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and then

How long before free speech is cowered?

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http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/27/us/nba-team-owner-alleged-racist-remarks/

Sterling is a Neanderthal - but how long before such behavior actually becomes illegal? And once it does, WHO gets to decide what is PC and what isn't? What happened to the good old days when idiots were just ostracized by polite society? I can practically smell the tar and feathers where this guy is concerned.

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So this was a private conversation, I think is the most important bit? Not something he said in an interview or a press conference or anything. So how did this Sports gossip website, which sounds a right gang of muckrakers (just the kind of people who'd have gone in for a nice spot of blackmail in the old days) get hold of it? :no:

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I don't think he should have any official penalties brought against him. All he was saying was his opinion on things, if people are so outraged by it let society have at him with their own free speech.

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I read someplace his girlfriend was black/hispanic so is he really a racist or jealous.

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I don't think he should have any official penalties brought against him. All he was saying was his opinion on things, if people are so outraged by it let society have at him with their own free speech.

That's what they are doing. No governmental action is being carried out that I can see. The business is, and they are responding to those people carrying out their own free speach. If

they feel the results of the fellow's comments impact their public image or business to such a degreee it offsets his worth, then they'll fire him.

From the article:

As they warmed up Sunday for an NBA playoff game, the Clippers players removed their warmup shirts bearing team logos to reveal red T-shirts worn inside out, with the logos hidden. They finished warming up, removed the red shirts and played the game wearing their regular uniforms.

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Legally he did nothing wrong, however..

Just as Westboro Baptist Church and KKK as well as the Black Panthers have rights as well (as long as they are just 'speaking'), people have rights to decide if they want to be a part of those people/groups, associate.. and reward them for things.

They have a right to speak as they choose, believe as they choose, and yes.. act as they choose to act. BUT they also must accept the consequences of their freedom.

Others have the freedom to react.

So legally he cannot be touched, but we the people can react and he may find he does not like the responsibility and consequences of his words.

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Yes according to the law he's done nothing wrong. His right to freedom of speech is not being impacted.

The government is not taking action here.

It is an entirely separate thing if the company decides his statements merit him being fired, due to the reaction of people after they learn of his statements.

Having free speech does not free you from the consequences of such speech. And in this case it may well cost him his job.

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Yes according to the law he's done nothing wrong. His right to freedom of speech is not being impacted.

The government is not taking action here.

It is an entirely separate thing if the company decides his statements merit him being fired, due to the reaction of people after they learn of his statements.

Having free speech does not free you from the consequences of such speech. And in this case it may well cost him his job.

And possibly he should be - but the avalanche of public opinion seems to be magnified these days with the immediacy of social media and I'm wondering if the whole idea of minding another's ideals and words is appropriate in larger public sphere? In the old days a person acted stupidly like this and his community caused him to realize it just wasn't acceptable. These days even if it happens to be a mistake, a person can be ruined in a matter of hours. It's kind of frightening when you think of it.
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And possibly he should be - but the avalanche of public opinion seems to be magnified these days with the immediacy of social media and I'm wondering if the whole idea of minding another's ideals and words is appropriate in larger public sphere?

Well yes, it's part of the marketplace of ideas.

To take an extreme example, the views of the CEO of ChikFila and his support both vocal and monetary of the Ugandan Kill the Gays bill is what led many to boycott the food chain. And in my point of view also unfortunately led many to support them for the same reasons.

I am happy to know the views that I am supporting when I consume something from it, and it is up to the individual to decide if the statements or beliefs override whatever it is they get out of consuming the product.

In the old days a person acted stupidly like this and his community caused him to realize it just wasn't acceptable. These days even if it happens to be a mistake, a person can be ruined in a matter of hours. It's kind of frightening when you think of it.

In the old days communities were much closer knit and new ideas tended to take more time to spread. In the modern day we see that ideas and criticism spread quicker.

It has always been the case that public speakers had to be careful of their speech, and until very recently racism and sexism were common place. And still are, depending on who you ask and where you live.

Now there certainly are people who are innocent and make comments in jest or satire or without thinking that cost them.

but I cannot see how to mitigate that without damaging the tool which has been the source of so much social change in our country, and much of it in my view for the better.

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I believe they are trying to force him out and move his team to Seattle, renaming them the SuperSonics. If this happens you may congradulate me on my pyschic powers.

Back on the subject of how long before free speech is cowered? Hasn't that been happening for decades if not centuries?

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What happened to the good old days when idiots were just ostracized by polite society? .

since than society added a lot more idiots, and now may of them make laws

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Posted (edited)

To take an extreme example, the views of the CEO of ChikFila and his support both vocal and monetary of the Ugandan Kill the Gays bill is what led many to boycott the food chain. And in my point of view also unfortunately led many to support them for the same reasons.

This isn't true. He DID NOT support the Uganda law.

