Egypt declares national emergency

[meryt-tetisheri]

like this one?

http://en.wikipedia....olution_of_1919

Honestly, did you read the article you linked? This was the flag of the 1919 revolution. Its leaders were Copts and Muslims, actually a priest gave a sermon from Al Azhar's pulpit. Whatever fanciful claims you are making, the article you linked disproved them. A word of advise, read any article before you link it!

[meryt-tetisheri]

I just chatted with my friend... she says Al Jazeera is now scrambled in Alexandria although her internet connection remains stable so far. She's hoping this is a sign that the military is getting serious and finally moving in to stop insanity. It's been a rough few days and she's going stir crazy holed up in her tiny flat with 4 adults, two infants and a cat who goes nuts every time it hears gunfire. She's not looking forward to tomorrow when one of them will need to go out and try to find supplies and food.

Al Jazeera is notorious for giving biased, not so truthful coverage. They even used clips covering the anti-Mursi demonstrations and broadcast them as anti-Sisi demonstrations! The internet should not be affected, I contact my family on Skype every day.

Please warn your friend not to go shopping tomorrow, let her Egyptian partner do it. He can walk unnoticed in the street.

I think the army is serious this time, the current state of affairs cannot continue for long.

[Mr.United_Nations]

I read somewhere the Muslim Brotherhood is planning mass terrorist attacks around the country?

[Rafterman]

Glad I visited when I had a chance in 2007.

[meryt-tetisheri]

I read somewhere the Muslim Brotherhood is planning mass terrorist attacks around the country?

I too heard the same. There were threats of attacking police stations, ministries and governmental buildings, and of course more churches.

Today three more churches were burnt to the ground in Minya (Anglican, Catholic, and Orthodox) as well as a Christian school. A monestary was attacked in Maassara and Copts were killed; and the parish building in Tanta was also attacked.

[meryt-tetisheri]

I just read now that a new church in Maadi, Cairo. The list I posted earlier is getting longer by the day. Below is yesterday's list with photos and sources. It includes quotes from some MB leaders about the subject:

"Muslim Brotherhood in Helwan: (Summary) Based off of the actions of Pope Tawadros and Christians in Egypt, they deserve these attacks on churches and their institutions. “For every action, a reaction.” FJP Helwan Facebook (Arabic), MBInEnglish"

"Mohamed Saad al-Azhary (former member of the constituent assembly 2012): (Translation) “I strongly condemn the burning of churches for two reasons. 1) Whoever does this ruins the image of the protesters. 2) Who in their right mind would burn waste?” Facebook (Arabic)"

http://nilerevolt.wordpress.com/2013/08/14/1198/

Faculty of engineering, Cairo University

Giza Governorate

This is the handiwork of those to whom Senators McCain and Graham referred as "political prisoners". In which universe would such people be allowed to govern or participate in the governance of any country? How could such a violent terrorist minority be trusted? The attempts to ethnically cleanse Copts deserved a phrase in Obama's speech; he earned the mistrust of all Egyptians, Muslims and Copts. The EU and the UN didn't fare any better. Egypt is under a terrorist attack, if it has to go it alone, so be it! Sisi has the backing and the mandate of the vast majority of Egyptians.

[meryt-tetisheri]

Google the photo of Giza governorate building, for some reason I have a problem downloading it!

[Raptor Witness]

The two posts I've outlined above were older material that I published in December of 2006. One clearly points to Egypt with respect to the issue of weapon sales, using the term "Horus," which is their ancient god.

In the other, which is of the same exact subject matter(weapon sales abroad,) it points to the sun rising and setting, not "in the west," as is typically used for directional purposes, but "on the West." The capitalization suggests places, not a direction. It's an important distinction, and I remember wondering if I should write it that way, at the time, but I chose to leave it.

"Ra" or the sun god is closely related to Horus. So to combine the sun with the subject matter of weapon sales, is an odd combination.

So both these curious posts deal with weapon sales and Egypt, and both forecast dire consequences for the West, if these are not halted..

What are the odds that I would be connected to both an argument regarding U.S. weapons sales to Egypt, currently being discussed as leverage in the midst of their revolution, and an arguable forecast of that revolution immediately prior to its occurrence?

