Neanderthals had flings with relatives

[spacecowboy342]

Neanderthals had flings with relatives and archaic humans

http://www.wausaudailyherald.com/usatoday/article/4034829

[Neognosis]

There's a girl at my work who kind of looks like a Neanderthal.

Yea, I would hit it.

But seriously.... for a very, very long time, humanoid species probably had no idea that sex resulted in children. Everyone was probably trying to have sex with everyone else, and nobody probably made a connection to childbirth until relatively recently.

I mean, come on... you get a bunch of humanoid species together with no Walking Dead or Mad Men to watch, what else are they going to do?

[+OverSword]

There's a girl at my work who kind of looks like a Neanderthal.

Yea, I would hit it.

But seriously.... for a very, very long time, humanoid species probably had no idea that sex resulted in children. Everyone was probably trying to have sex with everyone else, and nobody probably made a connection to childbirth until relatively recently.

I mean, come on... you get a bunch of humanoid species together with no Walking Dead or Mad Men to watch, what else are they going to do?

I'm not buying that. I'll bet it didn't take too much to figure out females that got nailed got pregnant.

[spacecowboy342]

I'm not buying that. I'll bet it didn't take too much to figure out females that got nailed got pregnant.

Yeah, the birds and the bees ain't exactly rocket science

[ShadowSot]

Neanderthals had flings with relatives and archaic humans

http://www.wausaudailyherald.com/usatoday/article/4034829

Well yeah, and archaic humans had flings with them as well, and a number oof other archaic members of the homo group.

[spacecowboy342]

Well yeah, and archaic humans had flings with them as well, and a number oof other archaic members of the homo group.

Since it can be shown we interbred shouldn't Neanderthals be considered a subspecies of Homo Sapiens instead of a separate species? It kind of surprised me that they also interbred with homo erectus

[Winter Summer]

@ OverSword "But seriously.... for a very, very long time, humanoid species probably had no idea that sex resulted in children. Everyone was probably trying to have sex with everyone else, and nobody probably made a connection to childbirth until relatively recently."

Birth control was mentioned in the Bible Genesis Ch 38. Onan spilled his seed upon the ground... you know what happened next. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onan

At least it shows that humans figured this out a long time ago - not sure about Neanderthals though.

Edited December 19, 2013 by Winter Summer

[+DieChecker]

Since it can be shown we interbred shouldn't Neanderthals be considered a subspecies of Homo Sapiens instead of a separate species? It kind of surprised me that they also interbred with homo erectus

Neanderthals are a subspecies of Homo Sapiens. We are Homo Sapiens Sapiens and they were Home Sapiens Neanderthalensis. That is what I think I have read anyway.

Oh, wait, here is what Wiki says....

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Neanderthal

Neanderthals are generally classified by palaeontologists as the species Homo neanderthalensis, but a minority consider them to be a subspecies of Homo sapiens, (Homo sapiens neanderthalensis).

I thought Neanderthals were Homo Sapiens, because I thought the assumption was they came out of the Homo Sapiens (Archaic), or now called the Early Modern Humans? Seems like there is still debate on the issue....

http://en.wikipedia....y_modern_humans

But seriously.... for a very, very long time, humanoid species probably had no idea that sex resulted in children. Everyone was probably trying to have sex with everyone else, and nobody probably made a connection to childbirth until relatively recently.

I think they probably had it figured out at least by the time of animal domestication. They knew how to breed animals after all.

Edited December 19, 2013 by DieChecker

[spacecowboy342]

Neanderthals are a subspecies of Homo Sapiens. We are Homo Sapiens Sapiens and they were Home Sapiens Neanderthalensis. That is what I think I have read anyway.

Oh, wait, here is what Wiki says....

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Neanderthal

I thought Neanderthals were Homo Sapiens, because I thought the assumption was they came out of the Homo Sapiens (Archaic), or now called the Early Modern Humans? Seems like there is still debate on the issue....

http://en.wikipedia....y_modern_humans

I think they probably had it figured out at least by the time of animal domestication. They knew how to breed animals after all.

Yeah, I had heard there was debate about the separate species vs. subspecies issue but I had always thought the line was drawn at whether they could produce viable offspring or not. I could be wrong about that but I'm not sure what the controversy is.

[ShadowSot]

Since it can be shown we interbred shouldn't Neanderthals be considered a subspecies of Homo Sapiens instead of a separate species? It kind of surprised me that they also interbred with homo erectus

Well homo erectus is their direct ancestor, while our earier ancestors also interbred with them. The ability to interbreed is why some paleontologists want to reclassify them as Homo Sapien Neanderthalus to our Homo Sapien Sapien.

