Davros of Skaro Posted April 16, 2014 #76 Share Posted April 16, 2014 9 out of 10 people alive would beg to differ. There is something to be said for a tradition that fills a social role as a method to retain ethics and morals. Humans cannot function on logic alone, they are emotional animals. Questioning the past is called progress, and is one of the reasons why less people throw spilled salt over their shoulder to blind a nonexistent Devil for example. So actions are best applied by emotions than reason and logic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philangeli Posted April 16, 2014 #77 Share Posted April 16, 2014 (edited) A new study has suggested that the traditional depiction of Jesus on the cross could be wrong. Read More: http://www.unexplain...ed-in-a-t-shape ?? The arms of Christ hanging on the Cross (as shown in the link) are in a Y shape so the blood would have run down his arms, regardless of whether the cross was T shaped or Y shaped. Besides, I've often seen crucifixes which were more or less Y shaped. Edited April 16, 2014 by Philangeli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 17, 2014 #78 Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Questioning the past is called progress, and is one of the reasons why less people throw spilled salt over their shoulder to blind a nonexistent Devil for example. So actions are best applied by emotions than reason and logic? Are humans emotional? Yes.... They are. Religion is a emotional control on humans. That is why it has been state sponsored throughout most of human history. The fact that some find it illogical does not diminish the need for some kind of emotional release and emotional sense of protection. A lack of relgion has failed everywhere it has been attempted. Every human society has developed religion, even ones that live in almost complete isolation on small islands, or deep jungle, or high mountain valleys. The fact you think it is outdated and useless does Not actually make those opinions a Fact. It actually tells me that you are as narrow minded, or unable to imagine, as a Young Earth Creationist. Blinded by your strongly held belief into simple denial of even simple logic that is against your opinion. Edited April 17, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 17, 2014 #79 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Are humans emotional? Yes.... They are. Religion is a emotional control on humans. That is why it has been state sponsored throughout most of human history. The fact that some find it illogical does not diminish the need for some kind of emotional release and emotional sense of protection. A lack of relgion has failed everywhere it has been attempted. Every human society has developed religion, even ones that live in almost complete isolation on small islands, or deep jungle, or high mountain valleys. The fact you think it is outdated and useless does Not actually make those opinions a Fact. It actually tells me that you are as narrow minded, or unable to imagine, as a Young Earth Creationist. Blinded by your strongly held belief into simple denial of even simple logic that is against your opinion. Wow! Some people are like if a Bird was born in a cage thinking flying is an illness. I will let the numbers speak for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 17, 2014 #80 Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Wow! Some people are like if a Bird was born in a cage thinking flying is an illness. I will let the numbers speak for themselves. Uhhh.... So I watched that and it is basically subjective opinion (both the GPI and the Ranking) based on a subjective poll. This data comes from multiple reports and surveys and polls. http://en.wikipedia....hics_of_atheism SwedenSeveral studies have found Sweden to be one of the most atheist countries in the world. 23% of Swedish citizens responded that "they believe there is a God", whereas 53% answered that "they believe there is some sort of spirit or life force" and 23% that "they do not believe there is any sort of spirit, God, or life force". This, according to the survey, would make Swedes the third least religious people in the 27-member European Union, after Estonia and the Czech Republic. But not even close to the 90% in your joke of a youtube video. As to Atheist nations being more peaceful.... http://www.thelocal....violence-league In Sweden, 81 percent of women said they had been harassed at some point after the age of 15 - compared to the EU average of 55 percent. After Sweden, which had the highest rate, Denmark, France, the Netherland and Finland all saw rates above 70 percent. The EU member state with the lowest rate - 24 percent - was Bulgaria.The culture of addressing and speaking about assault, harassment and rape of women may vary extensively across the union countries, and as such skew survey results, the researchers warned. They referenced a Eurobarometer survey from 2010 that found that Bulgaria had much lower rates of physical and sexual violence against women than Sweden did. Report: http://fra.europa.eu...