"Christian" is a useless term

[Mr Walker]

Or it indeed re-enforces my point, that the Christian religion has become so convoluted that this script written by someone else, quite accurately satirizes the mess of confusion inherent within the religion...

Yes it does that too. I was considering that point in regards to ignorance. Many people are; first ignorant of the bible, and second ignorant of other branches of Christianity, let alone other religions And yet, in ill informed ignorance, they still feel comfortable making both inaccurate jokes and inaccurate assessments of religion.

So many people judge religions without any comprehension at all of what belief means to, and does for, the individual believers. Yet even a little reading of historical fact or fiction will show how religion, as an integral part of peoples' lives, offered the only solace and comfort available to them in times when, for example, half of all women died in childbirth and 70% of children never survived to puberty. When a scratch or a fever could kill a healthy adult. When most people had to have their teeth pulled out without anaesthetic, because they were rotted and infected, and so on.

[Mr Walker]

I don't blame the divorce rates on the sexualization of society but on liberation; divorce is no longer a social or economic kiss of death, and courts no longer make it almost impossible. Therefore people are able to more easily break harmful and destructive relationships.

And yet most modern divorces are not the result of harmful/destructive relationships, but of selfishness, sexual infidelity, or a desire to do better for oneself. Sometimes it has been the result of increased female emancipation and expectation, when males have not yet been liberated from their traditional roles in life. But largely it is simply thi.s women can now live alone and cope economically. Once upon a time this was impossible. Until the mid to late 1800s, a woman was her fathers property until she married, when she became her husband's property. In return they had to maintain her and care for her as she provided her role as mother and home maker.

Fortunately in Australia, at least, divorce rates have levelled out and dropped considerably in recent years

[docyabut2]

The term "Christian" is almost meaningless. Although there is only one Church - the body of Christ, essentially the avatar of Jesus - there are many, many denominations, groups, movements, and belief systems. One person who calls himself Christian may actually have diametric beliefs to another Christian. All of this can make it difficult to discuss Christianity without identifying specific beliefs and influences.

I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Jhn 15:2

Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Jhn 15:3

Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

Jhn 15:4

Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

Jhn 15:5

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

Jhn 15:6

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

There are many branches of Chistianity but if you abide in him there is no problem:)

If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

[+Link of Hyrule]

I don't blame the divorce rates on the sexualization of society but on liberation; divorce is no longer a social or economic kiss of death, and courts no longer make it almost impossible. Therefore people are able to more easily break harmful and destructive relationships.

Are 60% of relationships in America harmful and destructive?

Or are people just selfish. When they no longer get what they want they move on to a better booty call.

Edited October 29, 2013 by Paranoid Android

[+Link of Hyrule]

The last Christian (at least she claimed to be one) I went out with had been divorced four times.

She admitted she got married a lot because, as a Christian, she felt that sex outside of marriage is a sin.

What did she think about divorce being a sin in God's eyes?

[docyabut2]

No wonder Jesus said one wife, he proberly knew all the sexual diseases people would get that could kill, pure hell:0)

[scowl]

What did she think about divorce being a sin in God's eyes?

She said that Jesus forgives all sins so no problem there. Better to sin four times than every weekend, right Jesus?

[scowl]

Or are people just selfish. When they no longer get what they want they move on to a better booty call.

What I've seen with the few divorces I've witnessed were not "booty call" situations in any way. In fact I don't know of a single married person who has cheated! I'd lean towards "selfish". In most of them one person changed or more likely became the person they actually are. From what I've seen, people are great at hiding flaws and acting on their best behavior before marriage. Some time after they're married, their true nature comes out.

Some divorces I know:

One woman loved to hike and camp and climb mountains and found a guy who also loved doing these things. About a year after they married, he decided that sitting in front of the TV every weekend was more fun. When she convinced him to go camping, he went out of his way to make the experience miserable.

Another woman divorced her husband after he decided that working sucked. Since she was bringing home the bacon he felt everything was fine. Every time I went over there he was playing video games like a teenager. When she suggested divorce, he emptied out their joint accounts and spent all the money.

Another woman married a really nice guy. They were a fun couple and we did lots of things together. Unfortunately five years later he discovered cocaine and never came home again.

A coworker married a woman who developed a spending addiction. She was running them into bankruptcy and there was nothing he could do about it but divorce her. This was a tough situation because we all think she's a sweet person who just doesn't know how money works.

