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JJ50

'You will burn in hell'

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I have been posting on another forum where some 'born again' Christian posters seem to be salivating at the idea of heathens like myself burning in hell forever and ever. How sick is that? They also keep saying the deity is a 'God of love', can't they see that condemning people to burn in hell for mere unbelief would be the act of an evil psycho?

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Posted (edited)

I have been posting on another forum where some 'born again' Christian posters seem to be salivating at the idea of heathens like myself burning in hell forever and ever. How sick is that? They also keep saying the deity is a 'God of love', can't they see that condemning people to burn in hell for mere unbelief would be the act of an evil psycho?

Im pretty sure no one on this site wants that. Its all in your head.

I can see your still emotionally attached to religion so if I had to guess I would say your new to being an atheist or agnostic or however you identify.

I could never accept the whole hell concept myself, the first thing that turned me towards atheist and then later in life spiritual leaning agnostic.

Edited by spartan max2
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JJ50,

I would take it with a grain of salt. I think there are a lot of Christians who are weak in their faith and in their knowledge of the faith and so when an atheist/agnostic such as yourself challenges them on it; they don't know how to engage, react or respond to such objections...so they default to pronouncing judgment. It's the only 'ammunition' they have. But please do not think that all or most Christians are like that. I see it as a kind of spiritual immaturity in which certain Christians are simply uncomfortable with people unlike themselves.

In fact, if you like, you could pm me the link to the thread in question where they are doing this. I would be more than happy to actually register and debate them on the issue...

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Turn from sin turns from hell, according to the Word of God, but the problem is men love their sins more than they love. Sin is of the devil, so you can't say it's love that you're following while you're sinning against God, which is Love.

Sins and false loves lead to darkness.

If you need help turning from sin then ask Them (God, Holy Spirit of God and Jesus). They want you to succeed not fail.

It's easier to hate than love- why's that?

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Posted (edited)

"We will burn in hell".

Ahh... but perhaps this sentence is misunderstood.

Is it US that are burning, or are we DOING the burning ?

WHAT, precisely, will we burn in hell ?

Personally, I think it is a large barbecue party. We will burn burgers and sausages in hell.

Edited by RoofGardener
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"We will burn in hell".

Ahh... but perhaps this sentence is misunderstood.

Is it US that are burning, or are we DOING the burning ?

WHAT, precisely, will we burn in hell ?

Personally, I think it is a large barbecue party. We will burn burgers and sausages in hell.

You're Soul.

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I always found the concept of hell problematic. Taking the age of accountability for many Christian groups is young, around seven or eight, you end up with a lot of young children to teenagers going to hell before they really have a chance to think about where they belong to the right religion. Or for that matter, the right form of Christianity.

There's another problem to me, in that people who's only crime is finding the god claim lacking in evidence, are also sent to this eternal punishment. Whereas it's a popular refrain from Christians that no matter how wicked a soul, they to can find salvation. I was often told as a kid that I should not be surprised to find even Hitler in Heaven, as he was a Christian however misguided.

Not so however the many Jews that died because of his programs.

It seems fundamentally unjust, that we could expect to find Hitler in heaven, but not Anne Frank.

Finally there's the problem of infinite punishment. While I have heard arguments that hell is not necessarily eternal, that in the final judgement souls will receive a new judgement, certainly many teach it is eternal. That a finite crime (thought crimes, stealing, ect.) are punishable by infinite punishment seems far outside of balance.

Admittedly I don't see heaven very positively either.

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If you need help turning from sin then ask Them (God, Holy Spirit of God and Jesus). They want you to succeed not fail.

Funny, I don't know an atheist or agnostic that didn't pray to god for help as they lost their faith. The lack of an answer caused them much grief until they lost their faith altogether.

You're Soul.

A threat that has no power at all if you neither believe in hell or souls.

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Funny, I don't know an atheist or agnostic that didn't pray to god for help as they lost their faith. The lack of an answer caused them much grief until they lost their faith altogether.

A threat that has no power at all if you neither believe in hell or souls.

