Wood Stove Regulations?! WTF?!

[Kowalski]

Rep. Massie Investigates EPA Wood Stove Regulations in Science Committee

Link:

Wood Stove "Regulations"?! Seriously?!

If I want to use my wood stove to heat my house, and to cook on, I will, and the government bureaucrats in the EPA, can go pound sand.....

[Mr.United_Nations]

I believe its to with serious health conditions i think

[freetoroam]

It only applies (whatever the new rules are) to NEW wood stoves.

Not to existing ones,

Personally can not see how they can change the already existing regulations to apply to only new ones:

we all know there are some pretty irresponsible people out there, but if this new rules only applies to new stoves, then it will not stop the irresponsible people with old ones causing damage.

I have an Epping stove and a Morso with a back boiler, we have smoke and carbon monoxide alarms and the stoves are fitted to the required regulations, but WE would have fitted them safely with or without the regulations, the problem is, some do not.

We have to have a boat safety check every 4 years, and there is nothing they could change which would make our burners any safer, so the only thing I can think of is the way they intend to make the burners in the future, will have to see what happens on this.

[Kowalski]

It only applies (whatever the new rules are) to NEW wood stoves.

Not to existing ones,

Personally can not see how they can change the already existing regulations to apply to only new ones:

we all know there are some pretty irresponsible people out there, but if this new rules only applies to new stoves, then it will not stop the irresponsible people with old ones causing damage.

I have an Epping stove and a Morso with a back boiler, we have smoke and carbon monoxide alarms and the stoves are fitted to the required regulations, but WE would have fitted them safely with or without the regulations, the problem is, some do not.

We have to have a boat safety check every 4 years, and there is nothing they could change which would make our burners any safer, so the only thing I can think of is the way they intend to make the burners in the future, will have to see what happens on this.

I get what your saying, but, I just think it's silly and ridiculous the amount of things the EPA gets involved in... all for the "environment and energy efficiency"...

It's just like those stupid "energy efficient" light bulbs they keep pushing on people. And now, you can't hardly find regular light bulbs anywhere. I can't have those energy efficient light bulbs in my house, they give me migraines! Ughh.... Next thing you know their going to be telling us that we can only install "water efficient" toilets in your home....Oh wait, they already do that in Austin, never mind....

[George Ford]

If we all use wood stoves the world would be awesome and there would be less wars and people would be more fit, so I'm gonna vote for the wood stove movement!

[freetoroam]

I get what your saying, but, I just think it's silly and ridiculous the amount of things the EPA gets involved in... all for the "environment and energy efficiency"...

It's just like those stupid "energy efficient" light bulbs they keep pushing on people. And now, you can't hardly find regular light bulbs anywhere. I can't have those energy efficient light bulbs in my house, they give me migraines! Ughh.... Next thing you know their going to be telling us that we can only install "water efficient" toilets in your home....Oh wait, they already do that in Austin, never mind....

Your light bulb example is exactly what I think will be happening to the NEW stove burners which are made in future.

They are bringing in this regulation which is completely useless if it does not apply to existing burners, so the only thing I can imagine is they have a plan on how the new ones will be built, maybe they will take a certain kind of wood only and will have a heat regulator which has to be serviced (at a cost) and certificated every year or so otherwise........wait for it, you will be breaking the law and they will fine you as well as remove your burner....we will see what they have up their sleeves.

[Kowalski]

If we all use wood stoves the world would be awesome and there would be less wars and people would be more fit, so I'm gonna vote for the wood stove movement!

LOL, I don't know about all that, but it would be good exercise for people, to cut down their own trees and gather wood.....

[freetoroam]

LOL, I don't know about all that, but it would be good exercise for people, to cut down their own trees and gather wood.....

Ah no Kowalski, you got my head thinking even more now.

Thats it! you beauty!

They are going to make stove burners for the lazy lot who can`t be assed to go and chop their own wood, people who will not leave their cosy nest in the winter months to gather up some fuel or chop up the supplies in the shed, but would be willing to spend hundreds of dollars or pounds to have it delivered to their doors or buy the expensive new stove only "wood" from their local supermarkets.

I want to make a law that those kind of people should NOT be allowed stoves in the first place.

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

If we all use wood stoves the world would be awesome and there would be less wars and people would be more fit, so I'm gonna vote for the wood stove movement!

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

[freetoroam]

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

And this is true. But today the city folks do not need stoves in their concrete/polystyrene estates, they have central heating, its far safer.

Edited November 21, 2013 by freetoroam

[Kowalski]

Your light bulb example is exactly what I think will be happening to the NEW stove burners which are made in future.

They are bringing in this regulation which is completely useless if it does not apply to existing burners, so the only thing I can imagine is they have a plan on how the new ones will be built, maybe they will take a certain kind of wood only and will have a heat regulator which has to be serviced (at a cost) and certificated every year or so otherwise........wait for it, you will be breaking the law and they will fine you as well as remove your burner....we will see what they have up their sleeves.

I agree.

We'll just have to wait and see on this....

[Bavarian Raven]

And this is true. But today the city folks do not need stoves in their concrete/polystyrene estates, they have central heating, its far safer.

[MiskatonicGrad]

And this is true. But today the city folks do not need stoves in their concrete/polystyrene estates, they have central heating, its far safer.

except for when they spring a leak and burn a hole in the atmosphere.

[Bavarian Raven]

Well true, but it's because most people don't know how to burn a fire properly. There shouldn't be any smoke coming from a chimney when you have a fire. I hear partially with wood (woodstove) and its a rare day you see smoke. Plus, by burning a fire right and not producing smoke, you very very rarely need your chimney cleaned.

I'd also like to comment on the safety aspect you mentioned. I've been making fires in the drive since I was eight. Never had an accident / problem. Woodstoves are perfectly safe to use if you use then properly.

