Earth is Growing!

[Big Bad Voodoo]

[StarMountainKid]

There was a thread about this a while ago. I for one did some simple research on this hypothesis, and the easy conclusion I reached was that it's B.S.

[Mikko-kun]

Interesting. It should be pretty obvious earth has always been growing, because we've being constantly hit by space rubble, albeit smaller mostly but there. Piles up and doesn't really go away. But it was news to me that earth's size has doubled since 65 million years ago. Pretty fast growth, we might one day be Jupiter-size, though it takes time. That kinda gravitational pressure would make whatever life might still be there, evolve to be stronger than us, but I wonder how it would affect their lifespan and thinking, would being stronger equate to increased adrenaline and aggression?

I know nothing bout tectonic plates though, xcept what school told me.

[EnderOTD]

Im just curious if earth was half the size 65 million years ago would there have even been enough gravity to keep its atmosphere?

From wikipedia:

An atmosphere (New Latin atmosphaera, created in the 17th century from Greek ἀτμός [atmos] "vapor"^[1] and σφαῖρα [sphaira] "sphere"^[2]) is a layer of gases surrounding a material body of sufficient mass^[3] that is held in place by the gravity of the body. An atmosphere is more likely to be retained if the gravity is high and the atmosphere's temperature is low.

I think thats one of the reasons Mars wasnt able to sustain a decent atmosphere itself and hence the reason its a dead planet today.

[DecoNoir]

The problem here is that the Earth is apparently growing from nothing! Is the Earth taking surface mass from its interior? No, because then the Earths interior would be largely hallow. We know it isn't because we still have volcanic activity, which requires large quantities of heat and pressure in which a hallow Earth cannot provide. Matter collected from space debris would be rather insignificant compaired to the total mass needed to support such growth, basically the equivalent of you doubling yoyr size with the mass of a hair. Thus we can conclude that the Earth is not growing in such a way because it doesn't have the mass to do so.

Something I've noticed a lot with fringe theories is that they always fail the basics.

[Mikko-kun]

The problem here is that the Earth is apparently growing from nothing! Is the Earth taking surface mass from its interior? No, because then the Earths interior would be largely hallow. We know it isn't because we still have volcanic activity, which requires large quantities of heat and pressure in which a hallow Earth cannot provide. Matter collected from space debris would be rather insignificant compaired to the total mass needed to support such growth, basically the equivalent of you doubling yoyr size with the mass of a hair. Thus we can conclude that the Earth is not growing in such a way because it doesn't have the mass to do so.

Something I've noticed a lot with fringe theories is that they always fail the basics.

Just two replies ago I mentioned the space rubble flying on us constantly. It's small, yes, but does it somehow leave earth? No.

Unless volcanoes shoot it high enough off the air. There was a stuff about space rubble constantly hitting us in a finnish science magazine, some argentinan research place where they register the frequency of space rubble showed results it being pretty constant. It might burn to fragments in the atmosphere, but those fragments still reach us.

Edited September 26, 2013 by Mikko-kun

[DecoNoir]

Just two replies ago I mentioned the space rubble flying on us constantly. It's small, yes, but does it somehow leave earth? No.

Unless volcanoes shoot it high enough off the air. There was a stuff about space rubble constantly hitting us in a finnish science magazine, some argentinan research place where they register the frequency of space rubble showed results it being pretty constant. It might burn to fragments in the atmosphere, but those fragments still reach us.

And I addressed that issue say specifically that the accumulated mass of such debris is insignificant in total comparison to the Earth. In fact the majority of such matter vaporizes into gas becoming part of our atmosphere, thus never adding its mass to the Earth itself.

[Mikko-kun]

But does that gas leave earth and not come back? If not, then we'd have a very gassy planet like Venus, but no. So the gas either leaves the earth or comes back down eventually.

And you should really read the study about how much matter actually manages to rain down to earth? They register it every minute, the sensors on ground level, maybe every second. That goes on thousands, millions of years. If those particles cannot be pushed outside earth's atmosphere by volcanoes or anything else, it will keep growing. Will some force pull those molecules out of the atmosphere, outside earth into space? Like a comet that passes by?

Edited September 26, 2013 by Mikko-kun

[DecoNoir]

But does that gas leave earth and not come back? If not, then we'd have a very gassy planet like Venus, but no. So the gas either leaves the earth or comes back down eventually.

And you should really read the study about how much matter actually manages to rain down to earth? They register it every minute, the sensors on ground level, maybe every second. That goes on thousands, millions of years. If those particles cannot be pushed outside earth's atmosphere by volcanoes or anything else, it will keep growing. Will some force pull those molecules out of the atmosphere, outside earth into space? Like a comet that passes by?

Ok, basic atmoshperics 101. One of the primary gases of our atmosphere is hydrogen. Hydrogen on its own is actually light enough to escape our atmosphere, and in fact does so at a rate of approximately 95,000 tonnes per year. Helium, being slightly heavier escapes at a rate of approximately 1,600 tonnes per year. Have no fear as this amounts to about. 000000000001% of the total atmospheric mass, so it would take trillions of years for it all to escape naturally. Of course by then the sun will have expanded and destroyed the Earth by then.

Getting back to the main topic. The estimated mass of yearly star dust hitting Earth is about 41,000 tonnes. Sounds like a lot right? However the total mass of the Earth is about 5.97219 × 10^24 kg.