It's not a threat it's a result of you're actions according to God.

And for what it's worth, I would never want you to go there- ever.

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It's not a threat it's a result of you're actions according to God.

And for what it's worth, I would never want you to go there- ever.

Yes, behave as I say or you'll be sent to unending torment. That's a threat.

Of course you don't, you just worship the deity that does if you don't worship him enough. He sends kids to eternal punishment and you glorify him for it.

But it's not his fault, of course. He just made the game and the torture house, then stacked the odds.

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I have been posting on another forum where some 'born again' Christian posters seem to be salivating at the idea of heathens like myself burning in hell forever and ever. How sick is that? They also keep saying the deity is a 'God of love', can't they see that condemning people to burn in hell for mere unbelief would be the act of an evil psycho?

They are just telling you what they believe.

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/hell.html

If they had logic, then they would not believe.

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Yes, behave as I say or you'll be sent to unending torment. That's a threat.

Of course you don't, you just worship the deity that does if you don't worship him enough. He sends kids to eternal punishment and you glorify him for it.

But it's not his fault, of course. He just made the game and the torture house, then stacked the odds.

He is the CREATOR and you are the Creation.

He gave a path by His Son Jesus for a "WAY OUT" according to Him. Free will choice each time you come to that cross road in life- you pick you're seat to the left of God's Hand or to the right of God's Hand.

If man ignores this path, you can believe after what 'we did to Him/Jesus at Crucifixion, God will be true to all His Promises concerning His Son.

~You're choice.

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No, you can have logic and believe. The two aren't exclusive. It's just hard to be a hardcore fundi and hold to logic.

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He is the CREATOR and you are the Creation.

He gave a path by His Son Jesus for a "WAY OUT" according to Him. Free will choice each time you come to that cross road in life- you pick you're seat to the left of God's Hand or to the right of God's Hand.

If man ignores this path, you can believe after what 'we did to Him/Jesus at Crucifixion, God will be true to all His Promises concerning His Son.

~You're choice.

...and if you don't like it?

~waa

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He is the CREATOR and you are the Creation.

He gave a path by His Son Jesus for a "WAY OUT" according to Him. Free will choice each time you come to that cross road in life- you pick you're seat to the left of God's Hand or to the right of God's Hand.

If man ignores this path, you can believe after what 'we did to Him/Jesus at Crucifixion, God will be true to all His Promises concerning His Son.

~You're choice.

First, it's starting to bug me but it's "your." This isn't an insult to you, it's just starting to annoy me.

Second, as I mentioned the age of accountability is seven or eight. Your lord sends those kids who die before having any chance to learn of the "right" religion to hell. Stop hiding behind free will. Even if it does exist, and there's no solid consensus on that, children and teens are noted for their lack of skills at assessing new information, if they have access to that information.

You also can't around he made the rules. He made hell. He fills it with good people who just happened to be wrong in their religious beliefs. This can be from the version of Christianity, to all religion entirely, from people who've never heard of Christianity, to people who were born and died long before Christianity existed.

At least admit you worship an unjust, jealous, petty god.

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No, you can have logic and believe. The two aren't exclusive. It's just hard to be a hardcore fundi and hold to logic.

A God that sends himself to kill himself, to appease a condition he created himself is not logical.

Think about it.

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...and if you don't like it?

~waa

Yes, worship the almighty dictator, because if you don't he'll torture you for all eternity.

It's unsurprising Christianity is backing away from this approach.

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Posted (edited)

A God that sends himself to kill himself, to appease a condition he created himself is not logical.

Think about it.

A god of peace spreads his religion by having his people enslave, murder, and rape everyone who he doesn't speak to. There's lots that doesn't make sense about the story.

But a theist is not devoid of logic because of it. There are many excellent religious philosophers and scientists.

And of course there will likely soon be apologist in here who will have a way to make it logical.

The more important part is to recognize that just because something is logical, doesn't mean it reflects reality.

Edited by HappyMonkey

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Posted (edited)

...