I wonder what the NSA would say about those odds ...

In later Egyptian dynastic times, Ra was merged with the god Horus, as Re-Horakhty ("Ra, who is Horus of the Two Horizons").

- Source Edited August 16, 2013 by Raptor Witness

[meryt-tetisheri]

I'm not sure but I think Raptor is referring to Isaiah 19:

And I will set the Egyptians against the Egyptians: and they shall fight every one against his brother, and every one against his neighbour; city against city, and kingdom against kingdom.

³ And the spirit of Egypt shall fail in the midst thereof; and I will destroy the counsel thereof: and they shall seek to the idols, and to the charmers, and to them that have familiar spirits, and to the wizards.

⁴ And the Egyptians will I give over into the hand of a cruel lord; and a fierce king shall rule over them, saith the Lord, the Lord of hosts.

⁵ And the waters shall fail from the sea, and the river shall be wasted and dried up.

⁶ And they shall turn the rivers far away; and the brooks of defence shall be emptied and dried up: the reeds and flags shall wither.

It continues for a few more verses but the reference to be ruled over by a "cruel king" has adherents in a couple of directions. I have always thought this prophecy is about the time when antichrist rules the world. Since there is no indication of any such thing just yet, I don't think this spasm of violence is THAT prophecy being fulfilled yet.

I prefer to stay optimistic! I am not so sure that the prophecy has yet to be fulfilled. Throughout its history Egypt passed through periods of strife, civil war (two ancient intermediate periods)...during the middle ages the plague dessimated its population to such an extent that 'the dead found no one to bury them' as Arab historians mentioned.

¹⁹ In that day there will be an altar to the Lord in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar to the Lord at its border. ²⁰ And it will be for a sign and for a witness to the Lord of hosts in the land of Egypt; for they will cry to the Lord because of the oppressors, and He will send them a Savior and a Mighty One, and He will deliver them....And the Lord will strike Egypt, He will strike and heal it; they will return to the Lord, and He will be entreated by them and heal them...²⁴ In that day Israel will be one of three with Egypt and Assyria—a blessing in the midst of the land, ²⁵ whom the Lord of hosts shall bless, saying, “Blessed is Egypt My people, and Assyria the work of My hands, and Israel My inheritance.”

[meryt-tetisheri]

Raptor, the endless discussions I had with Yamato about the US aid were centered about the definition whether the aid was 'charity' as he claimed, or proxy subsidy to weapons manufacturers. I am glad you saw it for what it is.

[MissMelsWell]

Al Jazeera is notorious for giving biased, not so truthful coverage. They even used clips covering the anti-Mursi demonstrations and broadcast them as anti-Sisi demonstrations! The internet should not be affected, I contact my family on Skype every day.

Please warn your friend not to go shopping tomorrow, let her Egyptian partner do it. He can walk unnoticed in the street.

I think the army is serious this time, the current state of affairs cannot continue for long.

Thankfully, neither she nor her fiancée are going out tomorrow. Some of their Muslim friends and neighbors are going out to shop for them. Her fiancée is Coptic and he's wisely going to stick around the flat. If the wrong people get a hold of his id, or finds out his name, which is clearly a Christian name, it could go sideways. Right now, they plan to rely on the kindness and generosity of their Muslim neighbors. It's all so worrisome. I kind of hope she and her fiancée seriously think about moving to the states.

[meryt-tetisheri]

Actually the fanaticism and violence of the MB and followers is not shared by the vast majority of Muslims in Egypt. I am glad their friends and neighbors will help. The last thing one would want would be for a Shenouda or Michael getting caught in the middle of an MB mob. Alexandria seems to be witnessing one of the worst riots. Good luck to your friends, may God keep them safe.

[MissMelsWell]

Actually the fanaticism and violence of the MB and followers is not shared by the vast majority of Muslims in Egypt.

Oh I know that... the MB are a small zealot faction of Muslims, they are NOT the average Egyptian Muslim. Not by a long shot.

