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Wickian

IRS lost all email to and from WH

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Posted (edited)

The Internal Revenue Service (IRS) claimed Friday that it cannot produce Lois Lerner’s emails to and from the White House and other administration departments due to a supposed computer crash.

The IRS previously agreed to hand over all of the ex-IRS official’s emails from 2009 to 2011 to the House Ways and Means Committee, chaired by Rep. Dave Camp. But the IRS claimed Friday that it has Lerner’s emails to and from other IRS officials but it cannot produce emails to and from the Treasury and Justice Departments, the Federal Election Commission, or Democratic offices.

link

Just like the article states, this is on par with the missing Watergate minutes.

edit: I'm curious about how a single computer crash deletes emails sent via a remote server to at least two different computers.

Edited by Wickian
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Posted (edited)

edit: I'm curious about how a single computer crash deletes emails sent via a remote server to at least two different computers.

It doesn't.

Further more, wouldn't the NSA have a copy? This is nonesense - it's computer sci 101. They are blatantly and very obviously trying to cover this up. How much more of this can people take?

Edited by Dark_Grey
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link

Just like the article states, this is on par with the missing Watergate minutes.

edit: I'm curious about how a single computer crash deletes emails sent via a remote server to at least two different computers.

On most e-mail accounts you delete the messages from the server as soon as you download them...automatically...

Now, the story still is fishy. Either the IRS is trying to hit Obama into the pan (because that is the only thing that can result from the loss) or they are slightly more incompetent than supposed. In either case, none of the two sound like people who should be collecting taxes.

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Now, given there are perhaps ten people on the planet who'll believe them, what's going to happen next?

I KNOW - nothing. The Committee, which is quel surprise, made up of those ten people, will go "well that's terrible. Chinese for lunch?" and that'll be that.

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Now, given there are perhaps ten people on the planet who'll believe them, what's going to happen next?

I KNOW - nothing. The Committee, which is quel surprise, made up of those ten people, will go "well that's terrible. Chinese for lunch?" and that'll be that.

Most likely. Having a scandal for covering up evidence is much better as far as PR goes than having evidence of the scandal they're trying to cover up.

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My tax returns were in there too. Honestly, the were...

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LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They have got to be kidding! What complete and utter bull feces.

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I'm sure it was an honest mistake. :lol:

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Way to go.

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6 reasons why they're bs'n...

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/06/13/veteran-it-professional-gives-six-reasons-why-the-irs-claim-that-it-lost-two-years-of-lois-lerners-emails-is-simply-not-feasible/

Norman Cillo, an Army veteran who worked in intelligence and a former program manager at Microsoft, argued it is very difficult to lose emails for good and laid out six reasons why he believes Congress is “being lied to” about the Lerner emails:

1. I believe the government uses Microsoft Exchange for their email servers. They have built-in exchange mail database redundancy. So, unless they did not follow Microsofts recommendations they are telling a falsehood. You can see by the diagram below that if you have three servers in a DAG you have three copies of the database.

2. Every IT organization that I know of has hotswappable disk drives. Every server built since 2000 has them. Meaning that if a single disk goes bad it’s easy to replace.

3. ALL Servers use some form of RAID technology. The only way that data can be totally lost (Meaning difficult to bring back) is if more than a single disk goes before the first bad disk is replaced. In the diagram below you can see that its possible to lose a single disk and still keep the data.

4. If the server crashed (Hardware failure other than disks), then the disks that contain the DATA for the Exchange database is still available because the server hardware and disks are exchangeable. Meaning that if I have another server with the same hardware in it, I can put the disks in and everything should boot right up.

5. All email servers in a professional organization use TAPE backup. Meaning if all the above fails, you can restore the server using the TAPE backups.

6. If they are talking about her local PC, then it’s a simple matter of going to the servers which have the email and getting them from the servers. If the servers have removed the data you can still get them by using the backups of the servers to recover the emails.

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Then there are these official rules about printing ALL documents...

http://www.irs.gov/irm/part1/irm_01-010-003.html

1.10.3.2.3 (07-08-2011)

Emails as Possible Federal Records

All federal employees and federal contractors are required by law to preserve records containing adequate and proper documentation of the organization, functions, policies, decisions, procedures, and essential transactions of the agency. Records must be properly stored and preserved, available for retrieval and subject to appropriate approved disposition schedules.

The Federal Records Act applies to email records just as it does to records you create using other media. Emails are records when they are:

Created or received in the transaction of agency business

Appropriate for preservation as evidence of the government’s function and activities, or

Valuable because of the information they contain

If you create or receive email messages during the course of your daily work, you are responsible for ensuring that you manage them properly. The Treasury Department’s current email policy requires emails and attachments that meet the definition of a federal record be added to the organization’s files by printing them (including the essential transmission data) and filing them with related paper records. If transmission and receipt data are not printed by the email system, annotate the paper copy. More information on IRS records management requirements is available at http://erc.web.irs.gov/Displayanswers/Question.asp?FolderID=4&CategoryID=5 or see the Records Management Handbook, IRM 1.15.1 http://publish.no.irs.gov/IRM/P01/PDF/31421A03.PDF).

