Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
adventureswithjim

My little hypothesis

39 posts in this topic

Hello, just wanted to induce myself here a bit.

I'm not a believer in any way, shape or form of ghosts/demons/spirits. But I'm not here to offend, mock or even to debunk.

I have a hypothesis I'd like to explore in more detail in the future. The ghost/hauniting thing is either a shared mass delusion, (the hope of proof of an afterlife) that spans millennia OR people have been observing real, albeit completely natural phenomenon, but lack the understanding to accurately describe it. I believe what are called "ghosts" (the spirits of the dead) really have nothing at all to do with human kind, it's something else all together.

Nothing grates on my nerves faster than someone showing me a blurry photo with the conclusion "Well, since I can't explain it, it must be a ghost." Well, actually no, that blurry photo that almost looks like a face is far cry from "proof"...from "it must be."

I believe "ghost hunting" has gotten a bad rap going all the way back to the Victorian age scammers and the recent flood of garbage TV hasn't helped matters. I think this aversion "main stream science" has to ghost hunting is obscuring some actually interesting science.

EVPs are one of the best examples of this, there are a huge number of sources that can create those sounds, both man made and natural...and none of them are supernatural in any way. But when a researcher simply concludes "I have a ghost sound because I can't explain it." The investigation ENDS, masking what might be perfectly natural, and interesting, undescribed source.

Thanks for reading through my ramble :-) I'll be around asking dumb questions, posting experiments I have in mind.

6 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello, just wanted to induce myself here a bit.

I'm not a believer in any way, shape or form of ghosts/demons/spirits. But I'm not here to offend, mock or even to debunk.

I have a hypothesis I'd like to explore in more detail in the future. The ghost/hauniting thing is either a shared mass delusion, (the hope of proof of an afterlife) that spans millennia OR people have been observing real, albeit completely natural phenomenon, but lack the understanding to accurately describe it. I believe what are called "ghosts" (the spirits of the dead) really have nothing at all to do with human kind, it's something else all together.

Nothing grates on my nerves faster than someone showing me a blurry photo with the conclusion "Well, since I can't explain it, it must be a ghost." Well, actually no, that blurry photo that almost looks like a face is far cry from "proof"...from "it must be."

I believe "ghost hunting" has gotten a bad rap going all the way back to the Victorian age scammers and the recent flood of garbage TV hasn't helped matters. I think this aversion "main stream science" has to ghost hunting is obscuring some actually interesting science.

EVPs are one of the best examples of this, there are a huge number of sources that can create those sounds, both man made and natural...and none of them are supernatural in any way. But when a researcher simply concludes "I have a ghost sound because I can't explain it." The investigation ENDS, masking what might be perfectly natural, and interesting, undescribed source.

Thanks for reading through my ramble :-) I'll be around asking dumb questions, posting experiments I have in mind.

I am interested in seeing where this is going.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How do you know spirits are not real?

Have you ever dared to play Ouija in a dark room with candle lit ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How do you know spirits are not real?

Have you ever dared to play Ouija in a dark room with candle lit ?

Oh good lord man.

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How do you know spirits are not real?

Have you ever dared to play Ouija in a dark room with candle lit ?

Have you ever dared to throw that peice of junk out and lit it with a candle?

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How do you know spirits are not real?

Have you ever dared to play Ouija in a dark room with candle lit ?

Actually, I have. And I found it remarkably easy to manipulate the outcome.

Ouija is one more example. "Proof" that it's a "spirit", so no need to look any more deeply into it. This is precisely the sort of thing I'm talking about. Making evidence fit your conclusions, beliefs...exactly the sort of thing I like to challenge. What sort of rigorous testing have you applied to it? Has it ever provided new information? The winning lottery numbers? The location of a lost city of Inca gold? Or has it told you what you wanted to hear? Told you all kinds of spooky meaningless things, just like you expect it to?

I have no interest in Ouija in particular, it's far too easy to manipulate, even subconsciously, I've been able to do it myself. It's far more a window into a person's inner thoughts that the "spirit realm." And this is my entire point, the under lying truth about ouija board is far more interesting as a device to access the human mind at a near subconscious level, but the tool is lost by the stigma of it's connection "the spirit realm."

