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Mystic Crusader

Iraqi militants accidentally set off bomb,

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http://news.yahoo.com/iraqi-militants-accidentally-set-off-bomb-21-dead-210620523.html

BAGHDAD (AP) — An instructor teaching his militant recruits how to make car bombs accidentally set off explosives in his demonstration Monday, killing 21 of them in a huge blast that alerted authorities to the existence of the rural training camp in an orchard north of Baghdad. Nearly two dozen people were arrested, including wounded insurgents trying to hobble away from the scene.

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Sooooo funny.

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That's what happens when you blow up schools instead of using them.

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21 dead. Can you imagine how many lives were at least temporarily saved by this little work accident?

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Suicide bombing instruction where 21 students die?

Everyone gets an A, however, graduation celebrations have been cancelled.

/priceless

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Kind of Dumb using live explosives whilst training but as already mentioned lives were saved.

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I can't help wondering if any of them were named "Achmed" :w00t:

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I think it's sad... and equally sad that people (any people/all people) are so misguided as to be making bombs in the first place.

i hate two things .. hate and fear.

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Kind of Dumb using live explosives whilst training but as already mentioned lives were saved.

Children need to be taught to not play with matches.
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The terror goes on in Iraq after the Americans left. What do they use now as their excuse?

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Karma is a b****.

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Yea can you imagine the bad karma in such a group. The explosives must have been itching to go off.

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glad the thread was cleaned :):tu:

we need more stories like this in all honesty, people who get what is coming to them much happier news imo

.

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glad the thread was cleaned :):tu:

we need more stories like this in all honesty, people who get what is coming to them much happier news imo

.

I am glad too.And I thanks the moderator for removing those insane post

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So let me get this straight, 21 people without names or stories, who had irreconcilable differences with Al Qaeda, but fought against the crumbling Shiite government of Iran's new best friend in the world, Iraq, die sudden grisly deaths, and if we're not celebrating over it, our voices get culled! Which we then celebrate even further!

Is this a cheer leading rehearsal or a debate forum?

Because we're so sure of who the good guys are from the bad guys over there, and thus suggesting that maybe we don't was unacceptable! Really?!

I don't know what/who else was "cleaned" here but I know for sure I didn't cuss, and I didn't say anything insane. I do remember that I asked questions, and referred to the Supreme Islamic Council, not to be a smartalec but because I'm trying to figure out how easy it is for you guys to pick political "sides" here when we're thousands of miles away from the souls of human beings we don't know split on a stick about. Maybe they're more opposed to Al Qaeda than we are. Maybe they're more opposed to Iran than we are. Maybe they'd be much better officials than the ones currently in office.

Just trying to figure out where our values lie. Please, don't be so scared of that, that we're even compelled to silence it!

Should I think that the former (or current?) members of the IRA deserve to be run over by cars, or shot through the head by the Queen's snipers, or poisoned by sexy agents down at the pub, or otherwise blown up in a tragic accident? Is it really this easy to just presume that insurgents, "militants", and rebels are evil by default?

At this point the question is begged. The government of Iraq: What's so great about it?

I think everyone posting here is of good character and so I'm guessing that there's a silent patriotism that's fueling the celebration and the moral clarity. But even so, the foreign militaries of the West have abandoned combat operations in Iraq long ago so who knows who's best when the regime's not worth fighting for anymore? I do know that the West's record of supporting corrupt and oppressive regimes in the Middle East is more the rule than the exception.

So you'll all just have to forgive my skepticism here unfortunately. Not to risk making the understatement of the year, but I do not look at Iraq today and see the world I want my children growing up in. Describing the state of affairs in Iraq today, I think the word hellscape would be closer to the mark. Maybe the West fought so the current regime could be overthrown? Are we really satisfied with what our money has bought us over there? I expect a little more bang for the buck than that, sorry. I would hope for a few questions more than none, as well. ;)

Edited by Yamato

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Yamato, it can safely be presumed these were people building bombs which were going to blow up innocent people. That's the spirit in which the replies here are being given I believe. Yes killing and death are bad.

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Yamato, look up Poe's Law.

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Yamato, it can safely be presumed these were people building bombs which were going to blow up innocent people. That's the spirit in which the replies here are being given I believe. Yes killing and death are bad.

better them than children or other innocents, as i said before good riddance.

Edited by Iron_Lotus
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Yamato, it can safely be presumed these were people building bombs which were going to blow up innocent people. That's the spirit in which the replies here are being given I believe. Yes killing and death are bad.

And terrorize people.

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...Is it really this easy to just presume that insurgents, "militants", and rebels are evil by default?

That's a question for debate. What I didn't think that was up for debate was these guys were likely to kill and maim 100's of otherwise innocent people.

It may be, in cases, fair to equate an insurgent with a patriot. But no. These guys were would-be indiscriminate killers.