I am glad their friends and neighbors will help. The last thing one would want would be for a Shenouda or Michael getting caught in the middle of an MB mob. Alexandria seems to be witnessing one of the worst riots. Good luck to your friends, may God keep them safe.

I'm glad too... and yes, her fiancée has one of those names like Michael that's instantly recognized as being ... oh, definitely Old Testament derived.

[Raptor Witness]

Raptor, your prophecy is really scary! I cannot claim that I fully understood it, especially the part of 'turning left' and the new dictator. However, I think a full-fledged civil war is unlikely. The MB are a highly organized armed terrorist group, but they and their supporters are still a minority. Egyptians had/have no options but to try to forge ahead and try to build a democracy based on freedom, equality and social justice. What is likely to happen is a prolonged terror campaign similar to the 1990s in which 2000 people died, but this time the majority of people are more aware and involved, while the MB has totally discredited itself and has lost a lot of support.

As for the US aid, it can not be used to force on the people a regime they do not accept.

If the U.S. stops giving deadly toys(a.k.a. "aid") to the Egyptian military, it will help.

When I wrote these two strong warnings in 2006, I thought they were more generalized, but after looking closely at the way they are worded; the primary focus was Egypt, and now the reason may be revealing itself, because a Syrian style civil war in Egypt would destabilize not just the East, but the West, also.

February 6, 2011 - Post 45

"If you do not protect your minorities, then you will be bound again by an even worse tyrant."

Edited August 16, 2013 by Raptor Witness

[stevewinn]

we need to support the military, (not their actions), but at the end of the day they are more pro western, which helps us with suez canal ect.. but we also need them to keep the peace. strange notion given whats happened, - but the peace - especially the peace treaty with Israel. the muslim brotherhood being in power is no good for the west and in the long run neither for the people of Egypt. Egypt as a nuclear program (energy) and we can ill afford a few years down the line the consequences of the muslim brotherhood once they've gained a foot hold in egyptian politics, we've already seen were the road is leading with their policies with a policy of instilling strict islamic beliefs, a record of violence throughout the years but as witnessed in recent times, with political assassinations and supporting terror groups Hamas ect.. the Saudi king as backed the egyptian military government, for he himself like in so many Arab countries looks over their shoulder at the rise or opposition that is the muslim brotherhood.

[meryt-tetisheri]

«After torching a Franciscan school, Islamists paraded three nuns on the streets like "prisoners of war" before a Muslim woman offered them refuge. Two other women working at the school were sexually harassed and abused as they fought their way through a mob."

"While the Christians of Egypt have endured attacks by extremists, they have drawn closer to moderate Muslims in some places, in a rare show of solidarity. Hundreds from both communities thronged two monasteries in the province of Bani Suef south of Cairo to thwart what they had expected to be imminent attacks on Saturday, local activist Girgis Waheeb said. Activists reported similar examples elsewhere in regions south of Cairo, but not enough to provide effective protection of churches and monasteries."

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_EGYPT_TARGETING_CHRISTIANS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-08-18-02-51-18

While the Copts are being subjected to a pogrom, Western governments are 'concerned' about the welfare of the armed jihadists and their supporters and are seeking ways to penalize the Egyptian government and army for trying to protect their country against a violent group that is not above using terror to enforce their delegitimized and dysfunctional rule over an unwilling population!

Today on CNN Sen. McCain (as Ambassador Patterson before) stated that the supporters of MB are "30% of the population". No one sources this amazing statistic or the date such a survey (if it existed) was taken. The population of Egypt in 2012 was 83 664 164, and in 2013 it reached 84,314, 2, it follows that MB supporters in 2012 should have been 25 099 249, yet only 13.2 million voted for Mursi (including those who voted in protest against Shafik, and assuming that the elections were unrigged). Where were the rest of his supporters on elections day (the height of MB 'popularity')? Did they go AWL, or someone needs to hand a calculator to the senator (assuming that MB maintained their popularity & following during their catastrophic year of rule)? Is this the kind of information on which the foreign policy of major states is based? Frankly, I’m flummoxed!