"Sexualization of our culture"? Bah. People have learned how to act like angels before marriage then feel they can act like selfish jerks after the honeymoon. These people didn't believe marriage is a partnership.

Of course this was less of a problem when the wife just did everything her husband told her to.

[Mr Walker]

Are 60% of relationships in America harmful and destructive?

Or are people just selfish. When they no longer get what they want they move on to a better booty call.

Well I'm sure every red blooded male is tempted by a better booty

[Mr Walker]

No wonder Jesus said one wife, he proberly knew all the sexual diseases people would get that could kill, pure hell:0)

Or he was being very considerate of men. One wife is more than most men can handle, except in societies where women are very subordinate to men, and even there it can be a problem.

[Mr Walker]

Of course this was less of a problem when the wife just did everything her husband told her to.

Also works where the husband does everything the wife tells him.

[+Link of Hyrule]

She said that Jesus forgives all sins so no problem there. Better to sin four times than every weekend, right Jesus?

She has a very warped view of sin. Not at all biblical.

What I've seen with the few divorces I've witnessed were not "booty call" situations in any way. In fact I don't know of a single married person who has cheated! I'd lean towards "selfish". In most of them one person changed or more likely became the person they actually are. From what I've seen, people are great at hiding flaws and acting on their best behavior before marriage. Some time after they're married, their true nature comes out.

Some divorces I know:

One woman loved to hike and camp and climb mountains and found a guy who also loved doing these things. About a year after they married, he decided that sitting in front of the TV every weekend was more fun. When she convinced him to go camping, he went out of his way to make the experience miserable.

Another woman divorced her husband after he decided that working sucked. Since she was bringing home the bacon he felt everything was fine. Every time I went over there he was playing video games like a teenager. When she suggested divorce, he emptied out their joint accounts and spent all the money.

Another woman married a really nice guy. They were a fun couple and we did lots of things together. Unfortunately five years later he discovered cocaine and never came home again.

A coworker married a woman who developed a spending addiction. She was running them into bankruptcy and there was nothing he could do about it but divorce her. This was a tough situation because we all think she's a sweet person who just doesn't know how money works.

"Sexualization of our culture"? Bah. People have learned how to act like angels before marriage then feel they can act like selfish jerks after the honeymoon. These people didn't believe marriage is a partnership.

Of course this was less of a problem when the wife just did everything her husband told her to.

My comment about booty calls was a tad flippant, I admit. And perhaps I'm oversimplifying by laying all the blame on the sexualisation of society. I should have said that the sexualisation of society is one component in a wider problem. Our society is becoming ever more "me" focused. The "Just Do It" generation. Everything is geared towards what makes you feel good. The sexualisation of society is one component of that, with focus on instant gratification. When it comes to marriage a similarly selfish attitude is helpful only as long as the other person makes you feel good. The moment that changes, you no longer get what you want out of it, they move on to new things. Marriage, as you say, is a partnership. With the examples you gave, with the possible exception of the dude on cocaine (drugs can change people) all of those examples were issues that could be dealt with if they weren't stuck in the me-generation mentality.

I'm not naive enough to suggest that everything would be peachy, or that in some cases the end result may still be divorce. But I daresay if people begin a marriage with an other-person focus rather than the self, divorce rates would ever so quickly fall.

[scowl]

She has a very warped view of sin. Not at all biblical.

No, Jesus forgives sins. It's in the New Testament. Four sins is better than a hundred sins.

My comment about booty calls was a tad flippant, I admit. And perhaps I'm oversimplifying by laying all the blame on the sexualisation of society. I should have said that the sexualisation of society is one component in a wider problem. Our society is becoming ever more "me" focused. The "Just Do It" generation. Everything is geared towards what makes you feel good. The sexualisation of society is one component of that, with focus on instant gratification.

People have been saying that about every generation since the 1900's, maybe even before that. I think it's some kind of flaw in human perception. We can't help but think the next generation must be inferior to ours.

When it comes to marriage a similarly selfish attitude is helpful only as long as the other person makes you feel good. The moment that changes, you no longer get what you want out of it, they move on to new things. Marriage, as you say, is a partnership. With the examples you gave, with the possible exception of the dude on cocaine (drugs can change people) all of those examples were issues that could be dealt with if they weren't stuck in the me-generation mentality.

I personally don't think it's this "me generation" stuff since that has always existed. If anything is happening, I think people are getting better and better at manipulating other people by playing "roles" and as a result, people's expectations are unrealistically high. People are less likely to start a relationship based on honesty since admitting your flaws reduces your apparent worth. Men and women have learned to "sell themselves" like products, glossing over their flaws, exaggerating if not falsifying their appealing qualities and predicting rosy futures together.

