ISIS issues ultimatum to Christians

[RoofGardener]

Those loveable scamps ISIS have been branding their version of Peace and Tolerance in a city they control.

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Islamist insurgents have issued an ultimatum to northern Iraq's dwindling Christian population to either convert to Islam, pay a religious levy or face death, according to a statement distributed in the militant-controlled city of Mosul.

.. full Reuters story

No doubt the UN will rise to their feet to condemn this, and it will be headline news across the world.

No doubt.

[bubblykiss]

Wow ISIS is just a machine composed of brilliant thoughts and policies designed to win the sympathy and support from a world that just loves genocide and religious persecution.

[RoofGardener]

Yeah... we really should have an Awards Ceremony for it, shouldn't we ?

[RavenHawk]

chirp chirp chirp

Personally I'm fine with their demands, however, they need to also offer the opportunity to leave. But that won’t happen with the tolerance of the Religion of Peace.

“Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion” (109:6mc)

“Whosoever will, let him believe, and whosever will, let him disbelieve (Quran18:29mc)

“There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is distinct from error” (Quran 2:256).”

Aren’t these the usual ayahs quoted to show tolerance, even thought they are a bit dishonest since it’s not explained as to what the consequences or punishment are for disobeying these.

I guess it is too early to tweet:

#Wewantourchristiansback

[bubblykiss]

Yeah... we really should have an Awards Ceremony for it, shouldn't we ?

Makes you wonder what ISIS is gonna do when they discover the complex relationship that the Kurds have with religion. That is going to be interesting, because, honestly, I don't think they understand it just yet.

[RoofGardener]

Isn't it strange though ?

If a "christian" nation demanded that all muslims convert, leave or die, then there would be a world uproar, and conniptions in the General Assembly.

But when the Islamists do it, nobody raises an eyebrow.

Have we all become so casually racist that we EXPECT muslims to behave like medieval barbarians, and therefore aren't surprised or outraged when some of they do ?

Shouldn't we be a bit worried about that ?

[RoofGardener]

Makes you wonder what ISIS is gonna do when they discover the complex relationship that the Kurds have with religion. That is going to be interesting, because, honestly, I don't think they understand it just yet.

I doubt they would get far enough to discover the Kurd's religion.

ISIS would be FAR more concerned with the Kurds complex relationship with their guns, in relation to defending their territory.

You... ISIS chappie..... GET A HAIRCUT, you HORRIBLE little man.

[bubblykiss]

Has anybody recognized their micro-empire as a nation-state yet? Right now the world just sees a gang of conquering thugs engaging in practices designed to appeal to fundamentalists in the Islamic world.

But of which will gain them little legitimacy in the eyes of the Occidental world.

[+OverSword]

This section of the article is particularly sad:

Mosul, once home to diverse faiths, had a Christian population of around 100,000 a decade ago, but waves of attacks on Christians since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion to topple Saddam Hussein have seen those numbers collapse.

The resident of Mosul who saw the Islamic State announcement estimated the city's Christian population before last month's militant takeover at around 5,000. The vast bulk of those have since fled, leaving perhaps only 200 in the city, he said.

I wonder what conditions those that fled are now living in?

Edited July 20, 2014 by OverSword

[Uncle Sam]

Who else thinks it is time to wipe out the ISIS?

[SaraT]

chirp chirp chirp

Personally I'm fine with their demands, however, they need to also offer the opportunity to leave. But that won't happen with the tolerance of the Religion of Peace.

"Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion" (109:6mc)

"Whosoever will, let him believe, and whosever will, let him disbelieve (Quran18:29mc)

"There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is distinct from error" (Quran 2:256)."

Aren't these the usual ayahs quoted to show tolerance, even thought they are a bit dishonest since it's not explained as to what the consequences or punishment are for disobeying these.

I guess it is too early to tweet:

#Wewantourchristiansback

No, the ayat are honest. But what is happening with Islamists shows just how far they have strayed from the original teachings which they profess.

[spartan max2]

Isn't it strange though ?

If a "christian" nation demanded that all muslims convert, leave or die, then there would be a world uproar, and conniptions in the General Assembly.