As the EU is reviewing its policy towards Egypt, I hope that the “we cannot condone unjustified violence” also includes the Muslim and Christian victims of torture, snipers and random shooting on the streets, torched houses and businesses, robbed museums, and the truly unjustifiable pogroms. Evidence is everywhere for those who want to find it. I hope that the EU’s definition of justice will not depend on the sound bites of media savvy groups directed at the international community, while ignoring the hate speech and violence of the same groups directed towards the unarmed majority in Egypt. EU will have to make a choice, are they for or against pogroms.

Today one of the MB rallies was supposed tp pass very close to my family's home, I cannot describe the worry and dread I felt...anything could have happened to them. The silence, the one-sided understanding of what is going on, the feeling that for some nations their lives would not count for much because they are members of an unimportant minority, the condemnation of the government and army which are trying to protect them are intolerable and deeply painful.

[Zaphod222]

While the Copts are being subjected to a pogrom, Western governments are 'concerned' about the welfare of the armed jihadists and their supporters and are seeking ways to penalize the Egyptian government and army for trying to protect their country against a violent group that is not above using terror to enforce their delegitimized and dysfunctional rule over an unwilling population!

It is totally bizarre. While the US and EU governments pretend to fight Al Quaeda by blowing up some tents and cars here or there in Yemen by remote control, killing the occasional Al Quaeda operative or not (who knows), their overall Middle East policy seems to be the pig-headed determination to hand control over the entire Middle East to Al Quaeda`s political arm, aka the Muslim Brotherhood.

"Schizophrenia" comes to mind. If they are so determined to help the Muslim Brothers to erect the Sunni Caliphate, why in the hell do they pretend to be against Al Quaeda? Just declare defeat and get over it.

Mind-boggling.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Zaphod222

[Black Red Devil]

And to make things even more bizarre,

Court to rule on Mubarak release

An Egyptian court is due to review a petition for the release of deposed President Hosni Mubarak.

Mubarak is facing a retrial for complicity in the deaths of protesters during the 2011 uprising that ended in his removal from power.

However, his lawyer hopes he will be released once cleared of a corruption charge.

Mubarak, 85, was convicted in June 2012 of conspiring in the killing of protesters in 2011 and sentenced to life in jail.

But in January 2013 an appeal against his conviction was upheld and a retrial ordered.

That retrial opened in May but Mubarak has served the maximum amount of pre-trial detention permitted in the case.

Mubarak's lawyer Fareed al-Dib said he expected his client to be freed after a court ordered his release in one of the remaining corruption cases against him.

However, the public prosecution is expected to appeal against the release, potentially delaying his actual departure from the prison for several days.

The case relates to claims that the former president received gifts from state-run publisher Al-Ahram.

Correspondents say his family has paid back the value of the alleged gifts, strengthening his lawyer's confidence that Mubarak will be released.

The appeals court will meet in the prison where Mubarak is being held.

Link

Personally, I don't think this is a good thing for Egypt if Mubarak gets released. I can understand their plight against radicalism. In fact, I always believed the Egyptian uprising to be the only true struggle against radicalism, dictatorship and corruption out of all the "arab spring" revolution.

Letting Mubarak off the hook will show the military is taking sides and not just purely there in defense of innocent citizens against radical extremists.

Edited August 21, 2013 by Black Red Devil

[Taun]

Perhaps they could put him in a form of house arrest - limiting his access to his old cronies - pending the results of his re-trial...

I'm not very knowledgeable about his trial and the evidence against him... Is his re-trial a legitimate 'quest for the truth'.. or simply political manuvering?

Is anyone on this forum reasonably well informed about the evidence against him? I don't doubt that deposing him was a good thing... I just am not sure about

his trial...

[Mr.United_Nations]

well he wont live long to become powerful again

[+and-then]

The MB slaughtered Sadat like he was a swine. Mubarak kicked them out of public life in the country. He suppressed and imprisoned them and Egypt knew a degree of peace. YES there was oppression and his regime was somewhat despotic - I don't support his crimes - but in this region he was fighting against a group that..slaughters sitting presidents like swine. The people of Egypt deserve better than they've received so far and I hope the military can find the wisdom to work through this and restore a truly representative civil government.

