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Ligia Cabus

What is religion?

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Posted (edited)

What is religion?

- A faith, the belief in some kind of superior protector power?

- a book?

- a social control institution...

Yes. Because many people talk religion' associating this word to those things quoted above. Even here, oh, many times here, in this forum.

Always somebody begins to talk about religion, soon, the discussion inflames. And then, we see or read the persons, quickly, deviating from the central theme - the WHAT - to talk in Bibles and even to quote (think, write) excerpts of these books.

Others, they concentrate the thinking in social aspects of the Religion in a conventional link among Religion and Churchs. This association isn't needed. In fact, with the current advance of the religious thinking, one thing can and even must exist without the other.

And, about faith like a fundament of all religions, here, the question is what is faith e faith in what?

And also, why religion is associated to ritual, (sometimes, very weird rituals)?

OK, Let's meditate.

Edited by Ligia Cabus

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Here's one of the Bing dictionary's d efinitions of religion" believing in a higher being: believing in and showing devotion or reverence for a deity or deities. I think this is the general understanding of religions, by consensus and usage. While it talks about deities, devotion, and reverence, it doesn't give any prescribed forms or practices.

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Posted (edited)

Religion comes from the Latin word religare;

relig(are) to tie, fasten (re- re- + ligare to bind, tie; cf. ligament)

It's a spiritual belief system that ties together a community.

http://dictionary.re...browse/religion

Edited by redhen

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Posted (edited)

Religion comes from the Latin word religare;

relig(are) to tie, fasten (re- re- + ligare to bind, tie; cf. ligament)

It's a spiritual belief system that ties together a community.

http://dictionary.re...browse/religion

Excellent. I love etymology but, this religare - re-ligation, reconnection is, in deep, in occultist terms, not a link between a community members. Is a conscious re-conection with another thing which can be called The being's Origin, the creator energy of all things.

In this sense religion is a technique based on the application of many sciences,technique based on the knowledge that turns someone able to execute this technique.

Edited by Ligia Cabus

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Posted (edited)

I used to see religion as a social belief system making everyone the 'same', or working towards a same value system.

Probably began in cave man time when you worshipped fire.. and protected it so it would protect you at nights with light, and with cooking food of course.. and providing heat. The group worked together to keep fire going.. (you get what I am getting at)

Then i think as people evolved and power struggles became more and more rampant, it became as a symbol of control and power used by whoever wanted control of the land and to get the land you had to control the people.

Even today religion/faith is used as 'power' to control people by making laws based on religious belief system which controls all others even if not of the same belief system (the gay marriage is a perfect example of this as is abortion control and birth control issues).

Its power wrapped up in purdy words like love, morals and protection.

as an edit.. i should explain something else i believe.

In the beginning faith ran rampant, and it was needed. As time grew and mankind began understanding more and throwing away the shackles of faith based belief systems that government and church used to control us with law, we grew. I see us growing more and more and superstitions of faith and religion becoming something that many are pulling away from, to down right running away from it.

I see tiny groups/pockets always being about here and there through time, but as we grow, I see religion dwindling down to nothing more than pockets of groups here and there.

And that too as is it should be. We are evolving, growing.. and moving away from superstitions and blind faith in a being or beings. We are moving towards learning, understanding and realizing that even though we are not able to find answers to all the mysteries there are right NOW, there are concrete answers to everything, and therefore we do not have to fall pray to supernatural belief systems.

I feel comfortable with this.

(i am trying to eat and watch taped episode of cosmos at same time, so excuse me if my thoughts/words mesh a bit)

Edited by willowdreams
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By nature of inconclusive evidence, religion is mostly "faith-based"

Just the way it is, I guess.

Much like "ghosts", "demons", "angels", "ET-UFO's", etc...

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A control mechanism based on psychology....

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Posted (edited)

Here's one of the Bing dictionary's d efinitions of religion" believing in a higher being: believing in and showing devotion or reverence for a deity or deities. I think this is the general understanding of religions, by consensus and usage. While it talks about deities, devotion, and reverence, it doesn't give any prescribed forms or practices.

I have to disagree That is precisely what a religion is not. A religion is a codified form of spiritual practice/observation. It is almost always applied/applicable to more than one person.It is theoretically possible for a person to have a singular religion but it wouldn't been seen as such but as an individual worship. A religion is where a group of people come together and hold certain things in common or at least within a set of fixed parameters Those things might include common beliefs, but might also include a need for certain practices or rituals.

I am a spiritual person with a personal connection to god but I am not religious Ie I do not go to any church. I do not belong to any group or church. I do not have rituals or special prayers or songs. I do not need the company or validation of other worshippers, because my life is connected directly to gods. So I believe in( or rather know) god. I respect and listen to him but I am NOT religious. I attach certain practices to my life like not drinking smoking or eating meat because they are healthy good for me and good for my planet not because they are a part of a religious expectation.