Now that they're dead, I hope that they chose this path (rather than they were forced into the situation).

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Gotta love it when they are teaching how to use a phone as a detonator and the ol' Lady calls wanting to know if you will drop by the market and grab something for dinner.

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Yamato, it can safely be presumed these were people building bombs which were going to blow up innocent people. That's the spirit in which the replies here are being given I believe. Yes killing and death are bad.

Hello Oversword. No sir, you cannot safely assume any such thing. Your mind sounds safely made up on zero evidence to me. The violence in Iraq and the death there is tragic. It's even arguably our fault for creating this pit of vipers in the first place. But what does "innocent" mean and how do you know how to define it universally for everyone?

Where's this line between innocent and guilty at that we can apply to people thousands of miles away we know absolutely nothing about? That is a fascinating power truly. I'm calling BS.

Is that 'Islamic State of Iraq' that just had a hand in stoning a girl to death for having a Facebook account so fabulous that we shouldn't even ask questions? Really? It's hella ironic for an American to wind up presuming that anyone fighting against their government is evil by default.

I don't have a crystal ball that I can divine the goodness or badness of those people and nobody else does either. Starting from that, this uninhibited rush to celebrate death looked almost ghoulish.

This seems to be a politically-correct feel good story for the simple-minded and the patriotic to get duped over as if they know better the intricacies of anybody over there. It's the kind of story that creates a crowd of know-nothings with perfect moral clarity. The fact is, none of us know better. Is it what group in Iraq we're told to support in the mass media? That's going to make up our mind? You, Oversword? I certainly hope not and I think I know better that you're not the gullible one with the flag in his hand. So I'll beg another question: Just what standard or principle of judgment and/or guilt are we embracing here?

I suppose that bombs that are dropped from 30,000 feet closing an electrical circuit with the push of a button are all dressed up so clean and neat aren't they. That's the moral way to do it? That's the way not to be an "extremist", Poe.

Does the rhetorical antiseptic that all the violence of the West is granted by default come from not being up close and personal with the target? The immunity that being rich and powerful confers us! It makes me have to ask because the question is begged, what are our values? Am I going to celebrate the deaths of Christian conservatives who were building bombs out of pickup trucks because some foreign government was imposed on my country by invasion and occupation? Where does the "terrorism" begin? Or as AC/DC put it, who made who? I know who turned the screw.

Like the US and Europe aren't dropping bombs on innocent people. If that was the acid-test that determined what people really think, we'd be cheering the deaths of US pilots when their armaments accidentally detonate under their wing.

I think if I could read minds here, the fallacy (the safe presumption) we're making would take the form of: The West never means to kill innocents; Militants in Iraq always do! Just, Wow! I wish I could be so clear headed as that; but I can't.

Give me the list of the Politically Correct weapons that I'm supposed to make moral and value judgements on. Give me the list of political groups in the Middle East I'm supposed to cheer for and the ones I'm supposed to hope get blown up in tragic accidents. Otherwise it's all rhetoric. "Innocent" and "extremism" and "terrorism". These words can mean whatever we want; whatever we're duped into presuming. If we imagine some hypothetical scenario where these 21 were going to bomb a classroom of kindergartners it gets the medicine down alright. And a pep-rally ensues.

But the news article in the OP should have asked some questions too, because it had little to no information about anyone.

Edited by Yamato
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That's a question for debate. What I didn't think that was up for debate was these guys were likely to kill and maim 100's of otherwise innocent people.

It may be, in cases, fair to equate an insurgent with a patriot. But no. These guys were would-be indiscriminate killers.

Now that they're dead, I hope that they chose this path (rather than they were forced into the situation).

What the hell is "innocent" people? These guys want to put that bomb on the target that gives them the best possible chance of political and legal reform in the country. They want maximum damage done to their enemy that they're fighting, which is for many of them the Shi'ite Islamic factions of the Iraqi government.

I'll make a presumption with no evidence here though so I don't feel left out of the crowd: These 21 were fighting a lot of Shi'ite imports from Iran too.

People are killing each other over religion and we're cheering about it like we have Crystal Balls of Innocence +5 under our desks. You have to understand why I care about this. This is just another symptom of the Western disease of sticking our high noses in foreign business we know nearly nothing about.

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:blink::wacko: psssst - Yam - these people were training to kill INDISCRIMINATELY. You are moralizing in their favor. This is not reasonable behavior for most people.
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:blink::wacko: psssst - Yam - these people were training to kill INDISCRIMINATELY. You are moralizing in their favor. This is not reasonable behavior for most people.

How do you know?

You're presuming in the favor of the regime in the new state of Iranq with no evidence.

Maybe I'm putting some holes in this air bag of blind moral clarity, so yeah, if that's what "moralizing" is.

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