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markdohle

The love of Scripture

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The love of Scripture

The love of Scripture can take time to develop in many people. The Word of God I believe should be read everyday if possible; even if for only a few minutes. It gives a time to listen to what the Word says to us. Even in times of dryness when the Word of God seems stale and lifeless, yet to continue in faith and in the spirit of prayer can bring forth good and beautiful fruit.

To slowly read in a prayerful mode, allows the Holy Spirit to gently work in our souls in ways that will bring forth healing, not only for the heart and soul, but healing of the mind and body as well. The gentle reading of scripture allows the living waters to flow upward from the heart, bringing forth joy and in the midst of suffering and chaos, a place to stand and pray from. It gives direction so that we can grow in the freedom of the Spirit.

Love as St. Paul says in the 13th Chapter of 1st Corinthians is the greatest spiritual gift, for in the end, it is what remains after faith and hope are no longer needed. Without love, nothing we do will bring forth much fruit, for love comes from God, it is his overflowing grace that we are all called to receive.

To read, to listen, and to contemplate scripture leads us ever deeper into the mystery of Christ Jesus and his infinite mercy and love. In the Catholic Tradition this is called “Lectio Divina”, it not study, which is important, but an allowing oneself to listen deeply and calmly to what the Holy Spirit is trying to tell us how to live, trust and love the Lord and others on a daily basis.

Edited by markdohle
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Amen!

I am a Born-Again Christian, saved about a year a half ago. I'll be honest, reading His Word was one of the last things I began to do, and even now there are times I struggle because as you mentioned, it can seem stale. You're absolutely right though, knowing His Word and giving that Word just a few minutes a day will bring us all ever closer!

God Bless.

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Amen!

I am a Born-Again Christian, saved about a year a half ago. I'll be honest, reading His Word was one of the last things I began to do, and even now there are times I struggle because as you mentioned, it can seem stale. You're absolutely right though, knowing His Word and giving that Word just a few minutes a day will bring us all ever closer!

God Bless.

Yes ti takes time, but be patient, it does bring us closer to the Lord in a way other books don't.

Peace

mark

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The only book in the bible I ever read over and over was Job. It "spoke" to me on so many levels. Taught me that no matter how bad it gets, keep going.

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What a bunch of BS!! It's not the word of a non-existent magical being - it's crap put together by the church(s) to gain converts who will, in turn, enrich the pockets of the priestly caste. You don't find many preachers doing it for nothing; the bigger the church, the more members, the bigger payday. Religion is a crutch for those not strong enough to accept the fact that they'll someday become worm food. Grow up, people, and accept life and death as it happens.

If the dead are to be given eternal life, how is this god supposed to find the ones who have been cremated and cast into the sea or the winds? Or how about the Vikings who are in Valhalla having a good time and don't want to go to some boring heavenly place? See, heaven is all about context - my heaven might be someone else's hell and vice-versa.

The fact that there are umpteen religions all claiming to be "The Way" further reinforces my belief that non of them are right - just a money making con in their own little corner of humanity.

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I believe only the spirituality vs. skepticism board can have such 'debates?'

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Posted (edited)

The love of Scripture

The love of Scripture can take time to develop in many people. The Word of God I believe should be read everyday if possible; even if for only a few minutes. It gives a time to listen to what the Word says to us. Even in times of dryness when the Word of God seems stale and lifeless, yet to continue in faith and in the spirit of prayer can bring forth good and beautiful fruit.

To slowly read in a prayerful mode, allows the Holy Spirit to gently work in our souls in ways that will bring forth healing, not only for the heart and soul, but healing of the mind and body as well. The gentle reading of scripture allows the living waters to flow upward from the heart, bringing forth joy and in the midst of suffering and chaos, a place to stand and pray from. It gives direction so that we can grow in the freedom of the Spirit.

Love as St. Paul says in the 13th Chapter of 1st Corinthians is the greatest spiritual gift, for in the end, it is what remains after faith and hope are no longer needed. Without love, nothing we do will bring forth much fruit, for love comes from God, it is his overflowing grace that we are all called to receive.

To read, to listen, and to contemplate scripture leads us ever deeper into the mystery of Christ Jesus and his infinite mercy and love. In the Catholic Tradition this is called “Lectio Divina”, it not study, which is important, but an allowing oneself to listen deeply and calmly to what the Holy Spirit is trying to tell us how to live, trust and love the Lord and others on a daily basis.