But when the Islamists do it, nobody raises an eyebrow.

Have we all become so casually racist that we EXPECT muslims to behave like medieval barbarians, and therefore aren't surprised or outraged when some of they do ?

Shouldn't we be a bit worried about that ?

I dont think its as much that we expect Muslims to do that.

Its more we just expect groups in the middle east to do stuff like that. Its more of a regional expectation then a religious .

[RavenHawk]

Who else thinks it is time to wipe out the ISIS?

Wow! What a question. The knee-jerk reaction is yes but what are implications and consequences? What will wiping ISIS out entail? Who will it aid? In order to do the job right will require long term occupation. Do we have the will for that? Whether ISIS is taken out or not, it will be replaced by something else. To prevent that means boots on the ground for a very long time. Or do we let things happen on their own and see what happens? Will ISIS peter out? Will their backers make some leadership changes? Will another party join or another front open up? I sense that there is some new wrinkle that we haven’t seen yet and it will reveal itself soon. I don’t know if that is prophetic or just common sense?

[RavenHawk]

No, the ayat are honest. But what is happening with Islamists shows just how far they have strayed from the original teachings which they profess.

Let me elaborate. Indeed those ayahs are honest if you are part of the Ummah. But more than 3/4th of the world is not part of the Ummah. Therefore, the casual reading of those ayahs does not include the consequences of not submitting to the Will of Allah. That is rarely brought up. I find it very hard to believe that at least 10% has strayed (10% being a conservative estimate of extremists). What is more likely is that in the dualistic nature of the Quran, more and more are following the tenants of dar al-Harb.

[bee]

.

Isn't it strange though ?

If a "christian" nation demanded that all muslims convert, leave or die, then there would be a world uproar, and conniptions in the General Assembly.

But when the Islamists do it, nobody raises an eyebrow.

Yeah....we would never hear the end of it....we are taught to bend over backwards to accommodate other

racial groups and religions.....and part of that accommodation seems to be that we don't expect them to

errrr be so accommodating towards us. Like we give them more leeway because of the religious indoctrination...

Which is pretty understanding of us...BUT....one day this over-accommodation could come back and bite us on the bum.

IMO

Have we all become so casually racist that we EXPECT muslims to behave like medieval barbarians, and therefore aren't surprised or outraged when some of they do ?

a good point....there is something intrinsically racist going on when we don't hold others up to the same high standards

we impose on ourselves......?

Shouldn't we be a bit worried about that ?

We should be....

Thanks for the thread...

.

[bee]

Who else thinks it is time to wipe out the ISIS?

If only it were possible.....but it could be too late....

Wow! What a question. The knee-jerk reaction is yes but what are implications and consequences? What will wiping ISIS out entail? Who will it aid? In order to do the job right will require long term occupation. Do we have the will for that? Whether ISIS is taken out or not, it will be replaced by something else. To prevent that means boots on the ground for a very long time. Or do we let things happen on their own and see what happens? Will ISIS peter out? Will their backers make some leadership changes? Will another party join or another front open up? I sense that there is some new wrinkle that we haven't seen yet and it will reveal itself soon. I don't know if that is prophetic or just common sense?

A knotty problem indeed.....

We can't change history but if only our politicians hadn't been so F-ing STUPID....with the so-called 'Arab Spring' malarkey...

Saddam Hussein and Muammar Gaddafi were doing ok keeping the extremists under control in Iraq and Libya...

even if they had to be pretty tough to do that. (like Israel has to be tough to do that with Hamas)

And Bashar al-Assad was doing ok keeping the Islamic extremists under control in Syria...

So what did 'we' have to go and do.......yes....screw it all up good and proper...

And now we see the consequences...it's like a slow motion movie heading for disaster...

It's anyone's guess where it is leading or how it might 'end'....

Dangerous times ahead for World Peace....

Fingers Crossed. eh..?

.

[RoofGardener]

I'm more optimistic.

I think what has been happening is "lancing the boil" - getting rid of the old Soviet-backed dictators.

There will always be chaos when you do this, but it is probably better to due it, than to let the boil fester.