A religion is indeed basically a set of prescribed forms and practices, and a religious person adheres to those forms and practices as part of their religious belief. It is interesting tha the forms and practices of religions are similar tot hose of any human group such as the members of a football club. Think singing, regular group meetings in a specially built place. Passionate devotion. A certain uniformity of dress and often even specialised dress/uniform There are ritual words which are almost liturgies and there is all the associated hierarchical paraphernalia within a club structure; but most significantly there exists a strong division into US (those who belong to our club) and THEM (those who do not.)

I am like a person who enjoys the fun and pleasure of kicking a football around but has no attachment to, or interest in, a football club or organisation .

Every individual human is, by the nature of our thought processing, a spiritual person. However religion really has no connection to this spirituality. It is driven by many other basic human needs including community, validation, a love of song, the importance of ritual in creating security and stability, a love of theatre, fancy dress etc.

Strange as it might seem, humans do not need religions to express their natural spirituality and most of us do not use religions to meet this need. Religion is something which serves a much wider range of psychological need in humans just as foot ball clubs, sorority groups, lodges etc. do. A church is, to many people, what a front bar or a sporting clubroom is to others, and serves almost identical human needs..

Edited by Mr Walker
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Posted (edited)

I used to see religion as a social belief system making everyone the 'same', or working towards a same value system.

Probably began in cave man time when you worshipped fire.. and protected it so it would protect you at nights with light, and with cooking food of course.. and providing heat. The group worked together to keep fire going.. (you get what I am getting at)

Then i think as people evolved and power struggles became more and more rampant, it became as a symbol of control and power used by whoever wanted control of the land and to get the land you had to control the people.

Even today religion/faith is used as 'power' to control people by making laws based on religious belief system which controls all others even if not of the same belief system (the gay marriage is a perfect example of this as is abortion control and birth control issues).

Its power wrapped up in purdy words like love, morals and protection.

as an edit.. i should explain something else i believe.

In the beginning faith ran rampant, and it was needed. As time grew and mankind began understanding more and throwing away the shackles of faith based belief systems that government and church used to control us with law, we grew. I see us growing more and more and superstitions of faith and religion becoming something that many are pulling away from, to down right running away from it.

I see tiny groups/pockets always being about here and there through time, but as we grow, I see religion dwindling down to nothing more than pockets of groups here and there.

And that too as is it should be. We are evolving, growing.. and moving away from superstitions and blind faith in a being or beings. We are moving towards learning, understanding and realizing that even though we are not able to find answers to all the mysteries there are right NOW, there are concrete answers to everything, and therefore we do not have to fall pray to supernatural belief systems.

I feel comfortable with this.

(i am trying to eat and watch taped episode of cosmos at same time, so excuse me if my thoughts/words mesh a bit)

Some good points my friend. However, just as today the study of NDE's is becoming more mainstream, so in the past I believe people had these experiences, but shared them, and from that the belief in something 'more' come to the fore. Also the world around us screams intelligence and rationality, so that could also point to believe in an underlying intelligence. The belief that we are just 'meat', or beings without a soul does not add up to peoples inner experience, now being studied at ever deeper levels.

NDE's for instance, all of the opposing views have been dealt with, and most of those who study the NDE become believers on some level, not in any particular religion, but in the reality that in fact we do live on after death. This is not good news for many, for there are some who wish not to continue after death.

So perhaps all of our religions started with some sort of NDE, the being of light etc, that has led us to see to unite ourselves to this light. My own faith, is another issue, apart form the overall understanding of what religion means.

Peace

Mark

Edited by markdohle

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A religion is where a group of people come together and hold certain things in common or at least within a set of fixed parameters Those things might include common beliefs, but might also include a need for certain practices or rituals.

I perceive you have a broad thinking. Only a observation. you say "WHERE a group of people come together".

"Where" refers to a place or, by extension, a situation in which persons are together to practice certain rituals based in a religious doctrine or line of thinking. This "where' - generally is linked to a institution that we recognize like a Church (not the buildings) but a civil institution like an association.

Then, religion is synonymous of CHURCH (churchs)? I think no. What comes first in History? Religion or Church? I think is religion.

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I want to call attention exactly for this point: the deturpation of the religion concept., the understanding of true meaning of this word and of the religion practice. And I say again. I would like that persons think about this idea: Religion is technique. I'd like people pay attention in this idea: Religion like a technique.

A technique which practice took many forms, the most, perverted by human, personal understandings and interests - but, still a technique and its truly goal is lost after millenia of contaminations, misrepresentation of its real function.

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Are you looking for religious technique in its purest form, the way it should have been? Or are you looking at how the technique has become muddled by humanity over the centuries?

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Are you looking for religious technique in its purest form, the way it should have been? Or are you looking at how the technique has become muddled by humanity over the centuries?