My wife and recited it in unison at our wedding. It was a lovely catholic wedding, in which the priest told me me he was proud to marry me to a catholic woman knowing I was not catholic. He died a few years latter and was an exceptional church leader that brought many messages of tolerance to his tutalige to all the kids the grew up at his catholic school . My wife is catholic and is more liberal than I am... Go figure.

"4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres."

Words to live by. I wish I were better at it

Edited by White Crane Feather
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The only book in the bible I ever read over and over was Job. It "spoke" to me on so many levels. Taught me that no matter how bad it gets, keep going.

Yes Job is considered one a great work of literature.

Peace

mark

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My wife and recited it in unison at our wedding. It was a lovely catholic wedding, in which the priest told me me he was proud to marry me to a catholic woman knowing I was not catholic. He died a few years latter and was an exceptional church leader that brought many messages of tolerance to his tutalige to all the kids the grew up at his catholic school . My wife is catholic and is more liberal than I am... Go figure.

"4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres."

Words to live by. I wish I were better at it

To struggle is part of the journey, an important part.

Peace

Mark

What a bunch of BS!! It's not the word of a non-existent magical being - it's crap put together by the church(s) to gain converts who will, in turn, enrich the pockets of the priestly caste. You don't find many preachers doing it for nothing; the bigger the church, the more members, the bigger payday. Religion is a crutch for those not strong enough to accept the fact that they'll someday become worm food. Grow up, people, and accept life and death as it happens.

If the dead are to be given eternal life, how is this god supposed to find the ones who have been cremated and cast into the sea or the winds? Or how about the Vikings who are in Valhalla having a good time and don't want to go to some boring heavenly place? See, heaven is all about context - my heaven might be someone else's hell and vice-versa.

The fact that there are umpteen religions all claiming to be "The Way" further reinforces my belief that non of them are right - just a money making con in their own little corner of humanity.

Thank you for sharing ;-).

Peace

Mark

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What a bunch of BS!! It's not the word of a non-existent magical being - it's crap put together by the church(s) to gain converts who will, in turn, enrich the pockets of the priestly caste. You don't find many preachers doing it for nothing; the bigger the church, the more members, the bigger payday. Religion is a crutch for those not strong enough to accept the fact that they'll someday become worm food. Grow up, people, and accept life and death as it happens.

If the dead are to be given eternal life, how is this god supposed to find the ones who have been cremated and cast into the sea or the winds? Or how about the Vikings who are in Valhalla having a good time and don't want to go to some boring heavenly place? See, heaven is all about context - my heaven might be someone else's hell and vice-versa.

The fact that there are umpteen religions all claiming to be "The Way" further reinforces my belief that non of them are right - just a money making con in their own little corner of humanity.

it is such a shame to read this kind of a "comment" under such a soft and lovely post. I think you are very young or has drunken a lot to make such remarks. if you want to attack something open another title of your own and I will come there. I promise.

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it is such a shame to read this kind of a "comment" under such a soft and lovely post. I think you are very young or has drunken a lot to make such remarks. if you want to attack something open another title of your own and I will come there. I promise.

He made a pretty good point; the world is not necessarily what we want it to be, and the afterlife, if there is one, may not be what we imagine.

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He made a pretty good point; the world is not necessarily what we want it to be, and the afterlife, if there is one, may not be what we imagine.

The OP is not church himself and there has been a mention of love of scripture from a personal point of view. Starting by saying BS to something which is lovely in someones heart can only be a product of a mind not knowing what they are doing. it is rather useless to discuss what is not lovely when love is found in it by someone else. If 'BS speaker' wants to discuss his point of view on life or after life or church or valhalla he can very well do it without associating their dislike to things in another heading where he somehow cant help getting personal. When somebody else has spoken first with love, if you respond to it by saying BS you begin to get personal. An adult could make this difference. On the other hand he is entitled to any idea of his in another post of his own with as much swearing and cursing as the forum can handle. Nobody would care.

Edited by thyra
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There are many works of literature from which the same sensations and emotions, as preached in the OP that are derived from reading scripture, can be derived. This suggests these sensations and emotions are not the work of some Holy Spirit - although it is fine to believe such a thing - but brought about by a recognition, conscious or unconscious, of what is common in our shared humanity with the author that he/she is attempting to reveal.