But the classification of species doesn't just mean inability to interbreed, it can also result from isolation of species from each other as well, and it doesn't look like there was lots of crossbreeding between the two populations before the Neanderthal's extinction.

Still, I think the classification is an ongoing discussion.

[ShadowSot]

Yeah, I had heard there was debate about the separate species vs. subspecies issue but I had always thought the line was drawn at whether they could produce viable offspring or not. I could be wrong about that but I'm not sure what the controversy is.

Species is actually a sort of loose term, the best way to put it is as something that would not normally mate and produce offspring in natural conditions. There are a few species that just have different active periods (night versus day) or mating rituals that prevent them from mating in the wild, but are genetically close enough to produce fertile offspring. Look up ring species if you get a chance to see how arbitrary species can be.

[Neognosis]

think they probably had it figured out at least by the time of animal domestication. They knew how to breed animals after all.

I agree. I think that is what turned the lightbulb on. But I think that before that there was likely just so much sex going on with all the females except the very old that being pregnant was probably the "normal" state of a female prehistoric and pre-animal domestication human female.

Eh, maybe or maybe not... but I don't think it was just common knowledge until relatively recently that sex results in pregnancy.

[+DieChecker]

Eh, maybe or maybe not... but I don't think it was just common knowledge until relatively recently that sex results in pregnancy.

Maybe the "how" sex results in pregnancy they didn't know? They had little to no knowledge of the science of biology. Just following rituals probably to have their children.

Edited December 19, 2013 by DieChecker

[ShadowSot]

Maybe the "how" sex results in pregnancy they didn't know? They had little to no knowledge of the science of biology. Just following rituals probably to have their children.

I know the Egyptians and Mesopotamian cultures had stories about life coming from a god m********ing, so they figured out a while ago at least part of the equation.

[spacecowboy342]

I'm thinking these guys weren't that stupid. Of course they had no knowledge of biology but I think they would have caught on to what was going on

[Neognosis]

I'm thinking these guys weren't that stupid. Of course they had no knowledge of biology but I think they would have caught on to what was going on

I think you are making some assumptions that are unwarranted.

You're assuming that sex wasn't something that happened routinely anyway, and all the time. Females probably started having sex before their first period.

I think that our species only caught on to the birds and the bees after we had instituted some social mores about sex. I don't think we had figured out that sex causes pregnancy until we had rules about sex. Knowing human nature and the way we deal with things about which we are ignorant (even today), I suspect that our ancestors that lived before animal domestication probably figured that you had to pray to god to get pregnant, and that god(s) put babies inside you.

It would be different if human females had heat cycles... but they don't. Humans have sex in all seasons, and often. I think that early humans had as much reason to believe that eating, or walking across a stream, or praying, or holding another baby, or being around a pregnant woman made you pregnant as they had to figure it was sex.

But I"m talking WAY back. Before animal domestication. eh, I'm just hypothesizing.

And that's about all I got to say about that.

[psyche101]

I'm not buying that. I'll bet it didn't take too much to figure out females that got nailed got pregnant.

But it only takes once then it's

Ohh

Oh, OK..........

Even now it can come as quite a surprise, that "it won't happen to me" thing. And way back in the day, did Dad's hang around? I am honestly not sure myself.

Ancient tales speak of Gods jumping human females as another poster pointed out, however, does any cave art indicate they had a clue about where babies come from? That I would think would be pretty indicative.

Edited December 20, 2013 by psyche101

[spacecowboy342]

I think you are making some assumptions that are unwarranted.

You're assuming that sex wasn't something that happened routinely anyway, and all the time. Females probably started having sex before their first period.

I think that our species only caught on to the birds and the bees after we had instituted some social mores about sex. I don't think we had figured out that sex causes pregnancy until we had rules about sex. Knowing human nature and the way we deal with things about which we are ignorant (even today), I suspect that our ancestors that lived before animal domestication probably figured that you had to pray to god to get pregnant, and that god(s) put babies inside you.

It would be different if human females had heat cycles... but they don't. Humans have sex in all seasons, and often. I think that early humans had as much reason to believe that eating, or walking across a stream, or praying, or holding another baby, or being around a pregnant woman made you pregnant as they had to figure it was sex.

But I"m talking WAY back. Before animal domestication. eh, I'm just hypothesizing.

And that's about all I got to say about that.

Yeah I am too. But consider that about 12,000 or so years ago humans used selective breeding to turn a herd of aurocks into the first cattle herd. They must have some idea of sexual reproduction by that time. My only point here is not to assume just because these guys had stone age tech, that they were mentally deficient. Some may have been dim witted but I'm sure there were also stone age equivalents of Newton and Einstein as well.

[Rlyeh]

Some humans have sex with relatives too.