An email determined to be a federal record may eventually be considered as having historical value by the National Archivist prior to disposal. Therefore, ensure that all your communications are professional in tone.

Please note that maintaining a copy of an email or its attachments within the IRS email MS Outlook application does not meet the requirements of maintaining an official record. Therefore, print and file email and its attachments if they are either permanent records or if they relate to a specific case.

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So it's quite clear they are either lying boldly and plainly OR they are quite simply incompetent, ignorant of their policies and above all unfit to do the job at hand.

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It doesn't.

Further more, wouldn't the NSA have a copy? This is nonesense - it's computer sci 101. They are blatantly and very obviously trying to cover this up. How much more of this can people take?

They've sent the NSA a letter asking for all meta data and as well as any other data they have on Loin Lerner during those years. The NSA can either refuse to cooperate, proving they really don't answer to anyone, or they can provide the data, proving that they really do track and keep records of everything we do.

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Posted (edited)

While they may well be lying, the idiots at "theBlaze" that Fess posted, are completely wrong. They conflate modern IT organizations with the federal government. We already know that for instance, the VA is using computers from 1985!!! To suppose that the IRS is using something modern for email is a bit much considering that the Republicans in Congress will not pass anything for ANY modernization.

Edited by ninjadude

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Posted (edited)

Ok man. I'll think the former intelligence officer/Microsoft managers insight over yours. What's worse is that you're more offended by theblaze then the IRS lying not to mention your non-expectation of a modernized facility.

Edited by F3SS
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Posted (edited)

snip

Edited by OverSword

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Now, given there are perhaps ten people on the planet who'll believe them, what's going to happen next?

I KNOW - nothing. The Committee, which is quel surprise, made up of those ten people, will go "well that's terrible. Chinese for lunch?" and that'll be that.

Not so sure about this tactic though. These guys/gals have stuck their necks out with such claims and if this is as innocent as they are saying then a forensics exam on said computers or servers cannot be impeded. This little dodge might actually put someone in jail.

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Ok man. I'll think the former intelligence officer/Microsoft managers insight over yours. What's worse is that you're more offended by theblaze then the IRS lying not to mention your non-expectation of a modernized facility.

They didn't lie. And I expect modern computers but seriously, Republicans have BLOCKED all legislation. How do you figure they would buy new computers?

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They didn't lie. And I expect modern computers but seriously, Republicans have BLOCKED all legislation. How do you figure they would buy new computers?

They didn't lie? Great defense.

Give us a break. Lois Lerner emails within the needed timeframe just happen to disappear? I would figure that they'd buy new computers because it defies logic that they wouldn't. Actually the computers are regardless. They could be working with a 1996 Compaq desktop. Emails aren't stored inside the computer. So long as an email is sent it is stored inside a server at which point we'll refer back to the intelligence officers knowledge and insight none of which a sensible person would need to read twice or at all to understand how weak of an excuse it is. It takes a real gullible mind to buy such a lame crock.

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Posted (edited)

Apparently even more emails were lost that were related to the investigations after other employee computers "crashed".

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Internal Revenue Service has lost more emails connected to the tea party investigation, congressional investigators said Tuesday.

The IRS said last Friday it had lost an untold number of emails when Lois Lerner's computer crashed in 2011. Lerner used to head the division that handles applications for tax-exempt status.

On Tuesday, two key lawmakers said the IRS has also lost emails from six additional IRS workers whose computers crashed. Among them was Nikole Flax, who was chief of staff to Lerner's boss, then-deputy commissioner Steven Miller.

edit: link

Apparently there's an epidemic of computer crashing and email losses at the IRS with absolutely no backups...

Edited by Wickian

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Give us a break. Lois Lerner emails within the needed timeframe just happen to disappear?

I don't deny it could be a scam.

I would figure that they'd buy new computers because it defies logic that they wouldn't.

seems you've missed the point again. CONGRESS allocates the cash. The IRS can't just go buy new computers. And the REPUBLICANS in CONGRESS have been blocking nearly all legislation. In fact, they've hardly even been working.

And computers are the issue.

Emails aren't stored inside the computer.

apparently at the IRS they are. Kind of like at the VA, using 1980's mail technology.

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Apparently there's an epidemic of computer crashing and email losses at the IRS with absolutely no backups...

Well, when you're using technology from 10-30 years ago, yeah things crash. And probably, they don't backup each employees computer. It's decades ago processes and technology.

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Well, when you're using technology from 10-30 years ago, yeah things crash. And probably, they don't backup each employees computer. It's decades ago processes and technology.

It is time for you to prove this. You've said it several times and you are the only source I've seen.

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Honestly I would find it more believable if they had said "Anonymous hacked us and deleted them!".

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Isn't it nice how they never lose your tax info?

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