From Snopes.com:

Some readers asked, "Did Chick-fil-A really spend millions lobbying Congress not to condemn Uganda’s 'Kill the Gays' bill"? We found no evidence that Chick-fil-A itself spent money (let alone millions) lobbying Congress to prevent that body from issuing a condemnation of a controversial Ugandan legislative bill which carried the death penalty for some homosexual acts. Some sources reported that the Family Research Council (FRC), one of the organizations to which Chick-fil-A donates through its WinShape corporate charity foundation, filed a report stating that it had spent $25,000 lobbying Congress against H.R. 1064, a resolution seeking to "express the sense of the House of Representatives" that Uganda's proposed Anti-Homosexuality Bill "threatens the protection of fundamental human rights." However, the FRC said that although they did perform lobbying activities regarding H.R. 1064, they did not support the Uganda bill or the death penalty for homosexuality, and their lobbying efforts were not aimed at killing the Congressional resolution but rather at changing its language "to remove sweeping and inaccurate assertions that homosexual conduct is internationally recognized as a fundamental human right."

Edited by simplybill
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While I like snopes I disagree with their conclusions here.

The FRC has people on record stating they support both gay reparative therapy wwhich is analogous to torture and criminal prosecution of homosexuality.

They also spread deliberately false and misleading informatirmation in regards to homosexuals.

Also while snopes claims they have stopped supporting hate groups but still fund the FRC.

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While I like snopes I disagree with their conclusions here.

The FRC has people on record stating they support both gay reparative therapy wwhich is analogous to torture and criminal prosecution of homosexuality.

They also spread deliberately false and misleading informatirmation in regards to homosexuals.

Also while snopes claims they have stopped supporting hate groups but still fund the FRC.

It may be better to address some of those topics under a different forum title. It would be a lively discussion.

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Yes, if you feel like starting it go ahead. I've alread seen this done to death elsewhere by those those who support the Ugandan bill and the FRC.

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I think what happened to Donald Sterling was quite fitting. He didn't suffer any legal reprecussions...he lost his ****! Because the American people(good ones, anyway) frown upon racism. It was either Sterling or the NBA...if you wanna feel that way about another race DON'T GET INVOLVED IN AN ORGANIZATION that employs them. Nba being something like 70% blacks.

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Just ask the football player who expressed disgust at Sam's gay kiss. They sent him to sensitivity training classes, which can bring reeducation camps to mind. The man has a right to his emotions and opinions, and these punitive reactions to individuals' rights to free expression will backfire in unpredictable ways. It just takes one brave person to refuse to cower to the thought police to reverse the present chilling trend. We should debate and discuss our differences, not censor or punish them. Someone must refuse to apologize after they commit a thought crime. Then, the dam will break, and the dominoes will fall. If not, our leadership will resemble Pol Pot more than George Washington.

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Posted (edited)

While I like snopes I disagree with their conclusions here.

The FRC has people on record stating they support both gay reparative therapy wwhich is analogous to torture and criminal prosecution of homosexuality.

They also spread deliberately false and misleading informatirmation in regards to homosexuals.

Also while snopes claims they have stopped supporting hate groups but still fund the FRC.

The Gay Mafia was defeated in that case when Chick-fil-A's sales went through the roof. People are sick and tired of the nonsense from bullies and pressure groups. You saw the same kind of reaction with "Duck Dynasty". I hope citizens continue to fight back!

Edited by Detective Mystery 2014
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The Gay Mafia was defeated in that case when Chick-fil-A's sales went through the roof. People are sick and tired of the nonsense from bullies and pressure groups. You saw the same kind of reaction with "Duck Dynasty". I hope citizens continue to fight back!

Gay bullies. Right.

Which group is it that keeps trying to pass legislation trying to prevent the other from getting married and which one was getting dragged behind cars and beaten regularly?

For that matter, you talk sensitivity training, I'll reference the gay reparitive theray where people are tortured to try to change their sexuality.

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How do you join the Gay Mafia? Do they make you an offer you can't refuse?

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Gay bullies. Right.

Which group is it that keeps trying to pass legislation trying to prevent the other from getting married and which one was getting dragged behind cars and beaten regularly?

For that matter, you talk sensitivity training, I'll reference the gay reparitive theray where people are tortured to try to change their sexuality.

Show me a gang of heterophobes doing to some innocent straight person what they did to Matthew Shepard, and I might begin to take the "gay mafia" theory seriously.

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While I like snopes I disagree with their conclusions here.

The FRC has people on record stating they support both gay reparative therapy wwhich is analogous to torture and criminal prosecution of homosexuality.

They also spread deliberately false and misleading informatirmation in regards to homosexuals.

Also while snopes claims they have stopped supporting hate groups but still fund the FRC.

Did anyone in the FRC express that killing gays was OK? That would speak better to support of the Uganda bill then considering being gay criminal.

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I do not support Sterling in any way, but how is it that Jamie Foxx can go on national television and say, "I kill all the white people in the movie. How great is that?"... yet Sterling can't say what he wants in the privacy of his own home without a media feeding frenzy and all hell breaking loose?

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Posted (edited)

Did anyone in the FRC express that killing gays was OK? That would speak better to support of the Uganda bill then considering being gay criminal.

Depends on how you take what the president of FRC said in his radio show here:

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2012/11/30/1262421/family-research-council-blatantly-lies-about-supporting-ugandas-kill-the-gays-bill/

Also: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/02/26/anti-lgbt-researcher-paul-cameron-open-to-death-penalty-for-dangerous-gay-parasites/

Edited by HappyMonkey

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