Saddam would have died eventually anyway, as would Ghadaffi. Would the ensuing bloodshed have been any less ?

Remember what happened to Yugoslavia when its dictator died ?

Things will eventually settle down. The Taliban will re-take Afghanistan, ISIS may - or may not - form a primitive new Afghanistan-style state. Iran will absorb parts of Iraq, which may completely splinter anyway. Eventually, a new realpolitik will emerge.

I think the best thing we can do is sit back and allow it to happen. Perhaps offer humanitarian assistance, but do NOT try and control the flow of events any longer.

[bee]

I'm more optimistic.

I think what has been happening is "lancing the boil" - getting rid of the old Soviet-backed dictators.

There will always be chaos when you do this, but it is probably better to due it, than to let the boil fester.

Saddam would have died eventually anyway, as would Ghadaffi. Would the ensuing bloodshed have been any less ?

Remember what happened to Yugoslavia when its dictator died ?

Things will eventually settle down. The Taliban will re-take Afghanistan, ISIS may - or may not - form a primitive new Afghanistan-style state. Iran will absorb parts of Iraq, which may completely splinter anyway. Eventually, a new realpolitik will emerge.

I think the best thing we can do is sit back and allow it to happen. Perhaps offer humanitarian assistance, but do NOT try and control the flow of events any longer.

Thanks for your optimism......

No really.....I mean that sincerely...

I can get a bit doom and gloom when it comes to the Global Islamic Jihad....

.

[Space Commander Travis]

Has anybody recognized their micro-empire as a nation-state yet? Right now the world just sees a gang of conquering thugs engaging in practices designed to appeal to fundamentalists in the Islamic world.

But of which will gain them little legitimacy in the eyes of the Occidental world.

yes, the papers printed a map showing that they'd taken over Turkey, India and Greece and parts of Spain and Italy and named it The Islamic State. The papers didn't seem to think that this was a deluded fantasy, they repeated it as if it was now official.

* In other thoughts, if one was inclined towards the conspiracy theory one might think how convenient it is for ISIS that all the attention has been switched away from them so conveniently first by HAMAS kicking off once again, and then by the Ukraine affair.

[Space Commander Travis]

i don't know what may be going on today, but I find myself largely agreeing with Roof Gardener's assessment above.

[Lilly]

Isn't it strange though ?

...If a "christian" nation demanded that all muslims convert, leave or die, then there would be a world uproar, and conniptions in the General Assembly.

....

We should all (regardless of our faiths) be outraged at any group that calls for the death of others based on religion. I'm not sure if ISIS is exactly a "nation" or just a group that's grabbed territory (like the Taliban)? No good can come of such an attitude, it's very frightening.

[Rlyeh]

Have we all become so casually racist that we EXPECT muslims to behave like medieval barbarians, and therefore aren't surprised or outraged when some of they do ?

Shouldn't we be a bit worried about that ?

How does that make us racist? For instance the Hadith calls for the execution of apostates, so when Muslims do it and non-muslims aren't surprised, we're the racists?

[Lilly]

How does that make us racist? For instance the Hadith calls for the execution of apostates, so when Muslims do it and non-muslims aren't surprised, we're the racists?

What's racist is when some people blame all Muslims for the actions of these extremists radicals. Keep in mind that the extremists also wish to do harm to other Muslims who don't/won't embrace their radical position. I think it's more like we've become accustomed to the extremist radicals behaving in a horrible barbaric manner.

[RoofGardener]

i don't know what may be going on today, but I find myself largely agreeing with Roof Gardener's assessment above.

It's probably just indigestion, Admiral.

Fear not, it will pass.

Plink Plink FIZZZZ..... Gardener offers Admiral Rhubarb a nice fizzing glass of Alka-Seltzer, as a peace token

[bubblykiss]

How does that make us racist? For instance the Hadith calls for the execution of apostates, so when Muslims do it and non-muslims aren't surprised, we're the racists?

Just to play with logical a bit more.....when did Islam become a race? ISIS is made up of several different peoples unified by a religion and desire to forge a political unit guided by their faith.