For sure, people of a particular religion may proclaim they cannot get this same quality of peaceful wonder and delight from other works but, again, this simply is suggestive of a bias they have implanted in themselves which denies them this satisfaction from anything other than what they consider their "holy scripture". But, then again this is only my belief. Is it as true as the belief espoused in the OP?

Edited by Leonardo
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The OP is not church himself and there has been a mention of love of scripture from a personal point of view. Starting by saying BS to something which is lovely in someones heart can only be a product of a mind not knowing what they are doing. it is rather useless to discuss what is not lovely when love is found in it by someone else. If 'BS speaker' wants to discuss his point of view on life or after life or church or valhalla he can very well do it without associating their dislike to things in another heading where he somehow cant help getting personal. When somebody else has spoken first with love, if you respond to it by saying BS you begin to get personal. An adult could make this difference. On the other hand he is entitled to any idea of his in another post of his own with as much swearing and cursing as the forum can handle. Nobody would care.

In other words.... They should take their skepticism elsewhere.

Bitterness, immaturity, arrogance and ignorance come through such posts while beauty shine through others. Thanks Mark for sharing your thoughts here. I too, love the book of Job and it's many insights into who God is, what he is like and 'how things work' in the universe. I didn't really discover a love for scripture until I was 30. I've grown to appreciate ancient writings more than ever and to love the poetry, the history, the wisdom and the truth therein.

Edited by Jack Skellington
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In other words.... They should take their skepticism elsewhere.

what skepticism? there is the talk of love towards a thing. where can you have the skepticism in somebody else's love? besides, what is it to you? when somebody tells you that they love their child or children in general, can you go ahead and say that it is BS that they cant have such a love? if there is anything that you want to discuss about how children are noisy or how they disturb you while you are resting or how children should be raised you go and discuss it in another place and in another time. But if you try to associate your bitterness to gods knows what and tell a parent it is BS that they love their child or their house, they will sure think you are out of your mind or drunk and if you insist in such impolite and harsh ways in your words or actions they will probably call the police. Being civilized, open and free in speech doesnt mean that you can act like a person out of their mind.

Edited by thyra

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That's exactly the point thyra. There are several other areas of the forum for antagonistic naysayers, immature flame throwers and disgruntled skeptics alike. I was inviting them to seek those areas out.

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That's exactly the point thyra. There are several other areas of the forum for antagonistic naysayers, immature flame throwers and disgruntled skeptics alike. I was inviting them to seek those areas out.

oh, sorry. I couldnt shake off my mood to any better since I heard somebody uttering disgust showing remarks to whole group of believers. I sometimes think that if there were no governments and police forces, something that would scare them off, these people could really attack at believers.

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There are many works of literature from which the same sensations and emotions, as preached in the OP that are derived from reading scripture, can be derived. This suggests these sensations and emotions are not the work of some Holy Spirit - although it is fine to believe such a thing - but brought about by a recognition, conscious or unconscious, of what is common in our shared humanity with the author that he/she is attempting to reveal.

For sure, people of a particular religion may proclaim they cannot get this same quality of peaceful wonder and delight from other works but, again, this simply is suggestive of a bias they have implanted in themselves which denies them this satisfaction from anything other than what they consider their "holy scripture". But, then again this is only my belief. Is it as true as the belief espoused in the OP?

Good points my friend. I read other scriptures, study Buddhism, find it helpful and it will continue to have a good effect on many Christians and help us to deepen our own understanding of the "Mind of Christ" I believe. Yet, if Jesus rose from the dead, as I believe he did, if I find the Scriptures trustworthy and I do, then this book will always have a central and pivotal role in my life.

Another point, we are all biased in our opinions, it would be impossible not to be. Also what you call the common experience of mankind, is in actuality the voice of conscience as well as our deepest longings calling us all for a response. God, is greater than any bias, or the interpolation of Scriptures. I find the sayings of Jesus, what they mean, how they are to be lived out, a life long process of study and pondering.

Your well thought our post, as yours always are, are also biased, basied on a certain perspective that I have no doubt that you think deeply upon.

Peace

Mark

Edited by markdohle

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Another point, we are all biased in our opinions, it would be impossible not to be. Also what you call the common experience of mankind, is in actuality the voice of conscience as well as our deepest longings calling us all for a response. God, is greater than any bias, or the interpolation of Scriptures. I find the sayings of Jesus, what they mean, how they are to be lived out, a life long process of study and pondering.