Or

5,972,190,000,000,000,000,000,000 kg

If you know anything about percentages you could see that the star dust fall is not only insuffecient to double the size of the Earth in the time frame the video showed, but laughably so.

[Frank Merton]

Just two replies ago I mentioned the space rubble flying on us constantly. It's small, yes, but does it somehow leave earth? No.

Unless volcanoes shoot it high enough off the air. There was a stuff about space rubble constantly hitting us in a finnish science magazine, some argentinan research place where they register the frequency of space rubble showed results it being pretty constant. It might burn to fragments in the atmosphere, but those fragments still reach us.

You know you are showing off a good deal of ignorance. Incoming matter is not just small, but compared to the planet it is microscopic. It would take billions of years for it to effect the earth's mass by even a fraction of a percent.

[Guest]

Absolute spectacular rubbish. Plate tectonics is an observable phenomena across the whole of the atlantic and on the pacific rim.

Answer the simple question - where did all the extra material come from ??

Mind blowing.

Br Cornelius

[Frank Merton]

Absolute spectacular rubbish. Plate tectonics is an observable phenomena across the whole of the atlantic and on the pacific rim.

Answer the simple question - where did all the extra material come from ??

Mind blowing.

Br Cornelius

I think maybe the gullibility people have to this sort of thing derives from ignorance, not any foolishness. In this case it is just not comprehending the real size of the planet, and of course not understanding plate tectonics.

[Rlyeh]

Why is the guy making this hypothesis not a geologist?

[Mikko-kun]

You know you are showing off a good deal of ignorance. Incoming matter is not just small, but compared to the planet it is microscopic. It would take billions of years for it to effect the earth's mass by even a fraction of a percent.

You sure are quick to brand me, I was just asking questions. Chill.

[DecoNoir]

Why is the guy making this hypothesis not a geologist?

Does it matter? He has a YouTube video, he must be right! (Sarcasm)

[Big Bad Voodoo]

Im not geologist but this seems logic. Atleast that how it looks in video.

Voodoo

[DecoNoir]

Im not geologist but this seems logic. Atleast that how it looks in video.

Voodoo

Its not. As I explained in previous posts you need mass to increase the volume of the Earth. In order to increase the Earths mass you need matter. My previous posts have shown the the rate of matter accumulation from space debris wouldn't even add up to a 1% increase in Earths mass over a time period of a billion years.

And since the Earth doesn't just spontaneously produce matter, because matter is never produced or destroyed, there is no mechanism for a growing Earth in any way, shape or form.

[Big Bad Voodoo]

Its not. As I explained in previous posts you need mass to increase the volume of the Earth. In order to increase the Earths mass you need matter. My previous posts have shown the the rate of matter accumulation from space debris wouldn't even add up to a 1% increase in Earths mass over a time period of a billion years.

And since the Earth doesn't just spontaneously produce matter, because matter is never produced or destroyed, there is no mechanism for a growing Earth in any way, shape or form.

You said it like we need new matter. Maybe just existing matter expand.

Like in this video.

Maybe some new mechanism/chemistry trick we dont know about cause it.

[DecoNoir]

You said it like we need new matter. Maybe just existing matter expand.

Like in this video.

Maybe some new mechanism/chemistry trick we dont know about cause it.

If that were the case we wouldn't have the geologic forces that we have: volcanos, earthquakes etc. These forces require immense amounts of heat and pressure that wouldn't be present if Earths matter spontaneously increased in volume. When you gain volume without the addition of mass, you lose density. When you lose density you lose the pressures on the mantle and all geologic activity stops. Also the gravitational force of the Earth would prevent such expansion. Also, the silicates that make up the Earth don't have the flexibility to expand in that way.

[Big Bad Voodoo]

Im mean Universe is spreading. Maybe we are also spreading. I dont understand geologic process to argue about. But I do know history of plate tectonics. Like that means a lot!

[DecoNoir]

Im mean Universe is spreading. Maybe we are also spreading. I dont understand geologic process to argue about. But I do know history of plate tectonics. Like that means a lot!

The universe is expanding, as in the space between objects in the universe is increasing. This is not equivalent to objects themselves gaining volume. Expansion of the Earth would be observable, and we have no evidence of such beyond the twisted statements of a YouYube video.

As it is, we have evidence of plate tectonics, it is observable (even by me as I live in a geologically active area) and has a mechanism that exists well withen the laws of physics.

[Big Bad Voodoo]

The universe is expanding, as in the space between objects in the universe is increasing. This is not equivalent to objects themselves gaining volume. Expansion of the Earth would be observable, and we have no evidence of such beyond the twisted statements of a YouYube video.

As it is, we have evidence of plate tectonics, it is observable (even by me as I live in a geologically active area) and has a mechanism that exists well withen the laws of physics.

Maybe we are expanding too!

[DecoNoir]

Maybe we are expanding too!

Guess what! We're not! Believe it or not you can actually tell if a massive object like Earth is expanding. Since its not hasn't been observed, its not happening.

Did you miss the part where I explained that objects aren't expanding, only the space between them?

[Big Bad Voodoo]

Did you miss the part where I explained that objects aren't expanding, only the space between them?

Why is that in the first place?

[DecoNoir]

Why is that in the first place?

Why is that in the first place?

The mechanism isn't fully known. We call it dark energy, dark as in it hasn't been directly observed. The theory is that this energy is greater than the energy of whatever is beyond the universe. So far it has only been observed increasing the space between objects, galaxies to be precise. You can tell when an object is moving away by observing the Doppler Shift.