Yes, I'm talking about the practice and primordial function of this technique called religion.

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Yes, I'm talking about the practice and primordial function of this technique called religion.

I just posted something similar in another thread. Religion in its purest sense should be a person's relationship with his higher power. Unfortunately, humans can't leave well enough alone and try to mess with the status quo. In this case, religion has morphed into a money-making industry instead of an institute that promotes personal growth.

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Posted (edited)

I just posted something similar in another thread. Religion in its purest sense should be a person's relationship with his higher power. Unfortunately, humans can't leave well enough alone and try to mess with the status quo. In this case, religion has morphed into a money-making industry instead of an institute that promotes personal growth.

And this is what has to change. It is hour and it is needed that people understand the real nature of Religion. Please, give me the URL of your thread

Edited by Ligia Cabus

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Posted (edited)

Religion is an institution where a few people convince others regarding what they believe, and how they should observe that belief - usually for the purpose of exerting authority over them.

Edited by Leonardo
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Excepting extreme "atheism" most people need some sort of religion, in my opinion.

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Excepting extreme "atheism" most people need some sort of religion, in my opinion.

Why? People don't need a religion in as much as they want religion. They want someone else to think for them, so when it all blows up they can blame it on someone else.

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Posted (edited)

I perceive you have a broad thinking. Only a observation. you say "WHERE a group of people come together".

"Where" refers to a place or, by extension, a situation in which persons are together to practice certain rituals based in a religious doctrine or line of thinking. This "where' - generally is linked to a institution that we recognize like a Church (not the buildings) but a civil institution like an association.

Then, religion is synonymous of CHURCH (churchs)? I think no. What comes first in History? Religion or Church? I think is religion.

Where can be any place but I also used it for where people who might hold similar practices meet in different places, Eg catholics meet in many places but all belong to the same church. The coming together does not have to be physical but can be in the form of a common practice based on common belief.

But I disagree with your point. Where you have a religion you have a church. This can also mean a group of people rather than a building " eg a person can say I beong to the Baptist church " and not mean a place but a common belief, so a group meeting of druids in a grove of trees is a church. As soon as you have a religious group you have a church of some sort.

Edited by Mr Walker

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Religion is an institution where a few people convince others regarding what they believe, and how they should observe that belief - usually for the purpose of exerting authority over them.

In my long life I have never met an adult human so dumb that they would allow someone else to dictate their beliefs for them, so I do not accept that concept of religion. People believe that which works successfully for them, and disbelieve that which does not work, or make sense, for them.

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In my long life I have never met an adult human so dumb that they would allow someone else to dictate their beliefs for them...

So, you've never met a Christian, Jew or Muslim? Never met a Hindu, Mormon, Scientologist or 7th Day Adventist?

Name one religion which has not sprung from the beliefs and thoughts of another, MW.

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Most definitions given so far in this thread appear (at least to me) to not actually define "religion" but rather define "Organised Religion". Though the two terms have come via modern society to be synonymous, they aren't actually the same thing. At its simplest, religion can be defined as "belief in God", that's the first definition provided in pretty much every dictionary I've ever read.

So that's the definition I'm going to use.

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So, you've never met a Christian, Jew or Muslim? Never met a Hindu, Mormon, Scientologist or 7th Day Adventist?

Name one religion which has not sprung from the beliefs and thoughts of another, MW.

I have met all of those and I live in close contact with many of the last and other fundamentalist christians. Not one of them ever had their religion dictated to them by any other person.. They came to it as adults because it appealed to them and gave them many benefits in their lives.

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Posted (edited)

FAITH AND RELIGION

the knowledge and the technique

One more time. RELIGION isn't synonimous of Church; in the same sense, idea of FAITH (even the word) isn't synonimous of RELIGION. Let's think, someone can say:

'I have faith in you, my friend'

"I have faith in this amulet" (like a stone, a rabbit feet, the luck coin ect.)

"I have fauth - I tryst in this Company then, I put my money in it."

But, in fact, nobody has a Religion. The Persons practice religion. They practice because the have faith, they have trust in this technic. A technic of comunication with something higher.

People have faith in the existence of a superior power which, through the technic - is accessible or can come to be accessible. The Religion, the RE-connection is this technic of conexion, technic of comunication.

Soon, appears the question: Comunication with what? Or, with who? What is or who are this superior power? A being? A energy?

This 'thing is conscious of itself? Or works guided only by logic impulses of interaction between all things because this thing has its own laws of balance?

And, even, if someone believes in this superior Thing, where is this Thing? Out there? At the sky (meaning all the Universe? at the cosmic space?)

It is important because - if someone trusts in a superior power and wants a communication with it, for where (using a religion's technic) this person must to send the message?

For whom the persons pray? For where will go their messages? Who or what receives or not, realizes or not this messages? Let's meditate.

Edited by Ligia Cabus

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