Edited by davros of skaro
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A god of peace spreads his religion by having his people enslave, murder, and rape everyone who he doesn't speak to. There's lots that doesn't make sense about the story.

But a theist is not devoid of logic because of it. There are many excellent religious philosophers and scientists.

Then be Baptised by your daughters then since it's logical to you.

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Then be Baptised by your daughters then since it's logical to you.

Eh?

I didn't say it made sense to me. I'm an atheist, as well as an attempted skeptic.

I edited my post to say that you can make the story logical, just ask any apologist.

Something being logical doesn't make it true, just read some of the Classical philosophers who came up with very logical accounts of reality that were dead wrong.

However the fact remains that being religious doesn't leave you devoid of logic, and as much research has shown the more intelligent you are the better able you are to justify bad ideas to yourself. Whether that's religion, politics, things like Creationism or Ancient Aliens.

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Free will choice each time you come to that cross road in life- you pick you're seat to the left of God's Hand or to the right of God's Hand.

The church formally rejected free will back about 410 AD when it excommunicated Pelagius for heresy. According to Christian tradition and church law, there is no such thing as free will. Everything is pre-destined. Thus, it does no good to pray for salvation because god already knows what your fate will be. Whether you pray or not, go to church or not, believe or not, your fate has already been determined and your only choice is to accept it.

Doug

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First, it's starting to bug me but it's "your." This isn't an insult to you, it's just starting to annoy me. (ya my bag, never learned it right I'm sure I'll do it again a million times.)

Second, as I mentioned the age of accountability is seven or eight. The age of accountability is not by a specific age for no person. Each person is different and only God is the Judge of it. Your lord sends those kids who die before having any chance to learn of the "right" religion to hell. Stop hiding behind free will. Even if it does exist, and there's no solid consensus on that, children and teens are noted for their lack of skills at assessing new information, if they have access to that information.

You also can't around he made the rules. He made hell. He fills it with good people who just happened to be wrong in their religious beliefs. This can be from the version of Christianity, to all religion entirely, from people who've never heard of Christianity, to people who were born and died long before Christianity existed.

At least admit you worship an unjust, jealous, petty god.

It is "unjust", "jealous" and "petty" you fear, not me.

I worship a God of love. Who sent His Son to show me the path of having a relationship with God and Him and the Holy Spirit.

You worship sin and I worship God.

Simple math, simple free will choice and you stop dancing around it. Waa you don't like it, so what. Stop looking for something you don't want.

Stop telling selling hate to something you can't stand.

Or read the words of the Gift from God and live and know them now, while its still your free will choice to do so.

Before 2 K/kings come to claim what belongs to them.

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Eh?

I didn't say it made sense to me. I'm an atheist, as well as an attempted skeptic.

I edited my post to say that you can make the story logical, just ask any apologist.

Something being logical doesn't make it true, just read some of the Classical philosophers who came up with very logical accounts of reality that were dead wrong.

However the fact remains that being religious doesn't leave you devoid of logic, and as much research has shown the more intelligent you are the better able you are to justify bad ideas to yourself. Whether that's religion, politics, things like Creationism or Ancient Aliens.

It's not about intelligence, but the reasoning centers of the Brain.

It's more complex than that, but the belief of magic blood that saves is not rational.

Think about it, and why you are making excuses.

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Since I'm not a Christian and don't believe in hell, I find myself kind of amused by the rabidity of those who seem so eager to condemn those who hold a different belief. Apparently that includes you and me. I could be mistaken about this, but isn't that more of a fundamentalist Christian belief? Fundamentalists are a Christian minority and don't represent mainstream Christianity. My mother was a very devout Christian, and I learned the concept of God from her, whom she saw as kind, loving, forgiving, and compassionate. I think my mom warped me (in a good way) that I have been unable to accept a concept of God other than the one she proposed, which makes me out of step with most Christian beliefs. Her focus was on living her life in a way that God would approve of, not on dogma or beliefs or proselytizing, but in her everyday acts & words. She was always kind, always loving, never judged or criticized, refused to give advice, I miss her a lot and her unconditional love for me.

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