President Harry Truman proposed to his wife asking if she'd be happy with a husband who would probably be a farmer for the rest of his life. Do you think that would work today?

We used to have books on how to pick up women in bars. I think those techniques have expanded into how to get someone to marry you. All these people I mentioned shouldn't have gotten married because they quickly became "different" after they got married. The people I know in these divorces all say that their spouse "changed". I'm cynical. I think they were frauds from the very first date.

Maybe that's because I didn't mention the con-artist who was a complete fraud. He claimed to have degrees in physics even though he was working in a book store. I was suspicious of him the moment I met him. He barely understood Newton's Laws but shrugged off my Physics 101 questions as insulting. Of course my friend who was going out with him thought he was a genius. Why wasn't this guy using his brilliance to make a living? "Politics, man! ****ing politics!" Yep, the whole scientific industry was keeping him down! We begged our friend not to marry this shyster but she was smitten by him. He was very charming.

She got suspicious when the newly married couple would visit people's houses and their friends claimed valuables were missing afterwards. We finally convinced her to make some phone calls and she found he didn't have the degrees he claimed. A background check showed that they only time he used Newton's Laws was on car ignitions and people's back doors. Once the jig was up, he ran off with another woman and the marriage was annulled.

[+Liquid Gardens]

Our society is becoming ever more "me" focused. The "Just Do It" generation. Everything is geared towards what makes you feel good.

Isn't that largely why you go to church and live your religious beliefs, because it feels good? What makes your particular 'me' focus better than the 'Just Do It' generation's?

With the examples you gave, with the possible exception of the dude on cocaine (drugs can change people) all of those examples were issues that could be dealt with if they weren't stuck in the me-generation mentality.

What generation has not been a 'me-generation', what era, and what was different?

[Mr Walker]

Isn't that largely why you go to church and live your religious beliefs, because it feels good? What makes your particular 'me' focus better than the 'Just Do It' generation's?

What generation has not been a 'me-generation', what era, and what was different?

Because it is more productive for individuals but especially for the society in which an individual lives . Ancient romans greeks and egyptian educated classes were taught to honorr family, to be honest, to serve, to be dutiful etc And to put family city and state before self.

My generation, along with those of my parents and grandparents were taught the same.Toto serve to obey to be a productive part of family and society. Sure we were encouraged to advance ourselves, but only because a educated and skilled person has more to offer to others and to their society.

I am sure not every person of those generations learned the same thing, especially in some parts of the western world but enough did to shape society, just as the lack of those principles is shaping modern society, even though many individuals stick to them. There have always been cheats, power seekers, con artists and selfish people, but today such behaviour and principles are encouraged by mainstream attitudes and values, and by laws and social expectations.

My wife only ever wanted to marry a farmer, instead she got me; but, being old school, she has made the best of it and shaped me so I can come close to her expectations (I can even shear a sheep with hand shears and milk a cow by hand.).

[+Link of Hyrule]

No, Jesus forgives sins. It's in the New Testament. Four sins is better than a hundred sins.

That's not how sin works. Assuming she went into her first marriage with the intention of making it a lifelong union (a big assumption, considering you've said she got married to have sex) then when she got divorced she became an adulteress, at the same time her ex-husband became an adulterer. By her fourth marriage she'smade three other people into adulterers and must expect that her vow for lifelong union is a lie, and therefore God has not sanctioned the marriage. So not only has she caused others to sin, she's also sinning by having sex out of marriage (biblical marriage isn't about a piece of paper). She's also trying to use God's rules to squirrel away what she wants, which is extremely hypocritical, as if she's using a loophole in God's law (remind you of the Pharisees?). If anything, she's sinning more by getting a marriage certificate because she's lying and causing others to sin.

People have been saying that about every generation since the 1900's, maybe even before that. I think it's some kind of flaw in human perception. We can't help but think the next generation must be inferior to ours.

I never said anything about any generation being inferior to another. Every society has problems, because no society is perfect. We fix some of the problems, and new problems arise. Pointing out the problems in our current society doesn't mean the previous generation was better.

I personally don't think it's this "me generation" stuff since that has always existed.

Not to the extent that our current society has. An unemployed adult playing computer games all day until that lifestyle is threatened and do he empties his wife's bank accounts and runs off. That's becoming par for the course these days. The extreme side of the me-generation. I am neither the first nor the last to point this out

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/3930620

Fact is that society has become increasingly self-centred over the last decades.