Believe as you like, I'd like to see proof...have it guide me to a buried hoard of spanish gold coins. The "spirits" surely should know where I am and will be able to find that new information for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How do you know spirits are not real?

Have you ever dared to play Ouija in a dark room with candle lit ?

To be fair, how do you know they are? The OP is attempting to apply a scientific approach (hopefully) and that does not start with the assumption that ghosts / spirits exist.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have a hypothesis I'd like to explore in more detail in the future. The ghost/hauniting thing is either a shared mass delusion, (the hope of proof of an afterlife) that spans millennia OR people have been observing real, albeit completely natural phenomenon, but lack the understanding to accurately describe it. I believe what are called "ghosts" (the spirits of the dead) really have nothing at all to do with human kind, it's something else all together.

I would like to hear of your hypothesis.

I think that if people do indeed see or feel ghosts, residual energy or whatever terms used to describe it, that may well be a completely natural phenomenon. The question is rather does what people may hypothetically experienced be explained in the actual frame of science, or is it something undiscovered? That's where the rift appear in many opinions.

You know, there are several hypothesises that have been put forward over time by all kind of people to explain the ''ghost'' phenomenon. The dead returning to see the living is one theory among others. Some paranormal researchers think it might be Ultraterrestrials, Aliens and some in the field of parapsychology are refering to mental projections of the subconscious.

Is any of this true? I don't have the answer to be honest. There are various interpretations and theories but not no solid proofs that the ''ghost'' phenomenon do exist. There is quite an interesting documentation but only testimonies, pictures, pieces of audio and video have been put forward so far that are disputable.

Edited by sam_comm

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Welcome to UM jim :st Looking forward to hearing more from you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would like to hear of your hypothesis.

I think that if people do indeed see or feel ghosts, residual energy or whatever terms used to describe it, that may well be a completely natural phenomenon. The question is rather does what people may hypothetically experienced be explained in the actual frame of science, or is it something undiscovered? That's where the rift appear in many opinions.

You know, there are several hypothesises that have been put forward over time by all kind of people to explain the ''ghost'' phenomenon. The dead returning to see the living is one theory among others. Some paranormal researchers think it might be Ultraterrestrials, Aliens and some in the field of parapsychology are refering to mental projections of the subconscious.

Is any of this true? I don't have the answer to be honest. There are various interpretations and theories but not no solid proofs that the ''ghost'' phenomenon do exist. There is quite an interesting documentation but only testimonies, pictures, pieces of audio and video have been put forward so far that are disputable.

My hypothesis is just that ghost phenom are really caused by natural events...what those natural events are, I can't say right now. A hypothesis is simply a question, not a model or theory, just a place to begin.

The one thing I accept is that SOMETHING is going on. As far back in history as you want to look, demons, spirits, ghost...in literature, mythology, paintings, so what's really going on? It seems like I'm in good company here, lots of open minds, and a need for actual scientific method.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello, just wanted to induce myself here a bit.

I'm not a believer in any way, shape or form of ghosts/demons/spirits. But I'm not here to offend, mock or even to debunk.

I have a hypothesis I'd like to explore in more detail in the future. The ghost/hauniting thing is either a shared mass delusion, (the hope of proof of an afterlife) that spans millennia OR people have been observing real, albeit completely natural phenomenon, but lack the understanding to accurately describe it. I believe what are called "ghosts" (the spirits of the dead) really have nothing at all to do with human kind, it's something else all together.

Nothing grates on my nerves faster than someone showing me a blurry photo with the conclusion "Well, since I can't explain it, it must be a ghost." Well, actually no, that blurry photo that almost looks like a face is far cry from "proof"...from "it must be."

I believe "ghost hunting" has gotten a bad rap going all the way back to the Victorian age scammers and the recent flood of garbage TV hasn't helped matters. I think this aversion "main stream science" has to ghost hunting is obscuring some actually interesting science.