[meryt-tetisheri]

Mubarak has been released 'temporarily' (but not acquitted) of two specific charges:

-Receiving gifts illegally from the state-owned Al-Ahram institute during his tenure as Egyptian president. He paid 18 million to cover gifts he received since 2005, the issue of gifts received before 2005 remains.

- Financial corruption related to the renovation of presidential palaces during his rule.

He was sentenced to life in prison last year for failing to prevent the killing of demonstrators. His appeal was accepted by court earlier this year and a retrial was ordered. There were no written orders issued to kill demonstrators, many documents were shredded, burnt, or lost. That makes the case against him difficult to prove in a court of law.

I don’t think he will be released; probably there will be another list of charges awaiting him. “Mubarak had been released pending investigations over other charges but has remained in custody as he is still facing trials over multiple other charges of murder and corruption, including this case. “ His, and his family's assets are still sequestered and they are still not allowed to leave Egypt.

In any case he is 85, and his health is very poor, I do not see him playing any political role in the future. His lawyer, Fareed El Deeb, is considered to be the ‘cleverest’ lawyer in Egypt, however, he found an even better lawyer in Mursi!

Mubarak had a tacit agreement with the MB, leaving the door ajar for them to run for parliamentary elections as ‘independent’; allowed them to organize, and run their ‘charity’ network, undeterred. Under his rule they actually fared better than other secular opposition parties or figures.

edited for clarification

Edited August 21, 2013 by meryt-tetisheri

[+and-then]

Mubarak has been released 'temporarily' (but not acquitted) of two specific charges:

-Receiving gifts illegally from the state-owned Al-Ahram institute during his tenure as Egyptian president. He paid 18 million to cover gifts he received since 2005, the issue of gifts received before 2005 remains.

- Financial corruption related to the renovation of presidential palaces during his rule.

He was sentenced to life in prison last year for failing to prevent the killing of demonstrators. His appeal was accepted by court earlier this year and a retrial was ordered. There were no written orders issued to kill demonstrators, many documents were shredded, burnt, or lost. That makes the case against him difficult to prove in a court of law.

I don’t think he will be released; probably there will be another list of charges awaiting him. “Mubarak had been released pending investigations over other charges but has remained in custody as he is still facing trials over multiple other charges of murder and corruption, including this case. “ His, and his family's assets are still sequestered and they are still not allowed to leave Egypt.

In any case he is 85, and his health is very poor, I do not see him playing any political role in the future. His lawyer, Fareed El Deeb, is considered to be the ‘cleverest’ lawyer in Egypt, however, he found an even better lawyer in Mursi!

Mubarak had a tacit agreement with the MB, leaving the door ajar for them to run for parliamentary elections as ‘independent’; allowed them to organize, and run their ‘charity’ network, undeterred. Under his rule they actually fared better than other secular opposition parties or figures.

edited for clarification

The press here has consistently told the story of Mubarak reigning them in and imprisoning many of them. More lies from them? I have long been under the impression that but for Mubarak the MB would have been running Egypt long ago. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

[meryt-tetisheri]

It was more of an 'on/off' arrangement: they were allowed to operate within certain boundaries but were still liable for punitive actions if they politically stray too far. Don't forget that Mursi was a member of the parliament and so were other MB members too (but never allowed to form a political party, they were 'independent')! While the deputy of the supreme guide, Kheirat el Shater was in prison, yet it was agreed upon that arresting the Guide, Mohammed Badei, was a 'red line'. Mohammed Badie referred to Mubarak as the 'father of the nation' and was on record willing to accept the nomination of Gamal Mubarak as president. During the first days of the January 25, 2011 revolution the MB clearly announced that they were against it. There was an agreed upon modus vivendi between the regime and the MB. He feared them I guess, but feared more the secular parties which were regularly harassed. As a result they effectively became the most active opposition group on the scene, which further helped increase their influence.

Edited August 21, 2013 by meryt-tetisheri

[meryt-tetisheri]

"In the context of the emergency law, the deputy military commander issued an order that Mohamed Hosni Mubarak should be put under house arrest," read a statement from the office."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/21/us-egypt-mubarak-housearrest-idUSBRE97K14F20130821