If anything is happening, I think people are getting better and better at manipulating other people by playing "roles" and as a result, people's expectations are unrealistically high. People are less likely to start a relationship based on honesty since admitting your flaws reduces your apparent worth. Men and women have learned to "sell themselves" like products, glossing over their flaws, exaggerating if not falsifying their appealing qualities and predicting rosy futures together.

President Harry Truman proposed to his wife asking if she'd be happy with a husband who would probably be a farmer for the rest of his life. Do you think that would work today?

We used to have books on how to pick up women in bars. I think those techniques have expanded into how to get someone to marry you. All these people I mentioned shouldn't have gotten married because they quickly became "different" after they got married. The people I know in these divorces all say that their spouse "changed". I'm cynical. I think they were frauds from the very first date.

And if they were "other-person focused" the fact they changed should not have mattered. Though naturally a relationship is a two-way street, so both should have been other-person focused. The coworker whose wife developed a spending addiction seems workable if both worked at it. Give the husband sole control of household finances, budget for a psychologist to regularly visit. It's not easy and may take a lifetime to fix, but divorce isn't the only option. But because of the me-generation syndrome, they aren't getting anything out of it, so they divorce.

Maybe that's because I didn't mention the con-artist who was a complete fraud. He claimed to have degrees in physics even though he was working in a book store. I was suspicious of him the moment I met him. He barely understood Newton's Laws but shrugged off my Physics 101 questions as insulting. Of course my friend who was going out with him thought he was a genius. Why wasn't this guy using his brilliance to make a living? "Politics, man! ****ing politics!" Yep, the whole scientific industry was keeping him down! We begged our friend not to marry this shyster but she was smitten by him. He was very charming.

She got suspicious when the newly married couple would visit people's houses and their friends claimed valuables were missing afterwards. We finally convinced her to make some phone calls and she found he didn't have the degrees he claimed. A background check showed that they only time he used Newton's Laws was on car ignitions and people's back doors. Once the jig was up, he ran off with another woman and the marriage was annulled.

Unfortunately there will always be conmen and those who tread on or swindle anyone they can to get ahead. That's not unique to the me-generation. Edited October 31, 2013 by Paranoid Android

[+Link of Hyrule]

Isn't that largely why you go to church and live your religious beliefs, because it feels good? What makes your particular 'me' focus better than the 'Just Do It' generation's?

I go to church to worship God, learn about him, encourage my brothers and sisters and in turn be encouraged by them. My focus is on God, and on my Christian family. It's not always happy happy joy joy, sometimes it's sombre and far from happy. But at all times my focus is to serve others.

Sometimes when I visit a new church I'll give them a little "test". Normally I'm friendly enough to just join a conversion and introduce myself, but at a new church after the service I've just moved to the side of the room and stood there, not knowing anyone. Some churches, the people divide up into various groups and just talk amongst themselves, ignoring the newbie standing alone. Other churches I've had half a dozen people come and strike up a conversation. I don't think it's a coincidence that the churches where people approached me had a strong focus through their Mission Statements and regular sermons to serve others and not just be in it for yourself.

What generation has not been a 'me-generation', what era, and what was different?

Different eras had different focuses. For example, a coworker of mine I once worked with was Indian. The first time she met her husband was the day they got married. Her parents had arranged the marriage, and they'd been together happily for 15 years. Did she get extremely lucky to be partnered with her soulmate? Or did they just work hard together? Meanwhile, in Hollywood we have celebrities marry and divorce 72 hours later.

The link I provided to Scowl (above) shows some of the issues confronting the modern me-generation.

[+Sherapy]

Isn't that largely why you go to church and live your religious beliefs, because it feels good? What makes your particular 'me' focus better than the 'Just Do It' generation's?

What generation has not been a 'me-generation', what era, and what was different?

I think you have a point; I was actually thinking this too, Until I had kids it was a very all about me time until I matured, it was a process of growing into my independence. In fact, it was encouraged, I was told things like figure out who you are first, be you, take the time to experience life unencumbered. Heck, I tell my kids the same thing. It is an important time in a life to experience independence. Its called maturing. It is normal, it passes. It doesn't mean that the 'me' er's do not do humanitarian things, contribute to their community,or go to church, or care about anyone. Personally, I think it is when we have children that we come out of the me stage and become truly altruistic/unselfish.