Peace

Mark

Well said. The bible says there are two kinds of faith. The first is a gift. Man is passive in this gift. It is 100 per cent the work of God.

The second faith is a fruit. Man is to go "from faith to faith". In other words from faith the gift to faith the fruit. Labor is required of man to grow this fruit. Man cannot grow this fruit of faith without the scriptures and prayer.

It is impossible for the natural man to see, receive, or enter into the govt of God's kingdom of heaven here on earth before God has given the gift of faith. (1 Cor. 2:14). Believing is the evidence of having received that gift of faith. "Whosoever believeth HATH (past tense - already has) everlasting life." The evidence. Not the work man must achieve in order to get it..

God bless His word and our study.

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What a bunch of BS!! It's not the word of a non-existent magical being - it's crap put together by the church(s) to gain converts who will, in turn, enrich the pockets of the priestly caste. You don't find many preachers doing it for nothing; the bigger the church, the more members, the bigger payday. Religion is a crutch for those not strong enough to accept the fact that they'll someday become worm food. Grow up, people, and accept life and death as it happens.

If the dead are to be given eternal life, how is this god supposed to find the ones who have been cremated and cast into the sea or the winds? Or how about the Vikings who are in Valhalla having a good time and don't want to go to some boring heavenly place? See, heaven is all about context - my heaven might be someone else's hell and vice-versa.

The fact that there are umpteen religions all claiming to be "The Way" further reinforces my belief that non of them are right - just a money making con in their own little corner of humanity.

When you want to attack something...do it with a style.

Recently I've been trying to figure out the politics and conflicts of interests behind the canonization of the Scripture. To understand the nature of the Bible, you have to understand them.

After I found out about something, now I do not want to touch the Bible with a ten-foot pole.

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I think you just described the harlot church of Revelation. She lives "deliciously" by always having some humanitarian project that will keep her hands in your money pocket. And she lets you do the sacrificing while she gets the glory from kings of nations. She feeds off the sheep rather than feeding the sheep.

But there are churches that do not fit in that category. The Primitive Baptist preachers are usually men who have jobs. They want to follow the example of Paul who was a tent maker. Of course you don't hear about those churches because they don't have the money to make a big show of themselves. And that is the way it should be.

God bless us all is my prayer

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When you want to attack something...do it with a style.

Recently I've been trying to figure out the politics and conflicts of interests behind the canonization of the Scripture. To understand the nature of the Bible, you have to understand them.

After I found out about something, now I do not want to touch the Bible with a ten-foot pole.

When the canon was put together, what was accepted were those books that were accepted by the majority of Christians. There is of course an historical process that goes on. St. Paul was the earliest witness for the Risen Lord put down in writing I guess the bottom line is if you find these writings trustworthy or not...you don't...so I understand you point.

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The amount of ambiguity behind the formulation of the New Testament and the Nicene creed is what spoils it for me. Even if there are pieces of scripture that are divinely inspired, how can we be sure they made it into the NT? Perhaps there are key pieces of apocrypha that were discarded because they weren't expedient for Athanasius or Constantine.

Personally I find more humanity and sympathy in the works of Kurt Vonnegut, H.G. Wells and William Blake.

I cannot deny the massive literary influence of scripture, though, and I don't think someone can consider themselves well read without some kind of understanding of it.

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You can know it is divinely inspired because God did not speak words for man and leave it up to man to preserve His word. The bible says it is God who will keep His word. God says His word is more precious than His name. And He loves to have His name glorified. So His word is pretty special to Him.

If it was not Gods true word, it would not be hated as much as it is. The Catholic Church and men in general have tried over and over to destroy it and have NOT been successful. They wouldn't care if it is corrupt. They would love it or ignore it.

God bless

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You can know it is divinely inspired because God did not speak words for man and leave it up to man to preserve His word. The bible says it is God who will keep His word. God says His word is more precious than His name. And He loves to have His name glorified. So His word is pretty special to Him.

If it was not Gods true word, it would not be hated as much as it is. The Catholic Church and men in general have tried over and over to destroy it and have NOT been successful. They wouldn't care if it is corrupt. They would love it or ignore it.

God bless

You do know that the bible has changed over time correct? So, it may not have been destroyed, but it has definitely been altered. Also, the facts that it is 'hated' is a way of determining its origin? Because I know people who hate the Quran as well, so does that mean that it is the word of god also?

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