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markdohle

Religion without spirituality

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Religion without spirituality

Religion without spirituality becomes dry and empty. Christians have a relationship not with something, but with someone. Many people find that off putting and there are times when Christians are the reason for that. For infinite love can often be reduced to something unstable like human love. Idols are hard to let go of, but grace slowly leads us deeper into the mystery.....each in his or her own time. I both seek this love and fight it at the same time, often coming from places beyond my control. So I just continue, hopefully allowing grace to do its healing work. We are called to love ourselves and others, something difficult to do with many failures along the way; all we need do is to get back up again. For what we relate to, that someone is also compassionate and merciful in ways that we as human, finite beings, cannot comprehend.

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...we as human, finite beings, cannot comprehend.

That is such a key point. We humans can be so self-centered that we find it troubling to accept that there are things greater than ourselves.

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I struggle with my faith, it seems to always be on shaky ground no matter what is happening at the time, good or bad. I had never thought much about it until now, but my own fears are kind of like that hard to let go of idol. In another way, does that make me self absorbed or self centered? That is not how I want to be at all.

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"Religion without spirituality becomes dry and empty." I have to hope you know what you mean by that but I sure don't.

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"Religion without spirituality becomes dry and empty." I have to hope you know what you mean by that but I sure don't.

Religion is there to lead us into a deeper relationship with the infinite (for me as a Christian that would be Jesus Christ). To only stay on the surface, to become a nominal follower, or believer, leading to shallowness and living out of rules that have no real meaning, if ones interior life is not in relationship with God. Today especially there is a need for people to study and understand what they believe and why.

Peace

Mark

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I struggle with my faith, it seems to always be on shaky ground no matter what is happening at the time, good or bad. I had never thought much about it until now, but my own fears are kind of like that hard to let go of idol. In another way, does that make me self absorbed or self centered? That is not how I want to be at all.

It is good to read others, to read broadly in ones own tradition as well as to read of the experiences of others. To find meaning in our lives is central to what I believe it means to be human, to be fully human. Without meaning, we drift.

Peace

Mark

That is such a key point. We humans can be so self-centered that we find it troubling to accept that there are things greater than ourselves.

I believe it is good to keep reality open ended, to never let go of seeking as well as study.

Peace

mark

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for me its spirituality without religion.

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Religion is an organized institution, sometimes forced on people. Spirituality is like an inner voice.

Religion without spirituality seems to be the norm when you look at the religious leaders of our world.

Spirituality without religion is the way to go as it makes you doubt and question to find your inner truth....this is how I see it.

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Religion without spirituality

Religion without spirituality becomes dry and empty.

I know exactly what you mean by this.

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I know exactly what you mean by this.

Thank you. From my personal experience, our inner experiences only deepen the insights of our traditions. Without them, we pick and choose, and leave out much that can challenge us and also lead to some understanding that we need guidance and community. Again, I am speaking for myself, my past and the past of others here are vastly different.

Peace

Mark

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Religion is there to lead us into a deeper relationship with the infinite (for me as a Christian that would be Jesus Christ). To only stay on the surface, to become a nominal follower, or believer, leading to shallowness and living out of rules that have no real meaning, if ones interior life is not in relationship with God. Today especially there is a need for people to study and understand what they believe and why.

Peace

Mark

I have to conclude by this that you think in slogans, not with rational but emotional notions. I think such "deeper relationships" are self-generated and part of our natural instinct to want to believe what we were taught as children rather than think for ourselves. Anyway, that is how it comes across to me; you need much more than just sloganeering to persuade someone genuinely spiritual rather than superficially so.

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While I agree that religion without spirituality and a sort-of sense of mystery. Has a a way of becoming dry and riddled with superficial symbols. What you whristians fail to see is that by worshiping Jesus (or any other idol) you forget about the real G-d. Jesus never claimed to be G-d, he simply wanted to b heard and respected within his community as a legitimate teacher. Paul of Taursus is the only reason modern Christians worship Jesus, he represents the rift between Judaism and the chriatian cult.

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The superficiality of religion is sometimes seen in rule-making and other forms of idolatry, but it can also be seen in use of emotions rather than reason.

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I too agree that religion without spirituality is dry and empty.

John 4:23-24 "But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

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