-results_en.pdf Sweden... France... The Netherlands... Denmark.... All very high rates of violence against women AND some of the highest rates of Atheism in Europe. Coincidence? Bulgaria has the lowest rate of violence toward women, yet is half as Atheist and twice as Christian as the previous mentioned countries. Huh..... Another coincidence? Edited April 17, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 17, 2014 #81 Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) As to Atheist nations being more peaceful.... http://www.thelocal....violence-league Report: http://fra.europa.eu...-results_en.pdf Sweden... France... The Netherlands... Denmark.... All very high rates of violence against women AND some of the highest rates of Atheism in Europe. Coincidence? Bulgaria has the lowest rate of violence toward women, yet is half as Atheist and twice as Christian as the previous mentioned countries. Huh..... Another coincidence? Coincidence!!!??? https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2014/04/14/muslim-rapists-in-sweden-enjoy-impunity-amnesty-international/ Edited April 17, 2014 by davros of skaro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 17, 2014 #82 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Coincidence!!!??? https://themuslimiss...-international/ Looks then like our atheists are simply tolerating rapists... Doing nothing about it? Maybe if they were a little more violent 6% of their population wouldn't be raping 25% of their women? Atheism.... When, "Who cares about those other people anyway"... is your slogan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted April 17, 2014 #83 Share Posted April 17, 2014 I would warn everyone to take crime statistics, no matter where they are from, with a huge grain of salt. So much depends on whether the police decide to file a report, what the enforcement patterns are, the pressure coming from the tourist authorities, and what the politicians want to be able to say about crime rates that the numbers are almost always manipulated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 17, 2014 #84 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Looks then like our atheists are simply tolerating rapists... Doing nothing about it? Maybe if they were a little more violent 6% of their population wouldn't be raping 25% of their women? Atheism.... When, "Who cares about those other people anyway"... is your slogan. I hope the Swedes fix their government. I googled "Atheism", and the slogan you phrased, but did not find anything. Look at the murder rates in these countries. http://businesstech.co.za/news/international/55703/the-most-violent-countries-in-the-world/ Good thing Jesus forgives...Right? Look at what this selfish immoral young Atheist does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenWolf Posted April 17, 2014 #85 Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Looks then like our atheists are simply tolerating rapists... Doing nothing about it? Maybe if they were a little more violent 6% of their population wouldn't be raping 25% of their women? Atheism.... When, "Who cares about those other people anyway"... is your slogan. Nice blanket statement, although I do remember you saying that all non-christians are like a disease with fungus on it and should be wiped off the face of the planet (2/3 of the population, 4-5 billion people), so it's actually you who doesn't care about others. Edited April 17, 2014 by Mystic Crusader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 17, 2014 #86 Share Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Nice blanket statement, although I do remember you saying that all non-christians are like a disease with fungus on it and should be wiped off the face of the planet (2/3 of the population, 4-5 billion people), so it's actually you who doesn't care about others. Huh. I don't remember writing that. If you could link to that I'd appreciate it...I thought I'd always said that non-Christians can go along their own way, as long as they are not persecuting Christians. I do believe that Christians are in God's favor, and that others are deceived to one degree or another, but that is not to call them a disease. I also believe that if a non-Christian is a "good" person, regardless of if they are a muslim, hindu or atheist, when the Last Judgement comes they will be judged according to their deeds, and not their religious affiliation. Edit: As to atheists not caring. I could find all kinds of crap about how Christians donate more money, give more time, send more food... But, really perhaps I should just say. "In my opinion and personnal experiences, most atheists I've met are more self involved then most Christians I'm met." Christians are more social, just do to the way they congregate and support each other. Atheists may very well do the same, but not in my experience. Edited April 17, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 17, 2014 #87 Share Posted April 17, 2014 I hope the Swedes fix their government. I googled "Atheism", and the slogan you phrased, but did not find anything. That is because I made it up in a (apparently lame) attempt at humor. I hope the Swedes are able to fix their rape/immigrant/muslim/atheist problems also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenWolf Posted April 17, 2014 #88 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Huh. I don't remember writing that. If you could link to that I'd appreciate it... I