[Frank Merton]

I think we would do well to get rid of the idea of "sin," or at least only use it with ticks around it. It is the idea of going against God. Sheesh how could there possibly be forgiveness for that?

The fact is we sometimes out of our less-than-better selves do things that harm others. These are in my mind moral offenses, and create negativity if in no other way than when we do it and don't correct ourselves we make ourselves a little more able to do it again, this time with less hesitance. In short, we make ourselves a little more evil. In parts of Asia that is called negative karma.

The problem with "sin" is that all sins are equally evil. They are all offenses against God. This eliminates the ability in some people's minds to think about human behavior rationally. Since moral offenses are sometimes serious, sometimes trivial, and often we much choose one harm (say telling a lie) over another (say hurting someone's feelings). Only with the ability to scale these offenses can we hope to make rational choices.

The important thing is when we do harm someone we do all we can to correct it or mitigate the harm. Otherwise we harden ourselves and leave the world a slightly worse place.

[Mr Walker]

I think we would do well to get rid of the idea of "sin," or at least only use it with ticks around it. It is the idea of going against God. Sheesh how could there possibly be forgiveness for that?

The fact is we sometimes out of our less-than-better selves do things that harm others. These are in my mind moral offenses, and create negativity if in no other way than when we do it and don't correct ourselves we make ourselves a little more able to do it again, this time with less hesitance. In short, we make ourselves a little more evil. In parts of Asia that is called negative karma.

The problem with "sin" is that all sins are equally evil. They are all offenses against God. This eliminates the ability in some people's minds to think about human behavior rationally. Since moral offenses are sometimes serious, sometimes trivial, and often we much choose one harm (say telling a lie) over another (say hurting someone's feelings). Only with the ability to scale these offenses can we hope to make rational choices.

The important thing is when we do harm someone we do all we can to correct it or mitigate the harm. Otherwise we harden ourselves and leave the world a slightly worse place.

I don't see it like this. To me sins have differing effects /harm and so like Karma some sins do more harm and damage and take more to make right. God forgives us our sins against him, but in Christianity one must also get (or at least sincerely ask for as a part of admitting ones hurts against another) the forgiveness of the one sinned against, and make right that which one has done wrong ie restore the balance of karma. Thus one "regrows" one's "soul" and makes it better, more positive, and stronger.

[Frank Merton]

You say, "I don't see it like this," and then go on to reinforce what I said. Sometimes I have to think you disagree just to disagree and palaver.

[Mr Walker]

You say, "I don't see it like this," and then go on to reinforce what I said. Sometimes I have to think you disagree just to disagree and palaver.

Sorry I should have highlighted the bit I meant. I do not see Christianity as saying" all sins are equal" either in the eyes of god, or in the eyes of man. I do like a good argument but I don't pick them deliberately. I get enough just by being myself and stating my views on things.. Edited October 31, 2013 by Mr Walker

[+Liquid Gardens]

Different eras had different focuses. For example, a coworker of mine I once worked with was Indian. The first time she met her husband was the day they got married. Her parents had arranged the marriage, and they'd been together happily for 15 years. Did she get extremely lucky to be partnered with her soulmate? Or did they just work hard together? Meanwhile, in Hollywood we have celebrities marry and divorce 72 hours later.

Uh, meanwhile in India we have also have people who are thoroughly unhappy with the marriage that has been arranged for them and to which very large barriers have been put in place for escaping it. I think you're married, do you think that you'd be thoroughly content and think you have a good marriage with just any person as long as you were both sufficiently 'other-focused'? Aren't there other factors in play besides being focused on the other person and aren't most of those factors properly deemed 'me-focused'? I agree with you for the most part, excessive selfishness spells doom and unhappiness for the continuation of most relationships, but the very core of why one is even in a relationship I think has a large 'me-focus'. Or to put it another way, assuming there isn't an imbalance in the 'other-focus' between a couple (I wouldn't blame someone other-focused from wanting to divorce someone who is 'me-focused' if they are snorting coke and playing video games all day), what would be factors that you think would justify a divorce? Is something like, "I don't love her anymore and haven't for a long time, and at some point it becomes dishonest to pretend otherwise", a valid reason?

The link I provided to Scowl (above) shows some of the issues confronting the modern me-generation.

