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scorpiosonic

How PreIncans contacted their Ancient Alien

37 posts in this topic

I've watched many AA Programs, and still am not convinced. I kept asking myself, "Why don't they present some plausible ideas?"

A few months ago, I came up w/ this Theory, (idea) and thought it was good enough to be included in the AA Program.....then I decided I would submit it to the 'Legendary Times' Mag, but their compensation for submitting a published article was 10 free copies of the issue, (see pg. 122 of Thread 'Ancient Aliens' by M jacobs for more on this story).

My main question here is: Do YOU think it's plausible? Believable? ETC. Opinions welcome.

Sunken courts are a common feature in Pre Incan structures. Consider the idea that all the ‘sunken courtyards’ in the Tiawanaku, (Tia) Temple Complex were used as pools and filled w/ water, and water surrounded some of these structures. Also, the Kalasasaya “staircase” is actually a waterfall and it fed the sunken temple, which would also be filled.

The entire Tia Complex, inc. Puma Punku and the Akapana (step) Pyramid’s sophisticated system of weirs were used to direct/control the flow of water to the many pools, etc. These pools, etc. acted as mirrors, reflecting the sunlight off the surfaces of the water and directed the sunlight to, (somewhere) in space, and sending a specific message to their AA friends, (like QR codes now on products). It is also poss the ppl had the ability to adjust/control the flow of water to each structure, (and to specific levels/sections of each individual structure) thereby changing the patterns/symbols shown in order to send different messages to AA’s.

What differentiates these bodies of water from the many others on this planet is the circle or ring of water that surrounds them. Posnansky said, “the principal ruins were surrounded by an artificial canal or moat...” (IF he meant the entire Complex, I agree w/ him on this point)

Copyright Scorpiosonic.

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you are about to think on these terms

"not saying it was aliens, but it was aliens"

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The main problem with signalling aliens in space with ponds reflecting the sun, is that the area where the signal is going to be reflected toward will constantly be moving. While the Sun moves, the signal would move also. And it would only be visible in a relatively small area of space in orbit. It could still work, if the ETs calculate the path the signal would travel and then fly that path while the people below edit their signal with their water levels.

An interesting idea, but not very adjustable.

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The main problem with signalling aliens in space with ponds reflecting the sun, is that the area where the signal is going to be reflected toward will constantly be moving. While the Sun moves, the signal would move also. And it would only be visible in a relatively small area of space in orbit. It could still work, if the ETs calculate the path the signal would travel and then fly that path while the people below edit their signal with their water levels.

An interesting idea, but not very adjustable.

Just so I understand it... hypotherical aliens who have superior knowledge of physics and superior technological skills to apply that superior knowledge of physics to perfect superlight travel have no other way to be contacted by their adoring primitive contactees except through bouncing light off a tiny pool of water and hoping they're in the right place at the right time to catch it?

Seems to me like magical aliens with magical technology might /use/ some of that magic technology and leave the dopey human simps their version of a cell phone if they really needed to be in contact with them. Seems to be your theory is exactly as overcomplicated and fundamentally illogical as every other tortuous ancient aliens theory.

...sorry, but you /did/ ask.

--Jaylemurph

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Posted (edited)

The main problem with signalling aliens in space with ponds reflecting the sun, is that the area where the signal is going to be reflected toward will constantly be moving. While the Sun moves, the signal would move also. And it would only be visible in a relatively small area of space in orbit. It could still work, if the ETs calculate the path the signal would travel and then fly that path while the people below edit their signal with their water levels.

An interesting idea, but not very adjustable.

All true....both the earth and the AA's planet are constantly moving thru space, and the rotation of the earth would also limit the amount of time the signal would be sent in the right direction.

Thanks for the,'It could still work'. :tu: (At least U are open-minded enough to consider the possibilities.)

Just so I understand it... hypotherical aliens who have superior knowledge of physics and superior technological skills to apply that superior knowledge of physics to perfect superlight travel have no other way to be contacted by their adoring primitive contactees except through bouncing light off a tiny pool of water and hoping they're in the right place at the right time to catch it?

Seems to me like magical aliens with magical technology might /use/ some of that magic technology and leave the dopey human simps their version of a cell phone if they really needed to be in contact with them. Seems to be your theory is exactly as overcomplicated and fundamentally illogical as every other tortuous ancient aliens theory.