thought I'd always said that non-Christians can go along their own way, as long as they are not persecuting Christians. I do believe that Christians are in God's favor, and that others are deceived to one degree or another, but that is not to call them a disease. I also believe that if a non-Christian is a "good" person, regardless of if they are a muslim, hindu or atheist, when the Last Judgement comes they will be judged according to their deeds, and not their religious affiliation. Edit: As to atheists not caring. I could find all kinds of crap about how Christians donate more money, give more time, send more food... But, really perhaps I should just say. "In my opinion and personnal experiences, most atheists I've met are more self involved then most Christians I'm met." Christians are more social, just do to the way they congregate and support each other. Atheists may very well do the same, but not in my experience. http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=262922&st=90#entry5094887 If you have a Garden and 66% of the plants are dying due to fungus, but you can save the other 33% by scorched earth, that can be lovingly done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 17, 2014 #89 Share Posted April 17, 2014 That is because I made it up in a (apparently lame) attempt at humor. I hope the Swedes are able to fix their rape/immigrant/muslim/atheist problems also. God knows what's in a Man's Heart.God is looking for a harvest of Fruit that knows it's place.The Fruit that does not humble before glory?Will fall away to rot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 18, 2014 #90 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Huh. I don't remember writing that. If you could link to that I'd appreciate it... I thought I'd always said that non-Christians can go along their own way, as long as they are not persecuting Christians. I do believe that Christians are in God's favor, and that others are deceived to one degree or another, but that is not to call them a disease. I also believe that if a non-Christian is a "good" person, regardless of if they are a muslim, hindu or atheist, when the Last Judgement comes they will be judged according to their deeds, and not their religious affiliation. Edit: As to atheists not caring. I could find all kinds of crap about how Christians donate more money, give more time, send more food... But, really perhaps I should just say. "In my opinion and personnal experiences, most atheists I've met are more self involved then most Christians I'm met." Christians are more social, just do to the way they congregate and support each other. Atheists may very well do the same, but not in my experience. In my experience it is the Christians generally doing the persecuting. though they have toned it down since the days of the inquisition. That is the legacy of Christianity. 1000 years of ignorance and superstition known as the dark ages. This is why we can't allow you people free rein 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 18, 2014 #91 Share Posted April 18, 2014 In my experience it is the Christians generally doing the persecuting. though they have toned it down since the days of the inquisition. That is the legacy of Christianity. 1000 years of ignorance and superstition known as the dark ages. This is why we can't allow you people free rein We'll all be sorry being brought before Maa't on judgement day and having our Hearts weighed against a Feather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 18, 2014 #92 Share Posted April 18, 2014 We'll all be sorry being brought before Maa't on judgement day and having our Hearts weighed against a Feather. Nah man I'm going to Valhalla. Fighting and drinking for eternity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted April 18, 2014 #93 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Nah man I'm going to Valhalla. Fighting and drinking for eternity You have to die in battle on Earth first...Ha Ha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 18, 2014 #94 Share Posted April 18, 2014 You have to die in battle on Earth first...Ha Ha. Always a downside to everything 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 18, 2014 #95 Share Posted April 18, 2014 (edited) http://www.unexplain...90#entry5094887 HA HA! A very, very good try. That was an analogy. One that you can go ahead and claim is where I call people fungus, and want them wiped out. But it was actually only an analogy that even an extreame action can be done in love. I probably could have worded my point better. I'd also point out that we are talking about a mythic "end of the world" scenario. One that is similar to the Ragnarok that involves Valhalla. And the end beliefs of Jews, Muslims and Hindus. All of whom have their own people coming out of the end to a Reward, which is kept from the rest, who die. Edited April 18, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 18, 2014 #96 Share Posted April 18, 2014 (edited) In my experience it is the Christians generally doing the persecuting. though they have toned it down since the days of the inquisition. That is the legacy of Christianity. 