EVPs are one of the best examples of this, there are a huge number of sources that can create those sounds, both man made and natural...and none of them are supernatural in any way. But when a researcher simply concludes "I have a ghost sound because I can't explain it." The investigation ENDS, masking what might be perfectly natural, and interesting, undescribed source.

Thanks for reading through my ramble :-) I'll be around asking dumb questions, posting experiments I have in mind.

My theory is similar to yours except that "Ghosts/Spirits" are a type of new animal. There food source seems to be Energy. Whether Emotional Energy of Humans or Electronic Devices. Example Poltergeists seem to be very territory. If people go into there territory they seem to get very agitated. And will do all sorts of things to keep the people out of there residence. Ghosts just seem to be want to left alone while demons can get attached to you and follow you ever you go like if you disturb there place of residence like a Bees Nest and they will Hunt you down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Steve...I like the idea of "ghost" being some non-human life form, but how do you test something like that? Sounds likes you've got a tremendous amount of work to do to lay down a foundation for multidimensional cryptozoology :-) I'm working on some ideas of mapping radio energy over time, maybe that will help...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Steve...I like the idea of "ghost" being some non-human life form, but how do you test something like that? Sounds likes you've got a tremendous amount of work to do to lay down a foundation for multidimensional cryptozoology :-) I'm working on some ideas of mapping radio energy over time, maybe that will help...

I assume you mean EM fields and propose to create some kind of EM profile of a location. If that is the case, you will have to accurately quantify all of the fields that occur in the location and identify their sources. That is a very tall order. To do it right would require testing over time with a wide array of sophisticated and well calibrated equipment. Simple detection won't suffice. You will have to determine the type of field, frequency, wave length, magnitude, and direction. You will also have to take into account weather conditions for the surrounding area and solar activity. It will also be necessary to track air traffic in the area, as planes and helicopters have RADAR and radio gear. There are literally tens of thousands of potential constant and random EM sources that are natural or man made. Each will have to be addressed for the data to be meaningful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sinewave...you make it sound difficult :-)

Check my other post, VLF radio. By limiting that study to radio waves below 22khz, the equipment is far cheaper, easy to calibrate with fewer variables to account for. While this won't be able to map the full spectrum of EM, it can identify and track sources. Nothing special about the number 22khz...just a matter of the available equipment. The VLF array is a stepping stone towards measuring the total EM fields flowing through a given space, as it does measure freq, direction and magnitude of sources. RADAR is less of an issue for my VLF array than aircraft ILS...which is present in my local area, most days at least, when they get around to turning on the beacons :-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh...and I have to take into account submarine VLF communication...there's at least one massive Navy antenna close enough to impact my equipment. It's a crazy thing hidden in plain sight, massive 1/4 mile long antenna through the woods, all plastered with official US Government no trespassing signs.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mostly agree with your hypothesis, adventureswithjim. I think you captured broadly the ways in which 'ghosts' can be explained. I'm generally inclined towards thinking that all ghost sightings are either (a. people's imagination playing tricks (coupled with their urge to believe in an afterlife, as you mentioned), or (b. poorly understood natural phenomena, or (c. hoaxes. The natural phenomena explanation surely accounts for a good number of ghost encounters, and I think it makes the whole ghost thing interesting, as we realise there is so much we still don't really understand about our world.

One thing is almost certain - the theory that ghosts are spirits of the dead just doesn't make much sense, and really is just something people thought up centuries ago, which keeps being believed to this day.

Edit: formatting

Edited by Exorcist

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My theory is similar to yours except that "Ghosts/Spirits" are a type of new animal. There food source seems to be Energy. Whether Emotional Energy of Humans or Electronic Devices. Example Poltergeists seem to be very territory. If people go into there territory they seem to get very agitated. And will do all sorts of things to keep the people out of there residence. Ghosts just seem to be want to left alone while demons can get attached to you and follow you ever you go like if you disturb there place of residence like a Bees Nest and they will Hunt you down.