...sorry, but you /did/ ask.

--Jaylemurph

And how would these 'dopey human simps' recharge these cell-phones? :unsure2:

(My smart-a*s comment is, the AA's didn't want to give out their phone #. :whistle: )

I DON'T believe in this theory, my main point is: IS it plausible?

I disagree w/ your last statement..... it's very simple really, should be no problem for such an advanced race to position their spacecraft @ the correct time and place to receive signals.

How is it illogical? Communication is an important part of everyday life.

No apology necessary, I did ask for honest opinions. :yes:

Edited by scorpiosonic
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This sounds similar to plans to start fires to signal the residents of Mars. I recall something about plans to create a fire big enough to be seen from Mars on Earth's night side.

The problem I see with your idea is that light reflecting off of the oceans would swamp any signal from sunlight reflected off of the ponds. I doubt it would be possible to see the pond info.

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All true....both the earth and the AA's planet are constantly moving thru space, and the rotation of the earth would also limit the amount of time the signal would be sent in the right direction.

Thanks for the,'It could still work'. :tu: (At least U are open-minded enough to consider the possibilities.)

And how would these 'dopey human simps' recharge these cell-phones? :unsure2:

(My smart-a*s comment is, the AA's didn't want to give out their phone #. :whistle: )

I DON'T believe in this theory, my main point is: IS it plausible?

I disagree w/ your last statement..... it's very simple really, should be no problem for such an advanced race to position their spacecraft @ the correct time and place to receive signals.

How is it illogical? Communication is an important part of everyday life.

No apology necessary, I did ask for honest opinions. :yes:

On the face of it I don't see a problem with those structures being used to contain/channel water... Virtually every ancient civilization was centered on water as it's primary resource...

But I think if they were, they were for human uses... i.e. drinking water, irrigation, fishing, religious or just purely decorative...

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OMG

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OMG

Stereologist, The AAs had the Hi-tech to detect signal.

Taun, I'll take that as a No.

g00dfella, the main purpose of the thread is to answer the question. :yes:

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And how would these 'dopey human simps' recharge these cell-phones? :unsure2:

(My smart-a*s comment is, the AA's didn't want to give out their phone #. :whistle: )

Well, this is what I meant by inconsistent/overcomplicated: the aliens have access to infinite energy to travel faster than light, but they don't have enough infinite energy to power a comm unit? And your second comment is more on the money: the aliens wanted to be contacted, but not regularly enough to make it at all convenient for anyone involved? (Take me for example, when my mother calls and I don't want to speak to her, I don't pick up the phone. I don't invent an elaborately complex and probably usually ineffective way for he to use to reach me, like Homing Basset Hounds or Swimming Cat Messenger.)

I DON'T believe in this theory, my main point is: IS it plausible?

Plausible, no, not by any practical use of the word. Possible is something else completely. It IS possible. But possible in the same way that it's possible for the moon to suddenly change its position in orbit because all its quantum particle suddenly decided to be in another place: i.e., possible but close to infinitely unlikely.

I disagree w/ your last statement..... it's very simple really, should be no problem for such an advanced race to position their spacecraft @ the correct time and place to receive signals.

To be able to recieve the message, they'd have to be in (almost) exactly the right time and the right place -- since, as pointed out before, the Earth and the Sun (and the Milky Way) are all in contsant motion -- but to know that positioning, they'd have to know the message is coming, which they wouldn't know if they didn't already have communication. So if they had the prior communication it would take to use it, they wouldn't need your system, and if they didn't they have the communication, no one would be able to use your system since the aliens would never be in the right place/time to get a message.

How is it illogical? Communication is an important part of everyday life.

See the above.

No apology necessary, I did ask for honest opinions. :yes:

It /seems/ like a good idea, but the more you think it through, the less useful it becomes.

--Jaylemurph

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Posted (edited)

J, re your first para: your first post didn't mention "inconsistent." The AAs had the ability to (re)charge a comm unit, the dopey humans did not. Except for cloudy days, sunshine is more than consistent enough for this purpose here on earth.

Qouting J, "To be able to receive the message, they'd have to be in (almost) exactly the right time and the right place -- since, as pointed out before, the Earth and the Sun (and the Milky Way) are all in constant motion -- but to know that positioning, they'd have to know the message is coming, which they wouldn't know if they didn't already have communication. So if they had the prior communication it would take to use it, they wouldn't need your system, and if they didn't they have the communication, no one would be able to use your system since the aliens would never be in the right place/time to get a message." END Quote.