1000 years of ignorance and superstition known as the dark ages. This is why we can't allow you people free rein I'd say then that you need to meet more Christians, because the ones you know are probably comparable to the A-hole atheists I know. The inquisition? That was 500 years ago. How about we talk about the Soviet Atheist empire, which was less then 30 years ago and what kinds of horrors those Atheists did in their Gulags and Mass Political killings? If, Christianity = Crusades & Inquisition Then, Atheism = Soviets & Political Purge of 3 million Edited April 18, 2014 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 18, 2014 #97 Share Posted April 18, 2014 I'd say then that you need to meet more Christians, because the ones you know are probably comparable to the A-hole atheists I know. The inquisition? That was 500 years ago. How about we talk about the Soviet Atheist empire, which was less then 30 years ago and what kinds of horrors those Atheists did in their Gulags and Mass Political killings? If, Christianity = Crusades & Inquisition Then, Atheism = Soviets & Political Purge of 3 million Stalin wasn't a good atheist. Hitler was a catholic and wrote about how he was doing God's work. I think the inquisition is relevant as it shows what happens when religious dogma and not the free exchange of ideas is the norm. Had it not been for the enlightenment and the rise of humanism we would still be flagellating ourselves to get rid of disease and burning anyone who criticized the church. I do know many kind and gentle Christians and then there are those like the Westboro Baptist church who care more about spreading bigotry and intolerance than Jesus' message of loving your neughbor 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 18, 2014 #98 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Stalin wasn't a good atheist. Hitler was a catholic and wrote about how he was doing God's work. I think the inquisition is relevant as it shows what happens when religious dogma and not the free exchange of ideas is the norm. Had it not been for the enlightenment and the rise of humanism we would still be flagellating ourselves to get rid of disease and burning anyone who criticized the church. I do know many kind and gentle Christians and then there are those like the Westboro Baptist church who care more about spreading bigotry and intolerance than Jesus' message of loving your neughbor So Stalin wasn't a good atheist, but we're going to use Westboro as an example of Christians? What of Mao, or even Castro? The thousands of other "atheist" government officers in those governments, who all acted badly. My point is that you can point at history and say, "Here are Christians", but that same judgement can be used against any belief system. You can point at Christians and say "Intolerant". And you can point at Christians and say "Deluded". And you can point to Christians and say "Think themselves better then others". And all that is true, but then it is true, again, of almost every belief system... Yes even atheism. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy342 Posted April 18, 2014 #99 Share Posted April 18, 2014 So Stalin wasn't a good atheist, but we're going to use Westboro as an example of Christians? What of Mao, or even Castro? The thousands of other "atheist" government officers in those governments, who all acted badly. My point is that you can point at history and say, "Here are Christians", but that same judgement can be used against any belief system. You can point at Christians and say "Intolerant". And you can point at Christians and say "Deluded". And you can point to Christians and say "Think themselves better then others". And all that is true, but then it is true, again, of almost every belief system... Yes even atheism. I would possibly be inclined to agree with you except that I don't consider atheism a belief system. My belief system is rationalism and empiricism. My atheism is just a lack of belief in magic, miracles and deities, without evidence of the same. The fact that it is illegal for an atheist to hold public office in Texas irks me but I do concede your point that all Christians aren't responsible for the intolerance of some. I have no issue at all with the morality taught by Jesus but it seems pretty rare to find anyone who truly follows these teachings 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted April 18, 2014 #100 Share Posted April 18, 2014 I would possibly be inclined to agree with you except that I don't consider atheism a belief system. My belief system is rationalism and empiricism. My atheism is just a lack of belief in magic, miracles and deities, without evidence of the same. The fact that it is illegal for an atheist to hold public office in Texas irks me but I do concede your point that all Christians aren't responsible for the intolerance of some. I have no issue at all with the morality taught by Jesus but it seems pretty rare to find anyone who truly follows these teachings I do sometimes reflect on that Gandi quote... "I love your Jesus, but hate yor Church." I think there are probably a very great number of sheep in Christianity who follow men who logically should not be followed. That is not a failing of Christianity, but of the human animal in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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