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'The Americans Lied'

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Last summer, German Chancellor Angela Merkel promised her citizens a pact which would prohibit US spying on German citizens. But since then, Washington has shown little interest in pursuing such a treaty. Now, officials in Germany fear the deal is dead.

Failed talks? Hardly. The negotiations "are continuing," says Germany's foreign intelligence service, the Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND). "We are still talking," says the German government. In other words, nothing has yet been decided. The No-Spy deal is still alive.

But the statements coming out of Berlin and Pullach, where the BND is headquartered, reek of forced optimism. Nobody wants it to look as though efforts have been abandoned toward a deal which would see the US agree to swear off spying operations in Germany. Yet despite the assertions, most of those involved are slowly coming to the realization that a surveillance deal between Washington and Berlin isn't likely to become reality. The US government is still digging in its heels.

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I see trouble on the horizon....

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not forgetting the stink ...

~

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Petty little man in a chair too big for him - this is what happens.

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Very True Colonel.

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So the NSA continues it's international spying. Ok, great. Where is this all headed? What is the master plan, so to speak? Are they just going to continue their spying, as it is now, for the rest of time?

I'd really like to know when/how this is all going to come to a peak - because it is going to peak at some point. Can anyone speculate on the NSA's end-game here?

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Do you mean you disapprove of the NSA's doing this? I'm pretty sure it was going on long before the current occupant of the Big Chair came to office, and indeed the NSA is pretty much a law unto itself, isn't it, it doesn't take much notice of whoever's name may be currently on the door.

The NSA is not a separate government. There are constraints at least I believe there still are. And I was referring to this man's reaction to anyone "telling" him anything. HE does the telling - no one else - or so his ego says. What happened with the spying on allies was another example of a tempest in a teapot. It has always been this way - it only became an issue when the idiot masses were given a peek behind the curtain. A real leader would have handled the situation more privately and kept a lower profile. He has done the same heavy handed in your face with nearly every issue he's handled in 5 years.

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But by all means let's make sure we spend half of the evening news getting to the bottom of a traffic jam in New Jersey.

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So the NSA continues it's international spying. Ok, great. Where is this all headed? What is the master plan, so to speak? Are they just going to continue their spying, as it is now, for the rest of time?

I'd really like to know when/how this is all going to come to a peak - because it is going to peak at some point. Can anyone speculate on the NSA's end-game here?

I won't speculate on the NSA's end game, but I know this much for sure: If that treaty is not forthcoming (in a controllable manner) there will be a major rift within NATO between the US and most European countries.

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Does anyone really think just because a paper is signed and hands are shaken that countries are going to stop spying on each other, give me a break. Even allies spy on each other.

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Yeah the end game of all this would be interesting to have a glimpse at. Maybe not, might be terrifying.

I assume it is all about control-control-control. Control of the people, control of the resources and control of the money. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

It doesn't take a huge leap of imagination to see a very-very dark future for humanity based on the movements in the shadows.

I will never understand the lust for ultimate power and supreme wealth...I am just not wired that way. But oh well....this is prob why I am not a wealthy person nor a predator of other human beings.

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Does anyone really think just because a paper is signed and hands are shaken that countries are going to stop spying on each other, give me a break. Even allies spy on each other.

No, there would be safeguards in that treaty (which is why the spooks don't want it). And yes, Allies spy on each other and alliances break because of that. So as long as you don't get caught all is peachy... but if you do get caught you better do something to fix it.

Edited by questionmark
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"The Americans"? When we're in the mirror, can we see how absurd that kind of rhetoric is? That must be how "the Germans" talk about Obama. It's just rhetoric, right. And rhetoric is cheap. Just don't set policy over it. Policy is expensive.

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Nay YAm my man ~ policies are dime a dozen in the hands of two bit politicians ~

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The deal they are really working on is having the NSA give them all the info they gain spying on German citizenry so as far as the general public will be concerned negotiations will continue in perpetuity.

Edited by OverSword
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Maybe they've been listening to all the talk about how Germany has been responsible for more wars than anybody else and they're just keeping an eye on things so they won't be caught out again. B)

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Maybe they've been listening to all the talk about how Germany has been responsible for more wars than anybody else and they're just keeping an eye on things so they won't be caught out again. B)

It is not only the Germans, yesterday the European parliament debated consequences if no agreement is reached. Looks like the US-EU free trade zone is in trouble.

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