When the AA visited earth, (S. America) they communicated w/ the PreIncans and taught them how to set-up and use this method of comm. so the AA knew, (when they left earth) when and where the signal would eventually be sent.

(I'm not the one who is over-complicating this theory )

Edited by scorpiosonic

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Stereologist, The AAs had the Hi-tech to detect signal.

Taun, I'll take that as a No.

g00dfella, the main purpose of the thread is to answer the question. :yes:

Here is the problem. The signal is a reflection of another signal. Thus it looks like all of the other reflections. There is nothing to distinguish it from other events. When astronomers look at distant stars they can even see a planet pass in front of a distant star. But they cannot detect the atmosphere of that distant planet even through the light of the star passes through it. The reason is that the signal from light passing through the atmosphere of the planet is swamped by the direct light of the star. In the situation you are suggesting the signal is passive. There are no events modulating or modifying the signal. On the other hand the reflection from the oceans is constantly changing due to waves altering the reflections from the oceans.

There was an interesting guy named Shannon that came along at a time when people were thinking that it was possible to send information faster and faster just by being creative. Shannon showed that there was a limit no matter how clever you tried to be. He invented what is known as information theory. That has been expanded to all sorts of important work.

Regardless of how clever the AA are there are still limits to signal detection and passing information. These limitations apply to humans and aliens and all levels of cleverness.

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J, re your first para: your first post didn't mention "inconsistent." The AAs had the ability to (re)charge a comm unit, the dopey humans did not. Except for cloudy days, sunshine is more than consistent enough for this purpose here on earth.

Qouting J, "To be able to receive the message, they'd have to be in (almost) exactly the right time and the right place -- since, as pointed out before, the Earth and the Sun (and the Milky Way) are all in constant motion -- but to know that positioning, they'd have to know the message is coming, which they wouldn't know if they didn't already have communication. So if they had the prior communication it would take to use it, they wouldn't need your system, and if they didn't they have the communication, no one would be able to use your system since the aliens would never be in the right place/time to get a message." END Quote.

When the AA visited earth, (S. America) they communicated w/ the PreIncans and taught them how to set-up and use this method of comm. so the AA knew, (when they left earth) when and where the signal would eventually be sent.

(I'm not the one who is over-complicating this theory )

The Earth is not as regular as you might think. Remember that precession of the axes and nutation would make the "pointing" pretty much off after a short period of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutation

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Posted (edited)

Here is the problem. The signal is a reflection of another signal. Thus it looks like all of the other reflections. There is nothing to distinguish it from other events. When astronomers look at distant stars they can even see a planet pass in front of a distant star. But they cannot detect the atmosphere of that distant planet even through the light of the star passes through it. The reason is that the signal from light passing through the atmosphere of the planet is swamped by the direct light of the star. In the situation you are suggesting the signal is passive. There are no events modulating or modifying the signal. On the other hand the reflection from the oceans is constantly changing due to waves altering the reflections from the oceans.

There was an interesting guy named Shannon that came along at a time when people were thinking that it was possible to send information faster and faster just by being creative. Shannon showed that there was a limit no matter how clever you tried to be. He invented what is known as information theory. That has been expanded to all sorts of important work.

Regardless of how clever the AA are there are still limits to signal detection and passing information. These limitations apply to humans and aliens and all levels of cleverness.

The Earth is not as regular as you might think. Remember that precession of the axes and nutation would make the "pointing" pretty much off after a short period of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutation

The sunlight is reflected off calm pools, etc. into space, and could be seen by those in outer space who know where and when to look, (and didn't attempt to look during an occultation event.) As I mentioned, the circle or ring of water distinguishes this from other reflections on earth.

The AAs, being very advanced in space travel, etc. knew of and understood the movements of the sun, earth, etc. and piloted their spaceship accordingly to the proper place and time to receive the signal.

Edited by scorpiosonic
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The main problem with signalling aliens in space with ponds reflecting the sun, is that the area where the signal is going to be reflected toward will constantly be moving. While the Sun moves, the signal would move also. And it would only be visible in a relatively small area of space in orbit. It could still work, if the ETs calculate the path the signal would travel and then fly that path while the people below edit their signal with their water levels.