And above all else, they're more environmentally friendly then heating with gas

Cheers

[freetoroam]

Would just like to add that we use coal and wood, the kind of wood used can effect on the condition of the chimney, eg: willow which has not been dried properly will definately have you cleaning out your chinmey.

Stoves burners are safe, as long as the person using it knows how to maintain it, and checking for leaks and cleaning it out correctly is important.

But as I said, I live on a boat in a confined environment, so we have to be especially aware of the dangers of how and where we get rid of hot ashes and because we use coal too, we have a carbonmonoxide alarm.

Many people are not aware that carbonmonoxide alarms should be placed lower down than smoke alarms because of its heaviness in certain heats and placing them on the ceiling could be fatal.

[psyche101]

I get what your saying, but, I just think it's silly and ridiculous the amount of things the EPA gets involved in... all for the "environment and energy efficiency"...

It's just like those stupid "energy efficient" light bulbs they keep pushing on people. And now, you can't hardly find regular light bulbs anywhere. I can't have those energy efficient light bulbs in my house, they give me migraines! Ughh.... Next thing you know their going to be telling us that we can only install "water efficient" toilets in your home....Oh wait, they already do that in Austin, never mind....

You need to look at the range of energy efficient lamps. They are great, and they use about 10% of the power incandescent ones use. This means less consumption, less burning, less usage all round, it's a good thing. Ask about cool white, warm white and daylight lamps, and ask the store representative to give you a demonstration on each one. I know this stuff, I am an electrician, give it a try I take it you mean LED, not the Compact Fluorescent type. But colour ranges are available with both types.

Some woods are toxic to burn. I grew up on broadacre farming, and we did used to gather our own wood, and my Stepfather would check it to see if we gather safe stuff to burn. Some cause allergies, and some nasty headaches, some tropical types are even fatal. Considering this, I do not think guidelines are a bad idea, and I don't think they introduce this law to annoy people like you.

Ones you might be concerned about are:

Oleander

Rhododendron

Poison Ivy (smoke can cause lung damage in some cases)

and wood from furniture and the like can have all types of glues and paints on them, making them toxic as well. Some logs are treated and also contain dangerous contaminants.

Link - Wood Database

Link - EPA, Best Practises for burning wood.

I would not object to, but would welcome such here in Australia. Safety is everyones problem.

Edited November 22, 2013 by psyche101

[aztek]

I know this stuff, I am an electrician, give it a try I take it you mean LED, not the Compact Fluorescent type. But colour ranges are available with both types.

If you know this stuff, you also know that cfl bulbs flicker, and many don't last nearly as long as advertised, mostly due to crapy quality ballast. not to mention buzz they make drives some ppl crazy. quite often we have to remove cfl bulbs and install halogens back, we tried diferent brands, but they all do the same, some ppl can't stand flicker and buzz.

Also you would also know amount of energy to make those bulbs, and energy needed to properly dispose of toxic waste negates all "savings, and environmentally friendly" b.s.

As for leds, same story, energy needed to make those, beats energy needed to make simple halogen bulb by a mile.

Not to mention many retrofit bulbs are just crap, especially when installed in enclosed fixture, leds need cooling, without it they fail shortly and negate all "economy" efforts.

to have leds work for thousands of hours they have to be in properly designed fixture with sufficient cooling, but even if that is met, most still fail due to cheap\crappy quality electronics.

I’m building maint. business, unlike electricians, that only install it, and leave, I have to deal with these light after, and see all the consequences.

Edited November 22, 2013 by aztek

[George Ford]

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

Ah OK. Well then they have to introduce a filter then. A cheap bio-degradable filter that can be mulched and used as fertilizer.

[Bavarian Raven]

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

Was that not due mainly to coal

[+and-then]

I remember the "old" folks saying: That wood will warm you TWICE for the price of once!

[Varelse]

Regulations for your neighbors' safety or insurance compliance are one thing. Telling you how to blow your smoke goes overboard.

EPA needs to bone up and take on the real polluting instead of all these small ridiculous issues like "no burning leaves on windy days, stupid bulky crap on my hose at the gas station...no riding-rare wild booby owls possibly seen in the area..rare 'delicate' fauna...albnio horny toads..erosion...noise...no smoking..no burying aunt Harriet in the backyard to save on funeral costs...no starting a chicken farm in the back yard..." I tell ya.

[Beany]

I did a little research on the net. The fine ash & particulates pollute the air, and in popular winter resorts the problem is especially bad. I saw some advertisements from companies who claim their stoves produce less pollution and are more efficient than traditional stoves. Maybe it's time to re-tool wood burners using current science and technology. After all, we don't drive Model T's anymore because of technological advances. Maybe the same is true of wood burners: update and upgrade. We do it with cell phones & computers & other electronics all the time.

I appreciate the job the EPA does. If it weren't for them, our environmental pollution would be a lot worse, and they have taken on some serious pollution issues, and are making headway.

Re: no chicken farms in the backyard, my neighbor built a coop and filled it with chickens. I live in a residential neighborhood, and we did NOT appreciate the rooster crowing at 30:dark hundred. Someone called the chicken cops, who confiscated the rooster, problem solved. You know those darned chicken cops, just sitting around waiting to violate someone's civil/poultry rights. Just a bunch of dumb clucks.

Edited November 24, 2013 by Beany

[Hawken]

Is it true that heating with a wood stove will make home owners insurance sky rocket?

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

Was that not due mainly to coal

Good point.

[questionmark]

Last time we all used wood stoves we had fogs that killed thousands of people.

Was that not due mainly to coal

It was mostly due to coal because there was not enough wood to burn. If there would have been it would not have made much difference.