That's pretty much my theory on Shadow Creatures. They create sleep paralysis and fear and negative thoughts so that they can feed from that energy. They are easy enough to get rid of though and also part of me thinks I'm just a bit mental and it was all just part of the illness which would be the easy explanation and so I keep my mind open due to the fact so many people report almost identical experiences here.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mostly agree with your hypothesis, adventureswithjim. I think you captured broadly the ways in which 'ghosts' can be explained. I'm generally inclined towards thinking that all ghost sightings are either (a. people's imagination playing tricks (coupled with their urge to believe in an afterlife, as you mentioned), or (b. poorly understood natural phenomena, or (c. hoaxes. The natural phenomena explanation surely accounts for a good number of ghost encounters, and I think it makes the whole ghost thing interesting, as we realise there is so much we still don't really understand about our world.

One thing is almost certain - the theory that ghosts are spirits of the dead just doesn't make much sense, and really is just something people thought up centuries ago, which keeps being believed to this day.

Edit: formatting

Frankly, I'm a little surprised at the reaction of other users here. This is an "unexplained ghost/ufo/bigfoot" web site...I half feared an assault by "true believers." This is one of the few places I found people discussing things like scientific method and that's cool. I hope I can contribute something interesting along the way...we'll see.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My theory is similar to yours except that "Ghosts/Spirits" are a type of new animal. There food source seems to be Energy. Whether Emotional Energy of Humans or Electronic Devices. Example Poltergeists seem to be very territory. If people go into there territory they seem to get very agitated. And will do all sorts of things to keep the people out of there residence. Ghosts just seem to be want to left alone while demons can get attached to you and follow you ever you go like if you disturb there place of residence like a Bees Nest and they will Hunt you down.

You might want to take a look at the Ultraterrestrial hypothesis, which seems similar in many ways to what you're mentionning. Someone did writted a article on this very website about the subject. (http://www.unexplain...mn.php?id=65181)

This has been put forward by ufologist and paranormal researchers John Keel and Jacque Vallé who though that Angels, UFOs, ghosts, fairies, bigfoot ect were somehow all linked together and of the same origin. That of beings inhabiting Earth for thousands of years.

Edited by sam_comm
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sinewave...you make it sound difficult :-)

Check my other post, VLF radio. By limiting that study to radio waves below 22khz, the equipment is far cheaper, easy to calibrate with fewer variables to account for. While this won't be able to map the full spectrum of EM, it can identify and track sources. Nothing special about the number 22khz...just a matter of the available equipment. The VLF array is a stepping stone towards measuring the total EM fields flowing through a given space, as it does measure freq, direction and magnitude of sources. RADAR is less of an issue for my VLF array than aircraft ILS...which is present in my local area, most days at least, when they get around to turning on the beacons :-)

But why that range? What points you in that direction?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mostly agree with your hypothesis, adventureswithjim. I think you captured broadly the ways in which 'ghosts' can be explained. I'm generally inclined towards thinking that all ghost sightings are either (a. people's imagination playing tricks (coupled with their urge to believe in an afterlife, as you mentioned), or (b. poorly understood natural phenomena, or (c. hoaxes. The natural phenomena explanation surely accounts for a good number of ghost encounters, and I think it makes the whole ghost thing interesting, as we realise there is so much we still don't really understand about our world.

One thing is almost certain - the theory that ghosts are spirits of the dead just doesn't make much sense, and really is just something people thought up centuries ago, which keeps being believed to this day.

Edit: formatting

I think is it just a name given to perceptual miscues, hallucinations, and ignorance of natural phenomena. The evidence is just not there for any other conclusion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I bet if the two people on an Ouija board don't look at the board, it won't spell a thing.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I bet if the two people on an Ouija board don't look at the board, it won't spell a thing.

You are correct. Look up the Penn & Teller BS Ouija episode. It should be on YouTube. In addition to being really funny it is quite revealing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another theory is that Ghosts/Spirits are actually Tulpas created when a person dies a tragic death.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another theory is that Ghosts/Spirits are actually Tulpas created when a person dies a tragic death.

I thought tulpas were thought constructs made by the living. Sheer force of will and concentration creating a physical manifestation. And under the control of the maker. Usually.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.