An interesting idea, but not very adjustable.

Just so I understand it... hypotherical aliens who have superior knowledge of physics and superior technological skills to apply that superior knowledge of physics to perfect superlight travel have no other way to be contacted by their adoring primitive contactees except through bouncing light off a tiny pool of water and hoping they're in the right place at the right time to catch it?

Seems to me like magical aliens with magical technology might /use/ some of that magic technology and leave the dopey human simps their version of a cell phone if they really needed to be in contact with them. Seems to be your theory is exactly as overcomplicated and fundamentally illogical as every other tortuous ancient aliens theory.

...sorry, but you /did/ ask.

--Jaylemurph

It seems to me that you maybe should have quoted the OP post not mine. As my post is basically saying it is possible, but not very useful.

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The sunlight is reflected off calm pools, etc. into space, and could be seen by those in outer space who know where and when to look, (and didn't attempt to look during an occultation event.) As I mentioned, the circle or ring of water distinguishes this from other reflections on earth.

The AAs, being very advanced in space travel, etc. knew of and understood the movements of the sun, earth, etc. and piloted their spaceship accordingly to the proper place and time to receive the signal.

So let's assume that they can limit the viewing area to a small patch of Earth and that the position from which they watch the daytime reflection gives them a signal. Please describe this signal. If you picked up a phone and asked a question and the person at the other end of the line always answered yes, then according to information theory no information has been sent since the answer is always known. It is yes. In this case what information is being sent since the reflection is always the same?

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So let's assume that they can limit the viewing area to a small patch of Earth and that the position from which they watch the daytime reflection gives them a signal. Please describe this signal. If you picked up a phone and asked a question and the person at the other end of the line always answered yes, then according to information theory no information has been sent since the answer is always known. It is yes. In this case what information is being sent since the reflection is always the same?

I described how they would change message in the OP.

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I described how they would change message in the OP.

Right. So there are different shapes to send different messages. Sounds rather poor since the variety of messages would be rather small. You'd run into the problem of changing messages should not look like messages you do not want to send. It would also restrict messages being sent during daylight hours requiring the viewer to be on the sun side of the observation. It would also restrict messaging to cloudless days. It would also restrict messaging to a short distance from Earth.

Plausible yes. Practical no. There are much simpler ways to handle this. That suggests this was not done. For example, a large courtyard could be covered in light colored stone. That's a one time operation. Then squares of dark wood could be placed on the courtyard grounds to spell out messages. The work is simpler. The set up is simpler. The messaging rate is faster.

I would discount the place as a message center due to the cumbersome nature of the messaging and simpler, cheaper, less resource costly methods are available.

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I think the OP idea was to raise or lower the water levels. But, I don't think that would work unless you drain them completely. 0 or 1. On or Off.

They could do the same thing by adding something to the water to break up the surface tension. Like leaves, reeds, or textiles.

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Right on the money, DC. (Except the individual areas are either filled or empty, [dry], the water levels are not important.)

The dry areas are non-reflective, ('black') and the water filled areas are reflective, ('white'). The pattern created forms the code or message being sent. The possible number of different patterns, (and/or variety of messages) would be determined by how many individual pools exist.

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Right on the money, DC. (Except the individual areas are either filled or empty, [dry], the water levels are not important.)

The dry areas are non-reflective, ('black') and the water filled areas are reflective, ('white'). The pattern created forms the code or message being sent. The possible number of different patterns, (and/or variety of messages) would be determined by how many individual pools exist.

Water is a so so reflector unless the light hits it an a small angle. Light coming straight down onto the water's surface penetrates the water. Doesn't that reduce the effectiveness of the water as a reflection surface? We think of water as a good reflector because we view it at a small angle. A space ship would would it more straight on meaning less reflection.

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And a space ship could view the reflection @ this same small angle.

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And a space ship could view the reflection @ this same small angle.

Does the surrounding terrain allow that to happen? My recollection is that the site is in hills which would prevent this sort of viewing.

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Posted (edited)

As I've said, the sunlight is reflected into outer space @ this small angle.

The surrounding terrain is irrelevant and doesn't block the reflection when viewed at the proper angle.

(Surely, U can't be serious. :unsure2: )

Edited by scorpiosonic

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