I didn't read that link as saying much about how 'me-focused' this generation is, it says that they have unreasonably high expectations which make them unhappy, and the article seems to acknowledge that this is partly because of how they have been raised to have apparently too much self-esteem and is not necessarily because of their extreme selfishness. I may have missed it, but I didn't see anything about how they are less focused on others; focusing on others and having unrealistic expectations about your career/life are not exclusive or necessarily even in opposition.

[scowl]

That's not how sin works.

Sure it is. Jesus forgives sins.

Assuming she went into her first marriage with the intention of making it a lifelong union (a big assumption, considering you've said she got married to have sex) then when she got divorced she became an adulteress, at the same time her ex-husband became an adulterer.

Divorced people aren't adulterers.

Not to the extent that our current society has. An unemployed adult playing computer games all day until that lifestyle is threatened and do he empties his wife's bank accounts and runs off. That's becoming par for the course these days.

Is it? That's the only time I've heard of it happening. Most people I know are happily married. In fact three of the people who had these horrible divorces have been happily married now for years.

Fact is that society has become increasingly self-centred over the last decades.

I think Nazi Germany was a somewhat more self-centered society than today's societies. America has become far more accepting of different people in recent decades.

And if they were "other-person focused" the fact they changed should not have mattered. Though naturally a relationship is a two-way street, so both should have been other-person focused. The coworker whose wife developed a spending addiction seems workable if both worked at it. Give the husband sole control of household finances, budget for a psychologist to regularly visit.

He did that. Put her on an allowance. That's what resulted in the divorce. He didn't want to be her daddy.

My two guesses is that some people don't want to face problems and don't really care what the other person thinks about them.

Unemployed and playing video games all day? Not a problem.

Not interested in outdoor activities any more? What's wrong with that? You married me so you could go camping?

Spending more money than what's coming in? We'll get better jobs eventually and pay off the cards.

I doubt this is a recent phenomenon.

[+Link of Hyrule]

Uh, meanwhile in India we have also have people who are thoroughly unhappy with the marriage that has been arranged for them and to which very large barriers have been put in place for escaping it.

I agree that arranged marriages aren't perfect. Neither am I saying India is filled with happy content married folk. But the coworker I used as an example, then either she was lying (possible, would you tell every coworker you've ever worked with that your relationship sucked), or she lucked the jackpot and was paired with her soulmate, or it confirms my belief that any two people can make a relationship work, if they both work on it. Which I suppose segues into your next question:

I think you're married, do you think that you'd be thoroughly content and think you have a good marriage with just any person as long as you were both sufficiently 'other-focused'?

Yes, I sincerely believe any two people can make a successful relationship, if they both work on it.

Aren't there other factors in play besides being focused on the other person and aren't most of those factors properly deemed 'me-focused'? I agree with you for the most part, excessive selfishness spells doom and unhappiness for the continuation of most relationships, but the very core of why one is even in a relationship I think has a large 'me-focus'. Or to put it another way, assuming there isn't an imbalance in the 'other-focus' between a couple (I wouldn't blame someone other-focused from wanting to divorce someone who is 'me-focused' if they are snorting coke and playing video games all day), what would be factors that you think would justify a divorce? Is something like, "I don't love her anymore and haven't for a long time, and at some point it becomes dishonest to pretend otherwise", a valid reason?

Personally, I don't believe there should be any valid reason for divorce. But that's an idealist statement made for a perfect world. And this is not a perfect world. In my opinion saying "I don't love you anymore" is sufficient reason to see a marriage counsellor, NOT divorce (though ignoring the second half of that statement is equally wrong - admit that you aren't getting what you want out of the relationship, and then work!). In fact, that reason of "I don't love you anymore" is the very epitome of self. But everyone has different standards, and it's up to them to decide whether it's a valid reason.

I didn't read that link as saying much about how 'me-focused' this generation is, it says that they have unreasonably high expectations which make them unhappy, and the article seems to acknowledge that this is partly because of how they have been raised to have apparently too much self-esteem and is not necessarily because of their extreme selfishness. I may have missed it, but I didn't see anything about how they are less focused on others; focusing on others and having unrealistic expectations about your career/life are not exclusive or necessarily even in opposition.

It's not explicit, but a key point was the idea of "entitlement". The hypothetical Lucy was brought up being told she is special, she deserves success, everything she wants she deserves and can get. As a result, as she moves into the workforce she's unhappy. Why? Because she's not getting everything she wants. She's brought up with the mentality of (to quote Captain Hook from the film Hook) "me me me me, mine mine mine mine, now now now now". This is, to me, the very essence of selfishness that is driving the me-generation.

Hope that clarifies