water scooter, and those who have a water scooter dont carry much. Those with big ships filled with luxurous things sail slow and tend to be very clumsy, much less able to make changes to their course.

Metaphoras can ring true because physical world and the thoughtful side of the world, are linked. The same link is between our bodies and minds, but I believe it exists in all things, perhaps not to the same degree though. We all should have this thing which is higher than our body and mind. It's what we use to steer ourselves in the river of life. How we can switch our moods at will and act, but also become more genuine. I find it quite hard to put a word on it. Spirit, maybe. Is it because you dont like the idea of god and religions, or because you dont like anything you can't verify, or for what reason? Is a question you might want to ask yourself.

God, as I've understood, teaches in most mainstream religions that through how we live our lives we influence our fate in the afterlife. Think about that. That thought includes that we'd have a say on our fate. If you use the assumption of god existing a base for whatever your thought is, you ought to recognice the full scale of consequences of god existing to that thought of yours. Of course, you can assume the religious books got it wrong on god, but then, wouldn't you be disagreeing with them? Not saying this because you'd be more wrong, but I think you should keep this distinction in mind if you want to talk about their god, not about just any god.

Edited by Mikko-kun
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Be moral. Be ethical. Be compassionate. Be considerate to fellow lifeforms. Be kind to the nature. Be altruistic and egalitarian. Don't be selfish and greedy.

Pai Chu-yi (772-846) was one of China's greatest poets and a devout Buddhist. Once when he visited a monastery he asked the abbot to tell him the most essential teaching of Buddhism. The abbot then recited the lines from the Dhammapada; "Commit no wrongs, perform good deeds, and let your thoughts be pure. Thus do all Buddhas teach.". This failed to impress the greatest poet of the age, who said "Every child of three summers knows these lines. I want to know the most profound teaching of the Buddha". The abbot replied "Every child of three summers knows these lines, but white-haired men of eighty still fail to put them in practice". Hearing this, the poet bowed low and returned home deep in thought"

- paraphrased from the Platform Sutra - the Zen teaching of Hui-Neng, by Bill Porter

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Be moral. Be ethical. Be compassionate. Be considerate to fellow lifeforms. Be kind to the nature. Be altruistic and egalitarian. Don't be selfish and greedy.

Always act on moral ground. That's the ultimate rebellion against God, who created us to watch us suffer for entertainment.

What god are you talking about, and you seem very angry and cynical in these posts.

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Posted (edited)

I am a bit distressed by your reactions. In my home country, non-Christians freely discuss the possibility of the evil deity that rules our world. Yeah, life situation is THAT bad in none other than South Korea.

Pessimism runs deep in my culture. And somehow I attained that attitude pretty much independently after I came to the state. The thing is, all the promises and covenants given to me were nothing but illusions. Yeah, I was promised of a bright future. Then gradually it was stripped off from me.

EDIT: and I am fully aware that it's a innate human instinct to think of a merciful, benevolent entity. Maybe that was part of human evolution. In that perspective I might be defective.

Edited by Ron Jeremy

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EDIT: and I am fully aware that it's a innate human instinct to think of a merciful, benevolent entity. Maybe that was part of human evolution. In that perspective I might be defective.

I disagree with you in this part, in that it'd be an innate human instinct to think of a merciful and benevolent entity. If I was god, I wouldn't be merciful, but I'd let my children go through hardships for their mistakes. You know why? So that they'd learn both to deal with the consequences and to appreciate what good there still is, as well as to learn that things can always be better.

But that's not the reason I disagree with you. But because I very much believe we're born with these things through which we form our beliefs on this and that. The culture and surroundings have very much to do with that, but I believe so does our birth-moment-place factors. I've always been without faith in anything being or not being there, I've had open mind. But that also means not getting attached to any faith, not having sanctuary nor confidence in them. It's not all-good and rosy thing to be like that, though it has its sides. And I've looked astrological charts of some sceptics, and discussed with other astrologers who have done the same, and there's factors that reappear and are stronger in certain charts. So we have a reason to believe everyone ain't born the same when it comes to things of faith. What you're born with, however, hardly dictates everything, on the contrary.

It's people who betray you, whether there's god or not, I'd say. But most of all, it's more important for you to not let yourself be kept down by them. It can also be you who dont trust your own instincts about what's gonna happen if you do this and that, though people can try trick you there too. Things are probably better here in Finland than where you've been, but we too have people with faults, shy and can be unsocial and uncommunicative. Might be weeks that your workmate doesn't talk to you even though you work side by side and you ain't done nothing wrong to them and so on. And everyone so worried about how they gonna look like in public. But you just do your thing then.

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Heh, sometimes I wonder if I was some mega rich lothario who broke many hearts and impregnated many women without taking responsibilities in my previous life.

But...the concept of reincarnation with karma is problematic. Even Diamond Sutra refutes it.

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You know, there are two people in this world that I love and adore most: my two nephews. I have trouble staying with my sister's family more than an hour because I feel guilty of being a failure.

I gotta be honest. I envy atheists for an obvious reason. I can't let go of the idea of God who loves to put people under his thumb just to make a point. And yeah, I have to remind myself that the world is an unfair place. I read a news article about 'homeless billionaire', who was born a German Jew and started his investment business with $2000, ending up with $2 billions. And he stated that he really didn't put that much effort in it. I was sad. And what about that Norwegian woman who was sentenced for 16 months because she was a rape victim? In my home country child rapists get less than five years of prison time, while some guy who translated hentai porn got five years in the slammer. What does God want from this? Irony? Lulz?

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You know, there are two people in this world that I love and adore most: my two nephews. I have trouble staying with my sister's family more than an hour because I feel guilty of being a failure.

I gotta be honest. I envy atheists for an obvious reason. I can't let go of the idea of God who loves to put people under his thumb just to make a point. And yeah, I have to remind myself that the world is an unfair place. I read a news article about 'homeless billionaire', who was born a German Jew and started his investment business with $2000, ending up with $2 billions. And he stated that he really didn't put that much effort in it. I was sad. And what about that Norwegian woman who was sentenced for 16 months because she was a rape victim? In my home country child rapists get less than five years of prison time, while some guy who translated hentai porn got five years in the slammer. What does God want from this? Irony? Lulz?

Gods not making people do these things people choose to do the things they do because they can. God gave us free will, and of course there are going to be people that do horrible crimes and such. But by you blaming it all on god is stupid in my opinion. We each are responsible for how we choose to live and it seems to me your using god as a crutch.

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No one can change my belief that God feeds on tears.

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I think Ron's statement makes some sense.

Then help me out and explain how it makes sense to "rebel" against something that I don´t believe exists.

E.g. don´t really believe that the Flying Spaghetti Monster exists (although I tend to quote it often), so rebelling against it sounds like a completely inane suggestion to me.

Help?

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No one can change my belief that God feeds on tears.

Well, since you simultaneously believe in him and insult him, I assume you are extremely gutsy. So you also believe that eternal roasting in hell awaits you?

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Who knows, maybe I will end up like Winston Smith and profess my love for God, just like millions of people succumbed into.

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